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    All Forums | NBA Betting Forum

    BUCKS @ RAPTORS: GAME 5!!!! You can only ugly up a game so much before the hammer comes down on you!

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    RandySee
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 9:21 PM ET #76

    Quote Originally Posted by scalabrine:

    Record: 22-25

    The pick:

    Bucks +6 over Raptors

    The Bucks will not only play this game extremely close, they have a great shot at winning it.

    That makes +6 a MONSTER SPREAD and far too much for this Raptors team to be giving up at this point in the series.

    So why are they giving it up? Because the books can't help but make standard adjustments from road to home. In this case that is 8.5 points off the closing line of Bucks -2.5 in Game 4. But there is so much more internally going on here that points to a Bucks cover, if not an outright win.

    1. Playing ugly

    Did you watch Game 4? What a shi*fest of below average basketball. You always have to worry about these afternoon starts (2pm in Milwaukee) and how teams can come out flat after playing virtually the entire season at 7 and 7:30.

    And came out flat they did. The Raps shot 41% and 22% from three. The Bucks shot 37% and 23% from 3.

    This is just the way the Raps like it. Lowry and Derozan have two of the lowest shooting percentages in the playoffs given the number of games they've played in (under 40%). This is even more alarming given these are really the primary (and at times only) scoring options for the Raps. So when they are off, the team implodes, as was exhibited last game in the Bucks blowout by 27.

    So what was the difference in the final score? Free throws and Jonas Valanciunis who was 5-5 from the floor with 12 points.

    As the game progressed the Raps played it just the way they like it: Close to the vest and try pull away late. They were successful in doing so. This doesn't work often, particularly in playoff series when teams make adjustments from game to game.

    The Bucks came out flat as did Giannis, and worse, he went completely cold in the 4th quarter. The Raps with Derozan and Lowry and suddenly revived a Valanciunis circa 2014 when he was decent and starting and they had enough to make the box score seem convincing for the this spread.

    2. Alarming problems for the Raps going forward and advantages for the Bucks

    A) Derozan was coming off a 0-8 game. History has dictated Derozan bounces back huge the next game, particularly in the playoffs. This will not happen two games in a row, that is, him going for 33 and accounting for more than 1/3 of the entire offense. That is not sustainable.

    That means the weight shifts back to Lowry. I simply don't see the killer instinct in anymore, nor do I see the consistency. He had a dud the first game with 4 points and an underwhelming 13 points in the 27 point blowout. Most of Lowry's offense here came on the back of Derozan (i.e., if Derozan isn't playing a high level, we simply can't depend on Lowry to here).

    B) Ibaka was absolutely dreadful for the second game in a row.

    NO shooting touch whatsoever. Perhaps this had something to do with him taking an elbow to the face early in the game. Over two games now he's 7-24 for 16 pts and only 2 FT's. That's a liability if there isn't a big bounceback in Game 5. He seems out of sorts in this offense, particularly when Derozan starts to ISO.

    C) Snell is getting whatever he wants from 3.

    The Bucks simply can't guard him on the perimeter. The spacing is obscene when he shoots the ball where there isn't a defender within 3 to 5 feet. 5-10 from three this game and 13-26 for the series. If the Bucks need a big shot, he will give it to them and he'll likely be open.

    D) The Bucks length

    It's brutally obvious and something the Raps have struggled with the entire series. On the defensive end the Bucks are blocking more shots (particularly key ones) and contesting far more, disrupting drives and making the Raps force shots. On the offensive end, when needed the offensive rebounding is prevalent.

    During one sequence at the 8 minute mark in the fourth, the Bucks got SIX offensive rebounds on one possession before scoring. Monroe, Giannis, and Maker are overpowering the Raps defensively/blocking shots, and grabbing loose balls, and intercepting passes as well in O-rebounding.

    This will continue.

    What's the end result, a TIGHT game where the Raps have demonstrated they don't respond in kind to their fans passion (as noted, 0-9 in the first game in the first round, which typically has been at home in recent years).

