I don't agree that McDaniels sucked in Denver...it takes time to turn a franchise around. His first year 8-8 they were in the playoff hunt until the last game of the year.
His second year he was 3-9 and though he refused to look at the tape of recorded practice of another team, Denver fired him for not reporting on the guy who taped it...this game was not taped at the direction of McDaniels.
He might be one of the better offensive minds in football...IMO.
@StumpTownStu
I don't agree that McDaniels sucked in Denver...it takes time to turn a franchise around. His first year 8-8 they were in the playoff hunt until the last game of the year.
His second year he was 3-9 and though he refused to look at the tape of recorded practice of another team, Denver fired him for not reporting on the guy who taped it...this game was not taped at the direction of McDaniels.
He might be one of the better offensive minds in football...IMO.
@tjohnsont35 Yea sure hire a candidate because of sex and race, imagine uproar if someone said only a male and a white male at that.
You mean like the past 300 years? Let me say this again, the Rooney Rule doesn't dictate who a team hires. If they hired Leftwich, it's because it's who they wanted. He's a successful OC. Where do you guys think HC candidates come from? I challenged you guys to name a better available candidate and nobody said a word.
R.I.P. #94 MARSHAWN KNEELAND - DC4L
Quote Originally Posted by Dickey227:
@tjohnsont35 Yea sure hire a candidate because of sex and race, imagine uproar if someone said only a male and a white male at that.
You mean like the past 300 years? Let me say this again, the Rooney Rule doesn't dictate who a team hires. If they hired Leftwich, it's because it's who they wanted. He's a successful OC. Where do you guys think HC candidates come from? I challenged you guys to name a better available candidate and nobody said a word.
Yes it absolutely matters that you’re forcing teams to interview certain people based off their race. You know you can only interview some many people in a day/week right? Have you ever conducted an interview? I have conducted hundreds if not thousands. Now a candidate walks into their interview and blows me away and I want to hire them but alas I cannot do that instantly I still have to interview my quota of qualified candidates before I can hire this person that just killed the interview. While I’m meeting my quota lo and behold the guy I wanted was scooped up by a competitor because I had to make sure I wasn’t being racist by liking a white man for the job I needed to fill. I have NO problem with Leftwich being hired because that’s who the jags wanted, however let’s say there was a reverse rule that said I had to interview more white candidates for the job first and while I was doing that poof someone else snagged the guy I wanted away from me. Seems to me the ONLY logical solution to this is to have a set schedule of interviews and that NO ONE can hire a coach until everyone had concluded their interviews, I honestly don’t follow the “coaching carousel” and the time frame but how impossible would it be to say make a decision on whether or not you’re firing your coach by such and such a date and then that’s it, if you fired your coach or they retired then begin the interview process, no team that fired/lost a coach can make a hire until a certain date given adequate time for all teams with vacancies to be able to explore all options, we do it with free agency do we not? Is there not a certain time before free agents can be sought after? Sht is there not a certain time frame that college kids have to make a life altering decision on whether or not they can enter the draft? Why not ask the same of the Owners/GM’s and Head Coaches of these 32 teams?
also Stephen A needs to shut his trap, you think maybe the Broncos hired the Packers guy over The chiefs had something to do with the Chiefs OC still coaching you know two more games to win the damn super bowl, and the Packers guys season was over?
