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    All Forums | Penalty Box

    To all gun owner advocates

    12345 Next Last»
    Anent
    AcerRubrum
    pjrez
    rooster010
    kaponofor3
    ...
    Participants:
    Search
    Views: 2311
    Posts: 109
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    Anent
    Anent
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 4:39 PM ET #1

    I'm reminding you of what also happens, besides "preventing crimes."

    let's keep it real, at least. no gun, no dead kid.

    https://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2011/01/gunman-apologized-shooting.html
    Reply
    To remove first post, remove entire topic.
    I'm reminding you of what also happens, besides "preventing crimes."

    let's keep it real, at least. no gun, no dead kid.

    https://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2011/01/gunman-apologized-shooting.html
     
    AcerRubrum
    AcerRubrum
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 4:49 PM ET #2



    so taking away the right to bear arms will stop this and make us all safer?  is that your point?....
    Reply


    so taking away the right to bear arms will stop this and make us all safer?  is that your point?....
     
    pjrez
    pjrez
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 4:50 PM ET #3

    We must ban these too
    Reply
    We must ban these too
     
    rooster010
    rooster010
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 4:52 PM ET #4

    lets keep it real

    if there was no public school there would be no dead kid

    Reply

    lets keep it real

    if there was no public school there would be no dead kid

     
    kaponofor3
    kaponofor3
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 4:54 PM ET #5

    Yeah this is not your strongest example, Anent.
    Reply
    Yeah this is not your strongest example, Anent.
     
    Ap1Bfreetorun
    Ap1Bfreetorun
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 5:12 PM ET #6

    Why do we not all turn in all of our guns and those that are not turned in must be confiscated by the police and federal troops.  Just how long do you think it would take the government to issue decrees and say "like it or lump it"?  It is only the fear of the people in the country that own guns and will respond in kind if any attempt at confiscation occurs.  It would be similar to the armed burglars breaking into homes in Washington, D.C. with no fear that the residents had any guns to protect themselves.  Thank God that we have our guns, therefore have protection from despots.  You better buy more ammo.
    Reply
    Why do we not all turn in all of our guns and those that are not turned in must be confiscated by the police and federal troops.  Just how long do you think it would take the government to issue decrees and say "like it or lump it"?  It is only the fear of the people in the country that own guns and will respond in kind if any attempt at confiscation occurs.  It would be similar to the armed burglars breaking into homes in Washington, D.C. with no fear that the residents had any guns to protect themselves.  Thank God that we have our guns, therefore have protection from despots.  You better buy more ammo.
     
    Stiln
    Stiln
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 5:33 PM ET #7

    Anent

    I got in to a heated debate with the poster straightshooter on the legality of firearms in cities specifically. But it ended up going nowhere as he cannot debate without clamining he's up 56-3 with his backups in depicting an imaginary football game of some sort.

    Anyhow, the primary point concerning gun laws is this. The purchase of a firearm should be the most difficult purchase in America. The background check should be extensive, intrusive, and exhaustive­. And once approved, you should be required to demonstrat­e your proficienc­y before taking possession­. 

    Because statistics show that there are more gun homicides in areas with less strict gun laws.

    Reply

    Anent

    I got in to a heated debate with the poster straightshooter on the legality of firearms in cities specifically. But it ended up going nowhere as he cannot debate without clamining he's up 56-3 with his backups in depicting an imaginary football game of some sort.

    Anyhow, the primary point concerning gun laws is this. The purchase of a firearm should be the most difficult purchase in America. The background check should be extensive, intrusive, and exhaustive­. And once approved, you should be required to demonstrat­e your proficienc­y before taking possession­. 

    Because statistics show that there are more gun homicides in areas with less strict gun laws.

     
    wallstreetcappers
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 5:47 PM ET #8

    Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:

    Anent

    I got in to a heated debate with the poster straightshooter on the legality of firearms in cities specifically. But it ended up going nowhere as he cannot debate without clamining he's up 56-3 with his backups in depicting an imaginary football game of some sort.

    Anyhow, the primary point concerning gun laws is this. The purchase of a firearm should be the most difficult purchase in America. The background check should be extensive, intrusive, and exhaustive­. And once approved, you should be required to demonstrat­e your proficienc­y before taking possession­. 

