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    All Forums | NFL Betting Forum

    NFL Week 1 - Early Leans & Some Thoughts

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    undermysac
    iConsciousness
    saintsfan1977
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    undermysac
    undermysac
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    Posted: Aug. 7, 2023 - 6:10 PM ET #26

    @iConsciousness

    Dolphins @ Chargers

    I have one question for the Dolphins, why aren't they offering DT Christian Wilkins a new deal?

    For those that don't know who he is, probably the best run stopper in the nfl.

    Sieler is another stud d lineman also in a contract year. One or both of these dudes better get an extension before the season starts. I don't know what their stance is on possibly sitting out or not, but the Phins should be tying up loose ends. 

    That D line was a tremendous unit for them last year. And now they added Vic Fangio as DC.

    Dude has been a defensive God everywhere he's been.

    Started with the Saints as a LB coach. Worked with guys like Rickey Jackson, Pat Swilling, Sam Mills and Vaughan Johnson.

    Expansion Panthers, with Fangio were 2nd in scoring defense in their 2nd year, and allowed a nfl record low 56 points after halftime for the entire season. Worked with Sam Mills, Kevin Greene, and Lamar Lathon.

    Short stint with the Colts. But he improved the D and helped them win a divisional title after a 15 year drought. 

    Sucked ass with the Texans, but who hasn't?

    Was with the Ravens from 2006 to 2009 as a special assistant to the coach, working primarily on the defensive side. That D was kinda good...

    2010 became the Stanford Cardinals DC, was one of the best units in the nation. They went 12-1.

    Became a D coordinator with SF following Harbaugh there. From 2011 to 2013 the Niners went 36-11-1. The defensive #'s within that span were ridiculous. 

    Bears D coordinator from 2015-2018. All defense, no offense.

    Denver HC from 2019-2021. All defense, no offense. Being the HC was too much for him, he was in over his head. 

    2022 took a year off.

    What will 2023 hold for Miami's defense?

    Reply

    @iConsciousness

    Dolphins @ Chargers

    I have one question for the Dolphins, why aren't they offering DT Christian Wilkins a new deal?

    For those that don't know who he is, probably the best run stopper in the nfl.

    Sieler is another stud d lineman also in a contract year. One or both of these dudes better get an extension before the season starts. I don't know what their stance is on possibly sitting out or not, but the Phins should be tying up loose ends. 

    That D line was a tremendous unit for them last year. And now they added Vic Fangio as DC.

    Dude has been a defensive God everywhere he's been.

    Started with the Saints as a LB coach. Worked with guys like Rickey Jackson, Pat Swilling, Sam Mills and Vaughan Johnson.

    Expansion Panthers, with Fangio were 2nd in scoring defense in their 2nd year, and allowed a nfl record low 56 points after halftime for the entire season. Worked with Sam Mills, Kevin Greene, and Lamar Lathon.

    Short stint with the Colts. But he improved the D and helped them win a divisional title after a 15 year drought. 

    Sucked ass with the Texans, but who hasn't?

    Was with the Ravens from 2006 to 2009 as a special assistant to the coach, working primarily on the defensive side. That D was kinda good...

    2010 became the Stanford Cardinals DC, was one of the best units in the nation. They went 12-1.

    Became a D coordinator with SF following Harbaugh there. From 2011 to 2013 the Niners went 36-11-1. The defensive #'s within that span were ridiculous. 

    Bears D coordinator from 2015-2018. All defense, no offense.

    Denver HC from 2019-2021. All defense, no offense. Being the HC was too much for him, he was in over his head. 

    2022 took a year off.

    What will 2023 hold for Miami's defense?

     
    undermysac
    undermysac
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    Posted: Aug. 8, 2023 - 6:52 PM ET #27

    I know it's only August, but the forum is rather quiet.

     

    I'm pumped for football. 

    There's a certain covers mod that might not want to hear this:

    Kirk Cousins is 8-9 in night games since joining the Vikings. The Vikings have 5 prime time games this year.

    They finished with -13.6% dvoa last year(6th worst team), but finished with a 13-4 record. Their "estimated wins" last year was 6.3, this is like pythagorean wins in baseball. 

    Also, they had the 3rd worst special teams unit in the league. -3.8%. This isn't entirely a ranking of kicking alone, but also shows poor depth of talent and possibly poor coaching. 

    They were 19th by sos last year. Their schedule looks like a roller coaster this year. Playing shit teams and excellent teams. 

    Bucs, @ Eagles, Chargers, @ Panthers, Chiefs, @ Bears, 49ers, @ Packers, @ Falcons, Saints, @ Broncos, Bears, @ Raiders, @ Bengals, Lions, Packers, @ Lions.

    They don't have b2b home games till week 15,16 and both are divisional games. They have b2b road games twice.

    So they could actually improve as a team if they have made the right off season moves. By how much though? And more importantly what will their record be?

    Does 7-9 sound right?

    Sorry DJ reallyhappy

    Reply

    I know it's only August, but the forum is rather quiet.

     

    I'm pumped for football. 

