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    All Forums | Politics

    Ukraine..What's the Next Step?

    «First Previous 222324 ... 9899100 Next Last»
    I_Need_A_Detox
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    I_Need_A_Detox
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 7:13 AM ET #526

    BREAKING: China — “The US has 336 labs in 30 countries under its control, including 26 in Ukraine alone. It should give a full account of its biological military activities at home and abroad and subject itself to multilateral verification.“


    an_popcorn

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    BREAKING: China — “The US has 336 labs in 30 countries under its control, including 26 in Ukraine alone. It should give a full account of its biological military activities at home and abroad and subject itself to multilateral verification.“


    an_popcorn

     
    I_Need_A_Detox
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 7:20 AM ET #527

    OPEC Says To Biden: If You Want More Oil, Pump It Yourself

    Good article from 11.9.21 

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/arielcohen/2021/11/09/opec-says-to-biden-if-you-want-more-oil-pump-it-yourself/amp/

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    OPEC Says To Biden: If You Want More Oil, Pump It Yourself

    Good article from 11.9.21 

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/arielcohen/2021/11/09/opec-says-to-biden-if-you-want-more-oil-pump-it-yourself/amp/

     
    I_Need_A_Detox
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 7:23 AM ET #528

    Quote Originally Posted by I_Need_A_Detox:

    BREAKING: China — “The US has 336 labs in 30 countries under its control, including 26 in Ukraine alone. It should give a full account of its biological military activities at home and abroad and subject itself to multilateral verification.“

    For people saying they’re just US funded bio-labs, why is Victoria Nuland worried about “research materials” falling into the hands of Russians?

    Please explain. 

    Or are you clueless and posting on Social Media thanking McDonalds, Coke, and Pepsi for pulling out of Russia? 

    sleep2

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    Quote Originally Posted by I_Need_A_Detox:

    BREAKING: China — “The US has 336 labs in 30 countries under its control, including 26 in Ukraine alone. It should give a full account of its biological military activities at home and abroad and subject itself to multilateral verification.“

    For people saying they’re just US funded bio-labs, why is Victoria Nuland worried about “research materials” falling into the hands of Russians?

    Please explain. 

    Or are you clueless and posting on Social Media thanking McDonalds, Coke, and Pepsi for pulling out of Russia? 

    sleep2

     
    I_Need_A_Detox
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 7:32 AM ET #529

    Word on the streets is the US has been exposed by documents seized by the Russians and there's more in the pipeline (no pun intended)

    Briefing by the Chief of Russian NBC Protection troops (in Russian with subtitles) 

     

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=oSXRYl9LNPA

     

    an_popcorn

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    Word on the streets is the US has been exposed by documents seized by the Russians and there's more in the pipeline (no pun intended)

    Briefing by the Chief of Russian NBC Protection troops (in Russian with subtitles) 

     

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=oSXRYl9LNPA

     

    an_popcorn

     
    KellyM_1964
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 9:24 AM ET #530

    Quote Originally Posted by Europa:

     

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by Europa: McDonald's to temporarily close 850 restaurants in Russia, it's about time. Sanctions are just piling up against Putin and Russia.   *Followup to news of increasing fallout posted by EUROPA....   McDonald’s, Starbucks and Coca-Cola leave Russia New York CNN Business — McDonald’s and Starbucks are shutting their restaurants and cafes in Russia, and Coca-Cola is suspending its operations there in response to Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. PepsiCo is also pulling some products from the country. Yum Brands (YUM), which owns KFC, Pizza Hut, Taco Bell and the Habit Grill, said in a statement that it “has suspended all investment and restaurant development in Russia.”

     

    Russian economy will take a hit, and Russian citizens will feel the heat from what Putin has made a huge mistake by invading Ukraine and killing many innocent Ukrainians, many of them are children, elderlies and women.  

    the ultimate byproduct of enablers and cheerleaders of the putin regime

     

     

    "I'm the MOST HONEST human being that GOD EVER created!" - Donald "the felon" Trump
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    Quote Originally Posted by Europa:

     

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by Europa: McDonald's to temporarily close 850 restaurants in Russia, it's about time. Sanctions are just piling up against Putin and Russia.   *Followup to news of increasing fallout posted by EUROPA....   McDonald’s, Starbucks and Coca-Cola leave Russia New York CNN Business — McDonald’s and Starbucks are shutting their restaurants and cafes in Russia, and Coca-Cola is suspending its operations there in response to Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. PepsiCo is also pulling some products from the country. Yum Brands (YUM), which owns KFC, Pizza Hut, Taco Bell and the Habit Grill, said in a statement that it “has suspended all investment and restaurant development in Russia.”

