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    All Forums | Politics

    Global warming :: is it just a 'chinese hoax' like trump told us or is it serious?

    «First Previous 333435 ... 464748 Next Last»
    fubah2
    philschnaars
    Raiders22
    Zeus4par
    thirdperson
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    «First Previous 333435 ... 464748 Next Last»
     
    fubah2
    fubah2
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    Posted: Aug. 12, 2023 - 9:13 PM ET #801

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Planet tipping point looming?

    REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington   Global warming driven by the burning of fossil fuels has made Antarctica more vulnerable to extreme events and the impact is "virtually certain" to get worse, the study said."

     an_speechless      paint_help

    Climate change will
    "lead to increases in the size and frequency" of heatwaves,
    ice shelf collapses and declines in sea ice, it said, drawing on
    recent evidence from scientific studies of the Antarctic ocean,
    atmosphere, cryosphere and biosphere.

    But from phenomena such as the rapid decline in sea ice,
    it is "scientifically reasonable" to assume that extreme events
    are going to intensify as global temperatures rise,
    said Martin Siegert, a glaciologist at the University of Exeter.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Planet tipping point looming?

    REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington   Global warming driven by the burning of fossil fuels has made Antarctica more vulnerable to extreme events and the impact is "virtually certain" to get worse, the study said."

     an_speechless      paint_help

    Climate change will
    "lead to increases in the size and frequency" of heatwaves,
    ice shelf collapses and declines in sea ice, it said, drawing on
    recent evidence from scientific studies of the Antarctic ocean,
    atmosphere, cryosphere and biosphere.

    But from phenomena such as the rapid decline in sea ice,
    it is "scientifically reasonable" to assume that extreme events
    are going to intensify as global temperatures rise,
    said Martin Siegert, a glaciologist at the University of Exeter.

     
    philschnaars
    philschnaars
    Banned
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    Posts: 4244
    Posted: Aug. 12, 2023 - 9:24 PM ET #802

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Planet tipping point looming? REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington   Global warming driven by the burning of fossil fuels has made Antarctica more vulnerable to extreme events and the impact is "virtually certain" to get worse, the study said."        Climate change will "lead to increases in the size and frequency" of heatwaves, ice shelf collapses and declines in sea ice, it said, drawing on recent evidence from scientific studies of the Antarctic ocean, atmosphere, cryosphere and biosphere. But from phenomena such as the rapid decline in sea ice, it is "scientifically reasonable" to assume that extreme events are going to intensify as global temperatures rise, said Martin Siegert, a glaciologist at the University of Exeter.

     

    but Biden is producing so much fossil fuel which is a great thing peace_5

    Freedom road was a one-way street
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Planet tipping point looming? REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington   Global warming driven by the burning of fossil fuels has made Antarctica more vulnerable to extreme events and the impact is "virtually certain" to get worse, the study said."        Climate change will "lead to increases in the size and frequency" of heatwaves, ice shelf collapses and declines in sea ice, it said, drawing on recent evidence from scientific studies of the Antarctic ocean, atmosphere, cryosphere and biosphere. But from phenomena such as the rapid decline in sea ice, it is "scientifically reasonable" to assume that extreme events are going to intensify as global temperatures rise, said Martin Siegert, a glaciologist at the University of Exeter.

     

    but Biden is producing so much fossil fuel which is a great thing peace_5

     
    Raiders22
    Raiders22
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    Posted: Aug. 12, 2023 - 9:30 PM ET #803

    @UNIMAN

     

    Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN:

    They expanded the canal back in 2006. That expansion must be hurting them now.

    How you mean?  No, it has helped them and us tremendously with revenue for them and shortened shipping times for the large container ships.

    Or are you meaning because of the water situation?  I think percentage-wise that is a wash.

    Reply

    @UNIMAN

     

    Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN:

    They expanded the canal back in 2006. That expansion must be hurting them now.

    How you mean?  No, it has helped them and us tremendously with revenue for them and shortened shipping times for the large container ships.

    Or are you meaning because of the water situation?  I think percentage-wise that is a wash.

     
    Raiders22
    Raiders22
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    Posts: 34784
    Posted: Aug. 12, 2023 - 9:32 PM ET #804

    @Midnight1

     

    Quote Originally Posted by Midnight1:

    @Raiders22  @UNIMAN Got to see the locks working at Saulte St Marie & was amazed. Almost like, wait how did they do that. And these ships have marginal space to pilot their ship into the locks.

    Yes.  The same there on a larger scale.  Amazing that they fit those ships in and with so little room to spare. peace_5

    Reply

    @Midnight1

     

    Quote Originally Posted by Midnight1:

    @Raiders22  @UNIMAN Got to see the locks working at Saulte St Marie & was amazed. Almost like, wait how did they do that. And these ships have marginal space to pilot their ship into the locks.

    Yes.  The same there on a larger scale.  Amazing that they fit those ships in and with so little room to spare. peace_5

     
    Zeus4par
    Zeus4par
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    Posts: 6070
    Posted: Aug. 12, 2023 - 9:35 PM ET #805

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Planet tipping point looming? REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington   Global warming driven by the burning of fossil fuels has made Antarctica more vulnerable to extreme events and the impact is "virtually certain" to get worse, the study said."       

