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    All Forums | NBA Betting Forum

    Playoff Time (Finals version)

    123 ... 567 Next Last»
    Ice4Blood
    ENJOY
    MoneyShot
    BigEastExpert
    mmechunk
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    123 ... 567 Next Last»
     
    Ice4Blood
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    Posted: May. 31, 2010 - 4:05 PM ET #1

    Playoff tally: (+12.5 U)

    Big plays: 7-1 (+5.9 U)

    Small plays:  26-17 (+3.60 U)

    ML parlays:  4-1 (+1.65 U)

    ML dogs:  2-1  (+2.35 U)

    teasers:  2-2 (-0.1 U)

    Series bets:  2-3 (+0.1 U)

    Futures:  0-1  (-1.0 U)

     

    https://www.covers.com/postingforum/post01/showmessage.aspx?spt=22&sub=100752201&page=1

     

    Series bets

     

    Celtics (+170)  (2U)

     

     

    restarting this thread... made the mistake of responding to alias morons on that thread... my bad!  strictly business...

    mods, keep a look out... i'm sure he will make an appearance around 4am EST...

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    Playoff tally: (+12.5 U)

    Big plays: 7-1 (+5.9 U)

    Small plays:  26-17 (+3.60 U)

    ML parlays:  4-1 (+1.65 U)

    ML dogs:  2-1  (+2.35 U)

    teasers:  2-2 (-0.1 U)

    Series bets:  2-3 (+0.1 U)

    Futures:  0-1  (-1.0 U)

     

    https://www.covers.com/postingforum/post01/showmessage.aspx?spt=22&sub=100752201&page=1

     

    Series bets

     

    Celtics (+170)  (2U)

     

     

    restarting this thread... made the mistake of responding to alias morons on that thread... my bad!  strictly business...

    mods, keep a look out... i'm sure he will make an appearance around 4am EST...

     
    Ice4Blood
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    Posted: May. 31, 2010 - 4:06 PM ET #2

    Boston on offense:  of course the offense will run primarily through Rondo, but will adjust based on how LA chooses to defend... Allen and Pierce can both run offensive sets very well... Boston has 4 starters who can all put up 20+ on a given night, 2 who can put up 30+... they can adjust to what the defense gives them... Lakers have 2 great perimeter defenders, but have to figure out how to stop 3 great perimeter players...

    mismatches...

    • whoever Fisher defends will have a decided advantage... Rondo is too quick and will be able to penetrate, which is what LA doesn't want... if Fisher is on Allen is gives Ray the opportunity to get off too many good looks and post up...
    • Gasol is not fast enough to stay with KG inside without help, and will have trouble defending on the perimeter...
    • Celtics ball rotation and 3 pt shooting is the key to their success, and what kills opponents... if you have a weakness on defense, they will exploit it... patience is the key...

     

    LA on offense:  i think the Lakers will try a lot of different looks to take advantage of their athleticism... Kobe will draw a lot of attention, and will force the Celtics to play Tony Allen extended minutes... Kobe and Fisher will both run offensive sets, and the Lakers will try to run a fast tempo to keep Boston out of their halfcourt sets... all 5 Boston starters are very strong defensively...

    mismatches...

    • nobody can shutdown Kobe one-on-one... Pierce did a great job on Kobe and Lebron in 2008, and did a great job on Lebron against this year... Celtics will have to shuffle defenders to absorb fouls...
    • will be a game between the Cs ability to help on Kobe and the Lakers ability to find the open man rotating... they are an excellent passing team... hitting open shots will be key for guys like Artest and Fisher...

     

    Boston bench:  if Sheed is healthy, he will be a factor... Boston has a pretty big edge in bench play, if health is not an issue... Boston can count on quality play from Wallace, Davis, Tony Allen, Robinson and Daniels when they are on the court... they rely on the first 3 guys to carry big roles, even in crunch time... depth allows Boston a little extra leeway on fouls...

    Lakers bench:  Odom is the story... he brings instant offense, and allows Phil to essentially use a 6-man lineup, with Odom for offense and Artest for derense... i also expect to see a big lineup with Fisher on the bench, or a small lineup with Bynum on the bench... other bench players can provide a lift when on, but are eratic, and how much will Phil be able to depend on them to give quality minutes against Boston's bench players is an unknown...

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    Boston on offense:  of course the offense will run primarily through Rondo, but will adjust based on how LA chooses to defend... Allen and Pierce can both run offensive sets very well... Boston has 4 starters who can all put up 20+ on a given night, 2 who can put up 30+... they can adjust to what the defense gives them... Lakers have 2 great perimeter defenders, but have to figure out how to stop 3 great perimeter players...

    mismatches...

    • whoever Fisher defends will have a decided advantage... Rondo is too quick and will be able to penetrate, which is what LA doesn't want... if Fisher is on Allen is gives Ray the opportunity to get off too many good looks and post up...
    • Gasol is not fast enough to stay with KG inside without help, and will have trouble defending on the perimeter...
    • Celtics ball rotation and 3 pt shooting is the key to their success, and what kills opponents... if you have a weakness on defense, they will exploit it... patience is the key...

     

    LA on offense:  i think the Lakers will try a lot of different looks to take advantage of their athleticism... Kobe will draw a lot of attention, and will force the Celtics to play Tony Allen extended minutes... Kobe and Fisher will both run offensive sets, and the Lakers will try to run a fast tempo to keep Boston out of their halfcourt sets... all 5 Boston starters are very strong defensively...

    mismatches...

    • nobody can shutdown Kobe one-on-one... Pierce did a great job on Kobe and Lebron in 2008, and did a great job on Lebron against this year... Celtics will have to shuffle defenders to absorb fouls...
    • will be a game between the Cs ability to help on Kobe and the Lakers ability to find the open man rotating... they are an excellent passing team... hitting open shots will be key for guys like Artest and Fisher...

     

    Boston bench:  if Sheed is healthy, he will be a factor... Boston has a pretty big edge in bench play, if health is not an issue... Boston can count on quality play from Wallace, Davis, Tony Allen, Robinson and Daniels when they are on the court... they rely on the first 3 guys to carry big roles, even in crunch time... depth allows Boston a little extra leeway on fouls...

