I think there’s a difference between Natural & Manufactured cost hikes? Tariffs are paid by the origin and the recouped by price to the consumer….Not Natural ! Trump and his cabinet royal rump kissers will understand come November…If only ICE would come the Carolina’s. Georgia and Texas and detain undocumented immigrants that have built 80 to 85% of the homes by company’s like DB Horton Mungo & Linear…Who are huge donors to the GOP on a state & Federal lever….This would make a lot of rich southerns angry!…Not one arrest by ICE since Trumps 1st day in the Myrtle Beach…Business as usual!
0
@BigGame90
I think there’s a difference between Natural & Manufactured cost hikes? Tariffs are paid by the origin and the recouped by price to the consumer….Not Natural ! Trump and his cabinet royal rump kissers will understand come November…If only ICE would come the Carolina’s. Georgia and Texas and detain undocumented immigrants that have built 80 to 85% of the homes by company’s like DB Horton Mungo & Linear…Who are huge donors to the GOP on a state & Federal lever….This would make a lot of rich southerns angry!…Not one arrest by ICE since Trumps 1st day in the Myrtle Beach…Business as usual!
@BigGame90 I think there’s a difference between Natural & Manufactured cost hikes? Tariffs are paid by the origin and the recouped by price to the consumer….Not Natural ! Trump and his cabinet royal rump kissers will understand come November…If only ICE would come the Carolina’s. Georgia and Texas and detain undocumented immigrants that have built 80 to 85% of the homes by company’s like DB Horton Mungo & Linear…Who are huge donors to the GOP on a state & Federal lever….This would make a lot of rich southerns angry!…Not one arrest by ICE since Trumps 1st day in the Myrtle Beach…Business as usual!
The Trump method is to artificially gain public favor by reducing taxes, which helps the overwhelming majority a tiny bit, yes, but helps the wealthy much more!
He then taxes EVERYBODY (indirectly) with his tariffs, which HURTS the overwhelming majority considerably (cost/income ratio) but is a total nothing burger to the wealthy!
Somewhat akin to the Robin Hood scenario:
Dems - take from the rich >>> to give to the "poor" (ie, the overwhelming majority)
CONS - take from the poor >>> to give to the rich! YAY MAGA!
1
Quote Originally Posted by joe pockets:
@BigGame90 I think there’s a difference between Natural & Manufactured cost hikes? Tariffs are paid by the origin and the recouped by price to the consumer….Not Natural ! Trump and his cabinet royal rump kissers will understand come November…If only ICE would come the Carolina’s. Georgia and Texas and detain undocumented immigrants that have built 80 to 85% of the homes by company’s like DB Horton Mungo & Linear…Who are huge donors to the GOP on a state & Federal lever….This would make a lot of rich southerns angry!…Not one arrest by ICE since Trumps 1st day in the Myrtle Beach…Business as usual!
The Trump method is to artificially gain public favor by reducing taxes, which helps the overwhelming majority a tiny bit, yes, but helps the wealthy much more!
He then taxes EVERYBODY (indirectly) with his tariffs, which HURTS the overwhelming majority considerably (cost/income ratio) but is a total nothing burger to the wealthy!
Somewhat akin to the Robin Hood scenario:
Dems - take from the rich >>> to give to the "poor" (ie, the overwhelming majority)
CONS - take from the poor >>> to give to the rich! YAY MAGA!
Tariffs will hit you all - but it is actually mostly the stagnation and job losses it brings - that are BAD for you right now - the inflation will already surpass double digits (without even taking tariffs into account) within a month after they are forced to cut interest rates (trying to combat the stagnation) - you guys are approaching stagflation at warp speed
0
Tariffs will hit you all - but it is actually mostly the stagnation and job losses it brings - that are BAD for you right now - the inflation will already surpass double digits (without even taking tariffs into account) within a month after they are forced to cut interest rates (trying to combat the stagnation) - you guys are approaching stagflation at warp speed
You're complaint is prices are raising and it's from Trumps tariffs. Prices rose right after covid, did you have issues with inflation then? If so, what's the difference between prices rising because we printed money, or rising because of tariffs? I threw the lib jab in because inflation is a form of taxation while tariffs is a more in your face taxation. Is it true that liberals/democrats are in favor of increasing taxes? If so, why would a lib complain when tariffs go up which is basically a tax? Liberals only like when taxes raise when it's NOT Trump who raised them?
1
@wallstreetcappers
You're complaint is prices are raising and it's from Trumps tariffs. Prices rose right after covid, did you have issues with inflation then? If so, what's the difference between prices rising because we printed money, or rising because of tariffs? I threw the lib jab in because inflation is a form of taxation while tariffs is a more in your face taxation. Is it true that liberals/democrats are in favor of increasing taxes? If so, why would a lib complain when tariffs go up which is basically a tax? Liberals only like when taxes raise when it's NOT Trump who raised them?
Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers: This morning I did my once a quarter trip to Restaurant Depot which is a warehouse that small businesses use to purchase items they sell so pretty much any small to midsize QSR or full service restaurant either uses them or an outfit like Sysco but pricing at RD is less than delivery because you are not paying for delivery (from experience) I do not run a restaurant any longer but anyone who has an LLC can sign up for a membership so I will go there for a set of items I cannot find at places like Kroger or Costco or Whole Foods and buy that way knowing I will use larger quantity over a few months time. So this trip I went with the intention of buying two or three things and maybe a few others depending on price. What I found is that the items I was considering based on price were dramatically impacted quarter over quarter due to tariffs. Ive purchased items like Chilean sea bass, high end filet/ribeye steaks, belgian chocolate etc. What I noticed is that all items I thought would be higher priced WERE higher priced vs the first quarter time frame by between 20-30%. Seabass was higher by 30%, chocolate up by 25% and steaks were up 30%. I also noticed other imported fish items were up as much or more (like crab or lobster). So what this means is when restaurants have to pay higher prices they either have to pass that along to the consumer or absorb the higher costs and thus have less profits and less earnings since most small to mid businesses are owner operated. THIS is the definition of tariff inflation flow through. Profit margins in most restaurants are very small to begin with. They can't absorb the costs and stay in business long. They either raise their prices or keep the prices the same but reduce the portion sizes, which we see happening in many products where size or quantity are an issue So instead of sitting down to a meal filling a large plate soon we could be sitting down to the same menu item but it only fills a medium size plate for the same price Since the actual price wouldn't rise, the dishonest Trump regime will claim they are doing a fantastic job for American consumers with the tariffs policy
This has always been going on and has been more prevalent shortly after covid. The media just never brought it up. I wonder why? Portion sizes were going down (clever packaging) while prices were up. Do you think this has more to do with corporations trying to maximize profits or the US trying to make people less fat? Maybe both. Probably both.
0
Quote Originally Posted by Zeus4par:
Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers: This morning I did my once a quarter trip to Restaurant Depot which is a warehouse that small businesses use to purchase items they sell so pretty much any small to midsize QSR or full service restaurant either uses them or an outfit like Sysco but pricing at RD is less than delivery because you are not paying for delivery (from experience) I do not run a restaurant any longer but anyone who has an LLC can sign up for a membership so I will go there for a set of items I cannot find at places like Kroger or Costco or Whole Foods and buy that way knowing I will use larger quantity over a few months time. So this trip I went with the intention of buying two or three things and maybe a few others depending on price. What I found is that the items I was considering based on price were dramatically impacted quarter over quarter due to tariffs. Ive purchased items like Chilean sea bass, high end filet/ribeye steaks, belgian chocolate etc. What I noticed is that all items I thought would be higher priced WERE higher priced vs the first quarter time frame by between 20-30%. Seabass was higher by 30%, chocolate up by 25% and steaks were up 30%. I also noticed other imported fish items were up as much or more (like crab or lobster). So what this means is when restaurants have to pay higher prices they either have to pass that along to the consumer or absorb the higher costs and thus have less profits and less earnings since most small to mid businesses are owner operated. THIS is the definition of tariff inflation flow through. Profit margins in most restaurants are very small to begin with. They can't absorb the costs and stay in business long. They either raise their prices or keep the prices the same but reduce the portion sizes, which we see happening in many products where size or quantity are an issue So instead of sitting down to a meal filling a large plate soon we could be sitting down to the same menu item but it only fills a medium size plate for the same price Since the actual price wouldn't rise, the dishonest Trump regime will claim they are doing a fantastic job for American consumers with the tariffs policy
This has always been going on and has been more prevalent shortly after covid. The media just never brought it up. I wonder why? Portion sizes were going down (clever packaging) while prices were up. Do you think this has more to do with corporations trying to maximize profits or the US trying to make people less fat? Maybe both. Probably both.
@StumpTownStu No comment on personal information, I wont disclose anything about me personally since in the past when i did even a SLIGHT discussion of my personal life there were many who personally attacked me with that information, a few still are members today so I will not be saying anything about what I did in the past. Lets just say I know the difference between low, mid and high quality items and I know the value of paying a bit more to get a LOT more in return. I would rather skip consuming or making something of low quality than to get the ingredients to MAKE the high quality product. To answer your other question, a place like RD or Sysco will carry a very small section of high end products but the majority of the stock is mid to low quality stuff used for mass production, so for example I bought some BOUNCER flour today it is high gluten used for artisan baking and I cannot find a similar quality high gluten product anywhere else that I find performs as well so I buy a 25 lb bag of BOUNCER ever so often for home use. It is my experience that the higher end pastas or cheeses or sauces etc you will have to find an importer that carries that elite brand if you are seeking that upper end product. I buy the Callebaut chocolate line at RD because it is considered an upper tier chocolate for baking but getting it at RD is as cheap as the Nestle bag at Costco, so I will drag my butt up to RD which is a 20 min drive to get a few items that are a good price and high quality.
