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    All Forums | Penalty Box

    Looks like Trump learned a lesson from his first term. Avoiding politicians and hiring private business people to many cabinet positions. The kind of people who actually know how to get things done an

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    thirdperson
    wallstreetcappers
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    thirdperson
    thirdperson
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    Posted: Nov. 20, 2024 - 7:07 AM ET #26

    Quote Originally Posted by cdog8043:

    The current cabinet is the most unqualified cabinet in our history. They were appointed by Biden. Although unqualified, they were confirmed.

    No evidence Biden cabinet is the most unqualified in US history despite Fox news propaganda.  Siena survey of historians rank Biden 10th and Trump 45th best in executive appointments.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cdog8043:

    The current cabinet is the most unqualified cabinet in our history. They were appointed by Biden. Although unqualified, they were confirmed.

    No evidence Biden cabinet is the most unqualified in US history despite Fox news propaganda.  Siena survey of historians rank Biden 10th and Trump 45th best in executive appointments.

     
    wallstreetcappers
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    Posted: Nov. 20, 2024 - 11:28 AM ET #27

    @THEMUGG

     I thought you were a moderate? Not much more than lib bashing from you all this year.

    Trump can pick who he likes but those picks which seem to be based on payback and retaliation do have consequences so "libs" can question and criticize cabinet picks because he is making poor choices AND...the big AND here is those choices are not just for what TNC party position or who carries Trump's golf clubs it has enormous impacts on millions of people. I find his current choices to be heavy on rhetoric, heavy on retaliation and payback and very heavy on negative impacts for the citizens in which these nominations will service. Cabinet positions are for SERVING THIS COUNTRY not serving Trump a martini at the 10th hole of his golf course.

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    @THEMUGG

     I thought you were a moderate? Not much more than lib bashing from you all this year.

    Trump can pick who he likes but those picks which seem to be based on payback and retaliation do have consequences so "libs" can question and criticize cabinet picks because he is making poor choices AND...the big AND here is those choices are not just for what TNC party position or who carries Trump's golf clubs it has enormous impacts on millions of people. I find his current choices to be heavy on rhetoric, heavy on retaliation and payback and very heavy on negative impacts for the citizens in which these nominations will service. Cabinet positions are for SERVING THIS COUNTRY not serving Trump a martini at the 10th hole of his golf course.

     
    Midnight1
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    Posted: Nov. 20, 2024 - 12:26 PM ET #28

    Quote Originally Posted by cdog8043:

    @Midnight1  Yes,  sit quietly and watch—lots and lots of negativity from the Covers dems. You'll have 4 years. Do you get a hall pass for calling President-Elect a POS-?

    His potential cabinet right now looks more like a junk drawer.

    Sit quietly?? Nah, not me. I'll say my piece whenever I choose.

     

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    Quote Originally Posted by cdog8043:

    @Midnight1  Yes,  sit quietly and watch—lots and lots of negativity from the Covers dems. You'll have 4 years. Do you get a hall pass for calling President-Elect a POS-?

    His potential cabinet right now looks more like a junk drawer.

    Sit quietly?? Nah, not me. I'll say my piece whenever I choose.

     

     
    UNIMAN
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    Posted: Nov. 20, 2024 - 2:45 PM ET #29

    Quote Originally Posted by Raiders22:

    As a businessman and not a politician when he was elected president, Mr. Trump was something the federal government was not accustomed to. A person who demanded efficiency and expertise from their employees. His approach shook up the deep state, and they immediately went to work trying to destroy him as an individual to keep him from serving as the president. They did not know what to do. Here was a person who expected hard work, honesty, and loyalty to the American system of government. He demanded results but was rewarded with disloyalty and distaste for what he was asking. The bureaucrats hid behind the protection they had built for themselves over the years, thumbed their noses at Trump, and just did things their way.  Mr. Biden is an excellent example of the deep-state experience. Experience having nothing to do with balancing a checkbook, demanding efficiency from its employees, or facing being fired for incompetent work. This comment, in no way, infers he is a bad person. It only points out that his entire career since entering the workforce has been in government. Like many other long-time politicians in Congress, understanding how the private sector works is beyond their realm of experience, competence, and understanding. Over the years, as the federal government has become increasingly bloated, the employees have built a shield of rules and regulations that protect them. This is the buzzsaw of experience that President Trump encountered during his first term. Now, he knows better.