    Bad news for the planet.

     

     

     

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Planet tipping point looming? REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington   Global warming driven by the burning of fossil fuels has made Antarctica more vulnerable to extreme events and the impact is "virtually certain" to get worse, the study said."       

    Bad news for the planet.

     

     

     

     
    Raiders22
    Raiders22
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    Joined: Dec, 2010
    Posts: 34784
    Posted: Aug. 12, 2023 - 9:36 PM ET #806

    @thirdperson

     

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Quote Originally Posted by THEMUGG:   Natural variability in climate is unlikely to play a major role in long term warming.Really? The earth is over 4 billion years old. In that time, the Grand Canyon has been under water eight times. I'd call that a lot of "natural variability".  Co2 is gonna be higher now. The elephant in the room is over-population.  but humans are like locusts.......we reproduce & strip the earth of resources to provide for our ever-growing population, which in turn causes higher emissions.  Why would the USA, a country whose main land mass is twice the size of India but is inhabited by a billion fewer people, need to bankrupt themselves to prove a debatable point?.. Natural variability refers only to current warming.  Unlike the past, current warming cannot be explained by sun, volcano, orbit or natural cycle.  Unnatural for changes to occur in decades instead of thousands of years. Scientists conclude only man-made greenhouse effect can explain abnormal warming. Climate change isn't caused by overpopulation bur rather consumption and production choices in the burning of fossil fuels.  Richest 10% of world population contributes 50% of carbon emissions.  Historically, US and Europe are responsible for over 50% of cumulative emissions.  Rich countries have outsourced carbon intensive industries to other countries.  Although China manufacturing is a big polluter, it also produces the most renewable energy and lower emissions per capita than many countries.  Economists estimate the costs of not tackling climate change are much higher than the costs of taking action.  Total cost to global economy could be under 1% of GDP by mid century.

    This is some more stuff to add to your research list.  Much of this is surprisingly wrong.  peace_5

    Reply

    @thirdperson

     

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Quote Originally Posted by THEMUGG:   Natural variability in climate is unlikely to play a major role in long term warming.Really? The earth is over 4 billion years old. In that time, the Grand Canyon has been under water eight times. I'd call that a lot of "natural variability".  Co2 is gonna be higher now. The elephant in the room is over-population.  but humans are like locusts.......we reproduce & strip the earth of resources to provide for our ever-growing population, which in turn causes higher emissions.  Why would the USA, a country whose main land mass is twice the size of India but is inhabited by a billion fewer people, need to bankrupt themselves to prove a debatable point?.. Natural variability refers only to current warming.  Unlike the past, current warming cannot be explained by sun, volcano, orbit or natural cycle.  Unnatural for changes to occur in decades instead of thousands of years. Scientists conclude only man-made greenhouse effect can explain abnormal warming. Climate change isn't caused by overpopulation bur rather consumption and production choices in the burning of fossil fuels.  Richest 10% of world population contributes 50% of carbon emissions.  Historically, US and Europe are responsible for over 50% of cumulative emissions.  Rich countries have outsourced carbon intensive industries to other countries.  Although China manufacturing is a big polluter, it also produces the most renewable energy and lower emissions per capita than many countries.  Economists estimate the costs of not tackling climate change are much higher than the costs of taking action.  Total cost to global economy could be under 1% of GDP by mid century.

    This is some more stuff to add to your research list.  Much of this is surprisingly wrong.  peace_5

     
    Zeus4par
    Zeus4par
    Captain
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Jul, 2021
    Posts: 6070
    Posted: Aug. 12, 2023 - 9:41 PM ET #807

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Planet tipping point looming? REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington 

    @fubah2

    Disaster awaits.  And it is assured.  an_getaway

     

     

     

     

     

     

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Planet tipping point looming? REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington 

    @fubah2

    Disaster awaits.  And it is assured.  an_getaway

     

     

     

     

     

     

     
    thirdperson
    thirdperson
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 2:46 AM ET #808

    Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN:

    Been well known large cities with so much buildings and blacktop retain the heat often times creating their own weather called the "urban heat island effect." What better place to point out "new" records than large cities that were not there just 40-50 years ago.

    For decades, scientists already adjust data to correct for urban heat island effect.  Standard procedure to improve accuracy.  Key is that warming trend is the same for both urban and rural areas.  So urban heat island is insignificant in records of global temperatures.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN:

    Been well known large cities with so much buildings and blacktop retain the heat often times creating their own weather called the "urban heat island effect." What better place to point out "new" records than large cities that were not there just 40-50 years ago.

    For decades, scientists already adjust data to correct for urban heat island effect.  Standard procedure to improve accuracy.  Key is that warming trend is the same for both urban and rural areas.  So urban heat island is insignificant in records of global temperatures.

     
    UNIMAN
    UNIMAN
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 8:56 AM ET #809

    US media puts out wave of stories about supposedly "historic" heat waves in Europe and North America. For example, The Washington Post published an article titled "Heat waves in U.S., Europe ‘virtually impossible’ without climate change, study finds." 