Freedom road was a one-way street
@StumpTownStu
Yes it absolutely matters that you’re forcing teams to interview certain people based off their race. You know you can only interview some many people in a day/week right? Have you ever conducted an interview? I have conducted hundreds if not thousands. Now a candidate walks into their interview and blows me away and I want to hire them but alas I cannot do that instantly I still have to interview my quota of qualified candidates before I can hire this person that just killed the interview. While I’m meeting my quota lo and behold the guy I wanted was scooped up by a competitor because I had to make sure I wasn’t being racist by liking a white man for the job I needed to fill. I have NO problem with Leftwich being hired because that’s who the jags wanted, however let’s say there was a reverse rule that said I had to interview more white candidates for the job first and while I was doing that poof someone else snagged the guy I wanted away from me. Seems to me the ONLY logical solution to this is to have a set schedule of interviews and that NO ONE can hire a coach until everyone had concluded their interviews, I honestly don’t follow the “coaching carousel” and the time frame but how impossible would it be to say make a decision on whether or not you’re firing your coach by such and such a date and then that’s it, if you fired your coach or they retired then begin the interview process, no team that fired/lost a coach can make a hire until a certain date given adequate time for all teams with vacancies to be able to explore all options, we do it with free agency do we not? Is there not a certain time before free agents can be sought after? Sht is there not a certain time frame that college kids have to make a life altering decision on whether or not they can enter the draft? Why not ask the same of the Owners/GM’s and Head Coaches of these 32 teams?
also Stephen A needs to shut his trap, you think maybe the Broncos hired the Packers guy over The chiefs had something to do with the Chiefs OC still coaching you know two more games to win the damn super bowl, and the Packers guys season was over?
Brandon Staley was an DC for one season. He helmed a defense that he didn't even build from the ground up. A defense featuring at least two future HOFers, one of which is a multiple defensive player of the year winner. He gets a HC job. Nobody complains.
A guy like Matt Rhule has two good seasons at Temple, a team that he did build. Gets the Baylor job. Has a horrible year, .500 year, and one good year where he went 11-1 only to lose the Big 12 Championship and his bowl game. Left with a record 1 game under .500. Gets the Carolina job. Nobody complains.
And can somebody, anybody, explain to me how Joe Judge deserved a HC coach job but Leftwich doesn't. I dare anybody to make a case for this but nobody complained when it happened. Not until we all saw how bad he was.
You guys talk all this Rooney Rule stuff but it's all empty. You guys don't even understand the Rule. Leftwich was giving consideration because he's one of the best available candidates. Not because of the Rooney Rule. Not because he is black. The Rooney Rule doesn't dictate hires.
R.I.P. #94 MARSHAWN KNEELAND - DC4L
Brandon Staley was an DC for one season. He helmed a defense that he didn't even build from the ground up. A defense featuring at least two future HOFers, one of which is a multiple defensive player of the year winner. He gets a HC job. Nobody complains.
A guy like Matt Rhule has two good seasons at Temple, a team that he did build. Gets the Baylor job. Has a horrible year, .500 year, and one good year where he went 11-1 only to lose the Big 12 Championship and his bowl game. Left with a record 1 game under .500. Gets the Carolina job. Nobody complains.
And can somebody, anybody, explain to me how Joe Judge deserved a HC coach job but Leftwich doesn't. I dare anybody to make a case for this but nobody complained when it happened. Not until we all saw how bad he was.
You guys talk all this Rooney Rule stuff but it's all empty. You guys don't even understand the Rule. Leftwich was giving consideration because he's one of the best available candidates. Not because of the Rooney Rule. Not because he is black. The Rooney Rule doesn't dictate hires.
You're making up hypothetical, fantasy stories that have nothing to do with the NFL coach hiring process. Your what ifs have never happened, and will never happen, in the NFL.
And besides, it's a moot point. Leftwich wasn't interviewed because he's black. He was interviewed because he's one of the best available candidates. I dared you guys to name some better available candidates and nobody did. My bro lancer threw you guys a bone and said McDaniel which 1) We don't even know is available, and 2) Was given a HC job, which didn't end well, including getting caught cheating. Then when offered another job, pulled out last minute. Totally messed the Colts over.
And if ignore Stephen A. Smith. That's a start. It's his job to stir shit. It's why he's paid so well. It's because he is polarizing. I haven't watched ESPN in like 3 or 4 years, except games.
R.I.P. #94 MARSHAWN KNEELAND - DC4L
@philschnaars
You're making up hypothetical, fantasy stories that have nothing to do with the NFL coach hiring process. Your what ifs have never happened, and will never happen, in the NFL.
