The ref's decision on the field after everything with the booth had played out was: "Illegal forward pass. Ball is dead. Zero time on the clock. The game is over."
In my opinion, that nonsense the ref said is not a rule in the NFL rulebook. A foward pass warrants a flag, which can be declined by the defensive team. Also, a fumble inside 2 minutes can, I repeat, *can* be advanced by the defensive team.
The original call was right and the overturn is not even a real rule. I think the ref knew it. This is so dirty .... holy moly .... I can't believe this. I didn't even have any money on this game. This really smells.
How .... how (?) .... can the ref call a rule that doesn't exist?
?????
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Bottom Line:
The ref's decision on the field after everything with the booth had played out was: "Illegal forward pass. Ball is dead. Zero time on the clock. The game is over."
In my opinion, that nonsense the ref said is not a rule in the NFL rulebook. A foward pass warrants a flag, which can be declined by the defensive team. Also, a fumble inside 2 minutes can, I repeat, *can* be advanced by the defensive team.
The original call was right and the overturn is not even a real rule. I think the ref knew it. This is so dirty .... holy moly .... I can't believe this. I didn't even have any money on this game. This really smells.
How .... how (?) .... can the ref call a rule that doesn't exist?
The worst part was the ref making the final announcement, and starting to raise his hands as if to signal touchdown, then adjusting his hat instead, with a confused look on his face.
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The worst part was the ref making the final announcement, and starting to raise his hands as if to signal touchdown, then adjusting his hat instead, with a confused look on his face.
IF YOU BET THE SHITTY STEELERS YOU KNEW YOU WERE DEAD WITH 20 SECONDS LEFT IN THE GAME. YOU SHOULD NEVER HAVE EXPECTED THE COVER. WHO REALLY F-ING SAT THERE AND SEE GEE IF THE CAN GET THE CHARGERS TO SCREW UP THE LATERAL IN THE BACKFIELD MAYBE WE CAN GET THE TD TO COVER. ALL YOU DEGENRATES WHO SAT THERE AND THOUGHT THAT IF YOU HAD HALF A BRAIN SAID TO YOURSELF "YEAH BUT EVEN IF THE GET THE CHARGERS TO SCREW UP IN THE BACKFIELD PITT WILL JUST FALL ON IT AND WE STILL WONT COVER. NO WAY YOU COULD SIT THERE AND SAY YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO THE COVER IF YOU BET PITT. STOP BITCHING PULL UP YOUR PANTIES AND ROLL WITH THE PUNCHES...BUT THIS ISNT EVEN A PUNCH THE STEELERS WERE NOT NO WAY IN HELL GOING TO COVER BECAUSE PITT IS SUPPOSED TO JUST FALL ON THE BALL INSTEAD OF ADVANCING IT RISKING ANOTHER POSSIBLE FUMBLE. THE RIGHT PLAY IS TO FALL ON IT ASSURING SD WITH NO POSSIBLE CHANCE AT ALL OF ANYTHING POSITIVE. POLAMALU IS A DUMB F--K
FOR NOT FALLING ON IT. HIT IN TEH HEAD TOO MANY TIMES AND SO ARE YOU IF YOU THINK PITT DESERVED TO COVER!
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IF YOU BET THE SHITTY STEELERS YOU KNEW YOU WERE DEAD WITH 20 SECONDS LEFT IN THE GAME. YOU SHOULD NEVER HAVE EXPECTED THE COVER. WHO REALLY F-ING SAT THERE AND SEE GEE IF THE CAN GET THE CHARGERS TO SCREW UP THE LATERAL IN THE BACKFIELD MAYBE WE CAN GET THE TD TO COVER. ALL YOU DEGENRATES WHO SAT THERE AND THOUGHT THAT IF YOU HAD HALF A BRAIN SAID TO YOURSELF "YEAH BUT EVEN IF THE GET THE CHARGERS TO SCREW UP IN THE BACKFIELD PITT WILL JUST FALL ON IT AND WE STILL WONT COVER. NO WAY YOU COULD SIT THERE AND SAY YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO THE COVER IF YOU BET PITT. STOP BITCHING PULL UP YOUR PANTIES AND ROLL WITH THE PUNCHES...BUT THIS ISNT EVEN A PUNCH THE STEELERS WERE NOT NO WAY IN HELL GOING TO COVER BECAUSE PITT IS SUPPOSED TO JUST FALL ON THE BALL INSTEAD OF ADVANCING IT RISKING ANOTHER POSSIBLE FUMBLE. THE RIGHT PLAY IS TO FALL ON IT ASSURING SD WITH NO POSSIBLE CHANCE AT ALL OF ANYTHING POSITIVE. POLAMALU IS A DUMB F--K
FOR NOT FALLING ON IT. HIT IN TEH HEAD TOO MANY TIMES AND SO ARE YOU IF YOU THINK PITT DESERVED TO COVER!