    Although certain parts of the U.S. have undoubtedly experienced strong heat waves this summer, there’s no reason to believe these weather events are evidence that the world is hurtling toward a climate change catastrophe. In fact, the best available evidence suggests that heat waves recorded a century ago were more problematic than anything we’re seeing today. 

    Government researchers have been tracking heat waves for more than 100 years. According to data from the U.S. Climate Change Science Program, which is made available by the Environmental Protection Agency, the annual heat wave index for the contiguous 48 states was substantially higher in the 1930s than at any point in recent years. In some years in the 1930s, it was four times greater or even more. 

    Additionally, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) has a large database of daily temperatures that goes back to 1948. NOAA used 1,066 weather stations located across the U.S. to collect this data. 

    According to NOAA, huge swaths of the U.S. have experienced a significant decrease in abnormally hot days recorded since 1948, especially in the Midwest and northern and eastern Texas. 

    Although it’s true that some parts of the U.S. have seen the number of hotter-than-usual days increase over the past 70 years — including in California and the New York metropolitan area, both of which happen to be areas where a large number of media outlets are located — most weather stations have shown no meaningful changes or even declines. 

    Meteorologist Anthony Watts, who works with me as a senior fellow at The Heartland Institute, analyzed NOAA’s data in detail and found that 81% of the weather stations used in NOAA’s database reported that since 1948 there has been "either a decrease or no change in the number of unusually hot days." 

    If the available data so clearly reveal that there is no heat-wave crisis, why are media outlets suggesting the opposite is true? The answer is sloppy, irresponsible media reporting, combined with cherry-picked data. an_light

     

     

     

     

    Reply

    US media puts out wave of stories about supposedly "historic" heat waves in Europe and North America. For example, The Washington Post published an article titled "Heat waves in U.S., Europe ‘virtually impossible’ without climate change, study finds." 

    Although certain parts of the U.S. have undoubtedly experienced strong heat waves this summer, there’s no reason to believe these weather events are evidence that the world is hurtling toward a climate change catastrophe. In fact, the best available evidence suggests that heat waves recorded a century ago were more problematic than anything we’re seeing today. 

    Government researchers have been tracking heat waves for more than 100 years. According to data from the U.S. Climate Change Science Program, which is made available by the Environmental Protection Agency, the annual heat wave index for the contiguous 48 states was substantially higher in the 1930s than at any point in recent years. In some years in the 1930s, it was four times greater or even more. 

    Additionally, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) has a large database of daily temperatures that goes back to 1948. NOAA used 1,066 weather stations located across the U.S. to collect this data. 

    According to NOAA, huge swaths of the U.S. have experienced a significant decrease in abnormally hot days recorded since 1948, especially in the Midwest and northern and eastern Texas. 

    Although it’s true that some parts of the U.S. have seen the number of hotter-than-usual days increase over the past 70 years — including in California and the New York metropolitan area, both of which happen to be areas where a large number of media outlets are located — most weather stations have shown no meaningful changes or even declines. 

    Meteorologist Anthony Watts, who works with me as a senior fellow at The Heartland Institute, analyzed NOAA’s data in detail and found that 81% of the weather stations used in NOAA’s database reported that since 1948 there has been "either a decrease or no change in the number of unusually hot days." 

    If the available data so clearly reveal that there is no heat-wave crisis, why are media outlets suggesting the opposite is true? The answer is sloppy, irresponsible media reporting, combined with cherry-picked data. an_light

     

     

     

     

     
    fubah2
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 9:15 AM ET #810

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeus4par:

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Planet tipping point looming?

    REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington  @fubah2 Disaster awaits.  And it is assured.

    @Zeus4par

    How climate change contributed to starting the deadly Maui blaze

    YAHOO NEWS -

    With at least 55 people dead and hundreds of buildings
    damaged or destroyed, the dramatic and deadly wildfires
    on the Hawaiian island of Maui are a grim reminder of
    how climate change is increasing wildfire risk.

    According to the National Weather Service, the fires on Maui
    are fueled by dry vegetation, strong winds and low humidity.

    Wildfires are not common in Hawaii — the Guardian called
    the current ones “unprecedented” — because  places with
    a wet, tropical climate do not typically have the dried-out
    vegetation to provide the fuel.


    an_light But rising global temperatures are changing that!
         According to the organization Global Forest Watch,
    fires do not naturally occur in tropical rainforests,
    but   as climate change has dried out forests,
    tropical forest fires have become more common,
    increasing by about 5% per year since 2001. an_speechless

     

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeus4par:

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Planet tipping point looming?

    REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington  @fubah2 Disaster awaits.  And it is assured.

    @Zeus4par

    How climate change contributed to starting the deadly Maui blaze

    YAHOO NEWS -

    With at least 55 people dead and hundreds of buildings
    damaged or destroyed, the dramatic and deadly wildfires
    on the Hawaiian island of Maui are a grim reminder of
    how climate change is increasing wildfire risk.

    According to the National Weather Service, the fires on Maui
    are fueled by dry vegetation, strong winds and low humidity.

