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    All Forums | NFL Betting Forum

    Please... Explain to me...

    jesron1269
    houguy28
    BlueJayz1978
    CheezeStack
    UrdaddyinAZ
    ...
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    Views: 386
    Posts: 18
     
    jesron1269
    jesron1269
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    Posted: Oct. 12, 2009 - 11:52 PM ET #1

    how for the love of all things holy people cannot defend the Wildcat?  90% of the or better it is the snap reciever runs straight ahead.  I don't know if I will ever understand how perhaps the simplest play in football is causing the most problems.
     
    For fricks sake you can put a spy on the QB if he runs out of the pocket but no spy works for Ronnie Brown or Ricky Williams.  WTF!
     
    Someone who apparently knows more about football than me please explain how this is such a difficult play to defend.  Thanks in advance!
    Reply
    To remove first post, remove entire topic.
    how for the love of all things holy people cannot defend the Wildcat?  90% of the or better it is the snap reciever runs straight ahead.  I don't know if I will ever understand how perhaps the simplest play in football is causing the most problems.
     
    For fricks sake you can put a spy on the QB if he runs out of the pocket but no spy works for Ronnie Brown or Ricky Williams.  WTF!
     
    Someone who apparently knows more about football than me please explain how this is such a difficult play to defend.  Thanks in advance!
     
    houguy28
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    Posted: Oct. 12, 2009 - 11:53 PM ET #2

    to me, you have to have 2 good running backs, which fins do have.
    Reply
    to me, you have to have 2 good running backs, which fins do have.
     
    BlueJayz1978
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    Posted: Oct. 12, 2009 - 11:54 PM ET #3

    Reply
     
    CheezeStack
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    Posted: Oct. 12, 2009 - 11:54 PM ET #4

    You can run a draw, you can run HB sweep, you can run WR sweep, you can fake a WR sweep, you can run a double HB reverse, you can run a double WR reverse, you can run a fake HB sweep -> HB throw... should I continue?
    Reply
    You can run a draw, you can run HB sweep, you can run WR sweep, you can fake a WR sweep, you can run a double HB reverse, you can run a double WR reverse, you can run a fake HB sweep -> HB throw... should I continue?
     
    UrdaddyinAZ
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    Posted: Oct. 12, 2009 - 11:54 PM ET #5

    It's not unless you have personell like the Dolphins do. Brown and Williams are the perfect combination of power and speed.
    Reply
    It's not unless you have personell like the Dolphins do. Brown and Williams are the perfect combination of power and speed.
     
    LockMania
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    Posted: Oct. 12, 2009 - 11:57 PM ET #6

    The biggest problem with the wildcat is at the point of attack you create a mismatch with more blockers than defenders.  Take a typical offensive setup with 5 OL,  2TE'S, 2 wr's, a FB, and the wildcat QB and you have 8 blockers against the front 7 of the defense.  The 2 corners are lined up on the outside, and the safeties are at the 2nd layer of the defense.
    Reply
    The biggest problem with the wildcat is at the point of attack you create a mismatch with more blockers than defenders.  Take a typical offensive setup with 5 OL,  2TE'S, 2 wr's, a FB, and the wildcat QB and you have 8 blockers against the front 7 of the defense.  The 2 corners are lined up on the outside, and the safeties are at the 2nd layer of the defense.
     
    vpnyc1
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    Posted: Oct. 12, 2009 - 11:58 PM ET #7

    Jesron, it's all about the personnel. Ronnie Brown and Ricky Williams are both strong backs but it's their speed and ability to read the holes. The line has played extremely well and they are moving the pile. I'm a Dolphin fan and was worried how Henne would fit in but he didn't seem to mind going in and out. You can see by his arm strength that this offense is going to be exciting to watch.
    Reply
    Jesron, it's all about the personnel. Ronnie Brown and Ricky Williams are both strong backs but it's their speed and ability to read the holes. The line has played extremely well and they are moving the pile. I'm a Dolphin fan and was worried how Henne would fit in but he didn't seem to mind going in and out. You can see by his arm strength that this offense is going to be exciting to watch.
     
    nbafan88
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    Posted: Oct. 13, 2009 - 12:00 AM ET #8

    i hate the wildcat

    Reply
    i hate the wildcat

     
    jesron1269
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    Posted: Oct. 13, 2009 - 12:00 AM ET #9

    Quote Originally Posted by CheezeStack:

    You can run a draw, you can run HB sweep, you can run WR sweep, you can fake a WR sweep, you can run a double HB reverse, you can run a double WR reverse, you can run a fake HB sweep -> HB throw... should I continue?