    Because statistics show that there are more gun homicides in areas with less strict gun laws.



    That should be a bare minimum, we could even be tougher. I completely agree.
    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:

    Anent

    I got in to a heated debate with the poster straightshooter on the legality of firearms in cities specifically. But it ended up going nowhere as he cannot debate without clamining he's up 56-3 with his backups in depicting an imaginary football game of some sort.

    Anyhow, the primary point concerning gun laws is this. The purchase of a firearm should be the most difficult purchase in America. The background check should be extensive, intrusive, and exhaustive­. And once approved, you should be required to demonstrat­e your proficienc­y before taking possession­. 

    Because statistics show that there are more gun homicides in areas with less strict gun laws.



    That should be a bare minimum, we could even be tougher. I completely agree.
     
    steveshane67
    steveshane67
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 5:52 PM ET #9

    bc a kid from a 1.4% white HS brought a gun to school, a gun that he most likely wasnt legally allowed to own let alone carry, guns should be taken away from the law abiding citizens?

    i remember when i was in HS, a 14 yo girl was stabbed to death at a city middles school.  i dont recall a big uproar over the banning of knives.

    i will say, i do think there should be some sort of 'good citizen' standard to owning a gun, i dont think there should be the gun show loop hole, and i cannot strongly disagree with the "proficiency" requirement.  just bc you arent a good shot, doesnt mean you should not be allowed to own.
    Reply
    bc a kid from a 1.4% white HS brought a gun to school, a gun that he most likely wasnt legally allowed to own let alone carry, guns should be taken away from the law abiding citizens?

    i remember when i was in HS, a 14 yo girl was stabbed to death at a city middles school.  i dont recall a big uproar over the banning of knives.

    i will say, i do think there should be some sort of 'good citizen' standard to owning a gun, i dont think there should be the gun show loop hole, and i cannot strongly disagree with the "proficiency" requirement.  just bc you arent a good shot, doesnt mean you should not be allowed to own.
     
    SarasotaSlim
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 5:59 PM ET #10

    If guns kill people ,do keyboards misspell words ?
    Reply
    If guns kill people ,do keyboards misspell words ?
     
    rooster010
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 6:09 PM ET #11

    Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:

    Anent

    I got in to a heated debate with the poster straightshooter on the legality of firearms in cities specifically. But it ended up going nowhere as he cannot debate without clamining he's up 56-3 with his backups in depicting an imaginary football game of some sort.

    Anyhow, the primary point concerning gun laws is this. The purchase of a firearm should be the most difficult purchase in America. The background check should be extensive, intrusive, and exhaustive­. And once approved, you should be required to demonstrat­e your proficienc­y before taking possession­. 

    Because statistics show that there are more gun homicides in areas with less strict gun laws.

    this unbiased study would beg to differ

    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:

    Anent

    I got in to a heated debate with the poster straightshooter on the legality of firearms in cities specifically. But it ended up going nowhere as he cannot debate without clamining he's up 56-3 with his backups in depicting an imaginary football game of some sort.

    Anyhow, the primary point concerning gun laws is this. The purchase of a firearm should be the most difficult purchase in America. The background check should be extensive, intrusive, and exhaustive­. And once approved, you should be required to demonstrat­e your proficienc­y before taking possession­. 

    Because statistics show that there are more gun homicides in areas with less strict gun laws.

    this unbiased study would beg to differ

     
    darkhorse12
    darkhorse12
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 6:14 PM ET #12

    Quote Originally Posted by steveshane67:

    bc a kid from a 1.4% white HS brought a gun to school, a gun that he most likely wasnt legally allowed to own let alone carry, guns should be taken away from the law abiding citizens?

    i remember when i was in HS, a 14 yo girl was stabbed to death at a city middles school.  i dont recall a big uproar over the banning of knives.

    i will say, i do think there should be some sort of 'good citizen' standard to owning a gun, i dont think there should be the gun show loop hole, and i cannot strongly disagree with the "proficiency" requirement.  just bc you arent a good shot, doesnt mean you should not be allowed to own.