And besides, it's a moot point. Leftwich wasn't interviewed because he's black. He was interviewed because he's one of the best available candidates. I dared you guys to name some better available candidates and nobody did. My bro lancer threw you guys a bone and said McDaniel which 1) We don't even know is available, and 2) Was given a HC job, which didn't end well, including getting caught cheating. Then when offered another job, pulled out last minute. Totally messed the Colts over.
And if ignore Stephen A. Smith. That's a start. It's his job to stir shit. It's why he's paid so well. It's because he is polarizing. I haven't watched ESPN in like 3 or 4 years, except games.
Whoa I believe I’m 100% right chump. And I SAID I love Leftwich and think he will do fine, and this whole thread started before he was hired so WTF does Leftwich have to do with the fact that the RACIST process that’s known as the Rooney Rule is whack and not helping anyone and only hurting anything, I DARE YOU to tell me a better way to make sure that there’s more equality in the HC ranks than what I said that was obviously too hard for you to understand. Do YOU in all your hypotheticals honestly believe people with multi million dollar a year jobs on the line are deciding who they want running their team based off their SKIN COLOR? Are you that thick? What’s the Rooney rule doing that’s helping if you are so quick to say it’s not hurting?
Freedom road was a one-way street
@StumpTownStu
Whoa I believe I’m 100% right chump. And I SAID I love Leftwich and think he will do fine, and this whole thread started before he was hired so WTF does Leftwich have to do with the fact that the RACIST process that’s known as the Rooney Rule is whack and not helping anyone and only hurting anything, I DARE YOU to tell me a better way to make sure that there’s more equality in the HC ranks than what I said that was obviously too hard for you to understand. Do YOU in all your hypotheticals honestly believe people with multi million dollar a year jobs on the line are deciding who they want running their team based off their SKIN COLOR? Are you that thick? What’s the Rooney rule doing that’s helping if you are so quick to say it’s not hurting?
@Dickey227 Don’t be outraged. Movies like Eternals where the white guy gets the Asian girl will keep you guys relevant. Everything is gonna be ok bro.
White dudes like Asian chicks like Black dudes like White Chicks but who's picking up the slack with the Inuit chicks? What, you guys don't dig whale blubber stew.
R.I.P. #94 MARSHAWN KNEELAND - DC4L
Quote Originally Posted by tjohnsont35:
@Dickey227 Don’t be outraged. Movies like Eternals where the white guy gets the Asian girl will keep you guys relevant. Everything is gonna be ok bro.
White dudes like Asian chicks like Black dudes like White Chicks but who's picking up the slack with the Inuit chicks? What, you guys don't dig whale blubber stew.
Brandon Staley was an DC for one season. He helmed a defense that he didn't even build from the ground up. A defense featuring at least two future HOFers, one of which is a multiple defensive player of the year winner. He gets a HC job. Nobody complains. A guy like Matt Rhule has two good seasons at Temple, a team that he did build. Gets the Baylor job. Has a horrible year, .500 year, and one good year where he went 11-1 only to lose the Big 12 Championship and his bowl game. Left with a record 1 game under .500. Gets the Carolina job. Nobody complains. And can somebody, anybody, explain to me how Joe Judge deserved a HC coach job but Leftwich doesn't. I dare anybody to make a case for this but nobody complained when it happened. Not until we all saw how bad he was. You guys talk all this Rooney Rule stuff but it's all empty. You guys don't even understand the Rule. Leftwich was giving consideration because he's one of the best available candidates. Not because of the Rooney Rule. Not because he is black. The Rooney Rule doesn't dictate hires.