    Lakers bench:  Odom is the story... he brings instant offense, and allows Phil to essentially use a 6-man lineup, with Odom for offense and Artest for derense... i also expect to see a big lineup with Fisher on the bench, or a small lineup with Bynum on the bench... other bench players can provide a lift when on, but are eratic, and how much will Phil be able to depend on them to give quality minutes against Boston's bench players is an unknown...

     
    Ice4Blood
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    Posted: May. 31, 2010 - 4:06 PM ET #3

    Intangibles...

    Floor generals:  both defenses (and coaches) will be switching up their looks and playing a veritable chess match trying to find favorable matchups... whichever team can adjust on the fly and find the mismatches on offense should do well... Rondo gives Boston a big edge here, as he has proven to be an extension of Rivers on the court...

    Revenge:  i always say this is an overrated angle, but clearly here it has merit... not just because Boston beat LA two years ago in the Finals... but because (a) they did it in such a humiliating blowout fashion, and (b) the bus incident outside the stadium afterwards clearly fueled the fire in a big way... i considered LA to be a team that needed something to motivate them, and the Celtics are the one thing that can do that...

    Toughness:  until proven otherwise, the Lakers are not a tough team... they are big, but not tough... the Celtics, on the other hand, set the standard for defense and toughness in the NBA right now... can LA take that revenge factor and convert it into the mental toughness they need? 

    Confidence:  Pierce, Allen, KG, Rondo, Perkins... those guys have no fear... they have never been beaten in a 7 game series, and they have no reason to believe they can be beaten... they have still never faced a dire situation in any playoff series... have never trailed after the first 4 games of a series... and have only once trailed in any playoff series (2-1 to Cleveland this year)...

    Tough road:  if the Celtics win the NBA championship, they will have earned it... beating the #1, #2 and #3 teams in the NBA this season, and doing it without homecourt in any of those series... i have always been of the opinion that the teams who tune up against the best competition are a leg up when it comes time to decide the championship...

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    Intangibles...

    Floor generals:  both defenses (and coaches) will be switching up their looks and playing a veritable chess match trying to find favorable matchups... whichever team can adjust on the fly and find the mismatches on offense should do well... Rondo gives Boston a big edge here, as he has proven to be an extension of Rivers on the court...

    Revenge:  i always say this is an overrated angle, but clearly here it has merit... not just because Boston beat LA two years ago in the Finals... but because (a) they did it in such a humiliating blowout fashion, and (b) the bus incident outside the stadium afterwards clearly fueled the fire in a big way... i considered LA to be a team that needed something to motivate them, and the Celtics are the one thing that can do that...

    Toughness:  until proven otherwise, the Lakers are not a tough team... they are big, but not tough... the Celtics, on the other hand, set the standard for defense and toughness in the NBA right now... can LA take that revenge factor and convert it into the mental toughness they need? 

    Confidence:  Pierce, Allen, KG, Rondo, Perkins... those guys have no fear... they have never been beaten in a 7 game series, and they have no reason to believe they can be beaten... they have still never faced a dire situation in any playoff series... have never trailed after the first 4 games of a series... and have only once trailed in any playoff series (2-1 to Cleveland this year)...

    Tough road:  if the Celtics win the NBA championship, they will have earned it... beating the #1, #2 and #3 teams in the NBA this season, and doing it without homecourt in any of those series... i have always been of the opinion that the teams who tune up against the best competition are a leg up when it comes time to decide the championship...

     
    ENJOY
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    Posted: May. 31, 2010 - 4:09 PM ET #4

    NO HOUSE NO POSEY............  THOSE GUYS WERE BEAST IN 2008.....................  EITHER WAY GOOD LUCK.......NOT HERE TO BASH YOUR PLAYBRO.

     

    GL   IM STICKING TO TOTAL PLAYS FOR ME

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    NO HOUSE NO POSEY............  THOSE GUYS WERE BEAST IN 2008.....................  EITHER WAY GOOD LUCK.......NOT HERE TO BASH YOUR PLAYBRO.

     

    GL   IM STICKING TO TOTAL PLAYS FOR ME

     
    Ice4Blood
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    Posted: May. 31, 2010 - 4:24 PM ET #5

    Quote Originally Posted by ENJOY:

    NO HOUSE NO POSEY............  THOSE GUYS WERE BEAST IN 2008.....................  EITHER WAY GOOD LUCK.......NOT HERE TO BASH YOUR PLAYBRO.

     

    GL   IM STICKING TO TOTAL PLAYS FOR ME

    just to give a little background to what i am about to say, so it is not interpreted that i am not trying to rationalize my bet, or that i am not seeing it clearly...

    in 2008, i had big series bets on Boston (-120) vs Detroit and Boston (+160) vs LA... i also bet on Boston ATS and ML in all 3 games in LA... i was very in tune with that team, and i followed it closely... i know how good they were...

    in 2009, the day it was announced that KG was done for the season (right before the playoffs started), i dropped down a big bet on LA to win the championship...

     

    having said that... not only were House and Posey both HUGE in that playoff run, but you left out PJ Brown and Leon Powe, who both had a big impact in their championship run...

    however, the Celtics have replaced those 4 players in their rotation, with these 4 players:  Rasheed Wallace, Glen Davis, Tony Allen and Nate Robinson...

    i don't think they have lost anything... if you really break that down, and look at how all 4 have played and what roles they fill on that team... the Cs 9-man rotation is every bit as strong as 2008, or stronger, since Rondo has made HUGE leaps since 2008...

    anyone who questioned the House for Nate trade simply didn't understand the issue... Nate gives Boston everything Eddie did and a bit more... great addition to that roster... Sheed is a starter on almost every team in the NBA... Tony Allen is one of the top 5 perimeter defenders in the NBA when healthy (just like Posey was)...

    having bet on Boston back then, i knew their bench was a big part of their success... and betting on them now, i am doing it in big part because of how strong of a bench they have, once again...

     

    thanks for the post, Enjoy...

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    Quote Originally Posted by ENJOY:

    NO HOUSE NO POSEY............  THOSE GUYS WERE BEAST IN 2008.....................  EITHER WAY GOOD LUCK.......NOT HERE TO BASH YOUR PLAYBRO.