    There's a certain covers mod that might not want to hear this:

    Kirk Cousins is 8-9 in night games since joining the Vikings. The Vikings have 5 prime time games this year.

    They finished with -13.6% dvoa last year(6th worst team), but finished with a 13-4 record. Their "estimated wins" last year was 6.3, this is like pythagorean wins in baseball. 

    Also, they had the 3rd worst special teams unit in the league. -3.8%. This isn't entirely a ranking of kicking alone, but also shows poor depth of talent and possibly poor coaching. 

    They were 19th by sos last year. Their schedule looks like a roller coaster this year. Playing shit teams and excellent teams. 

    Bucs, @ Eagles, Chargers, @ Panthers, Chiefs, @ Bears, 49ers, @ Packers, @ Falcons, Saints, @ Broncos, Bears, @ Raiders, @ Bengals, Lions, Packers, @ Lions.

    They don't have b2b home games till week 15,16 and both are divisional games. They have b2b road games twice.

    So they could actually improve as a team if they have made the right off season moves. By how much though? And more importantly what will their record be?

    Does 7-9 sound right?

    Sorry DJ reallyhappy

     
    iConsciousness
    iConsciousness
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    Posted: Aug. 9, 2023 - 11:51 AM ET #28

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    @iConsciousness  Bears fans always travel well. Last year in Dallas it felt as if we were nearly 50% of that stadium.  Granted the Bears almost always get smashed, the fans are still loyal.  Some more off season spat: https://www.sportsmockery.com/chicago-bears/unexpected-standout-of-bears-training-camp-andrew-billings/?amp

    It'll be interesting to see what that game in Arrowhead looks like, since it's always a sea of red there. I figured, unlike LA fans, they don't sell their tickets for a profit.

    As for Billings, some times you can find the right guy on the trash heap, put him in a defense with a coaching staff that feels like its tailor-made for them, and voila...you get a real gem. He sounds like our version of Morgan Fox, who is a DT that plays really well in Staley's defense.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    @iConsciousness  Bears fans always travel well. Last year in Dallas it felt as if we were nearly 50% of that stadium.  Granted the Bears almost always get smashed, the fans are still loyal.  Some more off season spat: https://www.sportsmockery.com/chicago-bears/unexpected-standout-of-bears-training-camp-andrew-billings/?amp

    It'll be interesting to see what that game in Arrowhead looks like, since it's always a sea of red there. I figured, unlike LA fans, they don't sell their tickets for a profit.

    As for Billings, some times you can find the right guy on the trash heap, put him in a defense with a coaching staff that feels like its tailor-made for them, and voila...you get a real gem. He sounds like our version of Morgan Fox, who is a DT that plays really well in Staley's defense.

     
    iConsciousness
    iConsciousness
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    Posts: 4652
    Posted: Aug. 9, 2023 - 12:01 PM ET #29

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    @iConsciousness Dolphins @ Chargers I have one question for the Dolphins, why aren't they offering DT Christian Wilkins a new deal? For those that don't know who he is, probably the best run stopper in the nfl. Sieler is another stud d lineman also in a contract year. One or both of these dudes better get an extension before the season starts. I don't know what their stance is on possibly sitting out or not, but the Phins should be tying up loose ends.  That D line was a tremendous unit for them last year. And now they added Vic Fangio as DC. Dude has been a defensive God everywhere he's been. Started with the Saints as a LB coach. Worked with guys like Rickey Jackson, Pat Swilling, Sam Mills and Vaughan Johnson. Expansion Panthers, with Fangio were 2nd in scoring defense in their 2nd year, and allowed a nfl record low 56 points after halftime for the entire season. Worked with Sam Mills, Kevin Greene, and Lamar Lathon. Short stint with the Colts. But he improved the D and helped them win a divisional title after a 15 year drought.  Sucked ass with the Texans, but who hasn't? Was with the Ravens from 2006 to 2009 as a special assistant to the coach, working primarily on the defensive side. That D was kinda good... 2010 became the Stanford Cardinals DC, was one of the best units in the nation. They went 12-1. Became a D coordinator with SF following Harbaugh there. From 2011 to 2013 the Niners went 36-11-1. The defensive #'s within that span were ridiculous.  Bears D coordinator from 2015-2018. All defense, no offense. Denver HC from 2019-2021. All defense, no offense. Being the HC was too much for him, he was in over his head.  2022 took a year off. What will 2023 hold for Miami's defense?


    I did attempt share my thoughts re: Fangio, Staley, and threw in Moore there, but in true Covers fashion, the whole dissertation I wrote got deleted when I tried to add a hyperlink to text. I couldn't "undo" it, so I'll need a short break before I attempt it again. Or just not. lol

    But, there's some head-to-head history between Staley and Fangio already, and Fangio vs a Kellen Moore offense. (Cliffs Notes version:  Fangio has the better record.)