Vanzack, don't make up rules, that is not corect. Any backward lateral can be advanced by either team. That wasn't even why they dis-allowed the 2nd TD. It was ruled a Forward lateral, that cannot be advanced, which replayed showed was a Backwards lateral that the ref clearly knew, but reversed it on the field,
Then 5 minutes later, in front of a room full of reporters, changed his mind again and said the TD should have counted.
What changed his mind from the replay booth to thr press room?
Its called the spread, the true outcome for the NFL!
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Vanzack, don't make up rules, that is not corect. Any backward lateral can be advanced by either team. That wasn't even why they dis-allowed the 2nd TD. It was ruled a Forward lateral, that cannot be advanced, which replayed showed was a Backwards lateral that the ref clearly knew, but reversed it on the field,
Then 5 minutes later, in front of a room full of reporters, changed his mind again and said the TD should have counted.
What changed his mind from the replay booth to thr press room?
Its called the spread, the true outcome for the NFL!
this game was fixed for Sandi to win...you look at both TD that were called back. Too much money was on Pitt. U kno the odds maker ain't taking a hit on their wallet. I'm happy, but a lateral or passing the ball behind the player w/ the ball is legal period.
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this game was fixed for Sandi to win...you look at both TD that were called back. Too much money was on Pitt. U kno the odds maker ain't taking a hit on their wallet. I'm happy, but a lateral or passing the ball behind the player w/ the ball is legal period.
The worst part was the ref making the final announcement, and starting to raise his hands as if to signal touchdown, then adjusting his hat instead, with a confused look on his face.
Hilarious. I noticed that too. That ref had the look of death on his face.
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Quote Originally Posted by abasin70:
The worst part was the ref making the final announcement, and starting to raise his hands as if to signal touchdown, then adjusting his hat instead, with a confused look on his face.
Hilarious. I noticed that too. That ref had the look of death on his face.
People u need to understand that the zebras control the game...not the player or the coaches. The owners only care if their teams win when they're supposed to.
Sincerely,
Tim Donaghy
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People u need to understand that the zebras control the game...not the player or the coaches. The owners only care if their teams win when they're supposed to.
Love how Van states this with such conviction, then wavers and is ultimately proven to be completely wrong.
The call was there was an illegal forward pass, which the refs ruled killed the play. That is true if the pass hits the ground. However, in this case, the "forward" pass was complete. At that point, the play stays alive, no different any other penalty, such as the QB being over the line of scrimmage at the time of the throw.
Why people still listen to Van kills me. The guy is always wrong on this stuff and acts like such a hardass about it that people are persuaded by his bullshit.
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Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:
Forget the illegal forward pass.
IN THE NFL YOU CANT ADVANCE A LATERAL.
Right call.
Love how Van states this with such conviction, then wavers and is ultimately proven to be completely wrong.
The call was there was an illegal forward pass, which the refs ruled killed the play. That is true if the pass hits the ground. However, in this case, the "forward" pass was complete. At that point, the play stays alive, no different any other penalty, such as the QB being over the line of scrimmage at the time of the throw.
Why people still listen to Van kills me. The guy is always wrong on this stuff and acts like such a hardass about it that people are persuaded by his bullshit.
The issue is dead. Like it or not it will not get overturned, and even if it DOES, no book is ever going to pay out both sides of a game. It reeks of something sinister, but we'll never know. The perception of inpropriety is often enough in the court of public opinion, and that is what the NFL has to deal with now. Particularly because the only people that are affected by the call one way or another are the betting public. Pitt still gets their W, SD still gets the L.
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The issue is dead. Like it or not it will not get overturned, and even if it DOES, no book is ever going to pay out both sides of a game. It reeks of something sinister, but we'll never know. The perception of inpropriety is often enough in the court of public opinion, and that is what the NFL has to deal with now. Particularly because the only people that are affected by the call one way or another are the betting public. Pitt still gets their W, SD still gets the L.