    Wildfires are not common in Hawaii — the Guardian called
    the current ones “unprecedented” — because  places with
    a wet, tropical climate do not typically have the dried-out
    vegetation to provide the fuel.


    an_light But rising global temperatures are changing that!
         According to the organization Global Forest Watch,
    fires do not naturally occur in tropical rainforests,
    but   as climate change has dried out forests,
    tropical forest fires have become more common,
    increasing by about 5% per year since 2001. an_speechless

     

     
    Raiders22
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 11:56 AM ET #811

    @UNIMAN

     peace_5

    Reply

    @UNIMAN

     peace_5

     
    thirdperson
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 11:57 AM ET #812

    Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN:

    there’s no reason to believe these weather events are evidence that the world is hurtling toward a climate change catastrophe. In fact, the best available evidence suggests that heat waves recorded a century ago were more problematic than anything we’re seeing today.  the annual heat wave index for the contiguous 48 states was substantially higher in the 1930s than at any point in recent years.     The Heartland Institute, analyzed NOAA’s data in detail and found that 81% of the weather stations used in NOAA’s database reported that since 1948 there has been "either a decrease or no change in the number of unusually hot days."

    Heartland institute or Fox news narrative is misleading.  They cherry pick US data while ignoring world data.  1930s dust bowl occurred in a small region of the US for a few years.  Most of Earth was much cooler in 1930s than in 2023.  Also climate change is measured in decades or centuries for proper perspective in determining trends.   Temporary hot weather in the 1930s doesn't change the fact that intensity and duration of heat waves are increasing long term.  According to NOAA, average global annual temperatures have increased since the 1960s.  19 of 20 warmest years have occurred since 2001.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN:

    there’s no reason to believe these weather events are evidence that the world is hurtling toward a climate change catastrophe. In fact, the best available evidence suggests that heat waves recorded a century ago were more problematic than anything we’re seeing today.  the annual heat wave index for the contiguous 48 states was substantially higher in the 1930s than at any point in recent years.     The Heartland Institute, analyzed NOAA’s data in detail and found that 81% of the weather stations used in NOAA’s database reported that since 1948 there has been "either a decrease or no change in the number of unusually hot days."

    Heartland institute or Fox news narrative is misleading.  They cherry pick US data while ignoring world data.  1930s dust bowl occurred in a small region of the US for a few years.  Most of Earth was much cooler in 1930s than in 2023.  Also climate change is measured in decades or centuries for proper perspective in determining trends.   Temporary hot weather in the 1930s doesn't change the fact that intensity and duration of heat waves are increasing long term.  According to NOAA, average global annual temperatures have increased since the 1960s.  19 of 20 warmest years have occurred since 2001.

     
    StumpTownStu
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 12:02 PM ET #813

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN: there’s no reason to believe these weather events are evidence that the world is hurtling toward a climate change catastrophe. In fact, the best available evidence suggests that heat waves recorded a century ago were more problematic than anything we’re seeing today.  the annual heat wave index for the contiguous 48 states was substantially higher in the 1930s than at any point in recent years.     The Heartland Institute, analyzed NOAA’s data in detail and found that 81% of the weather stations used in NOAA’s database reported that since 1948 there has been "either a decrease or no change in the number of unusually hot days." Heartland institute or Fox news narrative is misleading.  They cherry pick US data while ignoring world data.  1930s dust bowl occurred in a small region of the US for a few years.  Most of Earth was much cooler in 1930s than in 2023.  Also climate change is measured in decades or centuries for proper perspective in determining trends.   Temporary hot weather in the 1930s doesn't change the fact that intensity and duration of heat waves are increasing long term.  According to NOAA, average global annual temperatures have increased since the 1960s.  19 of 20 warmest years have occurred since 2001.

    Where did he mention the dust bowl?

    R.I.P. #94 MARSHAWN KNEELAND - DC4L
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN: there’s no reason to believe these weather events are evidence that the world is hurtling toward a climate change catastrophe. In fact, the best available evidence suggests that heat waves recorded a century ago were more problematic than anything we’re seeing today.  the annual heat wave index for the contiguous 48 states was substantially higher in the 1930s than at any point in recent years.     The Heartland Institute, analyzed NOAA’s data in detail and found that 81% of the weather stations used in NOAA’s database reported that since 1948 there has been "either a decrease or no change in the number of unusually hot days." Heartland institute or Fox news narrative is misleading.  They cherry pick US data while ignoring world data.  1930s dust bowl occurred in a small region of the US for a few years.  Most of Earth was much cooler in 1930s than in 2023.  Also climate change is measured in decades or centuries for proper perspective in determining trends.   Temporary hot weather in the 1930s doesn't change the fact that intensity and duration of heat waves are increasing long term.  According to NOAA, average global annual temperatures have increased since the 1960s.  19 of 20 warmest years have occurred since 2001.

    Where did he mention the dust bowl?