    I do think that the marriage of Herbert and Moore is a match made in heaven, though. If you held down Wolverine, and de-clawed him, he'd still have powers...but wouldn't be nearly as lethal. That was Herbert's career with Joe Lombardi as OC, in a nutshell. As far as I'm concerned, you add a full year of Rashawn Slater at LT, replace the ineffective Matt Feiler with Jamaree Salyer, get a full season of both Keenan Allen & Mike Williams, and add #1 draft pick Quentin Johnston to the mix, and you'll see another side of Herbert you've only seen glimpses of. Perhaps I'm just a homer, but I do have the rationale to lay it all out as to why. The Chargers beat the Dolphins last year without all of this, because sometimes Staley can whip up a masterclass on how to orchestrate a defense.

    But this thread isn't about the Chargers, per se, it's about the Dolphins defense this year. And I'll get to that part at some point later. It's going to force me to break down that matchup a little more, and I'm always up for that.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    @iConsciousness Dolphins @ Chargers I have one question for the Dolphins, why aren't they offering DT Christian Wilkins a new deal? For those that don't know who he is, probably the best run stopper in the nfl. Sieler is another stud d lineman also in a contract year. One or both of these dudes better get an extension before the season starts. I don't know what their stance is on possibly sitting out or not, but the Phins should be tying up loose ends.  That D line was a tremendous unit for them last year. And now they added Vic Fangio as DC. Dude has been a defensive God everywhere he's been. Started with the Saints as a LB coach. Worked with guys like Rickey Jackson, Pat Swilling, Sam Mills and Vaughan Johnson. Expansion Panthers, with Fangio were 2nd in scoring defense in their 2nd year, and allowed a nfl record low 56 points after halftime for the entire season. Worked with Sam Mills, Kevin Greene, and Lamar Lathon. Short stint with the Colts. But he improved the D and helped them win a divisional title after a 15 year drought.  Sucked ass with the Texans, but who hasn't? Was with the Ravens from 2006 to 2009 as a special assistant to the coach, working primarily on the defensive side. That D was kinda good... 2010 became the Stanford Cardinals DC, was one of the best units in the nation. They went 12-1. Became a D coordinator with SF following Harbaugh there. From 2011 to 2013 the Niners went 36-11-1. The defensive #'s within that span were ridiculous.  Bears D coordinator from 2015-2018. All defense, no offense. Denver HC from 2019-2021. All defense, no offense. Being the HC was too much for him, he was in over his head.  2022 took a year off. What will 2023 hold for Miami's defense?


    I did attempt share my thoughts re: Fangio, Staley, and threw in Moore there, but in true Covers fashion, the whole dissertation I wrote got deleted when I tried to add a hyperlink to text. I couldn't "undo" it, so I'll need a short break before I attempt it again. Or just not. lol

    But, there's some head-to-head history between Staley and Fangio already, and Fangio vs a Kellen Moore offense. (Cliffs Notes version:  Fangio has the better record.)

    I do think that the marriage of Herbert and Moore is a match made in heaven, though. If you held down Wolverine, and de-clawed him, he'd still have powers...but wouldn't be nearly as lethal. That was Herbert's career with Joe Lombardi as OC, in a nutshell. As far as I'm concerned, you add a full year of Rashawn Slater at LT, replace the ineffective Matt Feiler with Jamaree Salyer, get a full season of both Keenan Allen & Mike Williams, and add #1 draft pick Quentin Johnston to the mix, and you'll see another side of Herbert you've only seen glimpses of. Perhaps I'm just a homer, but I do have the rationale to lay it all out as to why. The Chargers beat the Dolphins last year without all of this, because sometimes Staley can whip up a masterclass on how to orchestrate a defense.

    But this thread isn't about the Chargers, per se, it's about the Dolphins defense this year. And I'll get to that part at some point later. It's going to force me to break down that matchup a little more, and I'm always up for that.

     
    saintsfan1977
    saintsfan1977
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    Posts: 348
    Posted: Aug. 9, 2023 - 3:20 PM ET #30

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness:

      That Jonathan Taylor-Jim Irsay fiasco isn't doing the team any favors. I like their head coach (Steichen), but he's going to need to find his way in his first season as HC. I wonder what the record is for rooking QBs starting their first game

     

    .

     

    You would put money on QB that doesn't win on the road? Haven't beat Indy on the road since 2017.Jacksonville has to play KC in week 2. Revenge game so they'll be looking ahead.

    Indy coaches have alot of familiarity with Jacksonville. 

    Gardner minshew will be fired up to beat Jacksonville. Rethink this bet unless the rookie starts week 1.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness:

      That Jonathan Taylor-Jim Irsay fiasco isn't doing the team any favors. I like their head coach (Steichen), but he's going to need to find his way in his first season as HC. I wonder what the record is for rooking QBs starting their first game

     

    .

     

    You would put money on QB that doesn't win on the road? Haven't beat Indy on the road since 2017.Jacksonville has to play KC in week 2. Revenge game so they'll be looking ahead.

    Indy coaches have alot of familiarity with Jacksonville. 

    Gardner minshew will be fired up to beat Jacksonville. Rethink this bet unless the rookie starts week 1.

     
    saintsfan1977
    saintsfan1977
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    Posted: Aug. 9, 2023 - 3:49 PM ET #31

    @iConsciousness

     I don't like Vikings in week 1. Tampa is not going to air it out vs Minnesota. They will run the shit out of the ball. That's why Byron Leftwich was fired.