     

    Russian economy will take a hit, and Russian citizens will feel the heat from what Putin has made a huge mistake by invading Ukraine and killing many innocent Ukrainians, many of them are children, elderlies and women.  

    the ultimate byproduct of enablers and cheerleaders of the putin regime

     

     

     
    I_Need_A_Detox
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 9:46 AM ET #531

    Under both Obama and now Biden, the person in charge of Ukraine policy at the State Department is a hard core neocon from the royal neocon Kagan family.

    Victoria Nuland was also Dick Cheney’s foreign policy advisor during the early years of the Iraq war.

    Ukraine crisis: Transcript of leaked Nuland-Pyatt call

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26079957

     

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    Under both Obama and now Biden, the person in charge of Ukraine policy at the State Department is a hard core neocon from the royal neocon Kagan family.

    Victoria Nuland was also Dick Cheney’s foreign policy advisor during the early years of the Iraq war.

    Ukraine crisis: Transcript of leaked Nuland-Pyatt call

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26079957

     

     
    UNIMAN
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 10:12 AM ET #532

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers: @I_Need_A_Detox  Har har...I think you glaze over truth that does not fit your narrative and jump right to the political whining. Gas prices were low because oil got crushed from oversupply, from excess credit and speculation. Then what happened? Shale/frackers went under, big OG cut R&D and slashed fringe production, THEN what happened... Oh my word this is so silly...     Good point.  Many factors, and the president is one of the least of them, but that won't matter in the political blame game

    They are good points...............to a point. Then you partisan view kicks in and says Joe has nothing at all to do prices rising when he took the presidency with reducing oil production in mind. The leader of a country says oil bad, must go, no more pipelines, hold off those leases, etc and HE BARES NO RESPONSIBILTY FOR HIGHER PRICES. Looks like glaze over the truth to me.

    Along those same lines you have one former President who meets our adversaries, shows respect along with letting them know he means business. This same President points the finger at Germany, tells them the US is not going to overpay NATO while Germany foolishly empower an adversary by depending on their oil and gas production all the while feeling so good about themselves that they "DON'T DO IT", shhh, just buy it from someone else. Germany laughed at Trump.

    https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/germany-step-up-plans-cut-dependence-russia-gas-2022-02-27/

    Then you have our current President who follows Germany's path. Nord Stream 2----GREEN LIGHT!!!! Domestic Production--no increases NOW, oil bad, no more leases, oil companies got the message. To our dangerous adversaries; YOUR A MURDER, A THUG!!! Now you may think that but you sure as Hell don't say it. Otherwise there will come a time you need to negotiate with this foe and may mean many lives, and in this case it did mean many lives. 

    Now Biden cuts off Russian oil, more increases for the US.......exactly what he wants!!!!! Sorta like a vaccine mandate through the backdoor. And he can blame Russia too, sweet!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers: @I_Need_A_Detox  Har har...I think you glaze over truth that does not fit your narrative and jump right to the political whining. Gas prices were low because oil got crushed from oversupply, from excess credit and speculation. Then what happened? Shale/frackers went under, big OG cut R&D and slashed fringe production, THEN what happened... Oh my word this is so silly...     Good point.  Many factors, and the president is one of the least of them, but that won't matter in the political blame game

    They are good points...............to a point. Then you partisan view kicks in and says Joe has nothing at all to do prices rising when he took the presidency with reducing oil production in mind. The leader of a country says oil bad, must go, no more pipelines, hold off those leases, etc and HE BARES NO RESPONSIBILTY FOR HIGHER PRICES. Looks like glaze over the truth to me.

    Along those same lines you have one former President who meets our adversaries, shows respect along with letting them know he means business. This same President points the finger at Germany, tells them the US is not going to overpay NATO while Germany foolishly empower an adversary by depending on their oil and gas production all the while feeling so good about themselves that they "DON'T DO IT", shhh, just buy it from someone else. Germany laughed at Trump.

    https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/germany-step-up-plans-cut-dependence-russia-gas-2022-02-27/

    Then you have our current President who follows Germany's path. Nord Stream 2----GREEN LIGHT!!!! Domestic Production--no increases NOW, oil bad, no more leases, oil companies got the message. To our dangerous adversaries; YOUR A MURDER, A THUG!!! Now you may think that but you sure as Hell don't say it. Otherwise there will come a time you need to negotiate with this foe and may mean many lives, and in this case it did mean many lives. 