     
    KellyM_1964
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 12:39 PM ET #814

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN: there’s no reason to believe these weather events are evidence that the world is hurtling toward a climate change catastrophe. In fact, the best available evidence suggests that heat waves recorded a century ago were more problematic than anything we’re seeing today.  the annual heat wave index for the contiguous 48 states was substantially higher in the 1930s than at any point in recent years.     The Heartland Institute, analyzed NOAA’s data in detail and found that 81% of the weather stations used in NOAA’s database reported that since 1948 there has been "either a decrease or no change in the number of unusually hot days." Heartland institute or Fox news narrative is misleading.  They cherry pick US data while ignoring world data.  1930s dust bowl occurred in a small region of the US for a few years.  Most of Earth was much cooler in 1930s than in 2023.  Also climate change is measured in decades or centuries for proper perspective in determining trends.   Temporary hot weather in the 1930s doesn't change the fact that intensity and duration of heat waves are increasing long term.  According to NOAA, average global annual temperatures have increased since the 1960s.  19 of 20 warmest years have occurred since 2001.

    @thirdperson

     peace_5

     

      

    "I'm the MOST HONEST human being that GOD EVER created!" - Donald "the felon" Trump
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN: there’s no reason to believe these weather events are evidence that the world is hurtling toward a climate change catastrophe. In fact, the best available evidence suggests that heat waves recorded a century ago were more problematic than anything we’re seeing today.  the annual heat wave index for the contiguous 48 states was substantially higher in the 1930s than at any point in recent years.     The Heartland Institute, analyzed NOAA’s data in detail and found that 81% of the weather stations used in NOAA’s database reported that since 1948 there has been "either a decrease or no change in the number of unusually hot days." Heartland institute or Fox news narrative is misleading.  They cherry pick US data while ignoring world data.  1930s dust bowl occurred in a small region of the US for a few years.  Most of Earth was much cooler in 1930s than in 2023.  Also climate change is measured in decades or centuries for proper perspective in determining trends.   Temporary hot weather in the 1930s doesn't change the fact that intensity and duration of heat waves are increasing long term.  According to NOAA, average global annual temperatures have increased since the 1960s.  19 of 20 warmest years have occurred since 2001.

    @thirdperson

     peace_5

     

      

     
    THEMUGG
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 12:57 PM ET #815

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Quote Originally Posted by THEMUGG:   Natural variability in climate is unlikely to play a major role in long term warming.Really? The earth is over 4 billion years old. In that time, the Grand Canyon has been under water eight times. I'd call that a lot of "natural variability".  Co2 is gonna be higher now. The elephant in the room is over-population.  but humans are like locusts.......we reproduce & strip the earth of resources to provide for our ever-growing population, which in turn causes higher emissions.  Why would the USA, a country whose main land mass is twice the size of India but is inhabited by a billion fewer people, need to bankrupt themselves to prove a debatable point?.. Natural variability refers only to current warming.  Unlike the past, current warming cannot be explained by sun, volcano, orbit or natural cycle.  Unnatural for changes to occur in decades instead of thousands of years. Scientists conclude only man-made greenhouse effect can explain abnormal warming. Climate change isn't caused by overpopulation bur rather consumption and production choices in the burning of fossil fuels.  Richest 10% of world population contributes 50% of carbon emissions.  Historically, US and Europe are responsible for over 50% of cumulative emissions.  Rich countries have outsourced carbon intensive industries to other countries.  Although China manufacturing is a big polluter, it also produces the most renewable energy and lower emissions per capita than many countries.  Economists estimate the costs of not tackling climate change are much higher than the costs of taking action.  Total cost to global economy could be under 1% of GDP by mid century.
    Your statement is full of contradictions. How does overpopulation not require more consumption? You cannot spew your own comparison of earth now to 800k years ago & then tell me my point is irrelevant. China manufacturing is THE biggest polluter ......& the "per capita" argument makes no sense since they also have the largest population. Recent history shows the US & Europe are the only ones trying to reduce emissions.

     For every "scientist" blaming humans for climate change, there is another that will dispute it. You wanna shut down carbon emissions? Eliminate the human race.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Quote Originally Posted by THEMUGG:   Natural variability in climate is unlikely to play a major role in long term warming.Really? The earth is over 4 billion years old. In that time, the Grand Canyon has been under water eight times. I'd call that a lot of "natural variability".  Co2 is gonna be higher now. The elephant in the room is over-population.  but humans are like locusts.......we reproduce & strip the earth of resources to provide for our ever-growing population, which in turn causes higher emissions.  Why would the USA, a country whose main land mass is twice the size of India but is inhabited by a billion fewer people, need to bankrupt themselves to prove a debatable point?.. Natural variability refers only to current warming.  Unlike the past, current warming cannot be explained by sun, volcano, orbit or natural cycle.  Unnatural for changes to occur in decades instead of thousands of years. Scientists conclude only man-made greenhouse effect can explain abnormal warming. Climate change isn't caused by overpopulation bur rather consumption and production choices in the burning of fossil fuels.  Richest 10% of world population contributes 50% of carbon emissions.  Historically, US and Europe are responsible for over 50% of cumulative emissions.  Rich countries have outsourced carbon intensive industries to other countries.  Although China manufacturing is a big polluter, it also produces the most renewable energy and lower emissions per capita than many countries.  Economists estimate the costs of not tackling climate change are much higher than the costs of taking action.  Total cost to global economy could be under 1% of GDP by mid century.
    Your statement is full of contradictions. How does overpopulation not require more consumption? You cannot spew your own comparison of earth now to 800k years ago & then tell me my point is irrelevant. China manufacturing is THE biggest polluter ......& the "per capita" argument makes no sense since they also have the largest population. Recent history shows the US & Europe are the only ones trying to reduce emissions.

