Posted:
#101
Quote Originally Posted by be easy:
Whatever happened to, innocent until proven guilty?
Whatever happened to, innocent until proven guilty?
media brainwashing
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Prosecutor denies interfering in Florida shooting case
Posted:
#102
Quote Originally Posted by be easy:
Whatever happened to, innocent until proven guilty?
Whatever happened to, innocent until proven guilty?
Nothing - but the killing was done, you have a dead body & a guy who admits doing the killing. The only thing that stops it from being outright murder or manslaughter is Z's claim that it was self defense. And all you have is Z's word for it (the guy who could spend yrs behind bars) & nothing else other than a couple injuries which prove nothing.
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Posted:
#103
Quote Originally Posted by cashin:
Nothing - but the killing was done, you have a dead body & a guy who admits doing the killing. The only thing that stops it from being outright murder or manslaughter is Z's claim that it was self defense. And all you have is Z's word for it (the guy who could spend yrs behind bars) & nothing else other than a couple injuries which prove nothing.
And simple things like injuries that corroborate his story and the fact there is not enough evidence to contradict his story means nothing to you.
Common sense man.
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Posted:
#105
Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:
Its kind of interesting that you haven't refuted any of your fellow righties who have denegrated Martin because he was caught with marijuana.
Hmmm.....wonder why that is. 
Caught with womens jewelery too...oh and a burglary tool.
More effort towards honesty please. Thanks in advance pumkin.
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Posted:
#106
Quote Originally Posted by SarasotaSlim:
Cashin,
You do know that one of the experts that is claiming voice recognition is Ed Primeau he doesn't believe in the other expert Tom Owens Biomettics Analysis..,
Ed simply listened to the recording .Then decided the noises for helps were Trayvon Martins,because of the tone of the voice.. he is saying the voice is a dead give away ..."That's a young man screaming"s ...
Zimmermans brother who was on TV had a soft spoken high pitched voice ( like Mikael or Jamaine Jackson ) and he said George's voice sounded like his ...Trayvon wasn't a little boy 6" plus hisvoice could have sounded like a grown man.. Primeau doesn't know what Trayvon voice sounded like ..
..and Tom Owens's biometric software he used to compare Zimmermans voice ...is one he invented and developed less than a month ago ..Easy Voice Biometrics and he selling it on a website for a $4,995 license fee....sounds like a conflict of interest..to promote his product...imo
Funny, the last I heard they were both in total agreement that the voice screaming was not Zimmerman's with almost scientific certainty. It was only that Owen couldn't say for certain that it was Martin's because he had no copy of his voice at the time while Primeau went ahead & said he believed it was Martin's voice. Has something changed?
What I've read about Tom Owen is that he's an internationally known & respected forensic expert & also the chairman ot the American Board of Recorded Evidence & of the Audio Engineering Society's Group on forensic audio. And that he worked for 11 yrs at the Lincoln Center Archives as the chief engineer. How is this a conflict & wouldn't that indicate he not only has a strong personal reputation to uphold as a voice expert, but also the credibility of his company & product/s?
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Posted:
#107
Quote Originally Posted by cashin:
Funny, the last I heard they were both in total agreement that the voice screaming was not Zimmerman's with almost scientific certainty. It was only that Owen couldn't say for certain that it was Martin's because he had no copy of his voice at the time while Primeau went ahead & said he believed it was Martin's voice. Has something changed?
What I've read about Tom Owen is that he's an internationally known & respected forensic expert & also the chairman ot the American Board of Recorded Evidence & of the Audio Engineering Society's Group on forensic audio. And that he worked for 11 yrs at the Lincoln Center Archives as the chief engineer. How is this a conflict & wouldn't that indicate he not only has a strong personal reputation to uphold as a voice expert, but also the credibility of his company & product/s?
Common sense factor:
Why would Trayvon in theory be screaming if he:
A. Didn't have a broken nose.
B. Didn't have his head slamming the sidewalk repeatedly.
C. If Zimmerman had blood on his face and stunned by sucker punch, how is he gonna put Trayvon in a position where he felt he needed to scream for his life?
D. Since Zimmerman did have blood on his face, back of his head, he would be the logical choice to have been screaming no?
E. When cops showed up one cop overheard Zimmerman explaining that he was upset that he was yelling for help and no one would come help him. Zimmerman had no idea that the 13 year old boy would corroborate that claim later in the investigation.
Common sense man.