    Nailed it. an_clap

    peace_5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raiders22:

    As a businessman and not a politician when he was elected president, Mr. Trump was something the federal government was not accustomed to. A person who demanded efficiency and expertise from their employees. His approach shook up the deep state, and they immediately went to work trying to destroy him as an individual to keep him from serving as the president. They did not know what to do. Here was a person who expected hard work, honesty, and loyalty to the American system of government. He demanded results but was rewarded with disloyalty and distaste for what he was asking. The bureaucrats hid behind the protection they had built for themselves over the years, thumbed their noses at Trump, and just did things their way.  Mr. Biden is an excellent example of the deep-state experience. Experience having nothing to do with balancing a checkbook, demanding efficiency from its employees, or facing being fired for incompetent work. This comment, in no way, infers he is a bad person. It only points out that his entire career since entering the workforce has been in government. Like many other long-time politicians in Congress, understanding how the private sector works is beyond their realm of experience, competence, and understanding. Over the years, as the federal government has become increasingly bloated, the employees have built a shield of rules and regulations that protect them. This is the buzzsaw of experience that President Trump encountered during his first term. Now, he knows better.

    Nailed it. an_clap

    peace_5

     
    THEMUGG
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    Posted: Nov. 20, 2024 - 3:14 PM ET #30

    @wallstreetcappers

      I thought you were a moderate? You've been Trump bashing all year & the guy wasn't even in office.

     We all have our opinions. You can bash his cabinet picks all you want, but remember....it's supposed to be about who's best for the job, not just "firsts". You may prefer recycled politicians but all that gets us is more of the same.

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    @wallstreetcappers

      I thought you were a moderate? You've been Trump bashing all year & the guy wasn't even in office.

     We all have our opinions. You can bash his cabinet picks all you want, but remember....it's supposed to be about who's best for the job, not just "firsts". You may prefer recycled politicians but all that gets us is more of the same.

     
    wallstreetcappers
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    Posted: Nov. 20, 2024 - 4:48 PM ET #31

    @THEMUGG

     The difference is I am not leading with LIBERALS in every response unlike you and yup I am a moderate you are correct. The difference is the TNC is not really the RNC, it is the extremist antagonistic retaliatory set of the party and not much of the moderate part is remaining. The moderate part of the RNC is about fiscal responsibility, reasonable family values and working with the other side to a greater good and none of that exists with Trump so yup I am a moderate with nothing moderate to be involved with. I do not call the general RNC population terms like you do, I call Trump what he is and when someone supports or applauds or refers to Trump then I say it is so and that is the extent of it.

    If you guys want to be RNC then be RNC, this guy who took over your party with his family and his zero ego garbage is no more RNC than Bernie Sanders is RNC. So lets get that straight.

    My only comment is that Trump is filling positions based on favors, retaliation and to be a spectacle, he LOVES being the center of attention and these picks are completely unqualified and not at all what is best for the common citizen. EVERY politician is a servant of the general population...do not forget that and Trump is not serving the general population with retaliation and pay back appointments.

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    @THEMUGG

     The difference is I am not leading with LIBERALS in every response unlike you and yup I am a moderate you are correct. The difference is the TNC is not really the RNC, it is the extremist antagonistic retaliatory set of the party and not much of the moderate part is remaining. The moderate part of the RNC is about fiscal responsibility, reasonable family values and working with the other side to a greater good and none of that exists with Trump so yup I am a moderate with nothing moderate to be involved with. I do not call the general RNC population terms like you do, I call Trump what he is and when someone supports or applauds or refers to Trump then I say it is so and that is the extent of it.

    If you guys want to be RNC then be RNC, this guy who took over your party with his family and his zero ego garbage is no more RNC than Bernie Sanders is RNC. So lets get that straight.