     For every "scientist" blaming humans for climate change, there is another that will dispute it. You wanna shut down carbon emissions? Eliminate the human race.

     
    thirdperson
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 3:38 PM ET #816

    Quote Originally Posted by THEMUGG:

    How does overpopulation not require more consumption? You cannot spew your own comparison of earth now to 800k years ago & then tell me my point is irrelevant. China manufacturing is THE biggest polluter ......& the "per capita" argument makes no sense since they also have the largest population. Recent history shows the US & Europe are the only ones trying to reduce emissions.  For every "scientist" blaming humans for climate change, there is another that will dispute it. 

    Over 97% of top climate scientists worldwide accept man-made global warming.  They conclude current warming is caused by burning fossil fuels.  Not overpopulation, sun, volcano, orbit or natural cycle.  Almost all countries in the world signed Paris accord to fight climate change.  Historically, US and Europe are the biggest polluters and the most responsible for global warming.  Despite bigger populations, China and India are lesser culprits.  China is both firefighter and arsonist in fighting climate change with massive investments aiming to become carbon neutral before 2050.  Eventually, all countries need to do more in the future because of huge threat from global warming. 

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by THEMUGG:

    How does overpopulation not require more consumption? You cannot spew your own comparison of earth now to 800k years ago & then tell me my point is irrelevant. China manufacturing is THE biggest polluter ......& the "per capita" argument makes no sense since they also have the largest population. Recent history shows the US & Europe are the only ones trying to reduce emissions.  For every "scientist" blaming humans for climate change, there is another that will dispute it. 

    Over 97% of top climate scientists worldwide accept man-made global warming.  They conclude current warming is caused by burning fossil fuels.  Not overpopulation, sun, volcano, orbit or natural cycle.  Almost all countries in the world signed Paris accord to fight climate change.  Historically, US and Europe are the biggest polluters and the most responsible for global warming.  Despite bigger populations, China and India are lesser culprits.  China is both firefighter and arsonist in fighting climate change with massive investments aiming to become carbon neutral before 2050.  Eventually, all countries need to do more in the future because of huge threat from global warming. 

     
    Raiders22
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 3:48 PM ET #817

    @thirdperson

     I thought you were going to research this.

    You are repeating the same thing as before.  Put it into context. peace_5

    Reply

    @thirdperson

     I thought you were going to research this.

    You are repeating the same thing as before.  Put it into context. peace_5

     
    KellyM_1964
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 5:44 PM ET #818

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeus4par: Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Planet tipping point looming? REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington  @fubah2 Disaster awaits.  And it is assured. @Zeus4par How climate change contributed to starting the deadly Maui blaze YAHOO NEWS - With at least 55 people dead and hundreds of buildings damaged or destroyed, the dramatic and deadly wildfires on the Hawaiian island of Maui are a grim reminder of how climate change is increasing wildfire risk. According to the National Weather Service, the fires on Maui are fueled by dry vegetation, strong winds and low humidity. Wildfires are not common in Hawaii — the Guardian called the current ones “unprecedented” — because  places with a wet, tropical climate do not typically have the dried-out vegetation to provide the fuel. But rising global temperatures are changing that!      According to the organization Global Forest Watch, fires do not naturally occur in tropical rainforests, but   as climate change has dried out forests, tropical forest fires have become more common, increasing by about 5% per year since 2001.

    and it will keep getting worse

    new_bleak

     

     

     

    "I'm the MOST HONEST human being that GOD EVER created!" - Donald "the felon" Trump
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeus4par: Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: Planet tipping point looming? REUTERS - Sea ice in the Antarctic region has fallen to a record low this year as a result of rising global temperatures and there is no quick fix to reverse the damage done, scientists said on Tuesday in a new study of the impact of climate change on the continent.cont ... "In some cases we are getting close to tipping points, which once crossed will lead to irreversible changes with unstoppable consequences for future generations," said Tim Naish, director of the Antarctic Research Centre at New Zealand's Victoria University of Wellington  @fubah2 Disaster awaits.  And it is assured. @Zeus4par How climate change contributed to starting the deadly Maui blaze YAHOO NEWS - With at least 55 people dead and hundreds of buildings damaged or destroyed, the dramatic and deadly wildfires on the Hawaiian island of Maui are a grim reminder of how climate change is increasing wildfire risk. According to the National Weather Service, the fires on Maui are fueled by dry vegetation, strong winds and low humidity. Wildfires are not common in Hawaii — the Guardian called the current ones “unprecedented” — because  places with a wet, tropical climate do not typically have the dried-out vegetation to provide the fuel. But rising global temperatures are changing that!      According to the organization Global Forest Watch, fires do not naturally occur in tropical rainforests, but   as climate change has dried out forests, tropical forest fires have become more common, increasing by about 5% per year since 2001.

    and it will keep getting worse

    new_bleak

     

     

     

     
    UNIMAN
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 7:08 PM ET #819

    March 2022, Mauinow; State officials are describing current drought conditions in Maui County as “historic,” and are advising people to take immediate action to reduce water use. As we enter, the more typically dry summer months, and without significant precipitation in the next few months, Hawai‘i could be in store for devastating wildfires this year.