    Now Biden cuts off Russian oil, more increases for the US.......exactly what he wants!!!!! Sorta like a vaccine mandate through the backdoor. And he can blame Russia too, sweet!!

     
    KellyM_1964
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 10:16 AM ET #533

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

     

    Quote Originally Posted by Europa:

    McDonald's to temporarily close 850 restaurants in Russia, it's about time. Sanctions are just piling up against Putin and Russia.

     

     

    *Followup to news of increasing fallout posted by EUROPA....

     

    McDonald’s, Starbucks and Coca-Cola leave Russia


    New York CNN Business —

    McDonald’s and Starbucks are shutting their restaurants and cafes in Russia, and Coca-Cola is suspending its operations there in response to Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.

    PepsiCo is also pulling some products from the country.

    Yum Brands (YUM), which owns KFC, Pizza Hut, Taco Bell and the Habit Grill, said in a statement that it “has suspended all investment and restaurant development in Russia.”

    the exodus is fun to watch though  thumbs_up

     

     

    "I'm the MOST HONEST human being that GOD EVER created!" - Donald "the felon" Trump
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    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

     

    Quote Originally Posted by Europa:

    McDonald's to temporarily close 850 restaurants in Russia, it's about time. Sanctions are just piling up against Putin and Russia.

     

     

    *Followup to news of increasing fallout posted by EUROPA....

     

    McDonald’s, Starbucks and Coca-Cola leave Russia


    New York CNN Business —

    McDonald’s and Starbucks are shutting their restaurants and cafes in Russia, and Coca-Cola is suspending its operations there in response to Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.

    PepsiCo is also pulling some products from the country.

    Yum Brands (YUM), which owns KFC, Pizza Hut, Taco Bell and the Habit Grill, said in a statement that it “has suspended all investment and restaurant development in Russia.”

    the exodus is fun to watch though  thumbs_up

     

     

     
    KellyM_1964
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 10:17 AM ET #534

    Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:

    @BigGame90  Think we discussed this already right? The move is a combination of speculation and the Russian supply being potentially crimped, but mostly speculation on futures contracts.

     

    absolutely      most analysts not on the rw partisan network fux news agree

    "I'm the MOST HONEST human being that GOD EVER created!" - Donald "the felon" Trump
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    Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:

    @BigGame90  Think we discussed this already right? The move is a combination of speculation and the Russian supply being potentially crimped, but mostly speculation on futures contracts.

     

    absolutely      most analysts not on the rw partisan network fux news agree

     
    UNIMAN
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 10:27 AM ET #535

    Quote Originally Posted by I_Need_A_Detox:

    Word on the streets is the US has been exposed by documents seized by the Russians and there's more in the pipeline (no pun intended) Briefing by the Chief of Russian NBC Protection troops (in Russian with subtitles)    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=oSXRYl9LNPA

    Wow, of course it will be dismissed as propaganda just like Putin dismisses our news but a lot of evidence so far adds credibility.

    The Russian people are hearing this don't think they will be thinking overthrow.

     

     

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    Quote Originally Posted by I_Need_A_Detox:

    Word on the streets is the US has been exposed by documents seized by the Russians and there's more in the pipeline (no pun intended) Briefing by the Chief of Russian NBC Protection troops (in Russian with subtitles)    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=oSXRYl9LNPA

    Wow, of course it will be dismissed as propaganda just like Putin dismisses our news but a lot of evidence so far adds credibility.

    The Russian people are hearing this don't think they will be thinking overthrow.

     

     

     
    KellyM_1964
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 10:30 AM ET #536

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

     

    Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:

     

    @I_Need_A_Detox

     Har har...I think you glaze over truth that does not fit your narrative and jump right to the political whining.

    Gas prices were low because oil got crushed from oversupply, from excess credit and speculation. Then what happened? Shale/frackers went under, big OG cut R&D and slashed fringe production, THEN what happened...

    Oh my word this is so silly...

     

     

     

     

    Good point.  Many factors, and the president is one of the least of them, but that won't matter in the political blame game

    defiinitely not to the chump cult

     

    "I'm the MOST HONEST human being that GOD EVER created!" - Donald "the felon" Trump
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    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

     

    Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:

     

    @I_Need_A_Detox

     Har har...I think you glaze over truth that does not fit your narrative and jump right to the political whining.

    Gas prices were low because oil got crushed from oversupply, from excess credit and speculation. Then what happened? Shale/frackers went under, big OG cut R&D and slashed fringe production, THEN what happened...

    Oh my word this is so silly...