    I agree on the own part but you should be proficient to carry and use.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by steveshane67:

    bc a kid from a 1.4% white HS brought a gun to school, a gun that he most likely wasnt legally allowed to own let alone carry, guns should be taken away from the law abiding citizens?

    i remember when i was in HS, a 14 yo girl was stabbed to death at a city middles school.  i dont recall a big uproar over the banning of knives.

    i will say, i do think there should be some sort of 'good citizen' standard to owning a gun, i dont think there should be the gun show loop hole, and i cannot strongly disagree with the "proficiency" requirement.  just bc you arent a good shot, doesnt mean you should not be allowed to own.

    I agree on the own part but you should be proficient to carry and use.

     
    rooster010
    rooster010
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 6:20 PM ET #13

    i think it should be more difficult for an elderly person to obtain a drivers license than for any law abiding citizen to obtain a firearm
    Reply
    i think it should be more difficult for an elderly person to obtain a drivers license than for any law abiding citizen to obtain a firearm
     
    AcerRubrum
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 6:22 PM ET #14

    agree rooster...but I hope you mean >80 when you say elderly! 
    Reply
    agree rooster...but I hope you mean >80 when you say elderly! 
     
    rick3117
    rick3117
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 6:26 PM ET #15

    Yes the UNDERAGE kid that had the ILLEGALLY acquired handgun is a perfect example of why regulation is needed??

    You cant make this shit up.  Get a clue. 

    You guys are making shit up left and right to take away the constitutional rights of others.

    IF you guys are that scared move to Canada or Denmark.  Stop being so cowardly that you are willing to give away your rights. 

    For fucks sake have a spine.
    Reply
    Yes the UNDERAGE kid that had the ILLEGALLY acquired handgun is a perfect example of why regulation is needed??

    You cant make this shit up.  Get a clue. 

    You guys are making shit up left and right to take away the constitutional rights of others.

    IF you guys are that scared move to Canada or Denmark.  Stop being so cowardly that you are willing to give away your rights. 

    For fucks sake have a spine.
     
    rick3117
    rick3117
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 6:28 PM ET #16

    P.S.  the constitution is a "Gun Owner Advocate" 

    I can not believe how small minded and fearful people can be.
    Reply
    P.S.  the constitution is a "Gun Owner Advocate" 

    I can not believe how small minded and fearful people can be.
     
    gers
    gers
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 6:38 PM ET #17

    Quote Originally Posted by Anent:

    I'm reminding you of what also happens, besides "preventing crimes."

    let's keep it real, at least. no gun, no dead kid.

    https://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2011/01/gunman-apologized-shooting.html
    Banning guns will not stop any future events crime up here is out of control.
    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by Anent:

    I'm reminding you of what also happens, besides "preventing crimes."

    let's keep it real, at least. no gun, no dead kid.

    https://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2011/01/gunman-apologized-shooting.html
    Banning guns will not stop any future events crime up here is out of control.
     
    atlheatholder
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 6:40 PM ET #18

    Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:

    The purchase of a firearm should be the most difficult purchase in America. The background check should be extensive, intrusive, and exhaustive­. And once approved, you should be required to demonstrat­e your proficienc­y before taking possession­. 

    Why should tha purchase be the most difficult?  It should actually be much simpler in my opinion.  And for the gvt to regulate said purchase is just pure bullshit.

     

    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by Stiln:

    The purchase of a firearm should be the most difficult purchase in America. The background check should be extensive, intrusive, and exhaustive­. And once approved, you should be required to demonstrat­e your proficienc­y before taking possession­. 

    Why should tha purchase be the most difficult?  It should actually be much simpler in my opinion.  And for the gvt to regulate said purchase is just pure bullshit.

     

     
    KOAJ
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 6:43 PM ET #19

    Quote Originally Posted by atlheatholder:

    Why should tha purchase be the most difficult?  It should actually be much simpler in my opinion.  And for the gvt to regulate said purchase is just pure bullshit.

     



    stop complaining. they are making safer for you


    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by atlheatholder:

    Why should tha purchase be the most difficult?  It should actually be much simpler in my opinion.  And for the gvt to regulate said purchase is just pure bullshit.

     



    stop complaining. they are making safer for you


     
    Stiln
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    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 7:50 PM ET #20

    @rooster

    Please provide page and line numbers to where this journal is refuting the my statement concerning less strict gun laws. Don't simply  take an article from the harvard law review that has "gun laws" that you most likely through google and expect me to believe its refuting my points. That article from the looks of it did not examine specific state laws concerning firearms.