    August 2022, USAToday; Over the summer, the island has been seeing very little rainfall, causing "lower recharge of the island's aquifers," according to a press release by the Department of Water Supply. Even once rainfall begins again, it'll take "some time to rebuild groundwater storage." As a result, there have been "persistent" droughts now affecting 76.4% of people in Maui County. 

     

    October 2022, sfgate; Maui County currently has the worst drought conditions in the state. In August, Maui hit seven record-high temperatures, and in September, the National Weather Service moved Maui’s central valley to “exceptional drought,” the highest category in the drought monitoring system. We’ve seen a decline in overall rainfall numbers over the past five years,” Pestana says. 

    HOW IN THE HELL COULD THEY NOT SEE THIS COMING???? 

    THEY OBVIOUSLY DID NOTHING.

    Reply

    March 2022, Mauinow; State officials are describing current drought conditions in Maui County as “historic,” and are advising people to take immediate action to reduce water use. As we enter, the more typically dry summer months, and without significant precipitation in the next few months, Hawai‘i could be in store for devastating wildfires this year.

    August 2022, USAToday; Over the summer, the island has been seeing very little rainfall, causing "lower recharge of the island's aquifers," according to a press release by the Department of Water Supply. Even once rainfall begins again, it'll take "some time to rebuild groundwater storage." As a result, there have been "persistent" droughts now affecting 76.4% of people in Maui County. 

     

    October 2022, sfgate; Maui County currently has the worst drought conditions in the state. In August, Maui hit seven record-high temperatures, and in September, the National Weather Service moved Maui’s central valley to “exceptional drought,” the highest category in the drought monitoring system. We’ve seen a decline in overall rainfall numbers over the past five years,” Pestana says. 

    HOW IN THE HELL COULD THEY NOT SEE THIS COMING???? 

    THEY OBVIOUSLY DID NOTHING.

     
    UNIMAN
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 7:24 PM ET #820

    Then you have obvious cover your ass propaganda;

    The Economist; Fires need dry fuel. Various factors provided these fires with a lot of it. Hawaii as a whole --(WE ARE TALKING MAUI, NOT "HAWAII AS A WHOLE")-- has been in a drought for over a year, and in Maui conditions recently worsened considerably. --(According to the above post they have been in a drought last 5 years)-- American drought-watchers recognise five levels of water stress, from “Abnormally dry” to “Exceptional drought”. In April nowhere in Maui County (composed of Maui and some smaller nearby islands) was abnormally dry, --(they were exceptionally dry just last September)--

    You can see the twist to "Hawaii as a whole" to get away from the fact Maui has had an 5 yr ongoing problem and very recognizable.

    They mislead the reader by saying "recently worsened conditions" like it suddenly snuck up on them. Not so!

    And they say Maui was just abnormally dry in April ommitting the fact just last summer they were categorized as Exceptionally Dry.

    The governing body in Hawaii failed their people. Did nothing to prepare for the inevitable. A passing hurricane was all it took.

    Reply

    Then you have obvious cover your ass propaganda;

    The Economist; Fires need dry fuel. Various factors provided these fires with a lot of it. Hawaii as a whole --(WE ARE TALKING MAUI, NOT "HAWAII AS A WHOLE")-- has been in a drought for over a year, and in Maui conditions recently worsened considerably. --(According to the above post they have been in a drought last 5 years)-- American drought-watchers recognise five levels of water stress, from “Abnormally dry” to “Exceptional drought”. In April nowhere in Maui County (composed of Maui and some smaller nearby islands) was abnormally dry, --(they were exceptionally dry just last September)--

    You can see the twist to "Hawaii as a whole" to get away from the fact Maui has had an 5 yr ongoing problem and very recognizable.

    They mislead the reader by saying "recently worsened conditions" like it suddenly snuck up on them. Not so!

    And they say Maui was just abnormally dry in April ommitting the fact just last summer they were categorized as Exceptionally Dry.

    The governing body in Hawaii failed their people. Did nothing to prepare for the inevitable. A passing hurricane was all it took.

     
    Raiders22
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    Posted: Aug. 13, 2023 - 7:53 PM ET #821

    @UNIMAN

     Of course they saw it coming.  You are correct.

    Quotes from some folks:

    A scientist with the state of Hawaii said the problem was a century in the making. At the beginning of the 20th century the western part of Maui was an agricultural area growing pineapples. When that ended the area was allowed to grow into a prairie of grass. When it caught fire the westerly winds carried the fire across the island. He said that had the area been managed as a forest, as had been recommended, the fire would not have spread as far nor as fast as it did. Another case of the left not listening to the science in which they disagree. 

     

    It was more of a poor land management issue than global warming but then the politicians would have to accept responsibility. Dry non native invasive grass from deforestation that was not properly cleared got the fire going and the wind did the rest. Just like poor forest management has wreaked havoc on the mainland.