In my line of work, I've found that manufactures haven't been focusing on their higher end products ever since covid. So finding the high quality product takes more work to deliver. At the same time, suppliers can be down sizing, trimming the fat and they have no room or capital to stock high end materials that may take longer to sell or may never sell. The elimination process of the higher end products slowed or stopped when covid opened back up. Even since the economy has been burning hot the last handful of years, customers might have stayed away from the higher value, higher quality and have shifted to the mid to lower tier prices/qualities. Maybe that's because of inflation? Maybe because of supply chain? Maybe the majority of consumers (the middle class ya know) have been squeezed and have been pushed to buy lower quality?
0
Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:
@StumpTownStu No comment on personal information, I wont disclose anything about me personally since in the past when i did even a SLIGHT discussion of my personal life there were many who personally attacked me with that information, a few still are members today so I will not be saying anything about what I did in the past. Lets just say I know the difference between low, mid and high quality items and I know the value of paying a bit more to get a LOT more in return. I would rather skip consuming or making something of low quality than to get the ingredients to MAKE the high quality product. To answer your other question, a place like RD or Sysco will carry a very small section of high end products but the majority of the stock is mid to low quality stuff used for mass production, so for example I bought some BOUNCER flour today it is high gluten used for artisan baking and I cannot find a similar quality high gluten product anywhere else that I find performs as well so I buy a 25 lb bag of BOUNCER ever so often for home use. It is my experience that the higher end pastas or cheeses or sauces etc you will have to find an importer that carries that elite brand if you are seeking that upper end product. I buy the Callebaut chocolate line at RD because it is considered an upper tier chocolate for baking but getting it at RD is as cheap as the Nestle bag at Costco, so I will drag my butt up to RD which is a 20 min drive to get a few items that are a good price and high quality.
In my line of work, I've found that manufactures haven't been focusing on their higher end products ever since covid. So finding the high quality product takes more work to deliver. At the same time, suppliers can be down sizing, trimming the fat and they have no room or capital to stock high end materials that may take longer to sell or may never sell. The elimination process of the higher end products slowed or stopped when covid opened back up. Even since the economy has been burning hot the last handful of years, customers might have stayed away from the higher value, higher quality and have shifted to the mid to lower tier prices/qualities. Maybe that's because of inflation? Maybe because of supply chain? Maybe the majority of consumers (the middle class ya know) have been squeezed and have been pushed to buy lower quality?
@BigGame90 I think there’s a difference between Natural & Manufactured cost hikes? Tariffs are paid by the origin and the recouped by price to the consumer….Not Natural ! Trump and his cabinet royal rump kissers will understand come November…If only ICE would come the Carolina’s. Georgia and Texas and detain undocumented immigrants that have built 80 to 85% of the homes by company’s like DB Horton Mungo & Linear…Who are huge donors to the GOP on a state & Federal lever….This would make a lot of rich southerns angry!…Not one arrest by ICE since Trumps 1st day in the Myrtle Beach…Business as usual!
Have any facts? In the future, I'll stop reading your posts when you slander someones name. Have already skipped over a couple posters in here that slander on every post. I'm not coming here to read or engage in garage.
I would imagine some of the quick housing developments that have been popping up in major cities have produced some lower quality workmanship warranty. But hey, we need lower cost housing, right? How else do you get lower costs? You can go read some reviews on the new builds to get a better idea. I'd suggest you give it a try if you'd like to do your own research on how the builds are going. Reviews (until AI takes them over) give a good idea of the living situations.
0
@joe pockets
Quote Originally Posted by joe pockets:
@BigGame90 I think there’s a difference between Natural & Manufactured cost hikes? Tariffs are paid by the origin and the recouped by price to the consumer….Not Natural ! Trump and his cabinet royal rump kissers will understand come November…If only ICE would come the Carolina’s. Georgia and Texas and detain undocumented immigrants that have built 80 to 85% of the homes by company’s like DB Horton Mungo & Linear…Who are huge donors to the GOP on a state & Federal lever….This would make a lot of rich southerns angry!…Not one arrest by ICE since Trumps 1st day in the Myrtle Beach…Business as usual!
Have any facts? In the future, I'll stop reading your posts when you slander someones name. Have already skipped over a couple posters in here that slander on every post. I'm not coming here to read or engage in garage.