    Too many people are thinking losing Brady and starting Baker is an easy cover for Minnesota.

    [quote] Since 2004, there have been nineteen occurrences of a team with a successful quarterback either being traded away or retiring. In Week One, those teams have gone 16-3 SU and 15-2-2 ATS.[/quote]

     

    Good luck 

    Reply

    @iConsciousness

     I don't like Vikings in week 1. Tampa is not going to air it out vs Minnesota. They will run the shit out of the ball. That's why Byron Leftwich was fired.

    Too many people are thinking losing Brady and starting Baker is an easy cover for Minnesota.

    [quote] Since 2004, there have been nineteen occurrences of a team with a successful quarterback either being traded away or retiring. In Week One, those teams have gone 16-3 SU and 15-2-2 ATS.[/quote]

     

    Good luck 

     
    undermysac
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    Posted: Aug. 9, 2023 - 4:57 PM ET #32

    Quote Originally Posted by saintsfan1977:

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness:   That Jonathan Taylor-Jim Irsay fiasco isn't doing the team any favors. I like their head coach (Steichen), but he's going to need to find his way in his first season as HC. I wonder what the record is for rooking QBs starting their first game   .   You would put money on QB that doesn't win on the road? Haven't beat Indy on the road since 2017.Jacksonville has to play KC in week 2. Revenge game so they'll be looking ahead. Indy coaches have alot of familiarity with Jacksonville.  Gardner minshew will be fired up to beat Jacksonville. Rethink this bet unless the rookie starts week 1.

    Dude, I can't agree with this. There's no team in history who's made week 1 their look ahead week. No way. Every dude will be pumped to play. Every team is even at 0-0. All that off season work to finally get on the field...

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by saintsfan1977:

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness:   That Jonathan Taylor-Jim Irsay fiasco isn't doing the team any favors. I like their head coach (Steichen), but he's going to need to find his way in his first season as HC. I wonder what the record is for rooking QBs starting their first game   .   You would put money on QB that doesn't win on the road? Haven't beat Indy on the road since 2017.Jacksonville has to play KC in week 2. Revenge game so they'll be looking ahead. Indy coaches have alot of familiarity with Jacksonville.  Gardner minshew will be fired up to beat Jacksonville. Rethink this bet unless the rookie starts week 1.

    Dude, I can't agree with this. There's no team in history who's made week 1 their look ahead week. No way. Every dude will be pumped to play. Every team is even at 0-0. All that off season work to finally get on the field...

     
    undermysac
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    Posted: Aug. 9, 2023 - 5:01 PM ET #33

    @iConsciousness

    It's interesting that Staley was a Fangio protégé. Who knows who better? 

    peace_5

    Reply

    @iConsciousness

    It's interesting that Staley was a Fangio protégé. Who knows who better? 

    peace_5

     
    saintsfan1977
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    Posted: Aug. 9, 2023 - 5:17 PM ET #34

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    Dude, I can't agree with this. There's no team in history who's made week 1 their look ahead week. No way. Every dude will be pumped to play. Every team is even at 0-0. All that off season work to finally get on the field...

     

    Not every player cares about winning. That's a fact. So no, not everyone will be fired up because it's game 1.

    Lawrence replaced Minshew. He can say there's no grudge but he will play better against his former team. It's nuts to take a team that can't beat indy in indy and yet everyone is lining up to grab Jacksonville.

    Division home dogs are 22-4 ats in week 1 since 2009. Take the Jags but you were warned. 

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    Dude, I can't agree with this. There's no team in history who's made week 1 their look ahead week. No way. Every dude will be pumped to play. Every team is even at 0-0. All that off season work to finally get on the field...

     

    Not every player cares about winning. That's a fact. So no, not everyone will be fired up because it's game 1.

    Lawrence replaced Minshew. He can say there's no grudge but he will play better against his former team. It's nuts to take a team that can't beat indy in indy and yet everyone is lining up to grab Jacksonville.

    Division home dogs are 22-4 ats in week 1 since 2009. Take the Jags but you were warned. 

     
    Biscuiteater1
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    Posted: Aug. 10, 2023 - 2:02 PM ET #35

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness:

