Posted:
#26
Welcome back
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Copa America Thread....
Posted:
#32
Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:
Honestly, I see things 180 degrees the other way.
I saw an uninspired, tactical disgrace. I heard what some of the announcers - and what Klinsman said afterwards - but I totally disagree. It wasnt just "two set pieces that made the difference" for me.
Everyone seems to forget that the reason the USA had possession for stretches of the game is because Colombia allowed them to. It wasn't dangerous possession for the USA - it was a lot of useless possession. The game has changed in the last 10 years - since Spain and Barca play the way they do - the counterattack has become a strategy instead of the only option available to some teams. Colombia chooses to play this way. So it was Colombia who dictated the whole game and allowed the US possession - because it was harmless - and when you are up 2-0 - you can sit back and watch the clock tick as your opponent fumbles around with as much possession late in the game as they want.
Some of the most disturbing passages of play for me were the times that Colombia did choose to possess the ball - and just sat back and had passing drills with their center backs WITH ZERO PRESSURE from the US attack. At one point (around the 60 minute mark), I think Colombia strung together like 30 passes or so - just bouncing it around their backfield - with absolutely nothing from a team that was down 2-0 at the time.
The high press will win this tournament. It is the strategy du jour in football - and until teams adjust (which they haven't) - it is what will likely win these tournaments. It is also particularly hard to play against a high press in these international tournaments because there is such a short amount of time to organize and get to know your teammates. So why didnt the USA press last night? You can bet your a*s that Colombia - if they didnt score 8 minutes in to the game - would have terrorized the USA defensive line with a high press - BUT THEY DIDNT HAVE TO.
If the game was 0-0, you would have seen a whole different Colombia strategy. But at 2-0 - you saw nothing from the US in terms of strategy - it was almost like they were OK with losing 2-0. Klinsman waited for the 60th minute (or so) to make any changes - and they were largely ineffective.
Saying the USA played even is almost the American Football equivalent of a team that goes up 28-0 and then coasts to a 42-14 win. Did they really play even for most of the game or did the team in the lead always have control?
I will be looking for teams that actively high press and counterattack to bet on in both tournaments - especially early. I watched Chile do this against Mexico the other day - and for 65 minutes of the game Mexico looked helpless (mexico won 1-0 on a late goal for what I felt was a very lucky result).
For the first time - I feel like Klinsman needs to go. We arent making progress. He is a tinkerer - and we have players who need to get consistent experience. But most of all - he has no plan B. When things go sideways - the best managers adjust - he doesnt. And his idiotic comments in the press dont help with confidence that he actually knows what he is doing.
Van, Nice feedback.. You are truly one of the few guys that will dissect things down to this level, and enjoyed reading your feedback.
Honestly , I didn't expect much from the U.S. team , particularly against a Colombian side that includes the likes of James Rodriguez... But they had their chances regardless with the set pieces. This cannot be discounted.
Perhaps most importantly, a team that scores both their goals from set pieces should not inspire confidence !
Next game will be interesting. USA goes against a Costa Rica side that has perhaps the best goalie in the world in Keylor Navas... Having watched many of their games this year, he was absolutely lights out as goalie for Real Madrid this year. But don't take my word for it....
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Posted:
#36
Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:
MAJOR STORM SITTING OVER ORLANDO.
MAJOR STORM SITTING OVER ORLANDO.
Be careful what you bet in Bolivia / Panama game.
I am not going to bet the over as originally planned.
Van, with all due respect, you know this is not possible. It is too late to NOT bet it. It was bet more than 24 hours ago. We can bet the Under 2 at -170, but to not bet the game is not an option.
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Posted:
#37
Good analysis on the US match from Friday. They look soft, and extremely unintimidating. Just timid and not at all cohesive is the best way I can describe it from what I saw. Granted, Colombia is in a tier above the US (at least one tier) in terms of quality. I can see the US stepping up and finishing draw/win to possibly advance and then get bounced in the 1st knockout round.
The more things change..........the more they stay the same.
I also agree the commentating is awful. But it's Fox, so I don't expect much. At least it's not Gus Johnson! Unless Gus is calling matches that I haven't watched yet. Please tell me he isn't.
BOL.........
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Posted:
#38
Quote Originally Posted by HighwayToHell:
Van, with all due respect, you know this is not possible. It is too late to NOT bet it. It was bet more than 24 hours ago. We can bet the Under 2 at -170, but to not bet the game is not an option.
I will count it against my record here.
But in real life - I didnt bet it yet.
Just ignore the above and consider it a bet.
Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
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Posted:
#39
Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:
I will count it against my record here.
But in real life - I didnt bet it yet.
Just ignore the above and consider it a bet.
And of course... There is a goal. I cant win.
Whatever happens is OK with me - if it goes over I wont count it - if it goes under I will.
I was trying to save people from possibly betting the over on this because of the weather - and of course - the weather is OK (for now) and there is a goal.
No monkey business intended.
Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
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Posted:
#41
While I am trying to ignore the game that I got scared off because of bad weather which turned out to be good weather, and an over that already has a goal and looks like more.....
9. USA plays Costa Rica on Tuesday night. I really cannot imagine a more must win game for the USA - for the coach, for the tournament on home soil, for every reason you can think of.