I would imagine some of the quick housing developments that have been popping up in major cities have produced some lower quality workmanship warranty. But hey, we need lower cost housing, right? How else do you get lower costs? You can go read some reviews on the new builds to get a better idea. I'd suggest you give it a try if you'd like to do your own research on how the builds are going. Reviews (until AI takes them over) give a good idea of the living situations.
@fubah2 Dems - take from the rich >>> to give to the "poor" (ie, the overwhelming majority)
CONS - take from the poor >>> to give to the rich! YAY MAGA!
Fixed your color coded words for you. Take a look and let me know what you think.
democRATS- tax the rich >>> waste the money (Could be a thousand page post on how they waste the funds). Deceit their followers to believe they are working with robinhood. bahhhaaaa
RepublICANs - Creates work >>> to move the economy! YAY MAGA!
2
@fubah2 Dems - take from the rich >>> to give to the "poor" (ie, the overwhelming majority)
CONS - take from the poor >>> to give to the rich! YAY MAGA!
Fixed your color coded words for you. Take a look and let me know what you think.
democRATS- tax the rich >>> waste the money (Could be a thousand page post on how they waste the funds). Deceit their followers to believe they are working with robinhood. bahhhaaaa
RepublICANs - Creates work >>> to move the economy! YAY MAGA!
My comment was QUARTER TO QUARTER price increases and actually to correct you during Covid prices were decent it wasnt until it started to fade that the inventory backlog wore off and prices went up. I paid less for goods and services during Covid than I am now for pretty much everything. Gas prices here are 3.65 today which is 70 cents higher than I paid when Biden exited. Point being that the butt in the seat cannot move the needle outside a shock, tariffs are a shock to supply and pricing there are few things that can instantly shift the price curve than tariffs.
I think libs understand that taxation happens, it isnt that libs want more taxation rather the way the slush fund is distributed. That is how I see things, I have no confidence in either party reducing taxes but both parties control how the funds and debt are used, I choose social programs and domestic programs for the lesser, your side strips social funding and shifts it to military funding or corporate freebies or illegals elimination. I choose social funding as well. (edited)
1
@BigGame90
My comment was QUARTER TO QUARTER price increases and actually to correct you during Covid prices were decent it wasnt until it started to fade that the inventory backlog wore off and prices went up. I paid less for goods and services during Covid than I am now for pretty much everything. Gas prices here are 3.65 today which is 70 cents higher than I paid when Biden exited. Point being that the butt in the seat cannot move the needle outside a shock, tariffs are a shock to supply and pricing there are few things that can instantly shift the price curve than tariffs.
I think libs understand that taxation happens, it isnt that libs want more taxation rather the way the slush fund is distributed. That is how I see things, I have no confidence in either party reducing taxes but both parties control how the funds and debt are used, I choose social programs and domestic programs for the lesser, your side strips social funding and shifts it to military funding or corporate freebies or illegals elimination. I choose social funding as well. (edited)
@BigGame90 Sheesh you need to give someone a chance to reply before you make so many questions and comments. My comment was QUARTER TO QUARTER price increases and actually to correct you during Covid prices were decent it wasnt until it started to fade that the inventory backlog wore off and prices went up. I paid less for goods and services during Covid than I am now for pretty much everything. Gas prices here are 3.65 today which is 70 cents higher than I paid when Biden exited. Point being that the butt in the seat cannot move the needle outside a shock, tariffs are a shock to supply and pricing there are few things that can instantly shift the price curve than tariffs. I think libs understand that taxation happens, it isnt that libs want more taxation rather the way the slush fund is distributed. That is how I see things, I have no confidence in either party reducing taxes but both parties control how the funds and debt are used, I choose social programs and domestic programs for the lesser, your side strips social funding and shifts it to military funding or corporate freebies or illegals elimination. I choose social funding as well.
2
Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:
@BigGame90 Sheesh you need to give someone a chance to reply before you make so many questions and comments. My comment was QUARTER TO QUARTER price increases and actually to correct you during Covid prices were decent it wasnt until it started to fade that the inventory backlog wore off and prices went up. I paid less for goods and services during Covid than I am now for pretty much everything. Gas prices here are 3.65 today which is 70 cents higher than I paid when Biden exited. Point being that the butt in the seat cannot move the needle outside a shock, tariffs are a shock to supply and pricing there are few things that can instantly shift the price curve than tariffs. I think libs understand that taxation happens, it isnt that libs want more taxation rather the way the slush fund is distributed. That is how I see things, I have no confidence in either party reducing taxes but both parties control how the funds and debt are used, I choose social programs and domestic programs for the lesser, your side strips social funding and shifts it to military funding or corporate freebies or illegals elimination. I choose social funding as well.