so Um WTF does this “rule” even exist, black guy gets hired means he was right man for the job, white guy gets hired means it’s all one big cult to keep the blacks down
Freedom road was a one-way street
@StumpTownStu
Quote Originally Posted by StumpTownStu:
Brandon Staley was an DC for one season. He helmed a defense that he didn't even build from the ground up. A defense featuring at least two future HOFers, one of which is a multiple defensive player of the year winner. He gets a HC job. Nobody complains. A guy like Matt Rhule has two good seasons at Temple, a team that he did build. Gets the Baylor job. Has a horrible year, .500 year, and one good year where he went 11-1 only to lose the Big 12 Championship and his bowl game. Left with a record 1 game under .500. Gets the Carolina job. Nobody complains. And can somebody, anybody, explain to me how Joe Judge deserved a HC coach job but Leftwich doesn't. I dare anybody to make a case for this but nobody complained when it happened. Not until we all saw how bad he was. You guys talk all this Rooney Rule stuff but it's all empty. You guys don't even understand the Rule. Leftwich was giving consideration because he's one of the best available candidates. Not because of the Rooney Rule. Not because he is black. The Rooney Rule doesn't dictate hires.
so Um WTF does this “rule” even exist, black guy gets hired means he was right man for the job, white guy gets hired means it’s all one big cult to keep the blacks down
@StumpTownStu Quote Originally Posted by StumpTownStu: Brandon Staley was an DC for one season. He helmed a defense that he didn't even build from the ground up. A defense featuring at least two future HOFers, one of which is a multiple defensive player of the year winner. He gets a HC job. Nobody complains. A guy like Matt Rhule has two good seasons at Temple, a team that he did build. Gets the Baylor job. Has a horrible year, .500 year, and one good year where he went 11-1 only to lose the Big 12 Championship and his bowl game. Left with a record 1 game under .500. Gets the Carolina job. Nobody complains. And can somebody, anybody, explain to me how Joe Judge deserved a HC coach job but Leftwich doesn't. I dare anybody to make a case for this but nobody complained when it happened. Not until we all saw how bad he was. You guys talk all this Rooney Rule stuff but it's all empty. You guys don't even understand the Rule. Leftwich was giving consideration because he's one of the best available candidates. Not because of the Rooney Rule. Not because he is black. The Rooney Rule doesn't dictate hires. so Um WTF does this “rule” even exist, black guy gets hired means he was right man for the job, white guy gets hired means it’s all one big cult to keep the blacks down
It exists as window dressing. It has no bearing on hiring. It has no bearing on anything. It's just virtue signaling. If a white guy gets hired, it's because he's who the team liked. If a black guy gets hired, it's because it's who the team liked. Period.
R.I.P. #94 MARSHAWN KNEELAND - DC4L
Quote Originally Posted by philschnaars:
@StumpTownStu Quote Originally Posted by StumpTownStu: Brandon Staley was an DC for one season. He helmed a defense that he didn't even build from the ground up. A defense featuring at least two future HOFers, one of which is a multiple defensive player of the year winner. He gets a HC job. Nobody complains. A guy like Matt Rhule has two good seasons at Temple, a team that he did build. Gets the Baylor job. Has a horrible year, .500 year, and one good year where he went 11-1 only to lose the Big 12 Championship and his bowl game. Left with a record 1 game under .500. Gets the Carolina job. Nobody complains. And can somebody, anybody, explain to me how Joe Judge deserved a HC coach job but Leftwich doesn't. I dare anybody to make a case for this but nobody complained when it happened. Not until we all saw how bad he was. You guys talk all this Rooney Rule stuff but it's all empty. You guys don't even understand the Rule. Leftwich was giving consideration because he's one of the best available candidates. Not because of the Rooney Rule. Not because he is black. The Rooney Rule doesn't dictate hires. so Um WTF does this “rule” even exist, black guy gets hired means he was right man for the job, white guy gets hired means it’s all one big cult to keep the blacks down
It exists as window dressing. It has no bearing on hiring. It has no bearing on anything. It's just virtue signaling. If a white guy gets hired, it's because he's who the team liked. If a black guy gets hired, it's because it's who the team liked. Period.