     

    Hawaii had a high amount of rain in the first half of this year, which caused tremendous vegetation growth, it was then almost immediately followed by a very dry pattern with higher temps. Perhaps the state and county of Maui should have done due diligence and cut the overgrowth of grass, but most definitely they should have warned people to evacuate far better and earlier. 6am the fires in the Lahaina area started, and basically no real proactive or helpful announcements until late afternoon and until the evening. And no sirens or warnings of any kind whatsoever.

    Reply

    @UNIMAN

     Of course they saw it coming.  You are correct.

    Quotes from some folks:

    A scientist with the state of Hawaii said the problem was a century in the making. At the beginning of the 20th century the western part of Maui was an agricultural area growing pineapples. When that ended the area was allowed to grow into a prairie of grass. When it caught fire the westerly winds carried the fire across the island. He said that had the area been managed as a forest, as had been recommended, the fire would not have spread as far nor as fast as it did. Another case of the left not listening to the science in which they disagree. 

     

    It was more of a poor land management issue than global warming but then the politicians would have to accept responsibility. Dry non native invasive grass from deforestation that was not properly cleared got the fire going and the wind did the rest. Just like poor forest management has wreaked havoc on the mainland.

     

    Hawaii had a high amount of rain in the first half of this year, which caused tremendous vegetation growth, it was then almost immediately followed by a very dry pattern with higher temps. Perhaps the state and county of Maui should have done due diligence and cut the overgrowth of grass, but most definitely they should have warned people to evacuate far better and earlier. 6am the fires in the Lahaina area started, and basically no real proactive or helpful announcements until late afternoon and until the evening. And no sirens or warnings of any kind whatsoever.

     
    KellyM_1964
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    Posted: Aug. 14, 2023 - 12:08 AM ET #822

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Over 97% of top climate scientists worldwide accept man-made global warming.  They conclude current warming is caused by burning fossil fuels.  

    @thirdperson

    and its getting worse every freakn day  

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

    "I'm the MOST HONEST human being that GOD EVER created!" - Donald "the felon" Trump
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:

    Over 97% of top climate scientists worldwide accept man-made global warming.  They conclude current warming is caused by burning fossil fuels.  

    @thirdperson

    and its getting worse every freakn day  

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     
    spockgato
    spockgato
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    Joined: Apr, 2005
    Posts: 15326
    Posted: Aug. 14, 2023 - 2:44 AM ET #823

    wallstreetcappers craps in his draws and pees fuckin backwards from his vaj with a squirt.
    Reply

     
    sundance
    sundance
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    Posts: 16805
    Posted: Aug. 14, 2023 - 9:31 AM ET #824

    Is it possible that the numerous fires across the planet have been made in the holy name of 'Climate Change'?

    Reply

    Is it possible that the numerous fires across the planet have been made in the holy name of 'Climate Change'?

     
     
    UNIMAN
    UNIMAN
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    Posted: Aug. 14, 2023 - 9:57 AM ET #825

    Quote Originally Posted by Raiders22:

    @UNIMAN   Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN: They expanded the canal back in 2006. That expansion must be hurting them now. How you mean?  No, it has helped them and us tremendously with revenue for them and shortened shipping times for the large container ships. Or are you meaning because of the water situation?  I think percentage-wise that is a wash.

    The upgrade was said to double the capacity of shipping through the canal and they installed water saving measures. 

    A quote from Google; The canal's locks, which include new and substantially larger chambers that opened in 2016, rely on freshwater to operate its locks. Approximately 200 million liters of water (52.8 million gallons) are needed for each vessel transit under normal conditions.Jul 12, 2023

    Now read this 2009 Popular Mechanics article; ....the new lock chambers will hold 65 percent more water than the originals, they will use 7 percent less water per transit. Currently, each transit flushes about 52 million gal. of fresh water - https://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/infrastructure/a1277/4212183/

    Looking at the 2023 Google statement and the 2009 PM article they both say 52 mg per transit. I don't see that 7% savings?

    So, basically they made the canal more efficient and expect 35% more traffic which in turn would use 35% more fresh water. 

     

     

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by Raiders22:

    @UNIMAN   Quote Originally Posted by UNIMAN: They expanded the canal back in 2006. That expansion must be hurting them now. How you mean?  No, it has helped them and us tremendously with revenue for them and shortened shipping times for the large container ships. Or are you meaning because of the water situation?  I think percentage-wise that is a wash.

    The upgrade was said to double the capacity of shipping through the canal and they installed water saving measures. 

    A quote from Google; The canal's locks, which include new and substantially larger chambers that opened in 2016, rely on freshwater to operate its locks. Approximately 200 million liters of water (52.8 million gallons) are needed for each vessel transit under normal conditions.Jul 12, 2023

    Now read this 2009 Popular Mechanics article; ....the new lock chambers will hold 65 percent more water than the originals, they will use 7 percent less water per transit. Currently, each transit flushes about 52 million gal. of fresh water - https://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/infrastructure/a1277/4212183/

    Looking at the 2023 Google statement and the 2009 PM article they both say 52 mg per transit. I don't see that 7% savings?

    So, basically they made the canal more efficient and expect 35% more traffic which in turn would use 35% more fresh water. 

     

     

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