He then taxes EVERYBODY (indirectly) with his tariffs, which HURTS the overwhelming majority considerably (cost/income ratio) but is a total nothing burger to the wealthy! Somewhat akin to the Robin Hood scenario: Dems - take from the rich >>> to give to the "poor" (ie, the overwhelming majority) CONS - take from the poor >>> to give to the rich! !
Instead of higher tariffs as a national sale tax, fairer and more efficient to allow income tax cuts to expire. As in many countries, better to have a sale tax on all goods and services because tax rate would be lower and tax refund transfer money from rich to poor.
1
Quote Originally Posted by fubah2:
He then taxes EVERYBODY (indirectly) with his tariffs, which HURTS the overwhelming majority considerably (cost/income ratio) but is a total nothing burger to the wealthy! Somewhat akin to the Robin Hood scenario: Dems - take from the rich >>> to give to the "poor" (ie, the overwhelming majority) CONS - take from the poor >>> to give to the rich! !
Instead of higher tariffs as a national sale tax, fairer and more efficient to allow income tax cuts to expire. As in many countries, better to have a sale tax on all goods and services because tax rate would be lower and tax refund transfer money from rich to poor.
Facts ? About who builds the majority of New development homes in the South East,Texas, Tennessee that are sold 700 thousand ? Fact the builder use undocumented labor! In a state like South Carolina where minimum wage is still 7.25 Hr a home for 370.000 is not for affordable housing buyers! Slander ….Trump ? He did or orchestrated with everything he was charged with and then some! And even though he is the poorest excuse for a human being to ever run for the office of President…I dislike the foolish people who bought into his BS and threw him support even more ! When this administration in the near future implodes the nation will rebound! Midterms are coming….Hopefully ICE can come to the Red states screw with the builders and businesses that have employed these criminals for as Trump calls them for many years and sent to anywhere but home…Great….Pendulum is swinging back as I type Bud!… …No emolument clause for him?? Shame on his supporters!
1
@BigGame90
Facts ? About who builds the majority of New development homes in the South East,Texas, Tennessee that are sold 700 thousand ? Fact the builder use undocumented labor! In a state like South Carolina where minimum wage is still 7.25 Hr a home for 370.000 is not for affordable housing buyers! Slander ….Trump ? He did or orchestrated with everything he was charged with and then some! And even though he is the poorest excuse for a human being to ever run for the office of President…I dislike the foolish people who bought into his BS and threw him support even more ! When this administration in the near future implodes the nation will rebound! Midterms are coming….Hopefully ICE can come to the Red states screw with the builders and businesses that have employed these criminals for as Trump calls them for many years and sent to anywhere but home…Great….Pendulum is swinging back as I type Bud!… …No emolument clause for him?? Shame on his supporters!
There was a decent breakdown of what I was referring to that came out earlier this week.
I have been saying for quite some time I think we have been in a recession of sorts for quite some time now and that the numbers made it appear that the economy was really better than it was.
You can make the argument that it has been this was since early 2022 or so.
I have been calling it an isolated recession or a hidden recession.
The way this guy termed it is very telling.He called it a ‘rolling’ recession.His contention is that the bottom appears to be around the time of ‘Liberation Day’.
As, I said the NBER classifies recessions somewhat differently and in hindsight.
This analyst’s contention is that the recession has been hitting different sectors at different times and, therefore, not as noticeable as if it were hitting everywhere at once.
Like we have talked about with the job numbers not being accurate, nor reflective of the entire situation that has been going on.The way he worded it:labor market data is “perhaps the most backward-looking of all the economic series” and “particularly prone to major revisions that tend to make the current data unreliable in real time.”
He goes into the earnings recovery and the R3K earnings bounce.
He does couch his expectations for a recovery on the FED’s reactions going forward into next year and government employment sector issues.
For example:“The boom in the government sector since Covid is one reason the economic statistics have been overstated relative to what’s actually going on in the private sector,” he said.
He does a very good job of breaking it down.It is well worth reading to get a sense of what I have been saying all along.Even if you do not read the detailed report, it is good to read the overview of it that is in most financial newsfeeds from earlier this week.
I do not agree with him completely on some of the minor details but overall I think his assessment is spot on.
0
@Rush51
There was a decent breakdown of what I was referring to that came out earlier this week.
I have been saying for quite some time I think we have been in a recession of sorts for quite some time now and that the numbers made it appear that the economy was really better than it was.
You can make the argument that it has been this was since early 2022 or so.
I have been calling it an isolated recession or a hidden recession.
The way this guy termed it is very telling.He called it a ‘rolling’ recession.His contention is that the bottom appears to be around the time of ‘Liberation Day’.
As, I said the NBER classifies recessions somewhat differently and in hindsight.
This analyst’s contention is that the recession has been hitting different sectors at different times and, therefore, not as noticeable as if it were hitting everywhere at once.