     

    GL   IM STICKING TO TOTAL PLAYS FOR ME

    just to give a little background to what i am about to say, so it is not interpreted that i am not trying to rationalize my bet, or that i am not seeing it clearly...

    in 2008, i had big series bets on Boston (-120) vs Detroit and Boston (+160) vs LA... i also bet on Boston ATS and ML in all 3 games in LA... i was very in tune with that team, and i followed it closely... i know how good they were...

    in 2009, the day it was announced that KG was done for the season (right before the playoffs started), i dropped down a big bet on LA to win the championship...

     

    having said that... not only were House and Posey both HUGE in that playoff run, but you left out PJ Brown and Leon Powe, who both had a big impact in their championship run...

    however, the Celtics have replaced those 4 players in their rotation, with these 4 players:  Rasheed Wallace, Glen Davis, Tony Allen and Nate Robinson...

    i don't think they have lost anything... if you really break that down, and look at how all 4 have played and what roles they fill on that team... the Cs 9-man rotation is every bit as strong as 2008, or stronger, since Rondo has made HUGE leaps since 2008...

    anyone who questioned the House for Nate trade simply didn't understand the issue... Nate gives Boston everything Eddie did and a bit more... great addition to that roster... Sheed is a starter on almost every team in the NBA... Tony Allen is one of the top 5 perimeter defenders in the NBA when healthy (just like Posey was)...

    having bet on Boston back then, i knew their bench was a big part of their success... and betting on them now, i am doing it in big part because of how strong of a bench they have, once again...

     

    thanks for the post, Enjoy...

     
    ENJOY
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    Posted: May. 31, 2010 - 4:27 PM ET #6

    GL BRO.............EITHER WAY ITS GOING TO BE FUN TO WATCH.....................

     

    All the respected cappers on COVERS never talk shit..........................  and you sir are respected....

    gl

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    GL BRO.............EITHER WAY ITS GOING TO BE FUN TO WATCH.....................

     

    All the respected cappers on COVERS never talk shit..........................  and you sir are respected....

    gl

     
    MoneyShot
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    Posted: May. 31, 2010 - 4:35 PM ET #7

    Celtics

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    Celtics

     
    BigEastExpert
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    Posted: May. 31, 2010 - 5:25 PM ET #8

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    mmechunk
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 12:50 AM ET #9

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    CrazyMilkMan
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 1:46 AM ET #10

    On it as well.

    Not only it is a sound bet but it has really good value as well.
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    On it as well.

    Not only it is a sound bet but it has really good value as well.
     
    ratherBgambling
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 1:54 AM ET #11

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    SuperCoolGuy
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 3:24 AM ET #12

    I read these forums all the time and wading through the various douchebags and real people is hard, that's why i've never posted anything until now. you have a good write up but i want to tell you why you are wrong imo. so heres my point counterpoint to you and others. take it how you want to take it.

    Boston on offense:  of course the offense will run primarily through Rondo, but will adjust based on how LA chooses to defend... Allen and Pierce can both run offensive sets very well... Boston has 4 starters who can all put up 20+ on a given night, 2 who can put up 30+... they can adjust to what the defense gives them... Lakers have 2 great perimeter defenders, but have to figure out how to stop 3 great perimeter players...

    You are highly undervaluing the lakers defense, iIMO I think for 75-80% of this series you will see Kobe on Rondo, with Fisher and Kobe switching from time to time. With that said of course Rondos speed will help and cause problems. However when he gets past Kobe and into the lane Gasol, Bynum, or Odom will be there on the help defense. in the Orl. series all he had to worry about was Howard patrolling and he could kick it out easier, not so w/ 2 bigs crowding the lane. also I dont know how Rondo turned into god all, he has definitely stepped up and is a great player, but hes not a game changer yet. Don't let ESPN and TNT brainwash you like the rest of the masses. He was neutralized somewhat for alot of the orl series by good def. from Nelson. His stats were down compared to the Cavs series . Artest will be glued to Pierces hip, and Paul is more than a step slower than Artest, don't expect Pierce to hoist big numbers, Ron has proven time and time again he can lock down a prolific scorer or 2. Not to say Pierce won't get his once or twice, but not enough to make a difference in this series. Also are you seriously telling me that the lakers don't have 4, maybe even 5 or 6 players that can score 20+, and 3-4 who are capable of putting up 30? cause if you are that is ludicrous, so the you have to get the Lakers the scoring edge there. Then you say the lakers perimeter play runs only 2 deep, okay i'll give you that. but who is the great 3rd perimeter players for the celts, cause i know its not rondo. so who is the 3rd option? allen (no) nate (no) sheed, kg, big baby? lakers have kobe, fish who is a diff. player come playoffs, celts have pierce and ray on the perimeter. after that i would call it a stalemate between the rest of lakers and c's starters and bench. 

    mismatches...

    • whoever Fisher defends will have a decided advantage... Rondo is too quick and will be able to penetrate, which is what LA doesn't want... if Fisher is on Allen is gives Ray the opportunity to get off too many good looks and post up...
    • like i said i think Kobe will see alot of time on Rondo which means Fish will be on Ray alot. With that being said at this point in their careers, Fish and Ray is alot more even of a matchup than you may think. Allen gets half his looks coming of set screens and pick and pops. he's not much of a slasher and driver anymore. We all saw last series how well fisher moved with and through screens against a superior pick and roll and pick and pop team in the suns. Also you are dead wrong if you think allen is gonna post up fisher, you may be right and ray gets a better look here and ther w/ the height advantage, but fisher is way stronger than allen and outweigh Allen by almost 10 lbs. I don't see Allen having a huge effect, rondo will get his here and there, but overall the lakers have been dealing with upper echelon point guards the whole playoffs, and Rondo is not in that category yet.
    • Gasol is not fast enough to stay with KG inside without help, and will have trouble defending on the perimeter...
    • Not gonna dwell on this alot, but that is just wrong. i think you're gonna see Gasol's best ball in this series. He remembers all the shit  he got in the last series being called out as such a soft ass box which he was. This series is gonna define Gasol for quite sometime I think. Plus I don't know where you get KG is faster than Gasol, Gasol possesses every edge on KG but intensity and toughness, which I think Gasol is gonna bring in spades this series.
    • Celtics ball rotation and 3 pt shooting is the key to their success, and what kills opponents... if you have a weakness on defense, they will exploit it... patience is the key...
    • Again Celtics do move the ball well, but 3 point shooting. I'm sorry but this isn't 2008, i don't see House or Posey in green and white. I will give you a slight edge in ball movement , but only cause Kobe can go off anytime and that can be a bigger plus than moving the ball efficiently, but don't sleep on his assist stats in the Suns series. 3 pt shooting i'll call it a draw.