     

     

     

     

    Good point.  Many factors, and the president is one of the least of them, but that won't matter in the political blame game

    defiinitely not to the chump cult

     

     
    wallstreetcappers
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 10:32 AM ET #537

    @BigGame90

     This isnt about Russia only, because in reality Russia impacts Brent since that is the product for that part of the world, West Texas which is our main source should not be impacted as much from a Euro Brent crude supply issue...yet it does and that very point is why all the comments from your Repub friends are useless. This isnt about our teeny Russian imports because as you mention it is a small figure for the US, yet the price of crude produced here has gone up the same. That is because this is a global supply connected commodity so even if we were 100% energy independent our product price would STILL GO UP because all markets are connected and say we were oil supplied without the need for Brent crude and Russia, the issue is that opportunity cost would incentivize West Texas suppliers to ship their product to Brent neighborhoods and that would raise prices for the US even if we were energy independent. All futures based commodity markets are linked and connected so this Trump good Biden to blame bullsh!t is useless. 

    Keystone helps China only, so last I checked why would the US help China get oil and why should we have EVER allowed Keystone? Why because the idiot politicians are suckers to PAC money and corporate donations, so the general public are gullible morons and do not understand the purpose and intent for Keystone, if they did I dont think most would want Canadian sour toxic nasty crude running for thousands of miles on our land so China can get refined product from Alberta....

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    @BigGame90

     This isnt about Russia only, because in reality Russia impacts Brent since that is the product for that part of the world, West Texas which is our main source should not be impacted as much from a Euro Brent crude supply issue...yet it does and that very point is why all the comments from your Repub friends are useless. This isnt about our teeny Russian imports because as you mention it is a small figure for the US, yet the price of crude produced here has gone up the same. That is because this is a global supply connected commodity so even if we were 100% energy independent our product price would STILL GO UP because all markets are connected and say we were oil supplied without the need for Brent crude and Russia, the issue is that opportunity cost would incentivize West Texas suppliers to ship their product to Brent neighborhoods and that would raise prices for the US even if we were energy independent. All futures based commodity markets are linked and connected so this Trump good Biden to blame bullsh!t is useless. 

    Keystone helps China only, so last I checked why would the US help China get oil and why should we have EVER allowed Keystone? Why because the idiot politicians are suckers to PAC money and corporate donations, so the general public are gullible morons and do not understand the purpose and intent for Keystone, if they did I dont think most would want Canadian sour toxic nasty crude running for thousands of miles on our land so China can get refined product from Alberta....

     
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 10:38 AM ET #538

    [Quote: Originally Posted by KellyM_1964] definitely not to the chump cult[/Quote]

     

    "Cool it...stay on topic"

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    This is what your all about!!!

     

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    [Quote: Originally Posted by KellyM_1964] definitely not to the chump cult[/Quote]

     

    "Cool it...stay on topic"

    "Quit with the jabs, you know better."

    "You better not call someone ignorant"

    This is what your all about!!!

     

     
    BigGame90
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 10:50 AM ET #539

    @wallstreetcappers

     Sounds like you're saying it's better to let other countries supply THE LARGEST commodity in the world and we'll just send our currency to them because planet! Lets not put Americans to work because we need to save the planet. Lets let Putin invade Ukraine because he wants the one (actually multiple) commodity that the entire world needs today and tomorrow. No wonder why Putin is invading. He wants to acquire what everyone NEEDS RIGHT NOW.

    I disagree on prices going sky high even if we are 100% energy independent. That's speculation. A large chuck of pricing is shipment. Don't have to ship very far when it's in your own backyard. 

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    @wallstreetcappers

     Sounds like you're saying it's better to let other countries supply THE LARGEST commodity in the world and we'll just send our currency to them because planet! Lets not put Americans to work because we need to save the planet. Lets let Putin invade Ukraine because he wants the one (actually multiple) commodity that the entire world needs today and tomorrow. No wonder why Putin is invading. He wants to acquire what everyone NEEDS RIGHT NOW.

    I disagree on prices going sky high even if we are 100% energy independent. That's speculation. A large chuck of pricing is shipment. Don't have to ship very far when it's in your own backyard. 

     
    fubah2
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 10:55 AM ET #540

    Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:

      Keystone helps China only, so last I checked why would the US help China get oil and why should we have EVER allowed Keystone? Why because the idiot politicians are suckers to PAC money and corporate donations, so the general public are gullible morons and do not understand the purpose and intent for Keystone, if they did I dont think most would want Canadian sour toxic nasty crude running for thousands of miles on our land so China can get refined product from Alberta....