Like we have talked about with the job numbers not being accurate, nor reflective of the entire situation that has been going on.The way he worded it:labor market data is “perhaps the most backward-looking of all the economic series” and “particularly prone to major revisions that tend to make the current data unreliable in real time.”
He goes into the earnings recovery and the R3K earnings bounce.
He does couch his expectations for a recovery on the FED’s reactions going forward into next year and government employment sector issues.
For example:“The boom in the government sector since Covid is one reason the economic statistics have been overstated relative to what’s actually going on in the private sector,” he said.
He does a very good job of breaking it down.It is well worth reading to get a sense of what I have been saying all along.Even if you do not read the detailed report, it is good to read the overview of it that is in most financial newsfeeds from earlier this week.
I do not agree with him completely on some of the minor details but overall I think his assessment is spot on.
Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: He then taxes EVERYBODY (indirectly) with his tariffs, which HURTS the overwhelming majority considerably (cost/income ratio) but is a total nothing burger to the wealthy! Somewhat akin to the Robin Hood scenario: Dems - take from the rich >>> to give to the "poor" (ie, the overwhelming majority) CONS - take from the poor >>> to give to the rich! ! Instead of higher tariffs as a national sale tax, fairer and more efficient to allow income tax cuts to expire. As in many countries, better to have a sale tax on all goods and services because tax rate would be lower and tax refund transfer money from rich to poor.
1
Quote Originally Posted by thirdperson:
Quote Originally Posted by fubah2: He then taxes EVERYBODY (indirectly) with his tariffs, which HURTS the overwhelming majority considerably (cost/income ratio) but is a total nothing burger to the wealthy! Somewhat akin to the Robin Hood scenario: Dems - take from the rich >>> to give to the "poor" (ie, the overwhelming majority) CONS - take from the poor >>> to give to the rich! ! Instead of higher tariffs as a national sale tax, fairer and more efficient to allow income tax cuts to expire. As in many countries, better to have a sale tax on all goods and services because tax rate would be lower and tax refund transfer money from rich to poor.
Very curious how you defended the BLS data and concluded that the head deserved to be fired for a MISS then you decide when some corroborative piece fits your recession excuse for Trump narrative that the BLS numbers are inaccurate and prone to revisions...gee that was exactly word for word what I said and you rebutted over and over and over.
2
@Raiders22
Very curious how you defended the BLS data and concluded that the head deserved to be fired for a MISS then you decide when some corroborative piece fits your recession excuse for Trump narrative that the BLS numbers are inaccurate and prone to revisions...gee that was exactly word for word what I said and you rebutted over and over and over.
The whole point is that the numbers were muted like I said all along. These were not the only numbers that were very opaque. I have been pointing that out all along. Then as I just pointed out these are the ‘most backward-looking’ numbers. That is why everyone over there should have been fired. These are some of the very numbers folks need to be transparent. But we have been saying all along those numbers were not truly reflective. Not sure what Trump had to do with this. This was started under Biden. The only way to wrangle him in is that he fired the BLS lady for being consistently inconsistent. That does not matter in the overall scheme — other than the FED situation. The recessionary things were evident in other avenues as well.
0
@wallstreetcappers
The whole point is that the numbers were muted like I said all along. These were not the only numbers that were very opaque. I have been pointing that out all along. Then as I just pointed out these are the ‘most backward-looking’ numbers. That is why everyone over there should have been fired. These are some of the very numbers folks need to be transparent. But we have been saying all along those numbers were not truly reflective. Not sure what Trump had to do with this. This was started under Biden. The only way to wrangle him in is that he fired the BLS lady for being consistently inconsistent. That does not matter in the overall scheme — other than the FED situation. The recessionary things were evident in other avenues as well.
@Raiders22 Very curious how you defended the BLS data and concluded that the head deserved to be fired for a MISS then you decide when some corroborative piece fits your recession excuse for Trump narrative that the BLS numbers are inaccurate and prone to revisions...gee that was exactly word for word what I said and you rebutted over and over and over.
0
Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:
@Raiders22 Very curious how you defended the BLS data and concluded that the head deserved to be fired for a MISS then you decide when some corroborative piece fits your recession excuse for Trump narrative that the BLS numbers are inaccurate and prone to revisions...gee that was exactly word for word what I said and you rebutted over and over and over.
For example, if you have truer numbers you can call the recession earlier and better and determine what you want to do financially and policy-wise. Now that you are seeing the true numbers you can look back and make a better call. It would also help the FED out to make their decisions. Now they are about to get caught in a bind with trying to handle only one side of their mandate. But you need to have better and true numbers. But I do not think the labor market is the sole reason for calling a recession — it is only a part of it. Then you have the government hiring disguising the true numbers — then that part of it does matter more.