I have to agree with phil here. I don't think the rule has any real benefit except to just appease the "minority" population. In which case, if you are doing something to make a certain race or gender "feel" more accepted, isn't that kind of racist? Isn't that basically saying we don't thing you're good enough to do it on your own so we are going to make a special rule to help you along? It's like telling girls that they get to do pushups on their knees. Isn't that the same as saying we don't think you're strong enough? To agree with StumpTownStu you are probably right that it will have little to no affect on that actual hiring process. It's not the outcome that some of us are against, it's the principle. Everyone has a fair chance if you are good at you're job you will have success and people will notice you. Like Byron Leftwich.
@philschnaars
I have to agree with phil here. I don't think the rule has any real benefit except to just appease the "minority" population. In which case, if you are doing something to make a certain race or gender "feel" more accepted, isn't that kind of racist? Isn't that basically saying we don't thing you're good enough to do it on your own so we are going to make a special rule to help you along? It's like telling girls that they get to do pushups on their knees. Isn't that the same as saying we don't think you're strong enough? To agree with StumpTownStu you are probably right that it will have little to no affect on that actual hiring process. It's not the outcome that some of us are against, it's the principle. Everyone has a fair chance if you are good at you're job you will have success and people will notice you. Like Byron Leftwich.
I do see it! Just like the whole point of this thread was that the rule DOESNT DO ANYTHING for which it was intended. You want more equality in the diversity of the coaching ranks in the NFL? See above where I outline how that would happen, there’s already way more minorities on coaching staffs than there was that happened naturally over time, in time so will there be more minorities in HC spots but it’s not something that will just change cause some moron decided everyone has to interview one for a job before they can hire someone
Freedom road was a one-way street
@tjohnsont35
I do see it! Just like the whole point of this thread was that the rule DOESNT DO ANYTHING for which it was intended. You want more equality in the diversity of the coaching ranks in the NFL? See above where I outline how that would happen, there’s already way more minorities on coaching staffs than there was that happened naturally over time, in time so will there be more minorities in HC spots but it’s not something that will just change cause some moron decided everyone has to interview one for a job before they can hire someone
Just to clarify- If it were up to me, race would never be involved in any aspect of your job/business. That is what real equality is. It's believing that race doesn't need to even be mentioned, because we don't acknowledge that it matters anyways. The more this country talks about race, the more we will be divided by it. I know that in the last 5 years I have felt more racial tension between fellow Americans than I have felt in the last 20 years prior. That's because we just never stop talking about it. This rule doesn't help, it just makes minorities feel like we owe them something for things that have happened in the past. It's more for the fans than it is the organizations. It's just trying to make the average minority feel like the NFL cares about them. Which is ridiculous because well, have you seen how many "minority" players have been made millionaires by this sport?
Just to clarify- If it were up to me, race would never be involved in any aspect of your job/business. That is what real equality is. It's believing that race doesn't need to even be mentioned, because we don't acknowledge that it matters anyways. The more this country talks about race, the more we will be divided by it. I know that in the last 5 years I have felt more racial tension between fellow Americans than I have felt in the last 20 years prior. That's because we just never stop talking about it. This rule doesn't help, it just makes minorities feel like we owe them something for things that have happened in the past. It's more for the fans than it is the organizations. It's just trying to make the average minority feel like the NFL cares about them. Which is ridiculous because well, have you seen how many "minority" players have been made millionaires by this sport?
Look, I never said the Rooney Rule was a good thing, nor that it should exist. I just said it's window dressing. Virtue signaling. The point is you guys are triggered as f*ck by something that while admittedly stupid, is not affecting anything. Are there a million black dudes getting head coaching jobs? Those who do deserve it. Now I've asked multiple times for you guys to name some better available candidates. Nothing. I also named candidates that were less experienced and/or deserving of HC jobs, yet we're still given jobs without complaint on this forum. Nothing. You do realize there were like 8 vacancies? Did you realize this? Do you even follow football? Start dropping some names. And while you're at it, explain to me how Joe Johnson deserved a job but Leftwich doesn't. How did Joe Johnson work out.
Meanwhile we have a guy who's been learning under on of the best offensive minds in football in the last few years, and a freakin' demigod for the last two. Has had full play calling responsibilities, which OC's under offensive HCs don't always have... "Nope! That guy doesn't deserve a job. Let's give Matt Rhule another shot." GTFO. Everything you guys are saying is empty.