    My only comment is that Trump is filling positions based on favors, retaliation and to be a spectacle, he LOVES being the center of attention and these picks are completely unqualified and not at all what is best for the common citizen. EVERY politician is a servant of the general population...do not forget that and Trump is not serving the general population with retaliation and pay back appointments.

     
    thirdperson
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    Posted: Nov. 20, 2024 - 4:49 PM ET #32

    Quote Originally Posted by SarasotaSlim:

    .however we are not a democrat country.. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of Americaand to the Republic for which it stands, one Nationunder God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all

    US is a democratic republic according to declaration of independence.  Democracy and republic mean the same.  A government where people elect the leaders.  Unlike a monarchy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SarasotaSlim:

    .however we are not a democrat country.. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of Americaand to the Republic for which it stands, one Nationunder God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all

    US is a democratic republic according to declaration of independence.  Democracy and republic mean the same.  A government where people elect the leaders.  Unlike a monarchy.

     
    cdog8043
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    Posted: Nov. 20, 2024 - 8:39 PM ET #33

    President Trump seems to be moving right along. A lot of excited Americans that can’t wait for January 20, 2025.

    61 days.

    Biden is sure to escalate the war.

    Another Biden/Harris mess - another Trump fix.

     

    I can only imagine when that day will come
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    President Trump seems to be moving right along. A lot of excited Americans that can’t wait for January 20, 2025.

    61 days.

    Biden is sure to escalate the war.

    Another Biden/Harris mess - another Trump fix.

     

     
    SarasotaSlim
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    Posted: Nov. 20, 2024 - 10:35 PM ET #34

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    US is a democratic republic according to declaration of independence.  Democracy and republic mean the same.  A government where people elect the leaders.  Unlike a monarchy.

    The United States is defined as a Constitutional Republic...

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    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    US is a democratic republic according to declaration of independence.  Democracy and republic mean the same.  A government where people elect the leaders.  Unlike a monarchy.

    The United States is defined as a Constitutional Republic...

     
    thirdperson
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 2:22 AM ET #35

    Trump wants to be a dictator by replacing professional experts with amateur loyalists to weaken checks and balances against his power grab.  That would be dangerous because it would increase the risks of illegal, impractical and unwise policies.  For example, blocking funds to federal agencies that have been authorized by congress.  The twice impeached convicted felon ranks last in moral authority among all presidents in survey of historians.  Senate should reject any unqualified appointee.

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    Trump wants to be a dictator by replacing professional experts with amateur loyalists to weaken checks and balances against his power grab.  That would be dangerous because it would increase the risks of illegal, impractical and unwise policies.  For example, blocking funds to federal agencies that have been authorized by congress.  The twice impeached convicted felon ranks last in moral authority among all presidents in survey of historians.  Senate should reject any unqualified appointee.

     
    jesron1269
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 11:42 AM ET #36

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Trump wants to be a dictator by replacing professional experts with amateur loyalists to weaken checks and balances against his power grab.  That would be dangerous because it would increase the risks of illegal, impractical and unwise policies.  For example, blocking funds to federal agencies that have been authorized by congress.  The twice impeached convicted felon ranks last in moral authority among all presidents in survey of historians.  Senate should reject any unqualified appointee.

    Ohhh boy. Here we go again. Lemmings to the cliff. If a coup was going to happen it would have happened the first time he was in office. Proof is in the pudding not lefty conspiracy theory.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Trump wants to be a dictator by replacing professional experts with amateur loyalists to weaken checks and balances against his power grab.  That would be dangerous because it would increase the risks of illegal, impractical and unwise policies.  For example, blocking funds to federal agencies that have been authorized by congress.  The twice impeached convicted felon ranks last in moral authority among all presidents in survey of historians.  Senate should reject any unqualified appointee.

    Ohhh boy. Here we go again. Lemmings to the cliff. If a coup was going to happen it would have happened the first time he was in office. Proof is in the pudding not lefty conspiracy theory.

     
    jesron1269
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 11:45 AM ET #37

    Quote Originally Posted by SarasotaSlim:

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson: US is a democratic republic according to declaration of independence.  Democracy and republic mean the same.  A government where people elect the leaders.  Unlike a monarchy. The United States is defined as a Constitutional Republic...

     

    This is correct. The people who don't know the difference really need to read up more. For the record the Declaration of Independence means jack $hit. The Constitution is what matters. Please people educate yourself. This is frankly embarrassing reading some of the stuff that people think they know something about in this forum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SarasotaSlim:

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson: US is a democratic republic according to declaration of independence.  Democracy and republic mean the same.  A government where people elect the leaders.  Unlike a monarchy. The United States is defined as a Constitutional Republic...