0
@wallstreetcappers
For example, if you have truer numbers you can call the recession earlier and better and determine what you want to do financially and policy-wise. Now that you are seeing the true numbers you can look back and make a better call. It would also help the FED out to make their decisions. Now they are about to get caught in a bind with trying to handle only one side of their mandate. But you need to have better and true numbers. But I do not think the labor market is the sole reason for calling a recession — it is only a part of it. Then you have the government hiring disguising the true numbers — then that part of it does matter more.
Just stop with this back peddling deflection already...own your words and own your flip flop and stop trying to worm out of it. I know you intentionally want to fight with me even when your logic is misguided you will make ten pages of deflect and divert just because you cannot handle a discussion with someone else that proves your point to be faulty.
The BLS is a DATA COLLECTOR...you fought with me to a point of stupidity, they do not CREATE the job numbers, they tabulate the surveys that COMPANIES FILL OUT and submit...the sample size is a joke, the lag time is a joke, the revision history is consistent and all of this makes the BLS information of little value ESPECIALLY the first print.
No you did and still continue to deflect and fight your erroneous point, why even post that above message which was a total 180 from your previous MULTIPLE messages to defend your political biases?
My BLS truth is not partisan, I am not defending a political party I only stated fact about the flaws of this report which have NOTHING to do with the BLS, the process they are forced to follow does not work for all the reasons stated above- sample size, revisions, lack of realistic reporting periods (needs to be at least a 3 month rolling number not month to month)
0
@Raiders22
Just stop with this back peddling deflection already...own your words and own your flip flop and stop trying to worm out of it. I know you intentionally want to fight with me even when your logic is misguided you will make ten pages of deflect and divert just because you cannot handle a discussion with someone else that proves your point to be faulty.
The BLS is a DATA COLLECTOR...you fought with me to a point of stupidity, they do not CREATE the job numbers, they tabulate the surveys that COMPANIES FILL OUT and submit...the sample size is a joke, the lag time is a joke, the revision history is consistent and all of this makes the BLS information of little value ESPECIALLY the first print.
No you did and still continue to deflect and fight your erroneous point, why even post that above message which was a total 180 from your previous MULTIPLE messages to defend your political biases?
My BLS truth is not partisan, I am not defending a political party I only stated fact about the flaws of this report which have NOTHING to do with the BLS, the process they are forced to follow does not work for all the reasons stated above- sample size, revisions, lack of realistic reporting periods (needs to be at least a 3 month rolling number not month to month)
No idea what you think I am backtracking on. This is two separate issues.
1) The BLS has been putting out bad numbers for a while now and we have been saying this. 2) We have been recessionary for a while now and the jobs is only a portion of it.
I have been saying both of these things for a long time now. I have not backtracked or deflected on either of them.
I do not want to argue with you. You jumped in here. I was addressing the post to @Rush51 not you. I do not recall us discussing a recession. I understand BLS very well. I have already pointed out to you that they are consistently +.2 for 10 years and now -.6. Nothing much to add there. The numbers have been obviously wrong for a time now. But, again, that is looking back to evaluate the situation. So, their function does not matter that much in real time as a complete assessment.
0
@wallstreetcappers
No idea what you think I am backtracking on. This is two separate issues.
1) The BLS has been putting out bad numbers for a while now and we have been saying this. 2) We have been recessionary for a while now and the jobs is only a portion of it.
I have been saying both of these things for a long time now. I have not backtracked or deflected on either of them.
I do not want to argue with you. You jumped in here. I was addressing the post to @Rush51 not you. I do not recall us discussing a recession. I understand BLS very well. I have already pointed out to you that they are consistently +.2 for 10 years and now -.6. Nothing much to add there. The numbers have been obviously wrong for a time now. But, again, that is looking back to evaluate the situation. So, their function does not matter that much in real time as a complete assessment.
But if you really want to understand their issues you can go read their report from a couple of years back that explain the issues that they have known about for a few years even before that report came out. Then toward the end of that year the DoL published their own report on the imputation problems and the methods they were looking at to deal with transparency. This is not a new issue at all. It was simply pushed to the forefront by the administration and they are attempting to ‘force’ changes.
Like one guy said:
“For 4 years, BLS bugged me every month for payroll data. After all that, they can't add.”
It is baffling how they cannot adapt and very disconcerting why they have not.
But you do not need only that data to see the issues the economy has had for a couple of years now.
0
@wallstreetcappers
But if you really want to understand their issues you can go read their report from a couple of years back that explain the issues that they have known about for a few years even before that report came out. Then toward the end of that year the DoL published their own report on the imputation problems and the methods they were looking at to deal with transparency. This is not a new issue at all. It was simply pushed to the forefront by the administration and they are attempting to ‘force’ changes.