    I could not possibly agree with you more on this. an_cheers

    But because it doesn't fit the anti-democrat/pro-trump narrative it is ignored

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    Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:

      Keystone helps China only, so last I checked why would the US help China get oil and why should we have EVER allowed Keystone? Why because the idiot politicians are suckers to PAC money and corporate donations, so the general public are gullible morons and do not understand the purpose and intent for Keystone, if they did I dont think most would want Canadian sour toxic nasty crude running for thousands of miles on our land so China can get refined product from Alberta....

    I could not possibly agree with you more on this. an_cheers

    But because it doesn't fit the anti-democrat/pro-trump narrative it is ignored

     
    baish2012
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 11:06 AM ET #541

    Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:

    @BigGame90  This isnt about Russia only, because in reality Russia impacts Brent since that is the product for that part of the world, West Texas which is our main source should not be impacted as much from a Euro Brent crude supply issue...yet it does and that very point is why all the comments from your Repub friends are useless. This isnt about our teeny Russian imports because as you mention it is a small figure for the US, yet the price of crude produced here has gone up the same. That is because this is a global supply connected commodity so even if we were 100% energy independent our product price would STILL GO UP because all markets are connected and say we were oil supplied without the need for Brent crude and Russia, the issue is that opportunity cost would incentivize West Texas suppliers to ship their product to Brent neighborhoods and that would raise prices for the US even if we were energy independent. All futures based commodity markets are linked and connected so this Trump good Biden to blame bullsh!t is useless.  Keystone helps China only, so last I checked why would the US help China get oil and why should we have EVER allowed Keystone? Why because the idiot politicians are suckers to PAC money and corporate donations, so the general public are gullible morons and do not understand the purpose and intent for Keystone, if they did I dont think most would want Canadian sour toxic nasty crude running for thousands of miles on our land so China can get refined product from Alberta....

    These are good points, wallstreetcappers.  I agree because had the pipeline finished (estimated mid 2023) the end product was indeed destined for overseas (China)

    Mind you further along in the future the use of Canadian heavy oil may well have been repurposed for American use if needed.  But even so, why?  America set a record in oil production last year and are the #1 producer in the world. That Canadian oil isn't cheap and I can't imagine the logic of paying more for their oil when our oil is cheaper.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:

    @BigGame90  This isnt about Russia only, because in reality Russia impacts Brent since that is the product for that part of the world, West Texas which is our main source should not be impacted as much from a Euro Brent crude supply issue...yet it does and that very point is why all the comments from your Repub friends are useless. This isnt about our teeny Russian imports because as you mention it is a small figure for the US, yet the price of crude produced here has gone up the same. That is because this is a global supply connected commodity so even if we were 100% energy independent our product price would STILL GO UP because all markets are connected and say we were oil supplied without the need for Brent crude and Russia, the issue is that opportunity cost would incentivize West Texas suppliers to ship their product to Brent neighborhoods and that would raise prices for the US even if we were energy independent. All futures based commodity markets are linked and connected so this Trump good Biden to blame bullsh!t is useless.  Keystone helps China only, so last I checked why would the US help China get oil and why should we have EVER allowed Keystone? Why because the idiot politicians are suckers to PAC money and corporate donations, so the general public are gullible morons and do not understand the purpose and intent for Keystone, if they did I dont think most would want Canadian sour toxic nasty crude running for thousands of miles on our land so China can get refined product from Alberta....

    These are good points, wallstreetcappers.  I agree because had the pipeline finished (estimated mid 2023) the end product was indeed destined for overseas (China)

    Mind you further along in the future the use of Canadian heavy oil may well have been repurposed for American use if needed.  But even so, why?  America set a record in oil production last year and are the #1 producer in the world. That Canadian oil isn't cheap and I can't imagine the logic of paying more for their oil when our oil is cheaper.

     
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 11:07 AM ET #542

    @BigGame90

     I am saying that the reason we even fracked in the first place was because of low interest rates and high oil prices. The cost of fracking is quite a bit higher than traditional crude so to make fracking economically viable prices have to be higher, the product which we get from fracking is not pure high quality crude it is also the same for tar sands or most any other petro sources that are of lower quality. It costs more to extract it costs more to refine, the resulting products from the sour/fracked crude yield lower so to make it viable the price for crude has to be higher, the price for sour crude is marginally lower than sweet crude. If the FED had not suppressed interest rates for the last 15 yrs fracking would never have come to fruition as it did, because the cost of capital is critical to speculative exploration for small firms that do the fracking. The lower cost of capital also gives companies like Shell and Exxon cheaper sources of cash to take more risk, so the reason we were "energy independent" was not for good long term reasons...rate suppression is a tax on the saver and a boon to corps and governments, I am not a fan of ZIRP for the last 15 yrs, and as you have seen even the whiff of higher rates crushes the marginal speculator. 