     


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    I read these forums all the time and wading through the various douchebags and real people is hard, that's why i've never posted anything until now. you have a good write up but i want to tell you why you are wrong imo. so heres my point counterpoint to you and others. take it how you want to take it.

    Boston on offense:  of course the offense will run primarily through Rondo, but will adjust based on how LA chooses to defend... Allen and Pierce can both run offensive sets very well... Boston has 4 starters who can all put up 20+ on a given night, 2 who can put up 30+... they can adjust to what the defense gives them... Lakers have 2 great perimeter defenders, but have to figure out how to stop 3 great perimeter players...

    You are highly undervaluing the lakers defense, iIMO I think for 75-80% of this series you will see Kobe on Rondo, with Fisher and Kobe switching from time to time. With that said of course Rondos speed will help and cause problems. However when he gets past Kobe and into the lane Gasol, Bynum, or Odom will be there on the help defense. in the Orl. series all he had to worry about was Howard patrolling and he could kick it out easier, not so w/ 2 bigs crowding the lane. also I dont know how Rondo turned into god all, he has definitely stepped up and is a great player, but hes not a game changer yet. Don't let ESPN and TNT brainwash you like the rest of the masses. He was neutralized somewhat for alot of the orl series by good def. from Nelson. His stats were down compared to the Cavs series . Artest will be glued to Pierces hip, and Paul is more than a step slower than Artest, don't expect Pierce to hoist big numbers, Ron has proven time and time again he can lock down a prolific scorer or 2. Not to say Pierce won't get his once or twice, but not enough to make a difference in this series. Also are you seriously telling me that the lakers don't have 4, maybe even 5 or 6 players that can score 20+, and 3-4 who are capable of putting up 30? cause if you are that is ludicrous, so the you have to get the Lakers the scoring edge there. Then you say the lakers perimeter play runs only 2 deep, okay i'll give you that. but who is the great 3rd perimeter players for the celts, cause i know its not rondo. so who is the 3rd option? allen (no) nate (no) sheed, kg, big baby? lakers have kobe, fish who is a diff. player come playoffs, celts have pierce and ray on the perimeter. after that i would call it a stalemate between the rest of lakers and c's starters and bench. 

    mismatches...

    • whoever Fisher defends will have a decided advantage... Rondo is too quick and will be able to penetrate, which is what LA doesn't want... if Fisher is on Allen is gives Ray the opportunity to get off too many good looks and post up...
    • like i said i think Kobe will see alot of time on Rondo which means Fish will be on Ray alot. With that being said at this point in their careers, Fish and Ray is alot more even of a matchup than you may think. Allen gets half his looks coming of set screens and pick and pops. he's not much of a slasher and driver anymore. We all saw last series how well fisher moved with and through screens against a superior pick and roll and pick and pop team in the suns. Also you are dead wrong if you think allen is gonna post up fisher, you may be right and ray gets a better look here and ther w/ the height advantage, but fisher is way stronger than allen and outweigh Allen by almost 10 lbs. I don't see Allen having a huge effect, rondo will get his here and there, but overall the lakers have been dealing with upper echelon point guards the whole playoffs, and Rondo is not in that category yet.
    • Gasol is not fast enough to stay with KG inside without help, and will have trouble defending on the perimeter...
    • Not gonna dwell on this alot, but that is just wrong. i think you're gonna see Gasol's best ball in this series. He remembers all the shit  he got in the last series being called out as such a soft ass box which he was. This series is gonna define Gasol for quite sometime I think. Plus I don't know where you get KG is faster than Gasol, Gasol possesses every edge on KG but intensity and toughness, which I think Gasol is gonna bring in spades this series.
    • Celtics ball rotation and 3 pt shooting is the key to their success, and what kills opponents... if you have a weakness on defense, they will exploit it... patience is the key...
    • Again Celtics do move the ball well, but 3 point shooting. I'm sorry but this isn't 2008, i don't see House or Posey in green and white. I will give you a slight edge in ball movement , but only cause Kobe can go off anytime and that can be a bigger plus than moving the ball efficiently, but don't sleep on his assist stats in the Suns series. 3 pt shooting i'll call it a draw.

     


     
    SuperCoolGuy
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 3:24 AM ET #13

    LA on offense:  i think the Lakers will try a lot of different looks to take advantage of their athleticism... Kobe will draw a lot of attention, and will force the Celtics to play Tony Allen extended minutes... Kobe and Fisher will both run offensive sets, and the Lakers will try to run a fast tempo to keep Boston out of their halfcourt sets... all 5 Boston starters are very strong defensively...

    I pretty much covered everything on the above analysis no reason to get into it again here.

    mismatches...

    • nobody can shutdown Kobe one-on-one... Pierce did a great job on Kobe and Lebron in 2008, and did a great job on Lebron against this year... Celtics will have to shuffle defenders to absorb fouls...
    • will be a game between the Cs ability to help on Kobe and the Lakers ability to find the open man rotating... they are an excellent passing team... hitting open shots will be key for guys like Artest and Fisher...

    • Kobe's gonna be Kobe, it is gonna be on Gasol to play big and tough, and the other guys to knock down shots. Lakers are shooting at a very high % team wise right now, and it's gonna be alot for the Celtics to trip them up. Celtics are not as fluid a offense as Lakers, and tend to get into clock trouble and scorless droughts. Not good if it comes down to a game of runs and defensive stops, as i think the Lakers will Shoot better than the celtics for the series, and get the stops they need.

     

    Boston bench:  if Sheed is healthy, he will be a factor... Boston has a pretty big edge in bench play, if health is not an issue... Boston can count on quality play from Wallace, Davis, Tony Allen, Robinson and Daniels when they are on the court... they rely on the first 3 guys to carry big roles, even in crunch time... depth allows Boston a little extra leeway on fouls...