R.I.P. #94 MARSHAWN KNEELAND - DC4L
@philschnaars
Look, I never said the Rooney Rule was a good thing, nor that it should exist. I just said it's window dressing. Virtue signaling. The point is you guys are triggered as f*ck by something that while admittedly stupid, is not affecting anything. Are there a million black dudes getting head coaching jobs? Those who do deserve it. Now I've asked multiple times for you guys to name some better available candidates. Nothing. I also named candidates that were less experienced and/or deserving of HC jobs, yet we're still given jobs without complaint on this forum. Nothing. You do realize there were like 8 vacancies? Did you realize this? Do you even follow football? Start dropping some names. And while you're at it, explain to me how Joe Johnson deserved a job but Leftwich doesn't. How did Joe Johnson work out.
Meanwhile we have a guy who's been learning under on of the best offensive minds in football in the last few years, and a freakin' demigod for the last two. Has had full play calling responsibilities, which OC's under offensive HCs don't always have... "Nope! That guy doesn't deserve a job. Let's give Matt Rhule another shot." GTFO. Everything you guys are saying is empty.
Exactly and now back to the OP’s point of the whole thread, why is this a rule? It doesn’t HELP ANYTHING, alas it’s been pointed out how if anything it’s hurting, you dont think my hypothetical has ever occurred or could, that’s fine, you don’t think it’s making anyone feel less deserving that dumb people will say “well they only interviewed him/hired him cause of the Rooney rule” is a BAD THING. People say we need to LISTEN, and to TALK, and to come up with CRITICAL THINKING, to help the world see racism and it’s like and to overcome it or at the least minimize it as best we can, then when the OP starts a conversation on the topic his whole message is frowned upon, I throw a thought out reasonable “Free-Agency-Like” idea to make sure ALL teams have ample time to interview ALL qualified candidates for the job and you don’t even mention that part of my posts. Great talk, I’ll make sure to LISTEN MORE about how many problems there are in tge world and how racist it is
Freedom road was a one-way street
@StumpTownStu
Exactly and now back to the OP’s point of the whole thread, why is this a rule? It doesn’t HELP ANYTHING, alas it’s been pointed out how if anything it’s hurting, you dont think my hypothetical has ever occurred or could, that’s fine, you don’t think it’s making anyone feel less deserving that dumb people will say “well they only interviewed him/hired him cause of the Rooney rule” is a BAD THING. People say we need to LISTEN, and to TALK, and to come up with CRITICAL THINKING, to help the world see racism and it’s like and to overcome it or at the least minimize it as best we can, then when the OP starts a conversation on the topic his whole message is frowned upon, I throw a thought out reasonable “Free-Agency-Like” idea to make sure ALL teams have ample time to interview ALL qualified candidates for the job and you don’t even mention that part of my posts. Great talk, I’ll make sure to LISTEN MORE about how many problems there are in tge world and how racist it is
@StumpTownStu “Leftwich was giving consideration because he's one of the best available candidates. Not because of the Rooney Rule.” sounds like the rule is pointless then doesn’t it?
It is pointless. It's the dumbest shit ever. I never made a point for the Rooney Rule. I'm simply saying a guy like Leftwich is getting interviews because he's one of the best candidates out there. You guys are proving my point by the fact that I have asked for better candidates, maybe five times now, and have yet to see one name.
R.I.P. #94 MARSHAWN KNEELAND - DC4L
Quote Originally Posted by puds:
@StumpTownStu “Leftwich was giving consideration because he's one of the best available candidates. Not because of the Rooney Rule.” sounds like the rule is pointless then doesn’t it?
It is pointless. It's the dumbest shit ever. I never made a point for the Rooney Rule. I'm simply saying a guy like Leftwich is getting interviews because he's one of the best candidates out there. You guys are proving my point by the fact that I have asked for better candidates, maybe five times now, and have yet to see one name.
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