    @steveshane

    "i dont think there should be the gun show loop hole, and i cannot strongly disagree with the "proficiency" requirement.  just bc you arent a good shot, doesnt mean you should not be allowed to own."

    Elaborate my friend, no one on this fourm will know what "good shot means." bc? Do you mean "because?" Try and type with a little more effort especially since this is the politics section of the forum......

    @rick3117

    No need to insult people who disagree with your opinion. This article is of course not a good example. But my point is this. Highly dense populations should have extremely strict laws concerning the purchasing of firearms, especially since there are many more police officers around to control these civilized areas.

    In a rural setting in Montana or Wyoming, Colorado, Nebraska, etc.... Go buy as many firearms as you'd like. Knock yourself out, go kill as manay bears, deers, geese, etc.... as you possibly can. But once you cross state lines and step on soil in places like California, NY, Illinois, NJ, CT, Delaware, MD, PA, Michigan, I believe Florida should ammend their laws. But that;s an entirely different argument. You must honor the laws of those states and if that means not being able to carry or even bring a hand gun across state lines then so be it. Because NYC certainly does not condone or honor out of state gun licences

    In cities where there are hundreds and probably many more people per square block guns should not be in the hands of ordinary citizens not invovlved with the law, military and so on.

    @heatholder

    You have to elaborate more. Why is it bullshit?

    Reply

    @rooster

    Please provide page and line numbers to where this journal is refuting the my statement concerning less strict gun laws. Don't simply  take an article from the harvard law review that has "gun laws" that you most likely through google and expect me to believe its refuting my points. That article from the looks of it did not examine specific state laws concerning firearms.

    @steveshane

    "i dont think there should be the gun show loop hole, and i cannot strongly disagree with the "proficiency" requirement.  just bc you arent a good shot, doesnt mean you should not be allowed to own."

    Elaborate my friend, no one on this fourm will know what "good shot means." bc? Do you mean "because?" Try and type with a little more effort especially since this is the politics section of the forum......

    @rick3117

    No need to insult people who disagree with your opinion. This article is of course not a good example. But my point is this. Highly dense populations should have extremely strict laws concerning the purchasing of firearms, especially since there are many more police officers around to control these civilized areas.

    In a rural setting in Montana or Wyoming, Colorado, Nebraska, etc.... Go buy as many firearms as you'd like. Knock yourself out, go kill as manay bears, deers, geese, etc.... as you possibly can. But once you cross state lines and step on soil in places like California, NY, Illinois, NJ, CT, Delaware, MD, PA, Michigan, I believe Florida should ammend their laws. But that;s an entirely different argument. You must honor the laws of those states and if that means not being able to carry or even bring a hand gun across state lines then so be it. Because NYC certainly does not condone or honor out of state gun licences

    In cities where there are hundreds and probably many more people per square block guns should not be in the hands of ordinary citizens not invovlved with the law, military and so on.

    @heatholder

    You have to elaborate more. Why is it bullshit?

     
    rooster010
    rooster010
    All-Star
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Jun, 2007
    Posts: 10911
    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 8:24 PM ET #21

    the entire article refutes your assertion on a global scale

    i tried to simply supply an unbiased study

    please link me some evidence of your statement

    if you need some more reading refuting your statement, you can read up on the Lott and Kleck studies, they are based on actual numbers also, not opinion like the brady billers

    im sure you will have to google it

    Reply

    the entire article refutes your assertion on a global scale

    i tried to simply supply an unbiased study

    please link me some evidence of your statement

    if you need some more reading refuting your statement, you can read up on the Lott and Kleck studies, they are based on actual numbers also, not opinion like the brady billers

    im sure you will have to google it

     
    potter36
    potter36
    Rookie
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    Joined: Dec, 2009
    Posts: 854
    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 8:52 PM ET #22

    Quote Originally Posted by rooster010:

    i think it should be more difficult for an elderly person to obtain a drivers license than for any law abiding citizen to obtain a firearm
    abso -fukn-lutely.
    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by rooster010:

    i think it should be more difficult for an elderly person to obtain a drivers license than for any law abiding citizen to obtain a firearm
    abso -fukn-lutely.
     