     

    This is correct. The people who don't know the difference really need to read up more. For the record the Declaration of Independence means jack $hit. The Constitution is what matters. Please people educate yourself. This is frankly embarrassing reading some of the stuff that people think they know something about in this forum.

     
    User854910
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 1:52 PM ET #38

    Post Deleted
    Don't let the book set the number
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    BigfootIsThere
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 2:00 PM ET #39

    Quote Originally Posted by unplucked_gem:

    @wallstreetcappers "My only comment is that Trump is filling positions based on favors, retaliation and to be a spectacle, he LOVES being the center of attention and these picks are completely unqualified and not at all what is best for the common citizen." Does your spectrum of possibility allow the notion that Washington DC no longer operates in the common citizen's best interest? If yes (your spectrum) then would it not also command the notion that his picks could be an effort to restore what he believes is best from the common citizen that voted him in?

     

    UG it's futile with the Left.  They want government IN their life, to make ALL decisions for them, to get anything FREE, to take away their pizza ovens, to take away their ceiling fans, to take away their gas stove, to tell them how much soda they can drink, to tell them how many miles they can drive each month.  Lefties don't want to have to think on their own, pretty much like children.

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    Quote Originally Posted by unplucked_gem:

    @wallstreetcappers "My only comment is that Trump is filling positions based on favors, retaliation and to be a spectacle, he LOVES being the center of attention and these picks are completely unqualified and not at all what is best for the common citizen." Does your spectrum of possibility allow the notion that Washington DC no longer operates in the common citizen's best interest? If yes (your spectrum) then would it not also command the notion that his picks could be an effort to restore what he believes is best from the common citizen that voted him in?

     

    UG it's futile with the Left.  They want government IN their life, to make ALL decisions for them, to get anything FREE, to take away their pizza ovens, to take away their ceiling fans, to take away their gas stove, to tell them how much soda they can drink, to tell them how many miles they can drive each month.  Lefties don't want to have to think on their own, pretty much like children.

     
    StumpTownStu
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 2:06 PM ET #40

    Quote Originally Posted by BigfootIsThere:

    Quote Originally Posted by unplucked_gem: @wallstreetcappers "My only comment is that Trump is filling positions based on favors, retaliation and to be a spectacle, he LOVES being the center of attention and these picks are completely unqualified and not at all what is best for the common citizen." Does your spectrum of possibility allow the notion that Washington DC no longer operates in the common citizen's best interest? If yes (your spectrum) then would it not also command the notion that his picks could be an effort to restore what he believes is best from the common citizen that voted him in?   UG it's futile with the Left.  They want government IN their life, to make ALL decisions for them, to get anything FREE, to take away their pizza ovens, to take away their ceiling fans, to take away their gas stove, to tell them how much soda they can drink, to tell them how many miles they can drive each month.  Lefties don't want to have to think on their own, pretty much like children.

    Take away their ceiling fans?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigfootIsThere:

    Quote Originally Posted by unplucked_gem: @wallstreetcappers "My only comment is that Trump is filling positions based on favors, retaliation and to be a spectacle, he LOVES being the center of attention and these picks are completely unqualified and not at all what is best for the common citizen." Does your spectrum of possibility allow the notion that Washington DC no longer operates in the common citizen's best interest? If yes (your spectrum) then would it not also command the notion that his picks could be an effort to restore what he believes is best from the common citizen that voted him in?   UG it's futile with the Left.  They want government IN their life, to make ALL decisions for them, to get anything FREE, to take away their pizza ovens, to take away their ceiling fans, to take away their gas stove, to tell them how much soda they can drink, to tell them how many miles they can drive each month.  Lefties don't want to have to think on their own, pretty much like children.

    Take away their ceiling fans?

     
    Raiders22
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 2:35 PM ET #41

    @StumpTownStu

     The issue with the fans is what’s not to like?

    You get a savings of less than $40 over the lifetime of the new design fan.  

    The manufacturer’s costs will be about $80M a year.  So, no doubt a lot will simply go out of business. 

    The Green Deal is just another huge scam and overreach of Big Government involvement. 
    They always fail to consider any unintended consequences.  It is all about the agenda. 

    You see this with everything from solar to EVs to appliances to wind.  
    Awful government overreach. 