     Kidd, for whatever lack of respect he has around the league, is a great coach for the Bucks. He has the NBA pedigree as one of the great PG's to have played the game and knows how to relate to the younger players, particularly Giannis. You can see how he let's Giannis, Maker and Brogdon have the freedom to play their games. That matters in this league.

    Casey? Well he's been in this spot before and the results have been unspectacular. If not for a Lowry jumper with 8 seconds in Game 2, contested by Brogdon, the Bucks could have swept the first two, I wouldn't want to give out a single point with the Raps in this spot so I'll take every one.

    We don't have to win here, just hope the Raps continue to ugly it up (which the Bucks can pull away from) and use the full strength of the six in a close one or at best, an upset.

    And what's the wildcard?

    3. The Refs

    They called ticky-tack fouls on the Bucks in the 4th ensuring this series got tied up.

    But from an Adam Silver conspiratorial perspective, the Bucks are simply the better story and more interesting to the average fan with the rise of Giannis (and some of Maker) and Kidd as a chess piece. The Raps have been here done that and this is becoming old hat to the fan and the league. So if there is a wink and a nod from Silver, it would be having the refs give a favorable call or two more to the Bucks when it counts. It's conjecture and we don't cap on this but it is a theme that can play itself out to get us a cover. 


    I noticed you talked a lot more in this thread compared to the others
    Is this reverse jinx? You actually wagered on Toronto ?
    Anyway 
    Toronto to win the whole series
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    Quote Originally Posted by scalabrine:

    Record: 22-25

    The pick:

    Bucks +6 over Raptors

    The Bucks will not only play this game extremely close, they have a great shot at winning it.

    That makes +6 a MONSTER SPREAD and far too much for this Raptors team to be giving up at this point in the series.

    So why are they giving it up? Because the books can't help but make standard adjustments from road to home. In this case that is 8.5 points off the closing line of Bucks -2.5 in Game 4. But there is so much more internally going on here that points to a Bucks cover, if not an outright win.

    1. Playing ugly

    Did you watch Game 4? What a shi*fest of below average basketball. You always have to worry about these afternoon starts (2pm in Milwaukee) and how teams can come out flat after playing virtually the entire season at 7 and 7:30.

    And came out flat they did. The Raps shot 41% and 22% from three. The Bucks shot 37% and 23% from 3.

    This is just the way the Raps like it. Lowry and Derozan have two of the lowest shooting percentages in the playoffs given the number of games they've played in (under 40%). This is even more alarming given these are really the primary (and at times only) scoring options for the Raps. So when they are off, the team implodes, as was exhibited last game in the Bucks blowout by 27.

    So what was the difference in the final score? Free throws and Jonas Valanciunis who was 5-5 from the floor with 12 points.

    As the game progressed the Raps played it just the way they like it: Close to the vest and try pull away late. They were successful in doing so. This doesn't work often, particularly in playoff series when teams make adjustments from game to game.

    The Bucks came out flat as did Giannis, and worse, he went completely cold in the 4th quarter. The Raps with Derozan and Lowry and suddenly revived a Valanciunis circa 2014 when he was decent and starting and they had enough to make the box score seem convincing for the this spread.

    2. Alarming problems for the Raps going forward and advantages for the Bucks

    A) Derozan was coming off a 0-8 game. History has dictated Derozan bounces back huge the next game, particularly in the playoffs. This will not happen two games in a row, that is, him going for 33 and accounting for more than 1/3 of the entire offense. That is not sustainable.

    That means the weight shifts back to Lowry. I simply don't see the killer instinct in anymore, nor do I see the consistency. He had a dud the first game with 4 points and an underwhelming 13 points in the 27 point blowout. Most of Lowry's offense here came on the back of Derozan (i.e., if Derozan isn't playing a high level, we simply can't depend on Lowry to here).

    B) Ibaka was absolutely dreadful for the second game in a row.

    NO shooting touch whatsoever. Perhaps this had something to do with him taking an elbow to the face early in the game. Over two games now he's 7-24 for 16 pts and only 2 FT's. That's a liability if there isn't a big bounceback in Game 5. He seems out of sorts in this offense, particularly when Derozan starts to ISO.