    That is true they could but like I said 90% of the they don't.  For the record I had NYJ +11 big time in the last leg of a 12 point 4 team teaser and not too worried most of the game.  But I must admit I was stupid enough to take NYJ pk 2H.  What can you do.  Needed to have more action cost me.

    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by CheezeStack:

    You can run a draw, you can run HB sweep, you can run WR sweep, you can fake a WR sweep, you can run a double HB reverse, you can run a double WR reverse, you can run a fake HB sweep -> HB throw... should I continue?

    That is true they could but like I said 90% of the they don't.  For the record I had NYJ +11 big time in the last leg of a 12 point 4 team teaser and not too worried most of the game.  But I must admit I was stupid enough to take NYJ pk 2H.  What can you do.  Needed to have more action cost me.

     
    longhornswin
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    Posted: Oct. 13, 2009 - 12:01 AM ET #10

    Double dose of power and speed is definitely the answer.  There are a couple of teams that could and should (Panthers) run this type offense.  But, it's not as easy to defend as you think.  It's like the option on steroids. 
    Reply
    Double dose of power and speed is definitely the answer.  There are a couple of teams that could and should (Panthers) run this type offense.  But, it's not as easy to defend as you think.  It's like the option on steroids. 
     
    jesron1269
    jesron1269
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    Posted: Oct. 13, 2009 - 12:02 AM ET #11

    Quote Originally Posted by LockMania:

    The biggest problem with the wildcat is at the point of attack you create a mismatch with more blockers than defenders.  Take a typical offensive setup with 5 OL,  2TE'S, 2 wr's, a FB, and the wildcat QB and you have 8 blockers against the front 7 of the defense.  The 2 corners are lined up on the outside, and the safeties are at the 2nd layer of the defense.

    This I could see being true.  Very good explaination and that makes sense.  Thank you very much.  You don't see that necessarily on the field but it makes sense.  Also, thank you too vpnyc1 as that also makes sense.  BOL to all just very frustrating that I HAD to have action in the 2H.  I still made money but it could have been a LOT more.  BOL again!

    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by LockMania:

    The biggest problem with the wildcat is at the point of attack you create a mismatch with more blockers than defenders.  Take a typical offensive setup with 5 OL,  2TE'S, 2 wr's, a FB, and the wildcat QB and you have 8 blockers against the front 7 of the defense.  The 2 corners are lined up on the outside, and the safeties are at the 2nd layer of the defense.

    This I could see being true.  Very good explaination and that makes sense.  Thank you very much.  You don't see that necessarily on the field but it makes sense.  Also, thank you too vpnyc1 as that also makes sense.  BOL to all just very frustrating that I HAD to have action in the 2H.  I still made money but it could have been a LOT more.  BOL again!

     
    cd329
    cd329
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    Posted: Oct. 13, 2009 - 12:04 AM ET #12

    you basically have an extra blocker on the field, with no qb
    Reply
    you basically have an extra blocker on the field, with no qb
     
    IraiseAllin
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    Posted: Oct. 13, 2009 - 12:05 AM ET #13

    It also has a lot to do with the timing bc there is no middle man.  Now I realize it is not much of a difference but when the running back gets the ball directly and knows where he is going without having to wait for the qb the lineman need to hold their blocks a second less.  Now you might not think that matters but it definitely does.  I was a halfback in highschool and those holes close quickly and in the pros i would imagine them closing much quicker.  This is just one advantage of the wildcat and of course you need to have explosive running backs like the dolphins do.
    Reply
    It also has a lot to do with the timing bc there is no middle man.  Now I realize it is not much of a difference but when the running back gets the ball directly and knows where he is going without having to wait for the qb the lineman need to hold their blocks a second less.  Now you might not think that matters but it definitely does.  I was a halfback in highschool and those holes close quickly and in the pros i would imagine them closing much quicker.  This is just one advantage of the wildcat and of course you need to have explosive running backs like the dolphins do.
     
    ikid2groove029
    ikid2groove029
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    Posted: Oct. 13, 2009 - 12:06 AM ET #14