    I imagine Sheed will see alot of time on Odom and I doubt he will 100% healthy which has ineffective written all over it. Odom can come out on D  and neutralize his 3 ball, all Sheed is good for these days is a timely 3 and some mid range jumpers. A poor mans Robert Horry if you will. Nate has only started playing recently and I think he's too excitable, good in short doses but any extended minutes can neutralize and stall the offense. he is more off than on. Celtics bench is no better than the lakers, the lakers already faced the best bench play in the playoff in the Suns. I don't see the celtics bench players really hurting them.

    Lakers bench:  Odom is the story... he brings instant offense, and allows Phil to essentially use a 6-man lineup, with Odom for offense and Artest for derense... i also expect to see a big lineup with Fisher on the bench, or a small lineup with Bynum on the bench... other bench players can provide a lift when on, but are eratic, and how much will Phil be able to depend on them to give quality minutes against Boston's bench players is an unknown...

    You said it the Lakers don't really rely on their bench that much. All they need is a little solid defense and some chip ins from Farmar Sasha and Brown.  Farmar has been shooting well but is a defensive liability. i like Sasha getting more minutes as he is a more effective defender. But like I said I think Lakers bench gets the edge because of Odom's ability to be so effective. Like you said essentially a 6th starter.

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    LA on offense:  i think the Lakers will try a lot of different looks to take advantage of their athleticism... Kobe will draw a lot of attention, and will force the Celtics to play Tony Allen extended minutes... Kobe and Fisher will both run offensive sets, and the Lakers will try to run a fast tempo to keep Boston out of their halfcourt sets... all 5 Boston starters are very strong defensively...

    I pretty much covered everything on the above analysis no reason to get into it again here.

    mismatches...

    • nobody can shutdown Kobe one-on-one... Pierce did a great job on Kobe and Lebron in 2008, and did a great job on Lebron against this year... Celtics will have to shuffle defenders to absorb fouls...
    • will be a game between the Cs ability to help on Kobe and the Lakers ability to find the open man rotating... they are an excellent passing team... hitting open shots will be key for guys like Artest and Fisher...

    • Kobe's gonna be Kobe, it is gonna be on Gasol to play big and tough, and the other guys to knock down shots. Lakers are shooting at a very high % team wise right now, and it's gonna be alot for the Celtics to trip them up. Celtics are not as fluid a offense as Lakers, and tend to get into clock trouble and scorless droughts. Not good if it comes down to a game of runs and defensive stops, as i think the Lakers will Shoot better than the celtics for the series, and get the stops they need.

     

    Boston bench:  if Sheed is healthy, he will be a factor... Boston has a pretty big edge in bench play, if health is not an issue... Boston can count on quality play from Wallace, Davis, Tony Allen, Robinson and Daniels when they are on the court... they rely on the first 3 guys to carry big roles, even in crunch time... depth allows Boston a little extra leeway on fouls...

    I imagine Sheed will see alot of time on Odom and I doubt he will 100% healthy which has ineffective written all over it. Odom can come out on D  and neutralize his 3 ball, all Sheed is good for these days is a timely 3 and some mid range jumpers. A poor mans Robert Horry if you will. Nate has only started playing recently and I think he's too excitable, good in short doses but any extended minutes can neutralize and stall the offense. he is more off than on. Celtics bench is no better than the lakers, the lakers already faced the best bench play in the playoff in the Suns. I don't see the celtics bench players really hurting them.

    Lakers bench:  Odom is the story... he brings instant offense, and allows Phil to essentially use a 6-man lineup, with Odom for offense and Artest for derense... i also expect to see a big lineup with Fisher on the bench, or a small lineup with Bynum on the bench... other bench players can provide a lift when on, but are eratic, and how much will Phil be able to depend on them to give quality minutes against Boston's bench players is an unknown...

    You said it the Lakers don't really rely on their bench that much. All they need is a little solid defense and some chip ins from Farmar Sasha and Brown.  Farmar has been shooting well but is a defensive liability. i like Sasha getting more minutes as he is a more effective defender. But like I said I think Lakers bench gets the edge because of Odom's ability to be so effective. Like you said essentially a 6th starter.

     
    PrimeTimeBoys
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 3:39 AM ET #14

    Go Celtics
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    Go Celtics
     
    jwheels86
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 3:49 AM ET #15

    Well at least we know that we have a new Laker fan on the boards thats usually lurking.
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    Well at least we know that we have a new Laker fan on the boards thats usually lurking.
     
    SuperCoolGuy
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 3:51 AM ET #16

    Intangibles...

    Floor generals:  both defenses (and coaches) will be switching up their looks and playing a veritable chess match trying to find favorable matchups... whichever team can adjust on the fly and find the mismatches on offense should do well... Rondo gives Boston a big edge here, as he has proven to be an extension of Rivers on the court...

    Wow really, so if Kobe and Rondo are standing at halfcourt, and I told you hey Pick one of these 2 guys to lead your team, and i'll pick 2nd. If you beat my team I'll give you a million bucks you're taking Rondo??!!! The edge goes to the Lakers all day, call Kobe selfish all you want but he has become a hell of a leader and teammate the last 2-3 years, and no one better I want leading my team with everything on the line.

    Revenge:  i always say this is an overrated angle, but clearly here it has merit... not just because Boston beat LA two years ago in the Finals... but because (a) they did it in such a humiliating blowout fashion, and (b) the bus incident outside the stadium afterwards clearly fueled the fire in a big way... i considered LA to be a team that needed something to motivate them, and the Celtics are the one thing that can do that...

    No doubt you nailed it here. You won;t see one game with the Lakers half stepping or losing focus here. Everyone but Ron and Brown were on this team for the Finals Series. You will see the most focused and together Laker team all season here. This is extremely personal and intense series for the Lakers and you will see it all left on the court. When the lakers are focused and hitting on all cylinders they are lights out unbeatable.

    Toughness:  until proven otherwise, the Lakers are not a tough team... they are big, but not tough... the Celtics, on the other hand, set the standard for defense and toughness in the NBA right now... can LA take that revenge factor and convert it into the mental toughness they need? 

    Lakers will be plenty tough, you saw it in the rockets series last year. When Hou. started to try and get dirty the Lakers stepped there game up and gave as good as they got, plus they got Artest now. The lakers can adjust and play a finesse game or slow it down and get dirty and physical. The celtics have the aura of toughness and blue collar, but they are not as tough as they seem in this current state.