    C) Snell is getting whatever he wants from 3.

    The Bucks simply can't guard him on the perimeter. The spacing is obscene when he shoots the ball where there isn't a defender within 3 to 5 feet. 5-10 from three this game and 13-26 for the series. If the Bucks need a big shot, he will give it to them and he'll likely be open.

    D) The Bucks length

    It's brutally obvious and something the Raps have struggled with the entire series. On the defensive end the Bucks are blocking more shots (particularly key ones) and contesting far more, disrupting drives and making the Raps force shots. On the offensive end, when needed the offensive rebounding is prevalent.

    During one sequence at the 8 minute mark in the fourth, the Bucks got SIX offensive rebounds on one possession before scoring. Monroe, Giannis, and Maker are overpowering the Raps defensively/blocking shots, and grabbing loose balls, and intercepting passes as well in O-rebounding.

    This will continue.

    What's the end result, a TIGHT game where the Raps have demonstrated they don't respond in kind to their fans passion (as noted, 0-9 in the first game in the first round, which typically has been at home in recent years).

     Kidd, for whatever lack of respect he has around the league, is a great coach for the Bucks. He has the NBA pedigree as one of the great PG's to have played the game and knows how to relate to the younger players, particularly Giannis. You can see how he let's Giannis, Maker and Brogdon have the freedom to play their games. That matters in this league.

    Casey? Well he's been in this spot before and the results have been unspectacular. If not for a Lowry jumper with 8 seconds in Game 2, contested by Brogdon, the Bucks could have swept the first two, I wouldn't want to give out a single point with the Raps in this spot so I'll take every one.

    We don't have to win here, just hope the Raps continue to ugly it up (which the Bucks can pull away from) and use the full strength of the six in a close one or at best, an upset.

    And what's the wildcard?

    3. The Refs

    They called ticky-tack fouls on the Bucks in the 4th ensuring this series got tied up.

    But from an Adam Silver conspiratorial perspective, the Bucks are simply the better story and more interesting to the average fan with the rise of Giannis (and some of Maker) and Kidd as a chess piece. The Raps have been here done that and this is becoming old hat to the fan and the league. So if there is a wink and a nod from Silver, it would be having the refs give a favorable call or two more to the Bucks when it counts. It's conjecture and we don't cap on this but it is a theme that can play itself out to get us a cover. 


    I noticed you talked a lot more in this thread compared to the others
    Is this reverse jinx? You actually wagered on Toronto ?
    Anyway 
    Toronto to win the whole series
     
    lucky808
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 9:21 PM ET #77

    Damm we know who the refs want win smh lol
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    Damm we know who the refs want win smh lol
     
    edvineantoine
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 9:29 PM ET #78

    Quote Originally Posted by lucky808:

    Damm we know who the refs want win smh lol


    LOL or the raps just were the better team in every single aspect of this game.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lucky808:

    Damm we know who the refs want win smh lol


    LOL or the raps just were the better team in every single aspect of this game.
     
    jrgumpert
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 9:30 PM ET #79

    They're going to win by 30 for Christ's sake. No competition tonight.

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    They're going to win by 30 for Christ's sake. No competition tonight.

     
    AnthonyStarks
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 9:32 PM ET #80

    I dont mean any disrespect at all. At least you put a lot of thought into it which is more than most people on here are capable of. And you take your medicine like a man. Get em next time
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    I dont mean any disrespect at all. At least you put a lot of thought into it which is more than most people on here are capable of. And you take your medicine like a man. Get em next time
     
    OwnedbyGreed
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 9:33 PM ET #81

    It was obvious when Ibaka hacked Giannis on the first dunk attempt with no call.
    Body contact, all over his arm, and not a finger on the ball.
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    It was obvious when Ibaka hacked Giannis on the first dunk attempt with no call.
    Body contact, all over his arm, and not a finger on the ball.
     
    budwiser
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 9:37 PM ET #82

    Quote Originally Posted by OwnedbyGreed:

    It was obvious when Ibaka hacked Giannis on the first dunk attempt with no call.
    Body contact, all over his arm, and not a finger on the ball.