    Then you have to wonder if ‘efficiency’ is more important than effectiveness.  You see that with the new ‘efficient’ washers, etc. 

    Huge scam. 

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    @StumpTownStu

     The issue with the fans is what’s not to like?

    You get a savings of less than $40 over the lifetime of the new design fan.  

    The manufacturer’s costs will be about $80M a year.  So, no doubt a lot will simply go out of business. 

    The Green Deal is just another huge scam and overreach of Big Government involvement. 
    They always fail to consider any unintended consequences.  It is all about the agenda. 

    You see this with everything from solar to EVs to appliances to wind.  
    Awful government overreach. 

    Then you have to wonder if ‘efficiency’ is more important than effectiveness.  You see that with the new ‘efficient’ washers, etc. 

    Huge scam. 

     
    wallstreetcappers
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 2:50 PM ET #42

    @unplucked_gem

     Your theory is based on the idea of Trump knowing what is best for the lowest common citizen. I do not agree with this thesis based on a multitude of reasons. One is that Trump has never lived the life of a common citizen he doesnt even know how to go shopping per his own words. He does not resonate with people who are the majority of the population and those of us who were not gifted wealth and have to scrape by are not his mindset or understanding and those of us are who HE is supposed to represent and serve. We are not his servants he is OUR servant and is to represent the least in this country not the most. I believe people who have lived through difficult times and had to make choices and sacrifices gain from these experiences the proper context and mindset to represent those who really need it. This is an area that Bernie Sanders is superior to any other politician that he understands the working class. Even the goofball Sinema down here she came from a single parent family in poverty and she worked her way through school and through the lower plumbing of the political process and not that it was some wealthy parent gifting her all she has. Trump has ZERO understanding and ability to serve those who he needs to serve the most.

    None of his cabinet choices have this ability or understanding either, none have a background or experience and since every single one of these choices are to SERVE the country and citizens they need to have an understanding of what they are best suited to do and how they can serve the LEAST in this country.

    I am not a supporter of the private sector transition to the government when the transition is from someone who is from the finance industry or who have conflicts of interest. Guys like swami and musk have no place in the government and their involvement adds zero value to the people who need the most.

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    @unplucked_gem

     Your theory is based on the idea of Trump knowing what is best for the lowest common citizen. I do not agree with this thesis based on a multitude of reasons. One is that Trump has never lived the life of a common citizen he doesnt even know how to go shopping per his own words. He does not resonate with people who are the majority of the population and those of us who were not gifted wealth and have to scrape by are not his mindset or understanding and those of us are who HE is supposed to represent and serve. We are not his servants he is OUR servant and is to represent the least in this country not the most. I believe people who have lived through difficult times and had to make choices and sacrifices gain from these experiences the proper context and mindset to represent those who really need it. This is an area that Bernie Sanders is superior to any other politician that he understands the working class. Even the goofball Sinema down here she came from a single parent family in poverty and she worked her way through school and through the lower plumbing of the political process and not that it was some wealthy parent gifting her all she has. Trump has ZERO understanding and ability to serve those who he needs to serve the most.

    None of his cabinet choices have this ability or understanding either, none have a background or experience and since every single one of these choices are to SERVE the country and citizens they need to have an understanding of what they are best suited to do and how they can serve the LEAST in this country.

    I am not a supporter of the private sector transition to the government when the transition is from someone who is from the finance industry or who have conflicts of interest. Guys like swami and musk have no place in the government and their involvement adds zero value to the people who need the most.

     
    Raiders22
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 3:02 PM ET #43

    @wallstreetcappers

     Your theory is based on the idea of Trump knowing what is best for the lowest common citizen. I do not agree with this thesis…

    You should disagree with it.  Because it is incorrect.  
    You simply set up a false thesis and then tried to tear it down.  

    It is not a thesis for ‘the lowest common citizen’.

    It is more about what he sees as best for the country overall.  That is completely different than having a thesis for the lazy, idle, shiftless, illegals, or criminals.  

    It should be seen more as what is in line with helping the ‘average citizen’ that wants to be productive and live in a safe country where they can be rewarded for their efforts. 
    Far different than rewarding the ‘lowest common citizen’.

    peace_5

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    @wallstreetcappers

     Your theory is based on the idea of Trump knowing what is best for the lowest common citizen. I do not agree with this thesis…

    You should disagree with it.  Because it is incorrect.  
    You simply set up a false thesis and then tried to tear it down.  