LOSTED 1000 ON THE GAME AND PUSHED 1000 ON THE 2ND HALF. THERE NOTHING WE CAN DO BUT MOVE ON. TO SAY YOU ARE NEVER GOING TO BET ON THE NFL IS CRAZY.JUST CHALK IT UP AS ONE OF THE WORST BEATS EVER AND THINK OF THE STORY YOU CAN TELL
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LOSTED 1000 ON THE GAME AND PUSHED 1000 ON THE 2ND HALF. THERE NOTHING WE CAN DO BUT MOVE ON. TO SAY YOU ARE NEVER GOING TO BET ON THE NFL IS CRAZY.JUST CHALK IT UP AS ONE OF THE WORST BEATS EVER AND THINK OF THE STORY YOU CAN TELL
I am moving on...and out of gambling. The NFL was the last sport I thought was above corruption. Now, whether there truly was a fix, we'll never know. But either way, I lost a game I should have won due to incompetence. That's enough for me.
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I am moving on...and out of gambling. The NFL was the last sport I thought was above corruption. Now, whether there truly was a fix, we'll never know. But either way, I lost a game I should have won due to incompetence. That's enough for me.
There was no flag on the play. So, how can the booth, charge an illegal forward pass.
The replay official job is to overturn or confirm a call on the field. The call on the field was a touchdown. That is the only play, the replay official can review
There was no flag for an illegal forward pass, therefore that was consider a missed call, and not a reviewable one.
That was an openly rigged game, and Steelers' backers was on the wrong side of the fix.
End of discussion.
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There was no flag on the play. So, how can the booth, charge an illegal forward pass.
The replay official job is to overturn or confirm a call on the field. The call on the field was a touchdown. That is the only play, the replay official can review
There was no flag for an illegal forward pass, therefore that was consider a missed call, and not a reviewable one.
That was an openly rigged game, and Steelers' backers was on the wrong side of the fix.
Love how Van states this with such conviction, then wavers and is ultimately proven to be completely wrong.
The call was there was an illegal forward pass, which the refs ruled killed the play. That is true if the pass hits the ground. However, in this case, the "forward" pass was complete. At that point, the play stays alive, no different any other penalty, such as the QB being over the line of scrimmage at the time of the throw.
Why people still listen to Van kills me. The guy is always wrong on this stuff and acts like such a hardass about it that people are persuaded by his bullshit.
said something very similar to this not too long ago........just the latest evidence,.....although this particular example is far less damaging then other things he's been terribly wrong about in the past
misinformation that is stated authoritatively or persuasively can be very dangerous, especially when delivered to the wrong hands
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Quote Originally Posted by alwayswin:
Love how Van states this with such conviction, then wavers and is ultimately proven to be completely wrong.
The call was there was an illegal forward pass, which the refs ruled killed the play. That is true if the pass hits the ground. However, in this case, the "forward" pass was complete. At that point, the play stays alive, no different any other penalty, such as the QB being over the line of scrimmage at the time of the throw.
Why people still listen to Van kills me. The guy is always wrong on this stuff and acts like such a hardass about it that people are persuaded by his bullshit.
said something very similar to this not too long ago........just the latest evidence,.....although this particular example is far less damaging then other things he's been terribly wrong about in the past
misinformation that is stated authoritatively or persuasively can be very dangerous, especially when delivered to the wrong hands
I am moving on...and outof gambling. The NFL was the last sport I thought was above corruption. Now, whether there truly was a fix, we'll never know. But either way, I lost a game I should have won due to incompetence. That's enough for me.
I like that.
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Quote Originally Posted by alwayswin:
I am moving on...and outof gambling. The NFL was the last sport I thought was above corruption. Now, whether there truly was a fix, we'll never know. But either way, I lost a game I should have won due to incompetence. That's enough for me.
The distinction between a fumble and a muff should be kept in mind in considering rules about fumbles. A fumble is the loss of player possession of the ball. A muff is the touching of a loose ball by a player in an unsuccessful attempt to obtain possession.
A fumble may be advanced by any player on either team regardless of whether recovered before or after ball hits the ground.
A fumble that goes forward and out of bounds will return to the fumbling team at the spot of the fumble unless the ball goes out of bounds in the opponent’s end zone. In this case, it is a touchback.
On a play from scrimmage, if an offensive player fumbles anywhere on the field during fourth down, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If any player fumbles after the two-minute warning in a half, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If recovered by any other offensive player, the ball is dead at the spot of the fumble unless it is recovered behind the spot of the fumble. In that case, the ball is dead at the spot of recovery. Any defensive player may recover and/or advance any fumble at any time.
A muffed hand-to-hand snap from center is treated as a fumble.