    Confidence:  Pierce, Allen, KG, Rondo, Perkins... those guys have no fear... they have never been beaten in a 7 game series, and they have no reason to believe they can be beaten... they have still never faced a dire situation in any playoff series... have never trailed after the first 4 games of a series... and have only once trailed in any playoff series (2-1 to Cleveland this year)...

    You can say the same thing about the Lakers, you think the Lakers are lacking any confidence or swagger. A silly non issue. No team playing for these stakes is lacking confidence.

    Tough road:  if the Celtics win the NBA championship, they will have earned it... beating the #1, #2 and #3 teams in the NBA this season, and doing it without homecourt in any of those series... i have always been of the opinion that the teams who tune up against the best competition are a leg up when it comes time to decide the championship...


    Again that aura of Blue Collar we can do anything mentality. A non issue. the real issue is how weak the Eastern Conerence was. It's no suprise that it was that easy for a experienced well coached team like the celts to carve up that competition. The Heat, a one man team. Wade can't do it by himself, and he had absolutely no support or chance. The Cavs? Hell no. Look good on paper, but were really a paper thin team not built for the long haul. Shaq hurt more than help, hogging minutes younger and more athletic player like Hickson could of had to develop and help in a playoff series. And of course once Lebron knew his teammates couldn't help and his assclown hack of a coach couldn't help him he shut it down and quit. Looking towards the offseason. Orlando? The Lakers dismantled a better version of this team for a championship last season. Orlando went through Charlotte? I mean really, they played with alot of grit but are harldy a playoff team. They were the best of the worst in a extremely shallow conference. The Hawks who quit in game 6 of the 1st round, and got lucky in game 7. Orlando were basically the east coast Suns.


    So That's my humble opinion and I hope it changes some minds. Cause form reading quite a few posts alot of money is about to be lost on the Celtics. Thanks for reading.

    Lakers in 6 or 7. It will be a good one.

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    Intangibles...

    Floor generals:  both defenses (and coaches) will be switching up their looks and playing a veritable chess match trying to find favorable matchups... whichever team can adjust on the fly and find the mismatches on offense should do well... Rondo gives Boston a big edge here, as he has proven to be an extension of Rivers on the court...

    Wow really, so if Kobe and Rondo are standing at halfcourt, and I told you hey Pick one of these 2 guys to lead your team, and i'll pick 2nd. If you beat my team I'll give you a million bucks you're taking Rondo??!!! The edge goes to the Lakers all day, call Kobe selfish all you want but he has become a hell of a leader and teammate the last 2-3 years, and no one better I want leading my team with everything on the line.

    Revenge:  i always say this is an overrated angle, but clearly here it has merit... not just because Boston beat LA two years ago in the Finals... but because (a) they did it in such a humiliating blowout fashion, and (b) the bus incident outside the stadium afterwards clearly fueled the fire in a big way... i considered LA to be a team that needed something to motivate them, and the Celtics are the one thing that can do that...

    No doubt you nailed it here. You won;t see one game with the Lakers half stepping or losing focus here. Everyone but Ron and Brown were on this team for the Finals Series. You will see the most focused and together Laker team all season here. This is extremely personal and intense series for the Lakers and you will see it all left on the court. When the lakers are focused and hitting on all cylinders they are lights out unbeatable.

    Toughness:  until proven otherwise, the Lakers are not a tough team... they are big, but not tough... the Celtics, on the other hand, set the standard for defense and toughness in the NBA right now... can LA take that revenge factor and convert it into the mental toughness they need? 

    Lakers will be plenty tough, you saw it in the rockets series last year. When Hou. started to try and get dirty the Lakers stepped there game up and gave as good as they got, plus they got Artest now. The lakers can adjust and play a finesse game or slow it down and get dirty and physical. The celtics have the aura of toughness and blue collar, but they are not as tough as they seem in this current state.

    Confidence:  Pierce, Allen, KG, Rondo, Perkins... those guys have no fear... they have never been beaten in a 7 game series, and they have no reason to believe they can be beaten... they have still never faced a dire situation in any playoff series... have never trailed after the first 4 games of a series... and have only once trailed in any playoff series (2-1 to Cleveland this year)...

    You can say the same thing about the Lakers, you think the Lakers are lacking any confidence or swagger. A silly non issue. No team playing for these stakes is lacking confidence.

    Tough road:  if the Celtics win the NBA championship, they will have earned it... beating the #1, #2 and #3 teams in the NBA this season, and doing it without homecourt in any of those series... i have always been of the opinion that the teams who tune up against the best competition are a leg up when it comes time to decide the championship...


    Again that aura of Blue Collar we can do anything mentality. A non issue. the real issue is how weak the Eastern Conerence was. It's no suprise that it was that easy for a experienced well coached team like the celts to carve up that competition. The Heat, a one man team. Wade can't do it by himself, and he had absolutely no support or chance. The Cavs? Hell no. Look good on paper, but were really a paper thin team not built for the long haul. Shaq hurt more than help, hogging minutes younger and more athletic player like Hickson could of had to develop and help in a playoff series. And of course once Lebron knew his teammates couldn't help and his assclown hack of a coach couldn't help him he shut it down and quit. Looking towards the offseason. Orlando? The Lakers dismantled a better version of this team for a championship last season. Orlando went through Charlotte? I mean really, they played with alot of grit but are harldy a playoff team. They were the best of the worst in a extremely shallow conference. The Hawks who quit in game 6 of the 1st round, and got lucky in game 7. Orlando were basically the east coast Suns.


    So That's my humble opinion and I hope it changes some minds. Cause form reading quite a few posts alot of money is about to be lost on the Celtics. Thanks for reading.

    Lakers in 6 or 7. It will be a good one.

     
    southerngroove
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 3:53 AM ET #17

    "ICE4BLOOD".... Outstanding. There is another veteran player on the bench. He hasn't played much (for whatever reason), but he is capable of contributing, especially since he knows his career is coming to an end, and this probably will be his last chance to win a ring. Michael Finley   
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    "ICE4BLOOD".... Outstanding. There is another veteran player on the bench. He hasn't played much (for whatever reason), but he is capable of contributing, especially since he knows his career is coming to an end, and this probably will be his last chance to win a ring. Michael Finley   
     
    SuperCoolGuy
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 3:53 AM ET #18

    Quote Originally Posted by jwheels86:

    Well at least we know that we have a new Laker fan on the boards thats usually lurking.