    I would rather focus on lower consumption than artificially making fracking viable especially fracking because it is toxic to the water table and destructive to the environment.

    Markets are interconnected, so higher prices on a global commodity will impact the entire complex, all global futures based products are interconnected, so the theory of independence does not guarantee any result for lower pricing, we live in a global economy so the complaint of Russia and commodity prices cannot be wiped away even if we supplied all our own crude because the reality is even if our production and consumption are equal, we STILL would be impacted from outside pricing, this country would NEVER be consumers of only West Texas crude, that is absurd to even consider that you can isolate crude AND be a capitalist economy, the concepts are polar opposites and impossible.

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    @BigGame90

     I am saying that the reason we even fracked in the first place was because of low interest rates and high oil prices. The cost of fracking is quite a bit higher than traditional crude so to make fracking economically viable prices have to be higher, the product which we get from fracking is not pure high quality crude it is also the same for tar sands or most any other petro sources that are of lower quality. It costs more to extract it costs more to refine, the resulting products from the sour/fracked crude yield lower so to make it viable the price for crude has to be higher, the price for sour crude is marginally lower than sweet crude. If the FED had not suppressed interest rates for the last 15 yrs fracking would never have come to fruition as it did, because the cost of capital is critical to speculative exploration for small firms that do the fracking. The lower cost of capital also gives companies like Shell and Exxon cheaper sources of cash to take more risk, so the reason we were "energy independent" was not for good long term reasons...rate suppression is a tax on the saver and a boon to corps and governments, I am not a fan of ZIRP for the last 15 yrs, and as you have seen even the whiff of higher rates crushes the marginal speculator. 

    I would rather focus on lower consumption than artificially making fracking viable especially fracking because it is toxic to the water table and destructive to the environment.

    Markets are interconnected, so higher prices on a global commodity will impact the entire complex, all global futures based products are interconnected, so the theory of independence does not guarantee any result for lower pricing, we live in a global economy so the complaint of Russia and commodity prices cannot be wiped away even if we supplied all our own crude because the reality is even if our production and consumption are equal, we STILL would be impacted from outside pricing, this country would NEVER be consumers of only West Texas crude, that is absurd to even consider that you can isolate crude AND be a capitalist economy, the concepts are polar opposites and impossible.

     
    BigGame90
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 11:44 AM ET #543

    @wallstreetcappers

    Low interest rates will boom a country, which is what we've seen since 2010. That doesn't last forever, unless you just keep printing money and devaluing the dollar. So of course fracking is lucrative when money is cheap and it takes money to find oil. Now when oil prices soar, everyone wants it because it will always be in high demand when the economy is moving (applying basic economics of supply and demand and pricing). Lower consumption is great for the environment, but it doesn't happen over night. Lower consumption needs to be phased in slowly, otherwise you have wild runs like we're seeing now. We can not magically go to clean energy over night like some think we can, we just don't have the infrastructure and it's not fully proven to be as efficient as oil. It looks like the goal is to siphon everyone's extra cash for a commodity that is necessary today (buy hey, everyone got free money for staying home so higher prices are all good, right?!). What happens when everyone's cash has been slowly sucked away from inflation? It'll get to a point when prices are too high, demand falls off, production slows and prices creep down, rinse and repeat the last 2 decades. But does it seem like everything is very extreme and fast paced? That's pretty damn unstable.

     Would it be better to have the option of having the product in your own backyard so you're not reliant on foreign countries for product? I believe those who have what you NEED can set the prices. If the US will not be producing as much (with China being a buyer of our product), then China will be looking else where for what they NEED. Do you really want China and Russia teaming up? That's what's happening. I don't want anything from China and at the same time I don't want China in bed with Russia. But it seems like lack of production in the US (yes, even though China is a buyer) will force buyers else where thus making foreign oil more lucrative.  Russia has what China wants and China will get what they want and Russia will do what ever it takes to provide, as we're currently witnessing.