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Posted:
#108
Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:
Common sense factor:
Why would Trayvon in theory be screaming if he:
A. Didn't have a broken nose.
B. Didn't have his head slamming the sidewalk repeatedly.
C. If Zimmerman had blood on his face and stunned by sucker punch, how is he gonna put Trayvon in a position where he felt he needed to scream for his life?
D. Since Zimmerman did have blood on his face, back of his head, he would be the logical choice to have been screaming no?
E. When cops showed up one cop overheard Zimmerman explaining that he was upset that he was yelling for help and no one would come help him. Zimmerman had no idea that the 13 year old boy would corroborate that claim later in the investigation.
Common sense man.
Conjecture.
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Posted:
#110
Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:
Would you like me to find all of your liberal buddies posts that have a higher percentage of conjecture that you mysteriously failed to recognize? I can!
You mean where I said I didn't believe there was any conspiracy and was waiting on more information to pass judgement?
Please do.
I just find it fascinating that you KNOW what happened, when the reality is that only two people KNOW what happened. One is dead.
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Posted:
#111
Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:
Common sense factor:
Why would Trayvon in theory be screaming if he:
A. Didn't have a broken nose.
B. Didn't have his head slamming the sidewalk repeatedly.
C. If Zimmerman had blood on his face and stunned by sucker punch, how is he gonna put Trayvon in a position where he felt he needed to scream for his life?
D. Since Zimmerman did have blood on his face, back of his head, he would be the logical choice to have been screaming no?
E. When cops showed up one cop overheard Zimmerman explaining that he was upset that he was yelling for help and no one would come help him. Zimmerman had no idea that the 13 year old boy would corroborate that claim later in the investigation.
Common sense man.
Nothing in police report or funeral parlor indicated Trayvon had been in a fight. So we can safely say that A and B are True.
C.Corroborated on police report.
D. Corroborated on police report.
E. Corroborated on police report.
This is asking a theoretical question and therefore is not conjecture after all.
Nice try.
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Posted:
#114
Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:
Its kind of interesting that you haven't refuted any of your fellow righties who have denegrated Martin because he was caught with marijuana.
Hmmm.....wonder why that is.
please don't ever assume that my absence of criticism is akin to support
my time is limited, and besides, i wouldn't want to step on your toes for telling the righties when they are wrong
i have tried my best to stay out of these threads altogether, because i don't even know anything surrounding the story. I'm a busy person and the last thing i want to do with my free time is waste it arguing in circles
Twinks open up the season at my Birds tomm at 3pm, thinking of heading down to watch,,,,want to make a personal agerway
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Posted:
#115
djbrow, that being said, i'm I ok with everyone here assuming that i wish nothing but bad things upon any asshole that speaks ill towards someone for consuming marijuana,,,,,it's likely that those same assholes regularly consume sugar 
pot prohibitionists are by definition, bad Americans
pot prohibitionists are by definition, bad Americans
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Posted:
#117
Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:
You mean where I said I didn't believe there was any conspiracy and was waiting on more information to pass judgement?
Please do.
I just find it fascinating that you KNOW what happened, when the reality is that only two people KNOW what happened. One is dead.
The following posts have much conjecture yet went unchecked by djbrow for the record:
Post #/#'s 73,69,66,64,61,59,26,32,33 and 20
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Posted:
#119
Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:
Common sense factor:
Why would Trayvon in theory be screaming if he:
A. Didn't have a broken nose.
B. Didn't have his head slamming the sidewalk repeatedly.
C. If Zimmerman had blood on his face and stunned by sucker punch, how is he gonna put Trayvon in a position where he felt he needed to scream for his life?
D. Since Zimmerman did have blood on his face, back of his head, he would be the logical choice to have been screaming no?
E. When cops showed up one cop overheard Zimmerman explaining that he was upset that he was yelling for help and no one would come help him. Zimmerman had no idea that the 13 year old boy would corroborate that claim later in the investigation.
Common sense man.
He was screaming because at that point in time Zimmerman was in control whether he had already pulled his gun or not. And with the rolling & fighting Martin easily could have seen Z's gun.There are so many obvious holes in Z's story, I don't have the time to again go into it. Why don't you read up on all the accounts of the below & put the lies together for yourself? And if it was true & righteous self defense, then why the lies?