    It is not a thesis for ‘the lowest common citizen’.

    It is more about what he sees as best for the country overall.  That is completely different than having a thesis for the lazy, idle, shiftless, illegals, or criminals.  

    It should be seen more as what is in line with helping the ‘average citizen’ that wants to be productive and live in a safe country where they can be rewarded for their efforts. 
    Far different than rewarding the ‘lowest common citizen’.

    peace_5

     
    wallstreetcappers
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 4:03 PM ET #44

    @Raiders22

     Oh I stand by what I said based on what you DID NOT quote, see how that works? You take a few words I said not giving the full context and try to pick a fight with me yet again,

    As public servants a cabinet member, a politician, a government worker anyone associated with the government is a servant to the common citizen period. Your tangent Trump thinking about the overall direction of the country is nonsense but as I keep saying you and your experts are entitled to your opinion and I will not try and pick a word or two and preach to you based on a word or two out of a several paragraph post. A public servant needs to provide the greatest good for the greatest majority and the majority of US citizens are at and below median income. That means Trump and Musk and swami lacking understanding about the common citizen means they are not suited to consider what the COMMON citizen needs. Politics has always been about capitalism and serving corporate and elite interests and that is what makes the US very terrible, but the underlying true purpose of ANY government servant still should be to protect and aid those who have the least, those who are not given wealth or that have wealth even if it is earned. The citizen who in the other thread you actually said pays no taxes is the citizen who needs the most from the government and any citizen of any age or wealth or profile has the same rights and needs more than those who like uncle Warren have no need for even a small portion of their wealth.

    The wealthy generated their estates by taking from the majority, those business owners and capitalist would not have their wealth without it coming from the pockets of the majority who do not have the ability  to make choices they would like. The US as a country should take care of those with the least especially since the wealth gap is so wide and millions of people are going to struggle as they age without resources and assets. 

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    @Raiders22

     Oh I stand by what I said based on what you DID NOT quote, see how that works? You take a few words I said not giving the full context and try to pick a fight with me yet again,

    As public servants a cabinet member, a politician, a government worker anyone associated with the government is a servant to the common citizen period. Your tangent Trump thinking about the overall direction of the country is nonsense but as I keep saying you and your experts are entitled to your opinion and I will not try and pick a word or two and preach to you based on a word or two out of a several paragraph post. A public servant needs to provide the greatest good for the greatest majority and the majority of US citizens are at and below median income. That means Trump and Musk and swami lacking understanding about the common citizen means they are not suited to consider what the COMMON citizen needs. Politics has always been about capitalism and serving corporate and elite interests and that is what makes the US very terrible, but the underlying true purpose of ANY government servant still should be to protect and aid those who have the least, those who are not given wealth or that have wealth even if it is earned. The citizen who in the other thread you actually said pays no taxes is the citizen who needs the most from the government and any citizen of any age or wealth or profile has the same rights and needs more than those who like uncle Warren have no need for even a small portion of their wealth.

    The wealthy generated their estates by taking from the majority, those business owners and capitalist would not have their wealth without it coming from the pockets of the majority who do not have the ability  to make choices they would like. The US as a country should take care of those with the least especially since the wealth gap is so wide and millions of people are going to struggle as they age without resources and assets. 

     
    ABooksNightmare
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 5:11 PM ET #45

    Politics win

    COVERS allows u to tell someone they are sexually frustrated so long as ur hands are clean
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    Politics win

     
    StumpTownStu
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 5:19 PM ET #46

    Quote Originally Posted by Raiders22:

    @StumpTownStu  The issue with the fans is what’s not to like? You get a savings of less than $40 over the lifetime of the new design fan.   The manufacturer’s costs will be about $80M a year.  So, no doubt a lot will simply go out of business.  The Green Deal is just another huge scam and overreach of Big Government involvement. They always fail to consider any unintended consequences.  It is all about the agenda.  You see this with everything from solar to EVs to appliances to wind.  Awful government overreach.  Then you have to wonder if ‘efficiency’ is more important than effectiveness.  You see that with the new ‘efficient’ washers, etc.  Huge scam.