    You know the team is running......... but which direction... middle/left/right... which guy is running? honestly its not that easy 2 stop..... dolphins been running on every team this year.... not just the jets tonight...
    Reply
    You know the team is running......... but which direction... middle/left/right... which guy is running? honestly its not that easy 2 stop..... dolphins been running on every team this year.... not just the jets tonight...
     
    landis1717
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    Posted: Oct. 13, 2009 - 12:06 AM ET #15

    i use to think the wildcat was a joke but i've realized two things that give the offense a huge advantage. first the RB has much more control than if he's handed off the ball, second the LB's and safeties have to hesitate because they're so many options every play (rb handoff to other RB, WR sweep, outside runs, inside runs, or even pass) so that second of hesitation by the LB's give the OL a chance to get to the second level of defenders.
    Reply
    i use to think the wildcat was a joke but i've realized two things that give the offense a huge advantage. first the RB has much more control than if he's handed off the ball, second the LB's and safeties have to hesitate because they're so many options every play (rb handoff to other RB, WR sweep, outside runs, inside runs, or even pass) so that second of hesitation by the LB's give the OL a chance to get to the second level of defenders.
     
    ikid2groove029
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    Posted: Oct. 13, 2009 - 12:07 AM ET #16

    EXAMPLE ON THAT LAST PLAY OF THE GAME....JETS THOUGHT RONNIE GOING 2 RUN OUTSIDE... HE RAN IT UP THE MIDDLE LOL
    Reply
    EXAMPLE ON THAT LAST PLAY OF THE GAME....JETS THOUGHT RONNIE GOING 2 RUN OUTSIDE... HE RAN IT UP THE MIDDLE LOL
     
    jesron1269
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    Posted: Oct. 13, 2009 - 12:08 AM ET #17

    Quote Originally Posted by IraiseAllin:

    It also has a lot to do with the timing bc there is no middle man.  Now I realize it is not much of a difference but when the running back gets the ball directly and knows where he is going without having to wait for the qb the lineman need to hold their blocks a second less.  Now you might not think that matters but it definitely does.  I was a halfback in highschool and those holes close quickly and in the pros i would imagine them closing much quicker.  This is just one advantage of the wildcat and of course you need to have explosive running backs like the dolphins do.

    Good point.  I was a D-lineman in HS and college so I can relate.  Perhaps that is where my frustration mostly resides in the fact that as a D-lineman I know where the ball is going a vast majority of the time.  But again different level on the pro level.  Thanks again to everyone.  I never understood the craze but after tonight I must admit I am starting to warm up to the "Wildcat."  I really hope the Vikes employ something like that with Percy Harvin, ADP, and Chester Taylor.  Wouldn't that be deadly!!!  Go Vikes!!!

    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by IraiseAllin:

    It also has a lot to do with the timing bc there is no middle man.  Now I realize it is not much of a difference but when the running back gets the ball directly and knows where he is going without having to wait for the qb the lineman need to hold their blocks a second less.  Now you might not think that matters but it definitely does.  I was a halfback in highschool and those holes close quickly and in the pros i would imagine them closing much quicker.  This is just one advantage of the wildcat and of course you need to have explosive running backs like the dolphins do.

    Good point.  I was a D-lineman in HS and college so I can relate.  Perhaps that is where my frustration mostly resides in the fact that as a D-lineman I know where the ball is going a vast majority of the time.  But again different level on the pro level.  Thanks again to everyone.  I never understood the craze but after tonight I must admit I am starting to warm up to the "Wildcat."  I really hope the Vikes employ something like that with Percy Harvin, ADP, and Chester Taylor.  Wouldn't that be deadly!!!  Go Vikes!!!

     
     
    bears861224
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    Posted: Oct. 13, 2009 - 12:16 AM ET #18

    Think of this also....The back can see the whole line of scrimmage and can also adjust quicker to holes opening and closing....with a qb, the qb still has to hand the ball off....so there is not alot of options you have on what hole you are going to hit...ya....the qb can audible...but the rb can actually see the play unfolding as he hits the line of scrimmage
    Reply
    Think of this also....The back can see the whole line of scrimmage and can also adjust quicker to holes opening and closing....with a qb, the qb still has to hand the ball off....so there is not alot of options you have on what hole you are going to hit...ya....the qb can audible...but the rb can actually see the play unfolding as he hits the line of scrimmage
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