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Fumble
The distinction between a fumble and a muff should be kept in mind in considering rules about fumbles. A fumble is the loss of player possession of the ball. A muff is the touching of a loose ball by a player in an unsuccessful attempt to obtain possession.
A fumble may be advanced by any player on either team regardless of whether recovered before or after ball hits the ground.
A fumble that goes forward and out of bounds will return to the fumbling team at the spot of the fumble unless the ball goes out of bounds in the opponent’s end zone. In this case, it is a touchback.
On a play from scrimmage, if an offensive player fumbles anywhere on the field during fourth down, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If any player fumbles after the two-minute warning in a half, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If recovered by any other offensive player, the ball is dead at the spot of the fumble unless it is recovered behind the spot of the fumble. In that case, the ball is dead at the spot of recovery. Any defensive player may recover and/or advance any fumble at any time.
A muffed hand-to-hand snap from center is treated as a fumble.
Pittsburgh backers got screwed, you can't advance a latteral? That is the most obsurd thing I've ever heard, like others have said that's like saying you can't advance a fumble....the only thing you can't advance is an onside kick recovery
haha actually u CAN advance an onside kick recovery.. its the same thing as a kick return, there have been a few onside kicks returned for td's
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Quote Originally Posted by slimjim511:
You should be able to find them at NFL.com
Pittsburgh backers got screwed, you can't advance a latteral? That is the most obsurd thing I've ever heard, like others have said that's like saying you can't advance a fumble....the only thing you can't advance is an onside kick recovery
haha actually u CAN advance an onside kick recovery.. its the same thing as a kick return, there have been a few onside kicks returned for td's
what is ppl not getting??? the first lateral was ilegal... LT released the ball at the 25 (while running which is why you think is backwards) and the other guy catched it at the 26... its a forward pass... the other lateral wal legal but it doesnt exist because the first one was ilegal... thats why its not even a recoverd fumble for pittsburg...
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what is ppl not getting??? the first lateral was ilegal... LT released the ball at the 25 (while running which is why you think is backwards) and the other guy catched it at the 26... its a forward pass... the other lateral wal legal but it doesnt exist because the first one was ilegal... thats why its not even a recoverd fumble for pittsburg...
2 - Tomlinson completes an illegal fwd pass to Chambers.
3 - Chambers essentially fumbles the ball backwards.
4 - Palomalu recovers the fumble and scores a TD.
5 - The refs rule TD.
6 - The booth reviews the play, and the ref subsequently says: "Illegal foward pass. It kills the play. There is zero time on the clock. The game is over."
There are a number of things that need to be addressed here.
1 - I believe the Tomlinson illegal fwd pass was in fact illegal.
2 - The NFL rulebook states that an illegal fwd pass is a penalty, not a dead ball situation.
3 - The NFL rulebook states that a defensive player can, yes, *can* advance a fumble, even inside 2 minutes.
4 - This is the most important one: The last play of the game is nullified (killed) on an offensive penalty, except in certain situations such as change of possession.
Number 4 is very important because I think this is where the mistake occurred. I think the booth/ref are saying that the penalty created by the Tomlinson illegal fwd pass nullified the play. That is the incorrect call because change of possession overrulles the play nullification.
This is the nature of the bad call and why it should have been a TD. The big question is, did the ref remember that a change of possession on the last play of a game in which a penalty occurs, does *not* nullify the play? Who knows?
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Sequence of events and opinion:
1 - Rivers completes a forward pass to Tomlinson.
2 - Tomlinson completes an illegal fwd pass to Chambers.
3 - Chambers essentially fumbles the ball backwards.
4 - Palomalu recovers the fumble and scores a TD.
5 - The refs rule TD.
6 - The booth reviews the play, and the ref subsequently says: "Illegal foward pass. It kills the play. There is zero time on the clock. The game is over."
There are a number of things that need to be addressed here.
1 - I believe the Tomlinson illegal fwd pass was in fact illegal.
2 - The NFL rulebook states that an illegal fwd pass is a penalty, not a dead ball situation.
3 - The NFL rulebook states that a defensive player can, yes, *can* advance a fumble, even inside 2 minutes.
4 - This is the most important one: The last play of the game is nullified (killed) on an offensive penalty, except in certain situations such as change of possession.
Number 4 is very important because I think this is where the mistake occurred. I think the booth/ref are saying that the penalty created by the Tomlinson illegal fwd pass nullified the play. That is the incorrect call because change of possession overrulles the play nullification.