    I need more details. What about the ceiling fans? I haven't heard about this aspect. I'm aware of the ridiculous movement away from natural gas towards electricity for heating, cooking, etc. I'm aware of ridiculous mandates for electric lawn equipment. What's this about ceiling fans? Are they newly mandated "efficient" fans?

    R.I.P. #94 MARSHAWN KNEELAND - DC4L
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raiders22:

    @StumpTownStu  The issue with the fans is what’s not to like? You get a savings of less than $40 over the lifetime of the new design fan.   The manufacturer’s costs will be about $80M a year.  So, no doubt a lot will simply go out of business.  The Green Deal is just another huge scam and overreach of Big Government involvement. They always fail to consider any unintended consequences.  It is all about the agenda.  You see this with everything from solar to EVs to appliances to wind.  Awful government overreach.  Then you have to wonder if ‘efficiency’ is more important than effectiveness.  You see that with the new ‘efficient’ washers, etc.  Huge scam.

    I need more details. What about the ceiling fans? I haven't heard about this aspect. I'm aware of the ridiculous movement away from natural gas towards electricity for heating, cooking, etc. I'm aware of ridiculous mandates for electric lawn equipment. What's this about ceiling fans? Are they newly mandated "efficient" fans?

     
    Raiders22
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 5:23 PM ET #47

    @wallstreetcappers

     Yessir.  But what you started off with an incorrect thesis.  Call it straw-manning, call it setting up something you want to knock down, etc.

    So, of course you stand by it.

    I can quote the whole thing.  But it does not take away from the fact that your starting point was wrong.

    is a servant to the common citizen period and the lowest common citizen

    Are two very different things.  One implies someone that enjoys having the opportunity to live and get ahead and be rewarded.  The other simply infers that the government should be helping all of the idlers that refuse to attempt to get going on their own.

    One thesis Trump is using, the other he is flat-out denying.

    "Providing good for the common citizen" and providing bets opportunity for the citizen is vastly different.

    At no point has Trump indicated the folks work for him.  That is another abuse of freedom in the thesis.

    the majority of US citizens are at and below median income

    This is totally incorrect just by the definition of the word 'median'.

    The thesis should be to provide the best opportunity for the folks to better themselves NOT to simply provide for them.

    Another overriding fault with your thesis is that the folks stay at that tier.  They do not.  

    People are constantly moving up and down -- largely thought efforts of their own (or lack thereof).  They make plenty fuse of the opportunity that is provided to them.  Some do not and stagnate.

    But Trump hiring self-starters and ambitious people and folks that expect results is not a bad things.

    For far too long bureaucrats and politicians that have very little real world experience have made it worse for the 'common citizen'.

    It is time to see if people with experience in other aspects will work or not.

    See how that works?

    peace_5

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    @wallstreetcappers

     Yessir.  But what you started off with an incorrect thesis.  Call it straw-manning, call it setting up something you want to knock down, etc.

    So, of course you stand by it.

    I can quote the whole thing.  But it does not take away from the fact that your starting point was wrong.

    is a servant to the common citizen period and the lowest common citizen

    Are two very different things.  One implies someone that enjoys having the opportunity to live and get ahead and be rewarded.  The other simply infers that the government should be helping all of the idlers that refuse to attempt to get going on their own.

    One thesis Trump is using, the other he is flat-out denying.

    "Providing good for the common citizen" and providing bets opportunity for the citizen is vastly different.

    At no point has Trump indicated the folks work for him.  That is another abuse of freedom in the thesis.

    the majority of US citizens are at and below median income

    This is totally incorrect just by the definition of the word 'median'.

    The thesis should be to provide the best opportunity for the folks to better themselves NOT to simply provide for them.

    Another overriding fault with your thesis is that the folks stay at that tier.  They do not.  

    People are constantly moving up and down -- largely thought efforts of their own (or lack thereof).  They make plenty fuse of the opportunity that is provided to them.  Some do not and stagnate.

    But Trump hiring self-starters and ambitious people and folks that expect results is not a bad things.

    For far too long bureaucrats and politicians that have very little real world experience have made it worse for the 'common citizen'.

    It is time to see if people with experience in other aspects will work or not.