911 call
call with gf right before Z confronted him
where the body was found in relation to M's dad's place & Z's car
timing & time elapsed of when Z says M was running & then all of a sudden he lost him & is returning to car
position of M's body after shooting & implausibility of Z being able to get his gun & shoot him while supposedly being on the bottom gettin his head pounded against concrete.
voice experts
Could go on & on (their size/weight, force it takes to actually knock someone over flat on their back - most folks fall forward, etc) but that's more than enough to show this is a fabricated story by Z.
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Posted:
#121
A bunch of people on here have already agreed the likelihood of someone screaming when gun is on them.
Z didn't say anything about a call T had with his girl. No lie there.
Z said he had been punched in nose and had his head pounded in pavement. No lie there based on lacerations seen in police video (enhanced)
Said he was screaming for help, based on lacerations on back of head he was on the bottom where 13 year old boy said the screamer was which trumps audio dumbasses.
Since when does a person fall forward when punched in nose? Fall backwards is more believeable and physics agree.
I don't know about how far the fight was from his car or Trayvons dad's house. It doesn't matter where the fucking fight was if Trayvon threw the first punch and followed with head banging.
Your theory that if he was lying about whether or not he was following T then he was lying about everything else is ignorant, stupid, not well thought out, dumb, assinine, moneysrh, and just plain wrong.
Even if he was following him and lied about it to the fucking dispatcher doesn't mean that he started a physical fight.
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Posted:
#122
Quote Originally Posted by 14daroad:
Another sad thing about this whole incident is it appears we will never know the truth. CYA has officially begun.
So many questions.
Did the police have Martin's cell phone?
Why didn't Martin's dad notice all the police cars/commotion outside (or were they gone by the time he returned home)?
Is there a video of Martin in a 7-11 prior to the incident?
Was Zimmerman returning home or on his way to the store?
Holy Shit, you got barred for kickin the know-it-alls ass in a debate.!
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Posted:
#123
Quote Originally Posted by bowlslit:
A bunch of people on here have already agreed the likelihood of someone screaming when gun is on them.
Z didn't say anything about a call T had with his girl. No lie there.
Z said he had been punched in nose and had his head pounded in pavement. No lie there based on lacerations seen in police video (enhanced)
Said he was screaming for help, based on lacerations on back of head he was on the bottom where 13 year old boy said the screamer was which trumps audio dumbasses.
Since when does a person fall forward when punched in nose? Fall backwards is more believeable and physics agree.
I don't know about how far the fight was from his car or Trayvons dad's house. It doesn't matter where the fucking fight was if Trayvon threw the first punch and followed with head banging.
Your theory that if he was lying about whether or not he was following T then he was lying about everything else is ignorant, stupid, not well thought out, dumb, assinine, moneysrh, and just plain wrong.
Even if he was following him and lied about it to the fucking dispatcher doesn't mean that he started a physical fight.
Sounds like you need to go back & look at everything Z said to the police & then try to logically see if it makes sense to you based on all that's known including the gf's account of the conversation with Martin. If it doesn't, doesn't 1 have to ask why he would have lied?
Truth here is Z only has 3 things here that that could work in his favor & even they show & prove nothing. The police report on the nose & back of his head & the witness that says they saw him at the bottom at 1 point in the fight with Martin hitting him. Absolutely everything else works against him from beginning to end & if the screaming voice is matched without a doubt to Martin, pretty much game over.
So much talk of Z having his head banged into the concrete - did anyone even witness that? How do we know he didn't just hit his head on the sidewalk after falling &/or during the fight? If you can't believe practically all of the key elements in Z's account (& noone folowing any logic/common sense could), how can anyone believe him about the fight & shooting? You can't -
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Posted:
#124
Trayvons girl said he was being followed and a little scared and she told him to run and he said he wasn't going to...she then heard the two ask each other a question and then scuffling before the call dropped. What am I missing?
If you show a video to 10 people and then ask each one to write down what they saw you will likely get 8 or 9 different accounts of the same video.
If Zimmerman simply made a mistake or two regarding a detail that doesn't amount to lying but would indeed be reasonable.
If he lied or made a mistake about where the fighting took place or if he was following or not it really doesn't matter.
He could have saved the whole thing if he backed off. Would a reasonable person have backed off? Not necessarily, especially if alot of burglars have been getting away in the past.
It still doesn't matter if he backed off or not. He has every right to question a strangers activities in his neighborhood. As long as thats all he did is question Trayvon he has no reason to regret anything he did. There is no evidence to suggest he did anything to the contrary so WE MUST give him the benefit of the doubt.
What are you saying exactly that he lied about?
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