    @undermysac    "Lions vs Chiefs - You said that it will take time for the Lions? That time has all ready come when they went 8-2 in their last 10 games of the season. One of the two losses were to the Bills, where they were tied with 23 seconds left. The Lions were the most dangerous team to not make the playoffs last year. No one would of wanted to play them."   Touche'. I feel you on this, Sac. My first impulse was to pick the Lions because of that. Their most impressive win during that stretch was against the Jags, imo. They hammered them. I'm also considering the fact that they added Jahmyr Gibbs.The thing is, the Lions aren't facing any old team. Andy Reid has a whole off-season to plan for this game. For the same reasons you tout Bill Bellichick, I tout Andy Reid. The Chiefs just have to beat the Lions by a touchdown. I think they can do this. I would most likely bet this if it was on the board, and wouldn't hate losing that bet (given my allegiances to the Chiefs' division rival). H2H:  I know you'll consider Goff's one game against the Chiefs, in which he was playing for the Rams at the time. If I recall correctly, the Chiefs got somewhat hosed when they had to move the game from Mexico City to the Coliseum in L.A. They lost an even playing field at the last moment, and the Rams gave away a lot of free tickets to LA residents to help fill the stadium on short notice. It was also a high scoring game. The Chiefs fan base travels well, and instead of travelling to Mexico City, most fans couldn't pivot to travels to LA on short notice. Had it been in LA all along you would've seen a sea of red. (Best thing that could've happened to the Rams.)  I don't want to spend too much time on this, so let's just leave this viewing angle alone for now. You brought up a good point. I knew they were hot down the stretch, but I wasn't paying attention to the actual numbers and who they beat. If the Lions can beat the Chiefs in Arrowhead, in the home opener, I'll deem them a serious contender for a Super Bowl. They've got the stud WR (St. Brown; eventually Williams), a QB playing at his peak, and I'll assume Gibbs is for real.
    Lions gave up 6 yards per play last year and if they were to do so against KC on opening night i think it's safe to say that they will be playing from behind.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness:

    @undermysac    "Lions vs Chiefs - You said that it will take time for the Lions? That time has all ready come when they went 8-2 in their last 10 games of the season. One of the two losses were to the Bills, where they were tied with 23 seconds left. The Lions were the most dangerous team to not make the playoffs last year. No one would of wanted to play them."   Touche'. I feel you on this, Sac. My first impulse was to pick the Lions because of that. Their most impressive win during that stretch was against the Jags, imo. They hammered them. I'm also considering the fact that they added Jahmyr Gibbs.The thing is, the Lions aren't facing any old team. Andy Reid has a whole off-season to plan for this game. For the same reasons you tout Bill Bellichick, I tout Andy Reid. The Chiefs just have to beat the Lions by a touchdown. I think they can do this. I would most likely bet this if it was on the board, and wouldn't hate losing that bet (given my allegiances to the Chiefs' division rival). H2H:  I know you'll consider Goff's one game against the Chiefs, in which he was playing for the Rams at the time. If I recall correctly, the Chiefs got somewhat hosed when they had to move the game from Mexico City to the Coliseum in L.A. They lost an even playing field at the last moment, and the Rams gave away a lot of free tickets to LA residents to help fill the stadium on short notice. It was also a high scoring game. The Chiefs fan base travels well, and instead of travelling to Mexico City, most fans couldn't pivot to travels to LA on short notice. Had it been in LA all along you would've seen a sea of red. (Best thing that could've happened to the Rams.)  I don't want to spend too much time on this, so let's just leave this viewing angle alone for now. You brought up a good point. I knew they were hot down the stretch, but I wasn't paying attention to the actual numbers and who they beat. If the Lions can beat the Chiefs in Arrowhead, in the home opener, I'll deem them a serious contender for a Super Bowl. They've got the stud WR (St. Brown; eventually Williams), a QB playing at his peak, and I'll assume Gibbs is for real.
    Lions gave up 6 yards per play last year and if they were to do so against KC on opening night i think it's safe to say that they will be playing from behind.

     
    Biscuiteater1
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    Posted: Aug. 10, 2023 - 2:16 PM ET #36

    Quote Originally Posted by saintsfan1977:

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac: Dude, I can't agree with this. There's no team in history who's made week 1 their look ahead week. No way. Every dude will be pumped to play. Every team is even at 0-0. All that off season work to finally get on the field...   Not every player cares about winning. That's a fact. So no, not everyone will be fired up because it's game 1. Lawrence replaced Minshew. He can say there's no grudge but he will play better against his former team. It's nuts to take a team that can't beat indy in indy and yet everyone is lining up to grab Jacksonville. Division home dogs are 22-4 ats in week 1 since 2009. Take the Jags but you were warned.
    Yes not every single player in the NFL will be pumped about opening day but very very few of them will be starters.I do agree with you about jumping willy nilly on the Jags here.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by saintsfan1977:

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac: Dude, I can't agree with this. There's no team in history who's made week 1 their look ahead week. No way. Every dude will be pumped to play. Every team is even at 0-0. All that off season work to finally get on the field...   Not every player cares about winning. That's a fact. So no, not everyone will be fired up because it's game 1. Lawrence replaced Minshew. He can say there's no grudge but he will play better against his former team. It's nuts to take a team that can't beat indy in indy and yet everyone is lining up to grab Jacksonville. Division home dogs are 22-4 ats in week 1 since 2009. Take the Jags but you were warned.
    Yes not every single player in the NFL will be pumped about opening day but very very few of them will be starters.I do agree with you about jumping willy nilly on the Jags here.

     
    undermysac
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    Posted: Aug. 10, 2023 - 5:08 PM ET #37

    @saintsfan1977

     All your reasons for backing Indy instead of the Jags are fine. Except 1, and that's because you think the Jags will be looking ahead. It's not valid imo.