    Anent
    Anent
    Captain
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Nov, 2007
    Posts: 9124
    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 9:03 PM ET #23

    Wow.  This is one hot issue.  I posted the article because I think it's a perfect example of the violence of living with guns.  Kids breaks laws, urban areas are rife with dangerous situations where kids can obtain, and use, a gun; random things happen, but when there's a gun in the area of mayhem, the guns seem to contribute to the violence rather than prevent it.  Some gun owners would like to see students carry guns on campus because of all of the violence and crime that would be prevented.  Well, what if the gun goes off accidentally, as in this case?  Is that a safer environment?  Will more gun laws completely remove illegally obtained handguns, etc.  Probably not.  I just wanted to counter balance the gun ownership argument that "guns save lives" with an almost daily counter-example where it just doesn't work out that way.

    I wonder if the kid who brought the gun understands the difference between a magazine and a clip?  This is what some of the responses to last weeks shooting have been about.  People are dying and we're dealing with semantics?
    Reply
    Wow.  This is one hot issue.  I posted the article because I think it's a perfect example of the violence of living with guns.  Kids breaks laws, urban areas are rife with dangerous situations where kids can obtain, and use, a gun; random things happen, but when there's a gun in the area of mayhem, the guns seem to contribute to the violence rather than prevent it.  Some gun owners would like to see students carry guns on campus because of all of the violence and crime that would be prevented.  Well, what if the gun goes off accidentally, as in this case?  Is that a safer environment?  Will more gun laws completely remove illegally obtained handguns, etc.  Probably not.  I just wanted to counter balance the gun ownership argument that "guns save lives" with an almost daily counter-example where it just doesn't work out that way.

    I wonder if the kid who brought the gun understands the difference between a magazine and a clip?  This is what some of the responses to last weeks shooting have been about.  People are dying and we're dealing with semantics?
     
    rooster010
    rooster010
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    Joined: Jun, 2007
    Posts: 10911
    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 9:08 PM ET #24

    Quote Originally Posted by Anent:

    Wow.  This is one hot issue.  I posted the article because I think it's a perfect example of the violence of living with guns.  Kids breaks laws, urban areas are rife with dangerous situations where kids can obtain, and use, a gun; random things happen, but when there's a gun in the area of mayhem, the guns seem to contribute to the violence rather than prevent it.  Some gun owners would like to see students carry guns on campus because of all of the violence and crime that would be prevented.  Well, what if the gun goes off accidentally, as in this case?  Is that a safer environment?  Will more gun laws completely remove illegally obtained handguns, etc.  Probably not.  I just wanted to counter balance the gun ownership argument that "guns save lives" with an almost daily counter-example where it just doesn't work out that way.

    I wonder if the kid who brought the gun understands the difference between a magazine and a clip?  This is what some of the responses to last weeks shooting have been about.  People are dying and we're dealing with semantics?

    i happen to think both arguments are flawed

    but i also believe more regulations and laws are not the answer

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by Anent:

    Wow.  This is one hot issue.  I posted the article because I think it's a perfect example of the violence of living with guns.  Kids breaks laws, urban areas are rife with dangerous situations where kids can obtain, and use, a gun; random things happen, but when there's a gun in the area of mayhem, the guns seem to contribute to the violence rather than prevent it.  Some gun owners would like to see students carry guns on campus because of all of the violence and crime that would be prevented.  Well, what if the gun goes off accidentally, as in this case?  Is that a safer environment?  Will more gun laws completely remove illegally obtained handguns, etc.  Probably not.  I just wanted to counter balance the gun ownership argument that "guns save lives" with an almost daily counter-example where it just doesn't work out that way.

    I wonder if the kid who brought the gun understands the difference between a magazine and a clip?  This is what some of the responses to last weeks shooting have been about.  People are dying and we're dealing with semantics?

    i happen to think both arguments are flawed

    but i also believe more regulations and laws are not the answer

     
     
    Anent
    Anent
    Captain
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Nov, 2007
    Posts: 9124
    Posted: Jan. 18, 2011 - 9:28 PM ET #25

    Quote Originally Posted by potter36:

    abso -fukn-lutely.


    hmm, I'm guessing that you are not an elderly person.
    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by potter36:

    abso -fukn-lutely.


    hmm, I'm guessing that you are not an elderly person.
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