    Like I said one of the douchebags I gotta wade through to get to some intelligent posts. He asked for opinions to his post and i gave it. I offered my counterpoint to his analysis, so that make me some Laker homer troll. get a life.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwheels86:

    Well at least we know that we have a new Laker fan on the boards thats usually lurking.

    Like I said one of the douchebags I gotta wade through to get to some intelligent posts. He asked for opinions to his post and i gave it. I offered my counterpoint to his analysis, so that make me some Laker homer troll. get a life.
     
    jwheels86
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 4:10 AM ET #19

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperCoolGuy:


    Like I said one of the douchebags I gotta wade through to get to some intelligent posts. He asked for opinions to his post and i gave it. I offered my counterpoint to his analysis, so that make me some Laker homer troll. get a life.


    Calm down, it was a joke big man. I figured this post would come, you made valid points. I was trying to get your attention
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperCoolGuy:


    Like I said one of the douchebags I gotta wade through to get to some intelligent posts. He asked for opinions to his post and i gave it. I offered my counterpoint to his analysis, so that make me some Laker homer troll. get a life.


    Calm down, it was a joke big man. I figured this post would come, you made valid points. I was trying to get your attention
     
    Ice4Blood
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 4:20 AM ET #20

    Quote Originally Posted by southerngroove:

    There is another veteran player on the bench. He hasn't played much (for whatever reason), but he is capable of contributing, especially since he knows his career is coming to an end, and this probably will be his last chance to win a ring. Michael Finley   

    wouldn't be at all surprised to see Finley hit a big shot or a couple big free throws down the stretch to help Boston win a game in this series...

    when Daniels is healthy he is also a solid player... and every guy in that rotation is strong on defense...

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    Quote Originally Posted by southerngroove:

    There is another veteran player on the bench. He hasn't played much (for whatever reason), but he is capable of contributing, especially since he knows his career is coming to an end, and this probably will be his last chance to win a ring. Michael Finley   

    wouldn't be at all surprised to see Finley hit a big shot or a couple big free throws down the stretch to help Boston win a game in this series...

    when Daniels is healthy he is also a solid player... and every guy in that rotation is strong on defense...

     
    SuperCoolGuy
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 4:26 AM ET #21

    Quote Originally Posted by jwheels86:



    Calm down, it was a joke big man. I figured this post would come, you made valid points. I was trying to get your attention


    Cool. You know how it is around here though. Respect man, and thanks.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwheels86:



    Calm down, it was a joke big man. I figured this post would come, you made valid points. I was trying to get your attention


    Cool. You know how it is around here though. Respect man, and thanks.
     
    jwheels86
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 4:29 AM ET #22

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperCoolGuy:



    Cool. You know how it is around here though. Respect man, and thanks.


    Oh, I def do, which is why you understand why i mess with guys with 4 posts.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperCoolGuy:



    Cool. You know how it is around here though. Respect man, and thanks.


    Oh, I def do, which is why you understand why i mess with guys with 4 posts.
     
    JCtS
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 5:05 AM ET #23

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperCoolGuy:

    I read these forums all the time and wading through the various douchebags and real people is hard, that's why i've never posted anything until now. you have a good write up but i want to tell you why you are wrong imo. so heres my point counterpoint to you and others. take it how you want to take it.

    Boston on offense:  of course the offense will run primarily through Rondo, but will adjust based on how LA chooses to defend... Allen and Pierce can both run offensive sets very well... Boston has 4 starters who can all put up 20+ on a given night, 2 who can put up 30+... they can adjust to what the defense gives them... Lakers have 2 great perimeter defenders, but have to figure out how to stop 3 great perimeter players...

    You are highly undervaluing the lakers defense, iIMO I think for 75-80% of this series you will see Kobe on Rondo, with Fisher and Kobe switching from time to time. With that said of course Rondos speed will help and cause problems. However when he gets past Kobe and into the lane Gasol, Bynum, or Odom will be there on the help defense. in the Orl. series all he had to worry about was Howard patrolling and he could kick it out easier, not so w/ 2 bigs crowding the lane. also I dont know how Rondo turned into god all, he has definitely stepped up and is a great player, but hes not a game changer yet. Don't let ESPN and TNT brainwash you like the rest of the masses. He was neutralized somewhat for alot of the orl series by good def. from Nelson. His stats were down compared to the Cavs series . Artest will be glued to Pierces hip, and Paul is more than a step slower than Artest, don't expect Pierce to hoist big numbers, Ron has proven time and time again he can lock down a prolific scorer or 2. Not to say Pierce won't get his once or twice, but not enough to make a difference in this series. Also are you seriously telling me that the lakers don't have 4, maybe even 5 or 6 players that can score 20+, and 3-4 who are capable of putting up 30? cause if you are that is ludicrous, so the you have to get the Lakers the scoring edge there. Then you say the lakers perimeter play runs only 2 deep, okay i'll give you that. but who is the great 3rd perimeter players for the celts, cause i know its not rondo. so who is the 3rd option? allen (no) nate (no) sheed, kg, big baby? lakers have kobe, fish who is a diff. player come playoffs, celts have pierce and ray on the perimeter. after that i would call it a stalemate between the rest of lakers and c's starters and bench. 

    mismatches...

    • whoever Fisher defends will have a decided advantage... Rondo is too quick and will be able to penetrate, which is what LA doesn't want... if Fisher is on Allen is gives Ray the opportunity to get off too many good looks and post up...
    • like i said i think Kobe will see alot of time on Rondo which means Fish will be on Ray alot. With that being said at this point in their careers, Fish and Ray is alot more even of a matchup than you may think. Allen gets half his looks coming of set screens and pick and pops. he's not much of a slasher and driver anymore. We all saw last series how well fisher moved with and through screens against a superior pick and roll and pick and pop team in the suns. Also you are dead wrong if you think allen is gonna post up fisher, you may be right and ray gets a better look here and ther w/ the height advantage, but fisher is way stronger than allen and outweigh Allen by almost 10 lbs. I don't see Allen having a huge effect, rondo will get his here and there, but overall the lakers have been dealing with upper echelon point guards the whole playoffs, and Rondo is not in that category yet.
    • Gasol is not fast enough to stay with KG inside without help, and will have trouble defending on the perimeter...
    • Not gonna dwell on this alot, but that is just wrong. i think you're gonna see Gasol's best ball in this series. He remembers all the shit  he got in the last series being called out as such a soft ass box which he was. This series is gonna define Gasol for quite sometime I think. Plus I don't know where you get KG is faster than Gasol, Gasol possesses every edge on KG but intensity and toughness, which I think Gasol is gonna bring in spades this series.
    • Celtics ball rotation and 3 pt shooting is the key to their success, and what kills opponents... if you have a weakness on defense, they will exploit it... patience is the key...
    • Again Celtics do move the ball well, but 3 point shooting. I'm sorry but this isn't 2008, i don't see House or Posey in green and white. I will give you a slight edge in ball movement , but only cause Kobe can go off anytime and that can be a bigger plus than moving the ball efficiently, but don't sleep on his assist stats in the Suns series. 3 pt shooting i'll call it a draw.