    Reply

    @saintsfan1977

     All your reasons for backing Indy instead of the Jags are fine. Except 1, and that's because you think the Jags will be looking ahead. It's not valid imo.

     
    iConsciousness
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    Posted: Aug. 10, 2023 - 5:20 PM ET #38

    Quote Originally Posted by saintsfan1977:

    You would put money on QB that doesn't win on the road? Haven't beat Indy on the road since 2017.Jacksonville has to play KC in week 2. Revenge game so they'll be looking ahead. Indy coaches have alot of familiarity with Jacksonville.  Gardner minshew will be fired up to beat Jacksonville. Rethink this bet unless the rookie starts week 1.

    ...

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness:

    A lot can happen between now, so I'm only going by the current state of each team (health, depth, word around camp, etc...). These are games I wouldn't lay any bets on at all, but are simply games I see on the board and have an initial reaction to. Some games are easier decisions for me even this early. Games such as Dolphins/Chargers, Jaguars/Colts, Lions vs Chiefs

    Meaning, this is just a casual eye test looking at the current makeup of the teams and what I've reading in training camp so far. Also...

    You seem to be dismissing the Jags for the team that they are. They won their last 5 regular season games, and last 7 of 9 regular season games. For as much as the fault lied with the Chargers for blowing a 27 point lead against the Jags in the wild card round, you have to give credit to Doug Pederson, Trevor Lawrence, and their defense as well. They ended up losing to the Chiefs -- the eventual SB winner -- by one touchdown.

    Simply put, they are top tier AFC team. Pederson has won a Super Bowl already and will keep this team focused. I'll put more stock on that than the Minshew revenge angle. Forgive me if Minshew doesn't move the needle much for me, regardless of once being a starting QB in Jacksonville.

     

    Quote Originally Posted by saintsfan1977:

    I don't like Vikings in week 1. Tampa is not going to air it out vs Minnesota. They will run the shit out of the ball. That's why Byron Leftwich was fired.

    Too many people are thinking losing Brady and starting Baker is an easy cover for Minnesota.



    Fair, but...

    1. If Danielle Hunter is starting, they're not goin to be easy to run on. They've also added Marcus Davenport in the off-season. The Brian Flores-led defense looks aggressive this offseason, so I don't think it's as easy as the combined efforts of Rachaad White, Chase Edmonds, and whoever is 3d on the RB depth chart plowing through the Vikings' defense. But I guess we'll see.

    2. Mayfield looks like sh*it this off-season. You need a strong passing game to have an effective run game. And vice-versa, but I just don't see the run game being as effective as you think it is.

    3. This is not a primetime game, so this means that Cousins will be okay. 

    4. The Vikings were 8-1 at home last season. If you look at that as a predictive model for their chances at pulling off a victory against the Buccs, I like their chances Week 1.


    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by saintsfan1977:

    You would put money on QB that doesn't win on the road? Haven't beat Indy on the road since 2017.Jacksonville has to play KC in week 2. Revenge game so they'll be looking ahead. Indy coaches have alot of familiarity with Jacksonville.  Gardner minshew will be fired up to beat Jacksonville. Rethink this bet unless the rookie starts week 1.

    ...

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness:

    A lot can happen between now, so I'm only going by the current state of each team (health, depth, word around camp, etc...). These are games I wouldn't lay any bets on at all, but are simply games I see on the board and have an initial reaction to. Some games are easier decisions for me even this early. Games such as Dolphins/Chargers, Jaguars/Colts, Lions vs Chiefs

    Meaning, this is just a casual eye test looking at the current makeup of the teams and what I've reading in training camp so far. Also...

    You seem to be dismissing the Jags for the team that they are. They won their last 5 regular season games, and last 7 of 9 regular season games. For as much as the fault lied with the Chargers for blowing a 27 point lead against the Jags in the wild card round, you have to give credit to Doug Pederson, Trevor Lawrence, and their defense as well. They ended up losing to the Chiefs -- the eventual SB winner -- by one touchdown.

    Simply put, they are top tier AFC team. Pederson has won a Super Bowl already and will keep this team focused. I'll put more stock on that than the Minshew revenge angle. Forgive me if Minshew doesn't move the needle much for me, regardless of once being a starting QB in Jacksonville.

     

    Quote Originally Posted by saintsfan1977:

    I don't like Vikings in week 1. Tampa is not going to air it out vs Minnesota. They will run the shit out of the ball. That's why Byron Leftwich was fired.

    Too many people are thinking losing Brady and starting Baker is an easy cover for Minnesota.



    Fair, but...

    1. If Danielle Hunter is starting, they're not goin to be easy to run on. They've also added Marcus Davenport in the off-season. The Brian Flores-led defense looks aggressive this offseason, so I don't think it's as easy as the combined efforts of Rachaad White, Chase Edmonds, and whoever is 3d on the RB depth chart plowing through the Vikings' defense. But I guess we'll see.

    2. Mayfield looks like sh*it this off-season. You need a strong passing game to have an effective run game. And vice-versa, but I just don't see the run game being as effective as you think it is.

    3. This is not a primetime game, so this means that Cousins will be okay. 

    4. The Vikings were 8-1 at home last season. If you look at that as a predictive model for their chances at pulling off a victory against the Buccs, I like their chances Week 1.


     
    iConsciousness
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    Posted: Aug. 10, 2023 - 5:28 PM ET #39

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    @iConsciousness It's interesting that Staley was a Fangio protégé. Who knows who better?