    See how that works?

    peace_5

     
    Raiders22
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 5:25 PM ET #48

    Quote Originally Posted by StumpTownStu:

    Quote Originally Posted by Raiders22: @StumpTownStu  The issue with the fans is what’s not to like? You get a savings of less than $40 over the lifetime of the new design fan.   The manufacturer’s costs will be about $80M a year.  So, no doubt a lot will simply go out of business.  The Green Deal is just another huge scam and overreach of Big Government involvement. They always fail to consider any unintended consequences.  It is all about the agenda.  You see this with everything from solar to EVs to appliances to wind.  Awful government overreach.  Then you have to wonder if ‘efficiency’ is more important than effectiveness.  You see that with the new ‘efficient’ washers, etc.  Huge scam. I need more details. What about the ceiling fans? I haven't heard about this aspect. I'm aware of the ridiculous movement away from natural gas towards electricity for heating, cooking, etc. I'm aware of ridiculous mandates for electric lawn equipment. What's this about ceiling fans? Are they newly mandated "efficient" fans?

    The push is to design them to be more 'efficient' because of the Green Energy scam.

    So, manufacturers will have to retool, etc.

    There is no great savings for the consumer.  Especially, if you already have a working fan, etc.

    It is another vast over reach by agenda-driven politicians to force things they deem as 'polluting' to be 'fixed'.  They do this without considering the unintended consequences of their actions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by StumpTownStu:

    Quote Originally Posted by Raiders22: @StumpTownStu  The issue with the fans is what’s not to like? You get a savings of less than $40 over the lifetime of the new design fan.   The manufacturer’s costs will be about $80M a year.  So, no doubt a lot will simply go out of business.  The Green Deal is just another huge scam and overreach of Big Government involvement. They always fail to consider any unintended consequences.  It is all about the agenda.  You see this with everything from solar to EVs to appliances to wind.  Awful government overreach.  Then you have to wonder if ‘efficiency’ is more important than effectiveness.  You see that with the new ‘efficient’ washers, etc.  Huge scam. I need more details. What about the ceiling fans? I haven't heard about this aspect. I'm aware of the ridiculous movement away from natural gas towards electricity for heating, cooking, etc. I'm aware of ridiculous mandates for electric lawn equipment. What's this about ceiling fans? Are they newly mandated "efficient" fans?

    The push is to design them to be more 'efficient' because of the Green Energy scam.

    So, manufacturers will have to retool, etc.

    There is no great savings for the consumer.  Especially, if you already have a working fan, etc.

    It is another vast over reach by agenda-driven politicians to force things they deem as 'polluting' to be 'fixed'.  They do this without considering the unintended consequences of their actions.

     
    Raiders22
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 5:27 PM ET #49

    @StumpTownStu

     Went jogging down beach to eat.

    Will send link or two about it in a bit.

    It is just nonsense and a scam.

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    @StumpTownStu

     Went jogging down beach to eat.

    Will send link or two about it in a bit.

    It is just nonsense and a scam.

     
     
    Raiders22
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    Posted: Nov. 21, 2024 - 6:12 PM ET #50

    @StumpTownStu

    The last one is the technical stuff.  The others are an overview of the proposal and the issues folks have with it, etc. 

    https://www.ntd.com/energy-department-proposes-new-restrictions-on-ceiling-fans_938586.html

     

    https://americanmilitarynews.com/2023/08/biden-admin-cracking-down-on-another-popular-home-device/

     

    https://www.eenews.net/articles/not-just-gas-stoves-gop-widens-assault-on-energy-efficiency/

     

    https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2018/07/f54/Jan%202018%20ASHRAE%20Journal%20article%20-%20New%20Federal%20Regulations%20for%20Ceiling%20Fans.pdf

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    @StumpTownStu

    The last one is the technical stuff.  The others are an overview of the proposal and the issues folks have with it, etc. 

    https://www.ntd.com/energy-department-proposes-new-restrictions-on-ceiling-fans_938586.html

     

    https://americanmilitarynews.com/2023/08/biden-admin-cracking-down-on-another-popular-home-device/

     

    https://www.eenews.net/articles/not-just-gas-stoves-gop-widens-assault-on-energy-efficiency/

     

    https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2018/07/f54/Jan%202018%20ASHRAE%20Journal%20article%20-%20New%20Federal%20Regulations%20for%20Ceiling%20Fans.pdf

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