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    @wallstreetcappers

    Low interest rates will boom a country, which is what we've seen since 2010. That doesn't last forever, unless you just keep printing money and devaluing the dollar. So of course fracking is lucrative when money is cheap and it takes money to find oil. Now when oil prices soar, everyone wants it because it will always be in high demand when the economy is moving (applying basic economics of supply and demand and pricing). Lower consumption is great for the environment, but it doesn't happen over night. Lower consumption needs to be phased in slowly, otherwise you have wild runs like we're seeing now. We can not magically go to clean energy over night like some think we can, we just don't have the infrastructure and it's not fully proven to be as efficient as oil. It looks like the goal is to siphon everyone's extra cash for a commodity that is necessary today (buy hey, everyone got free money for staying home so higher prices are all good, right?!). What happens when everyone's cash has been slowly sucked away from inflation? It'll get to a point when prices are too high, demand falls off, production slows and prices creep down, rinse and repeat the last 2 decades. But does it seem like everything is very extreme and fast paced? That's pretty damn unstable.

     Would it be better to have the option of having the product in your own backyard so you're not reliant on foreign countries for product? I believe those who have what you NEED can set the prices. If the US will not be producing as much (with China being a buyer of our product), then China will be looking else where for what they NEED. Do you really want China and Russia teaming up? That's what's happening. I don't want anything from China and at the same time I don't want China in bed with Russia. But it seems like lack of production in the US (yes, even though China is a buyer) will force buyers else where thus making foreign oil more lucrative.  Russia has what China wants and China will get what they want and Russia will do what ever it takes to provide, as we're currently witnessing.

     
    KellyM_1964
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 1:15 PM ET #544

    Quote Originally Posted by baish2012:

    These are good points, wallstreetcappers.  I agree because had the pipeline finished (estimated mid 2023) the end product was indeed destined for overseas (China) Mind you further along in the future the use of Canadian heavy oil may well have been repurposed for American use if needed.  But even so, why?  America set a record in oil production last year and are the #1 producer in the world. That Canadian oil isn't cheap and I can't imagine the logic of paying more for their oil when our oil is cheaper.

    makes sense 

    point is producing more oil is a step in the wrong direction for multiple reasons already posted

     

    "I'm the MOST HONEST human being that GOD EVER created!" - Donald "the felon" Trump
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    Quote Originally Posted by baish2012:

    These are good points, wallstreetcappers.  I agree because had the pipeline finished (estimated mid 2023) the end product was indeed destined for overseas (China) Mind you further along in the future the use of Canadian heavy oil may well have been repurposed for American use if needed.  But even so, why?  America set a record in oil production last year and are the #1 producer in the world. That Canadian oil isn't cheap and I can't imagine the logic of paying more for their oil when our oil is cheaper.

    makes sense 

    point is producing more oil is a step in the wrong direction for multiple reasons already posted

     

     
    BigGame90
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 1:24 PM ET #545

    @KellyM_1964

    Appears Kelly doesn't understand how the world stays open.

     How are you using your electricity right now? How is your home staying heated? How are you using your computer?

    You want to stop oil production, you're going to have a really hard time trying to live your current life.

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    @KellyM_1964

    Appears Kelly doesn't understand how the world stays open.

     How are you using your electricity right now? How is your home staying heated? How are you using your computer?

    You want to stop oil production, you're going to have a really hard time trying to live your current life.

     
    DeezyAZ81
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 2:03 PM ET #546

    Quote Originally Posted by BigGame90:

    @KellyM_1964 Appears Kelly doesn't understand how the world stays open.  How are you using your electricity right now? How is your home staying heated? How are you using your computer? You want to stop oil production, you're going to have a really hard time trying to live your current life.

    It seems that BigGame does not understand the differences between the resources natural gas and oil. an_light

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigGame90:

    @KellyM_1964 Appears Kelly doesn't understand how the world stays open.  How are you using your electricity right now? How is your home staying heated? How are you using your computer? You want to stop oil production, you're going to have a really hard time trying to live your current life.

    It seems that BigGame does not understand the differences between the resources natural gas and oil. an_light

     
    BigGame90
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 3:25 PM ET #547

    Quote Originally Posted by DeezyAZ81:

    Quote Originally Posted by BigGame90: @KellyM_1964 Appears Kelly doesn't understand how the world stays open.  How are you using your electricity right now? How is your home staying heated? How are you using your computer? You want to stop oil production, you're going to have a really hard time trying to live your current life. It seems that BigGame does not understand the differences between the resources natural gas and oil.

     

    Deezy forgot his own people that are trying to eliminate oil also want to eliminate natural gas. Oil just happens to be the headliner. Deezy also thinks the wind and sun will power the entire world.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeezyAZ81:

    Quote Originally Posted by BigGame90: @KellyM_1964 Appears Kelly doesn't understand how the world stays open.  How are you using your electricity right now? How is your home staying heated? How are you using your computer? You want to stop oil production, you're going to have a really hard time trying to live your current life. It seems that BigGame does not understand the differences between the resources natural gas and oil.