    A good student pays close attention to their teacher. A good teacher will observe their student's strengths and faults.

    So, good question.

    I'll say this, the one thing I liked about Staley was that he played the QB position in college. His mentality coming into the Chargers' HC position was to let the defense know the mindset of a QB, and equip the QB with the mindset of what the defenses will exploit. I mean, this should be a standard process to impress upon a defense and QB play, but he really emphasized that. I think I also read that he has 7-8 former QBs on his coaching staff.

    Fangio is a dawg, though. There's a reason why the Eagles employed him as a special assistant some time during the playoffs. I think he'll be more effective if he's just focusing on the defensive side of the ball.

    The Chargers promoted their DB coach as their DC this off-season, and of course gave Lombardi the boot in favor of Kellen Moore. 

    Moore vs. Fangio will be the chess game to watch in this game.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    @iConsciousness It's interesting that Staley was a Fangio protégé. Who knows who better?


    A good student pays close attention to their teacher. A good teacher will observe their student's strengths and faults.

    So, good question.

    I'll say this, the one thing I liked about Staley was that he played the QB position in college. His mentality coming into the Chargers' HC position was to let the defense know the mindset of a QB, and equip the QB with the mindset of what the defenses will exploit. I mean, this should be a standard process to impress upon a defense and QB play, but he really emphasized that. I think I also read that he has 7-8 former QBs on his coaching staff.

    Fangio is a dawg, though. There's a reason why the Eagles employed him as a special assistant some time during the playoffs. I think he'll be more effective if he's just focusing on the defensive side of the ball.

    The Chargers promoted their DB coach as their DC this off-season, and of course gave Lombardi the boot in favor of Kellen Moore. 

    Moore vs. Fangio will be the chess game to watch in this game.

     
    iConsciousness
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    Posted: Aug. 10, 2023 - 5:31 PM ET #40

    @Biscuiteater1

     Has the Lions defense added anyone of note this off-season? I'm still of the opinion that the Chiefs > Lions (especially by just 1 TD) for Week 1. But I acknowledge that the Lions are trending in the right direction and could contend for an NFC Championship.

    Reply

    @Biscuiteater1

     Has the Lions defense added anyone of note this off-season? I'm still of the opinion that the Chiefs > Lions (especially by just 1 TD) for Week 1. But I acknowledge that the Lions are trending in the right direction and could contend for an NFC Championship.

     
    undermysac
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    Posted: Aug. 10, 2023 - 7:23 PM ET #41

    @iConsciousness

     https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offseason-report-detroit-lions

    peace_5

    Reply

    @iConsciousness

     https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offseason-report-detroit-lions

    peace_5

     
    Biscuiteater1
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    Posted: Aug. 11, 2023 - 6:23 AM ET #42

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    @iConsciousness  https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offseason-report-detroit-lions
     peace_5..they really did not say much about 3rd dt Broderic Martin and i can't either other than he has the size part covered, 6'.5" 331 pounds.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    @iConsciousness  https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offseason-report-detroit-lions
     peace_5..they really did not say much about 3rd dt Broderic Martin and i can't either other than he has the size part covered, 6'.5" 331 pounds.

     
    iConsciousness
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    Posted: Aug. 11, 2023 - 2:47 PM ET #43

    @undermysac

     Thanks for doin the dirty work on that one. peace_5

    Reply

    @undermysac

     Thanks for doin the dirty work on that one. peace_5

     
    iConsciousness
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    Posted: Aug. 11, 2023 - 2:49 PM ET #44

    Per Vincent Bonsignore:

     

    WR Davante Adams left practice Friday after suffering an apparent leg injury.

     

    EDIT:  Update: "Raiders coach Josh McDaniels hasn't gotten a full report on Davante Adams but his understanding is the injury isn't too serious."

    Reply

    Per Vincent Bonsignore:

     

    WR Davante Adams left practice Friday after suffering an apparent leg injury.

     

    EDIT:  Update: "Raiders coach Josh McDaniels hasn't gotten a full report on Davante Adams but his understanding is the injury isn't too serious."

     
    iConsciousness
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    Posted: Aug. 14, 2023 - 1:33 AM ET #45

    After 1 full week of pre-season play, what is everyone's thoughts?

    These thoughts should constantly evolve throughout the preseason, but in my opinion depth is going to play an important role for each team moving forward. I'm getting a glimpse of this with a few teams.

    The Jets defense are going to be for real this year. If Aaron Rodgers, Nathaniel Hackett, and the offense hold up their bargain, the AFC East is going to be a real dogfight. Could we see 3 of the team in that division in the AFC playoffs?

    Reply

    After 1 full week of pre-season play, what is everyone's thoughts?

    These thoughts should constantly evolve throughout the preseason, but in my opinion depth is going to play an important role for each team moving forward. I'm getting a glimpse of this with a few teams.