I think CR will sit back and play defensive - hope to keep a clean sheet - and go in to their game with Colombia with a chance to advance. Can the US break down a side that will most certainly play 5 at the back and a lot of times 9 behind the ball? That remains to be seen because my real worry with this game is the constant lack of a true playmaker on the US side.
Michael Bradley turns it over way too much, but plays well on defense. This game won't need defense - which is why I would drop back Jermaine Jones to that defensive midfield spot and put Nagbe in, and drop Dempsey back to midfield and play Zardes and Wondolowski in a true 4-4-2. Dempsey is lost in the striker role - or even a "false 9" as they like to call it. Load the midfield with playmakers - because CR is likely to pack it in in the back - and Michael Bradley just isn't going to break that down. There has to be multiple playmakers in the midfield that can feed true strikers.
I just cannot see the US losing this game. Over 90 minutes - with everything on the line - there has to be US goal(s). I am a little bit concerned that they just don't want to play for Klinsman - and like we have seen many times before in intl soccer - they just give up - but at home? The US just doesn't seem to have that mentality anyway.
Big bet for me. I hope Klinsman does the right thing.
USA -117 for 4 units
10. Colombia -106? Really? Am I the biggest square around? I cannot resist. I can't see how Paraguay could ever score, and I think Colombia has multiple goals in them against anyone. With our without Rodrguez - gimme this short line.
Colombia -106 for 3 units
11. Haiti won't be able to contain a Brazil side in a must win situation.
Brazil -2 -105 for 1.5 units
12. I love what Ecuador did the other night against Brazil - a dark horse to win the whole thing. Peru gets blasted here.
Ecuador -116 for 2.5 units
I realize I have 4 favs listed there. I realize that looks totally square. I get it. But I think all 4 have their own unique reasons - but also one similarity - the way this tournament has lined up so far is that the two favs in these groups have played each other while the two teams that shouldn't advance also played each other. I just think this made them seem more equal than they really are - and the betting line is indicative of this.
We will see....
GL all
Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
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Posted:
#42
And some rear view mirror thoughts....
Jamaica was the right side yesterday - and given the chance - I would bet them again. Bad result, and bad circumstances and fortune.
Not so much with Uruguay- although I don't think the disparity was as wide as the media would lead you to believe. I think Mexico will be overpriced from here on out - doesnt mean they wont keep winning - but you will pay for the privilege of betting them.
Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
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Posted:
#43
Quote Originally Posted by bk1374:
Good analysis on the US match from Friday. They look soft, and extremely unintimidating. Just timid and not at all cohesive is the best way I can describe it from what I saw. Granted, Colombia is in a tier above the US (at least one tier) in terms of quality. I can see the US stepping up and finishing draw/win to possibly advance and then get bounced in the 1st knockout round.
Good analysis on the US match from Friday. They look soft, and extremely unintimidating. Just timid and not at all cohesive is the best way I can describe it from what I saw. Granted, Colombia is in a tier above the US (at least one tier) in terms of quality. I can see the US stepping up and finishing draw/win to possibly advance and then get bounced in the 1st knockout round.
The more things change..........the more they stay the same.
I also agree the commentating is awful. But it's Fox, so I don't expect much. At least it's not Gus Johnson! Unless Gus is calling matches that I haven't watched yet. Please tell me he isn't.
BOL.........
Some of these matches I dream about having Gus back.
Tonight at least they have Wynalda doing it from the studio (not at the game). He is much better than what has been put out there.
WTF is this Dr Joe character? Can he and Mike Carey (NFL CBS ref analyst) be the same person? Absolutely zero insight while the match is being played and important stuff is going on - they are talking about the play from 10 minutes ago or how the USA is affected by a draw.
I can't stand it. Spanish TV here on out for me.
Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
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Posted:
#44
Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:
Some of these matches I dream about having Gus back.
Tonight at least they have Wynalda doing it from the studio (not at the game). He is much better than what has been put out there.
WTF is this Dr Joe character? Can he and Mike Carey (NFL CBS ref analyst) be the same person? Absolutely zero insight while the match is being played and important stuff is going on - they are talking about the play from 10 minutes ago or how the USA is affected by a draw.
I can't stand it. Spanish TV here on out for me.
This match is being announced like a baseball game that is 0-0 going into the 9th. Can they pretend to enjoy it? At least Gus would be yelling even where it didn't make sense to. I would watch the FS Deportes if it was on even though I understand very little spanish because it would be a lot better than this.
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Posted:
#45
Quote Originally Posted by matt12:
This match is being announced like a baseball game that is 0-0 going into the 9th. Can they pretend to enjoy it? At least Gus would be yelling even where it didn't make sense to. I would watch the FS Deportes if it was on even though I understand very little spanish because it would be a lot better than this.
Imagine if when watching the BPL on NBCSN the British announcing team - during Chelsea Arsenal said "Lets go to Fred back in the studio to explain the difference between a red card and a yellow card"
It is absurd to insult American viewers the way Fox does.
Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
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Posted:
#50
Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:
Some of these matches I dream about having Gus back.
Not me. He's the worst. One of the worst NCAA football announcers I've heard in years. Loves to scream names and hates telling you what is going on. In soccer, he just yells names, that's it. I get having someone with some excitement is good, but he doesn't know a free kick from a free throw when it comes to gauging his voice fluctuations.
Good luck on USA tonight. I am on other side.
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