     


    Don't know what you're trying to prove ..or said ! Cause " RED " look bloody ! ...VERY BLOODY

    Good luck with your new alias and your intentions !

     

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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperCoolGuy:

    I read these forums all the time and wading through the various douchebags and real people is hard, that's why i've never posted anything until now. you have a good write up but i want to tell you why you are wrong imo. so heres my point counterpoint to you and others. take it how you want to take it.

    Boston on offense:  of course the offense will run primarily through Rondo, but will adjust based on how LA chooses to defend... Allen and Pierce can both run offensive sets very well... Boston has 4 starters who can all put up 20+ on a given night, 2 who can put up 30+... they can adjust to what the defense gives them... Lakers have 2 great perimeter defenders, but have to figure out how to stop 3 great perimeter players...

    You are highly undervaluing the lakers defense, iIMO I think for 75-80% of this series you will see Kobe on Rondo, with Fisher and Kobe switching from time to time. With that said of course Rondos speed will help and cause problems. However when he gets past Kobe and into the lane Gasol, Bynum, or Odom will be there on the help defense. in the Orl. series all he had to worry about was Howard patrolling and he could kick it out easier, not so w/ 2 bigs crowding the lane. also I dont know how Rondo turned into god all, he has definitely stepped up and is a great player, but hes not a game changer yet. Don't let ESPN and TNT brainwash you like the rest of the masses. He was neutralized somewhat for alot of the orl series by good def. from Nelson. His stats were down compared to the Cavs series . Artest will be glued to Pierces hip, and Paul is more than a step slower than Artest, don't expect Pierce to hoist big numbers, Ron has proven time and time again he can lock down a prolific scorer or 2. Not to say Pierce won't get his once or twice, but not enough to make a difference in this series. Also are you seriously telling me that the lakers don't have 4, maybe even 5 or 6 players that can score 20+, and 3-4 who are capable of putting up 30? cause if you are that is ludicrous, so the you have to get the Lakers the scoring edge there. Then you say the lakers perimeter play runs only 2 deep, okay i'll give you that. but who is the great 3rd perimeter players for the celts, cause i know its not rondo. so who is the 3rd option? allen (no) nate (no) sheed, kg, big baby? lakers have kobe, fish who is a diff. player come playoffs, celts have pierce and ray on the perimeter. after that i would call it a stalemate between the rest of lakers and c's starters and bench. 

    mismatches...

    • whoever Fisher defends will have a decided advantage... Rondo is too quick and will be able to penetrate, which is what LA doesn't want... if Fisher is on Allen is gives Ray the opportunity to get off too many good looks and post up...
    • like i said i think Kobe will see alot of time on Rondo which means Fish will be on Ray alot. With that being said at this point in their careers, Fish and Ray is alot more even of a matchup than you may think. Allen gets half his looks coming of set screens and pick and pops. he's not much of a slasher and driver anymore. We all saw last series how well fisher moved with and through screens against a superior pick and roll and pick and pop team in the suns. Also you are dead wrong if you think allen is gonna post up fisher, you may be right and ray gets a better look here and ther w/ the height advantage, but fisher is way stronger than allen and outweigh Allen by almost 10 lbs. I don't see Allen having a huge effect, rondo will get his here and there, but overall the lakers have been dealing with upper echelon point guards the whole playoffs, and Rondo is not in that category yet.
    • Gasol is not fast enough to stay with KG inside without help, and will have trouble defending on the perimeter...
    • Not gonna dwell on this alot, but that is just wrong. i think you're gonna see Gasol's best ball in this series. He remembers all the shit  he got in the last series being called out as such a soft ass box which he was. This series is gonna define Gasol for quite sometime I think. Plus I don't know where you get KG is faster than Gasol, Gasol possesses every edge on KG but intensity and toughness, which I think Gasol is gonna bring in spades this series.
    • Celtics ball rotation and 3 pt shooting is the key to their success, and what kills opponents... if you have a weakness on defense, they will exploit it... patience is the key...
    • Again Celtics do move the ball well, but 3 point shooting. I'm sorry but this isn't 2008, i don't see House or Posey in green and white. I will give you a slight edge in ball movement , but only cause Kobe can go off anytime and that can be a bigger plus than moving the ball efficiently, but don't sleep on his assist stats in the Suns series. 3 pt shooting i'll call it a draw.

     


    Don't know what you're trying to prove ..or said ! Cause " RED " look bloody ! ...VERY BLOODY

    Good luck with your new alias and your intentions !

     

     
    knickatnite
    knickatnite
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    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 10:49 AM ET #24

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    Ice4Blood
    Ice4Blood
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    Joined: Dec, 2008
    Posts: 11845
    Posted: Jun. 1, 2010 - 11:16 AM ET #25

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperCoolGuy:

    Don't let ESPN and TNT brainwash you like the rest of the masses.

     

    i see you are "new" around here... so you probably weren't aware that none of my opinions regarding sports ever come from ESPN or TNT or any other sports program...

    started to read your post but didn't go past that part... i assume you like the Lakers, though...

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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperCoolGuy:

    Don't let ESPN and TNT brainwash you like the rest of the masses.

     

    i see you are "new" around here... so you probably weren't aware that none of my opinions regarding sports ever come from ESPN or TNT or any other sports program...

    started to read your post but didn't go past that part... i assume you like the Lakers, though...

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