    The Jets defense are going to be for real this year. If Aaron Rodgers, Nathaniel Hackett, and the offense hold up their bargain, the AFC East is going to be a real dogfight. Could we see 3 of the team in that division in the AFC playoffs?

     
    undermysac
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    Posted: Aug. 14, 2023 - 7:24 AM ET #46

    Got to watch a few games, not all of them.

    Trey Lance looked awful. Threw 2 interceptable balls that won't show up on the stat sheet. One turned into the luckiest of td's.

    The Bears had 8 sacks and both starting DE's didn't play. 

    The kid from Purdue who plays for the Raiders(O'Connell) looked sharp. Will he be Jimmy G's backup?

    The Panthers look to be in a world of trouble but play in the worst division in the nfl.

    That's all I got

    Reply

    Got to watch a few games, not all of them.

    Trey Lance looked awful. Threw 2 interceptable balls that won't show up on the stat sheet. One turned into the luckiest of td's.

    The Bears had 8 sacks and both starting DE's didn't play. 

    The kid from Purdue who plays for the Raiders(O'Connell) looked sharp. Will he be Jimmy G's backup?

    The Panthers look to be in a world of trouble but play in the worst division in the nfl.

    That's all I got

     
    undermysac
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    Posted: Aug. 14, 2023 - 3:47 PM ET #47

    Zack Martin signs in Dallas

    Reply

    Zack Martin signs in Dallas

     
    OlDirtyBaztid
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    Posted: Aug. 14, 2023 - 4:11 PM ET #48

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness:

    @undermysac  I usually look up PFF or Sharp Football Analysis (Warren Sharp) for rankings such as these.

    i used to look the sharp football analysis. has he fallen off or is he charging or what now? he ditched the old website and the new one stinks

    No team is as good as it looks when winning nor are they as bad as they look when losing
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness:

    @undermysac  I usually look up PFF or Sharp Football Analysis (Warren Sharp) for rankings such as these.

    i used to look the sharp football analysis. has he fallen off or is he charging or what now? he ditched the old website and the new one stinks

     
    iConsciousness
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    Posted: Aug. 14, 2023 - 5:05 PM ET #49

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    Got to watch a few games, not all of them. Trey Lance looked awful. Threw 2 interceptable balls that won't show up on the stat sheet. One turned into the luckiest of td's. The Bears had 8 sacks and both starting DE's didn't play.  The kid from Purdue who plays for the Raiders(O'Connell) looked sharp. Will he be Jimmy G's backup? The Panthers look to be in a world of trouble but play in the worst division in the nfl. That's all I got


    Yep, the Bears D looked legit.

    I'm waiting for Lance to turn things around. At this pace, I might be growing my beard out wiating for that to happen.

    You're right about the Panthers.

    We both like the Patriots to a certain extent. Well, guess what? Per, Ian Rapoport:

     

    The Patriots are expected to sign former Cowboys star RB Ezekiel Elliott to a 1-year deal worth up to $6M after his successful FA visit earlier in camp. Some backfield help for NE and a new home for Zeke… who plans to rock his No. 15 from college.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by undermysac:

    Got to watch a few games, not all of them. Trey Lance looked awful. Threw 2 interceptable balls that won't show up on the stat sheet. One turned into the luckiest of td's. The Bears had 8 sacks and both starting DE's didn't play.  The kid from Purdue who plays for the Raiders(O'Connell) looked sharp. Will he be Jimmy G's backup? The Panthers look to be in a world of trouble but play in the worst division in the nfl. That's all I got


    Yep, the Bears D looked legit.

    I'm waiting for Lance to turn things around. At this pace, I might be growing my beard out wiating for that to happen.

    You're right about the Panthers.

    We both like the Patriots to a certain extent. Well, guess what? Per, Ian Rapoport:

     

    The Patriots are expected to sign former Cowboys star RB Ezekiel Elliott to a 1-year deal worth up to $6M after his successful FA visit earlier in camp. Some backfield help for NE and a new home for Zeke… who plans to rock his No. 15 from college.

     
     
    iConsciousness
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    Posted: Aug. 14, 2023 - 5:06 PM ET #50

    Quote Originally Posted by OlDirtyBaztid:

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness: @undermysac  I usually look up PFF or Sharp Football Analysis (Warren Sharp) for rankings such as these. i used to look the sharp football analysis. has he fallen off or is he charging or what now? he ditched the old website and the new one stinks


    I couldn't say, but I like some of his analysis that I've come across on X (Twitter). He does have a paid subscription aspect for what he does, but I don't even bother that. 

    I typically just follow a core group of football analysts and create a Twitter list so that I can bypass the cesspool of stuff and go straight to their tweets. 

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by OlDirtyBaztid:

    Quote Originally Posted by iConsciousness: @undermysac  I usually look up PFF or Sharp Football Analysis (Warren Sharp) for rankings such as these. i used to look the sharp football analysis. has he fallen off or is he charging or what now? he ditched the old website and the new one stinks


    I couldn't say, but I like some of his analysis that I've come across on X (Twitter). He does have a paid subscription aspect for what he does, but I don't even bother that. 

    I typically just follow a core group of football analysts and create a Twitter list so that I can bypass the cesspool of stuff and go straight to their tweets. 

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