Like one guy said:
“For 4 years, BLS bugged me every month for payroll data. After all that, they can't add.”
It is baffling how they cannot adapt and very disconcerting why they have not.
But you do not need only that data to see the issues the economy has had for a couple of years now.
I cant even have a discussion when your premise is fixated on partisan politics. The BLS does not create data they do not engineer information they do nothing more than count surveys that companies send in. There is no DATA that they have participation in, they are a bean counter they tabulate DATA from OUTSIDE SOURCES. TABULATE, they are a COUNTER of data not a creator or owner or originator of data. Your premise back then and now is wrong it is flat out wrong, you cannot try and squeeze in lies and partisan nonsense then smooth it over with frosting, the BLS does not own or originate data.
Your partisan blame oriented digs are wrong, the person in charge at the BLS could be George Bush's grandkid or they could be a Tim Curry transvestite and it would not matter in any shape or form the output of the data, they do nothing more than tabulate surveys, that is it.
A recession is the flip flop rationale that you tossed in to try and smooth out a bad argument from before I guess because what a recession has to do with your previous conversation is absent you just saw a new shiny coin and are fixated on it as if the BLS data correlates a recession or that this concept completely destroys all your past contentions and erroneous conclusions.
The flaws with the BLS are as I stated above and several times before. The way to FIX the BLS data is to make the report a rolling 4 month average, I say 4 so that all revisions can cycle in and not distort and be more smooth.
OR you could pull a Donald Trump fascist move and threaten imprisonment and fines to FORCE corps to report the data and do so inside say the 25th of the month and if not they their company would be nationalized and they would be shipped off to a Venezuelan prison for not following the dictators mandate.
Your quote above about the business owner is the proof to my absurd point above that businesses ELECT to report data and the BLS is not the HOUND police and yet they have done that in the past, this is the sign that the sample size is too small, the elective nature of reporting means the surveys are not comprehensive or complete or accurate and there is absolutely NOTHING outside a TNC fascist attack that could alter the flaws of a survey based data collection report.
1
@Raiders22
I cant even have a discussion when your premise is fixated on partisan politics. The BLS does not create data they do not engineer information they do nothing more than count surveys that companies send in. There is no DATA that they have participation in, they are a bean counter they tabulate DATA from OUTSIDE SOURCES. TABULATE, they are a COUNTER of data not a creator or owner or originator of data. Your premise back then and now is wrong it is flat out wrong, you cannot try and squeeze in lies and partisan nonsense then smooth it over with frosting, the BLS does not own or originate data.
Your partisan blame oriented digs are wrong, the person in charge at the BLS could be George Bush's grandkid or they could be a Tim Curry transvestite and it would not matter in any shape or form the output of the data, they do nothing more than tabulate surveys, that is it.
A recession is the flip flop rationale that you tossed in to try and smooth out a bad argument from before I guess because what a recession has to do with your previous conversation is absent you just saw a new shiny coin and are fixated on it as if the BLS data correlates a recession or that this concept completely destroys all your past contentions and erroneous conclusions.
The flaws with the BLS are as I stated above and several times before. The way to FIX the BLS data is to make the report a rolling 4 month average, I say 4 so that all revisions can cycle in and not distort and be more smooth.
OR you could pull a Donald Trump fascist move and threaten imprisonment and fines to FORCE corps to report the data and do so inside say the 25th of the month and if not they their company would be nationalized and they would be shipped off to a Venezuelan prison for not following the dictators mandate.
Your quote above about the business owner is the proof to my absurd point above that businesses ELECT to report data and the BLS is not the HOUND police and yet they have done that in the past, this is the sign that the sample size is too small, the elective nature of reporting means the surveys are not comprehensive or complete or accurate and there is absolutely NOTHING outside a TNC fascist attack that could alter the flaws of a survey based data collection report.
@Raiders22 I cant even have a discussion when your premise is fixated on partisan politics.
- The BLS is a DATA COLLECTOR
The BLS does not create data! they do not engineer information!
Your premise back then and now is wrong it is flat out wrong, you cannot try and squeeze in lies and partisan nonsense then smooth it over with frosting,
@wallstreetcappers
Just like the scoreboard operator in a football stadium.
Team X scores a TD and successful PAT, and he punches up 7 pts on the board.
Same thing.
0
Quote Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:
@Raiders22 I cant even have a discussion when your premise is fixated on partisan politics.
- The BLS is a DATA COLLECTOR
The BLS does not create data! they do not engineer information!
Your premise back then and now is wrong it is flat out wrong, you cannot try and squeeze in lies and partisan nonsense then smooth it over with frosting,
@wallstreetcappers
Just like the scoreboard operator in a football stadium.
Team X scores a TD and successful PAT, and he punches up 7 pts on the board.
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