Its really simple.
Space, time and matter BEGAN to exist. Prior to this point, Space, time and matter did not exist.
Something cannot come from nothing under naturalism.
Logically, space, time and matter was created from something that was spaceless, timeless and immaterial.
This is a religiously neutral statement. It is the arguments deducted LOGICALLY from this fact is what causes major problems for Atheists..
So much so, you have atheists like Stephen Hawking, Lawrence Krauss and co "labelling" the quantum vacuum as nothing, simply to avoid the problems the argument presents. The quantum vacuum is not nothing, it is a sea of fluctuating energy. Its like me calling my vacuum cleaner, nothing. It is intellectually dishonest.
Furthermore, Atheists posit multi verses, simply to try and explain away the problem of a beginning for them. The reality is, there is NO EVIDENCE for a multi verse....That is not science, that is a collection of nice ideas.
The reality is, I have stated scientific facts regarding the latest Cosmological findings and facts, and I have also deducted logically from these evidences, that is, space, time and matter cannot create itself out of nothing. The cause must be outside of space, time and energy.
I haven't seen anyone debunk this argument, the only thing I have seen thrown around here is insults hurdled at Christians as per title...
Why doesn't Club start a thread about Muslims? person?
You know what, let me just follow Clubdirts and co line of thinking....
Blaming the doctrine of Christianity for the immoral acts of Christians is as logical as someone blaming their drug and alcohol problem on the AA programme.
Seriously, the logic on this forum is so horrible at times that I have more reasonable discussions with my 10 year old nephew and 12 year old niece...
Seriously, blaming the immoral actions of Christians on the doctrine of Christianity. 
The Theory is that the spaghetti monster created the universe, after he drank alcohol.
Firstly, when the universe began to exist, space, time and matter began to exist. The spaghetti monster is created out of spaghetti, which is matter, but matter began to exist at the big bang. How can the matter of spaghetti exist in a time before matter began to exist?
Seriously, I am stooping to these low levels, is this what Atheism is?
You know what, let me just follow Clubdirts and co line of thinking....
Blaming the doctrine of Christianity for the immoral acts of Christians is as logical as someone blaming their drug and alcohol problem on the AA programme.
Seriously, the logic on this forum is so horrible at times that I have more reasonable discussions with my 10 year old nephew and 12 year old niece...
Seriously, blaming the immoral actions of Christians on the doctrine of Christianity.
The flying spaghetti monster is testable, God isn't...
That is one of the worst atheistic arguments I have ever seen tbh.
How can you find a link between Christs teachings and committing an atrocity?
LOL, how can the flying spaghetti monster create the universe where at the bug bang all space, time and matter began to exist?
The flying spaghetti monster is made out of spaghetti, that is matter.
The flying spaghetti monster is a self defeating argument when you consider the latest scientific evidence.
SJD, he is following a trend of Atheists that do this when they get cornered. System was found out when he pretty much called himself an Atheist that doesn't know, ie, married bachelor.
They are quick to scream and shout that God is not the cause of the universe, then when presented with 2 choices, natural or supernatural, because they are the only 2 choices available, they say they don't know.
Its like there are 2 horses in a race, horse A and horse B. I ask, you is going to win, they say, well its not Horse A, so I say, then Horse B? To which they reply , I don't know......
That's another reason why I could never be an atheist, simply because it leads to intellectual dishonesty.
How can you find a link between Christs teachings and committing an atrocity?
At the big bang, ALL space, time and matter BEGAN to exist. The flying spaghetti monster while it might be invinsible is still made out of matter. How can it create the universe?
Its a self defeating argument......
LOL, how can the flying spaghetti monster create the universe where at the bug bang all space, time and matter began to exist?
The flying spaghetti monster is made out of spaghetti, that is matter.
The flying spaghetti monster is a self defeating argument when you consider the latest scientific evidence.
The Theory is that the spaghetti monster created the universe, after he drank alcohol.
Firstly, when the universe began to exist, space, time and matter began to exist. The spaghetti monster is created out of spaghetti, which is matter, but matter began to exist at the big bang. How can the matter of spaghetti exist in a time before matter began to exist?
Seriously, I am stooping to these low levels, is this what Atheism is?
SJD, he is following a trend of Atheists that do this when they get cornered. System was found out when he pretty much called himself an Atheist that doesn't know, ie, married bachelor.
You can keep on saying your little married bachelor joke, but it doesn't change the definition. It just makes you look like a dumb a s s...
a·the·ist
They are quick to scream and shout that God is not the cause of the universe, then when presented with 2 choices, natural or supernatural, because they are the only 2 choices available, they say they don't know.
Its like there are 2 horses in a race, horse A and horse B. I ask, you is going to win, they say, well its not Horse A, so I say, then Horse B? To which they reply , I don't know......
That's another reason why I could never be an atheist, simply because it leads to intellectual dishonesty.
Jesus' central teaching is to love each other, forgive each other, turn the other cheek etc etc.
To then commit atrocities in the name of Jesus is non sequiter.
Its almost like me going out and murdering someone then saying, the Indiana Pacers caused me to do it....
The sad thing in all this, it seems to me that Atheists are buying into these arguments from people who commit these atrocities then saying Christianity caused me to do it.
Committing atrocities in the name of Jesus has as much connection as Atheism has on committing atrocities.
I would like to think people can see this.
Let me use an example to show how confused you are, that shows once trapped, you have no where to hide.
By your logic, I ask someone, their is a 2 horse race, Horse A and Horse B. Who is going to win.
The person responds, it is not Horse A.
I then say, so its Horse B?
He then responds, "I don't know".
The cause of the universe is either natural or supernatural, they are the only 2 options.
You say it is not supernatural, I then ask for argument why its natural to which you say you don't know.
Your reasoning would get a big F if answered in a philosophy exam.
Let me use an example to show how confused you are, that shows once trapped, you have no where to hide.
By your logic, I ask someone, their is a 2 horse race, Horse A and Horse B. Who is going to win.
The person responds, it is not Horse A.
I then say, so its Horse B?
He then responds, "I don't know".
The cause of the universe is either natural or supernatural, they are the only 2 options.
You say it is not supernatural, I then ask for argument why its natural to which you say you don't know.
Your reasoning would get a big F if answered in a philosophy exam.
Jesus' central teaching is to love each other, forgive each other, turn the other cheek etc etc.
To then commit atrocities in the name of Jesus is non sequiter.
Its almost like me going out and murdering someone then saying, the Indiana Pacers caused me to do it....
The sad thing in all this, it seems to me that Atheists are buying into these arguments from people who commit these atrocities then saying Christianity caused me to do it.
Committing atrocities in the name of Jesus has as much connection as Atheism has on committing atrocities.
I would like to think people can see this.
Let me use an example to show how confused you are, that shows once trapped, you have no where to hide.
By your logic, I ask someone, their is a 2 horse race, Horse A and Horse B. Who is going to win.
The person responds, it is not Horse A.
I then say, so its Horse B?
He then responds, "I don't know".
The cause of the universe is either natural or supernatural, they are the only 2 options.
You say it is not supernatural, I then ask for argument why its natural to which you say you don't know.
Your reasoning would get a big F if answered in a philosophy exam.
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