This is the nature of the bad call and why it should have been a TD. The big question is, did the ref remember that a change of possession on the last play of a game in which a penalty occurs, does *not* nullify the play? Who knows?
here is one problem i have with this discussion...
there are people who feel like they got screwed over because Pitt didn't cover the spread on that play...
ummm... did you happen to notice that Pitt was not covering for even 1 second of this game? you made a bad bet... period... get over it... you never deserved to win that game, regardless of the rule...
i guess u diddnt watch the game they dominated every phase of the game except for punting. the one drive we were drivin down the field and they tried to stall it with sum bullshit illegal formation penalty that the announcers said hasnt been calld in 50 years they usually juss tell the tackle to move up a couple inches next time. that made it 2nd and 20 thats a drive killer.
everytime we would drive we would get a holding call which could be calld on every play right. my point is it wasnt juss that kickoff, it was the hwole game. 2 plays b4 that willie ran it in but got calld back for a hold.
SD got dominated and it woulda never came down to that kickoff if it wasnt for all the drive killing penalties the steelers got.
sd had one pen for 5 yards ... haha thats crazy
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Quote Originally Posted by lobosrule:
here is one problem i have with this discussion...
there are people who feel like they got screwed over because Pitt didn't cover the spread on that play...
ummm... did you happen to notice that Pitt was not covering for even 1 second of this game? you made a bad bet... period... get over it... you never deserved to win that game, regardless of the rule...
i guess u diddnt watch the game they dominated every phase of the game except for punting. the one drive we were drivin down the field and they tried to stall it with sum bullshit illegal formation penalty that the announcers said hasnt been calld in 50 years they usually juss tell the tackle to move up a couple inches next time. that made it 2nd and 20 thats a drive killer.
everytime we would drive we would get a holding call which could be calld on every play right. my point is it wasnt juss that kickoff, it was the hwole game. 2 plays b4 that willie ran it in but got calld back for a hold.
SD got dominated and it woulda never came down to that kickoff if it wasnt for all the drive killing penalties the steelers got.
you can bet everything you own, if the spread wasnt a factor in that play, the play would have never been reviewed.
You could see what the refs were doing the whole 4th quarter. Every time pitt made some type of good play, the flags came out{which you can throw on every single play if they want to}
[/Quote]
Your tellin me, the Steelers had a total of 15 penalties for over a hundred yards and SD had ONE penalty for a grand total of 5 yards! This was the most obvious fixed game i think i've ever watched. The refs def had action on SD and its bullshit that the league hasn't made any statements today about that game b/c those points not only affect gamblers but also in case their is a tie heading into the playoffs, and all of the fantasy football leagues across the world. If it wasn't for betting and fantasy football the NFL wouldn't be half as popular as it is today so i think we deserve the respect of having the commish tell us what happened and why cus the refs didn't have a clue!!
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you can bet everything you own, if the spread wasnt a factor in that play, the play would have never been reviewed.
You could see what the refs were doing the whole 4th quarter. Every time pitt made some type of good play, the flags came out{which you can throw on every single play if they want to}
[/Quote]
Your tellin me, the Steelers had a total of 15 penalties for over a hundred yards and SD had ONE penalty for a grand total of 5 yards! This was the most obvious fixed game i think i've ever watched. The refs def had action on SD and its bullshit that the league hasn't made any statements today about that game b/c those points not only affect gamblers but also in case their is a tie heading into the playoffs, and all of the fantasy football leagues across the world. If it wasn't for betting and fantasy football the NFL wouldn't be half as popular as it is today so i think we deserve the respect of having the commish tell us what happened and why cus the refs didn't have a clue!!
F the NFL, if i bet on any NFL game ever again it will be decided by a coin flip. NFL has always been suspect, but this has convinced me....unreal
college sports for me from here on out, it's sad really.
Believe man i think its bullshit and lost money on this game but just cuz you only play CFB doesn't mean that those games aren't fixed either.. Its all about the refs. If a ref really wants a team to win or just cover there are too many ways that they can make it happen and no gaurantee that any sport wont have some fixed games throughout a season. It really blows just hope ur on the right side of the fix for that game.
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Quote Originally Posted by cmo1037:
F the NFL, if i bet on any NFL game ever again it will be decided by a coin flip. NFL has always been suspect, but this has convinced me....unreal
college sports for me from here on out, it's sad really.
Believe man i think its bullshit and lost money on this game but just cuz you only play CFB doesn't mean that those games aren't fixed either.. Its all about the refs. If a ref really wants a team to win or just cover there are too many ways that they can make it happen and no gaurantee that any sport wont have some fixed games throughout a season. It really blows just hope ur on the right side of the fix for that game.
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