     

    Deezy forgot his own people that are trying to eliminate oil also want to eliminate natural gas. Oil just happens to be the headliner. Deezy also thinks the wind and sun will power the entire world.

     
    Zeus4par
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 3:37 PM ET #548

    Quote Originally Posted by KellyM_1964:

    Quote Originally Posted by baish2012: These are good points, wallstreetcappers.  I agree because had the pipeline finished (estimated mid 2023) the end product was indeed destined for overseas (China) Mind you further along in the future the use of Canadian heavy oil may well have been repurposed for American use if needed.  But even so, why?  America set a record in oil production last year and are the #1 producer in the world. That Canadian oil isn't cheap and I can't imagine the logic of paying more for their oil when our oil is cheaper.

    makes sense  point is producing more oil is a step in the wrong direction for multiple reasons already posted

    Totally agree.

    Reduce dependency on oil thumbs_up

     

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    Quote Originally Posted by KellyM_1964:

    Quote Originally Posted by baish2012: These are good points, wallstreetcappers.  I agree because had the pipeline finished (estimated mid 2023) the end product was indeed destined for overseas (China) Mind you further along in the future the use of Canadian heavy oil may well have been repurposed for American use if needed.  But even so, why?  America set a record in oil production last year and are the #1 producer in the world. That Canadian oil isn't cheap and I can't imagine the logic of paying more for their oil when our oil is cheaper.

    makes sense  point is producing more oil is a step in the wrong direction for multiple reasons already posted

    Totally agree.

    Reduce dependency on oil thumbs_up

     

     
    BigGame90
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 4:03 PM ET #549

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeus4par:

    Quote Originally Posted by KellyM_1964: Quote Originally Posted by baish2012: These are good points, wallstreetcappers.  I agree because had the pipeline finished (estimated mid 2023) the end product was indeed destined for overseas (China) Mind you further along in the future the use of Canadian heavy oil may well have been repurposed for American use if needed.  But even so, why?  America set a record in oil production last year and are the #1 producer in the world. That Canadian oil isn't cheap and I can't imagine the logic of paying more for their oil when our oil is cheaper. makes sense  point is producing more oil is a step in the wrong direction for multiple reasons already posted Totally agree. Reduce dependency on oil

     

    substitute it with what?

    We should also get rid of cars and planes and just start teleporting everywhere.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeus4par:

    Quote Originally Posted by KellyM_1964: Quote Originally Posted by baish2012: These are good points, wallstreetcappers.  I agree because had the pipeline finished (estimated mid 2023) the end product was indeed destined for overseas (China) Mind you further along in the future the use of Canadian heavy oil may well have been repurposed for American use if needed.  But even so, why?  America set a record in oil production last year and are the #1 producer in the world. That Canadian oil isn't cheap and I can't imagine the logic of paying more for their oil when our oil is cheaper. makes sense  point is producing more oil is a step in the wrong direction for multiple reasons already posted Totally agree. Reduce dependency on oil

     

    substitute it with what?

    We should also get rid of cars and planes and just start teleporting everywhere.

     
     
    KellyM_1964
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    Posted: Mar. 9, 2022 - 4:09 PM ET #550

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeus4par:

    Quote Originally Posted by KellyM_1964: Quote Originally Posted by baish2012: These are good points, wallstreetcappers.  I agree because had the pipeline finished (estimated mid 2023) the end product was indeed destined for overseas (China) Mind you further along in the future the use of Canadian heavy oil may well have been repurposed for American use if needed.  But even so, why?  America set a record in oil production last year and are the #1 producer in the world. That Canadian oil isn't cheap and I can't imagine the logic of paying more for their oil when our oil is cheaper. makes sense  point is producing more oil is a step in the wrong direction for multiple reasons already posted Totally agree. Reduce dependency on oil

    peace_5   only a fool thinks oil is the way of the future

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeus4par:

    Quote Originally Posted by KellyM_1964: Quote Originally Posted by baish2012: These are good points, wallstreetcappers.  I agree because had the pipeline finished (estimated mid 2023) the end product was indeed destined for overseas (China) Mind you further along in the future the use of Canadian heavy oil may well have been repurposed for American use if needed.  But even so, why?  America set a record in oil production last year and are the #1 producer in the world. That Canadian oil isn't cheap and I can't imagine the logic of paying more for their oil when our oil is cheaper. makes sense  point is producing more oil is a step in the wrong direction for multiple reasons already posted Totally agree. Reduce dependency on oil

    peace_5   only a fool thinks oil is the way of the future

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