    raptors beat the living he ll out of them


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    Quote Originally Posted by OwnedbyGreed:

    It was obvious when Ibaka hacked Giannis on the first dunk attempt with no call.
    Body contact, all over his arm, and not a finger on the ball.

    raptors beat the living he ll out of them


     
    davidgibson25
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 9:42 PM ET #83

    Well scalabrine all good man we lost to norman freaking powell so it dosent matter good call on to the next one hehe
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    Well scalabrine all good man we lost to norman freaking powell so it dosent matter good call on to the next one hehe
     
    OwnedbyGreed
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 9:46 PM ET #84

    When the Raptors are getting all of the calls, it is natural for the other team to lose motivation.
    Lowry was gifted 6 fts on bad calls.
    The commentator said it best.
    "Throw your arms into the defender, initiate contact, and get to the line".
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    When the Raptors are getting all of the calls, it is natural for the other team to lose motivation.
    Lowry was gifted 6 fts on bad calls.
    The commentator said it best.
    "Throw your arms into the defender, initiate contact, and get to the line".
     
    GTD
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 9:47 PM ET #85

    Quote Originally Posted by GTD:

    They ain't winning the series jack 

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    Quote Originally Posted by GTD:

    They ain't winning the series jack 

     
    Achilles1629
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 10:05 PM ET #86

    Quote Originally Posted by Achilles1629:

    So talk to me about the Greek. The 6 for 20 last game that nobody talks about it. We are instead reading threads about ibaka struggles which is mind boggling. Ibaka is their 3rd of 4th option where giannis is the bucks eveything. Bucks can't have that awful production from giannis going forward if they are to win let alone cover games. I have pointed this out a few times but take a look at this tonite. The Greek can't hit the outside shot consistently AND he can't drive left unless he spins back to his right. Watch this because it is glaring. Keep him out of the lane and he's not great. Raptors did that game three and it worked well. 

    As for the raps, with no consistent output from Val and ibaka, this series still being tied, no worries from bucks backers? You really think Val and ibaka don't show up going forward? What about tony snell? Will he give 20 every night? The fact that the bucks relied on this guy late was a joke at best. I'm a bulls guy and I saw his worth there; he's overshot the moon so far and I don't see it continuing. As for Middleton, he's good. Does he continue to play well? Not so sure. The raps can play defense especially at home and I expect this series from the raptors perspective to be more of a half court game of execution. Interested to see how the bucks handle this on the road without home court advantage. Going back to half court ball, Raps have the advantage there by far becuase we all know the bucks want to control the pace. Casey shouldn't and won't allow the bucks to run.


     Lastly, the pick and roll for the raptors and getting favorable matchups for Lowry and DeRozan will be huge going forward. Not so sure bucks can stop it and if giannis gets pulled out of the lane, ibaka and Val will rule down low. 6 points is a lot in a series like this but this business where the books have to make that line becuase of the home/away situations....that is absurd. The books make lines based off of perception of the public too. Can't deny that. Can the bucks cover is 6? Sure for reasons I listed above, I can see the raptors playing their most complete game tonite as a team. We will see. Again, I could be wrong here and if so, good stuff Scal. As we have seen, anything goes in these playoffs.

    Not sure what else to say with this. Raptors came to play. Scal, let's get that new winning streak started though. Good luck going forward amigo. 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Achilles1629:

    So talk to me about the Greek. The 6 for 20 last game that nobody talks about it. We are instead reading threads about ibaka struggles which is mind boggling. Ibaka is their 3rd of 4th option where giannis is the bucks eveything. Bucks can't have that awful production from giannis going forward if they are to win let alone cover games. I have pointed this out a few times but take a look at this tonite. The Greek can't hit the outside shot consistently AND he can't drive left unless he spins back to his right. Watch this because it is glaring. Keep him out of the lane and he's not great. Raptors did that game three and it worked well. 

    As for the raps, with no consistent output from Val and ibaka, this series still being tied, no worries from bucks backers? You really think Val and ibaka don't show up going forward? What about tony snell? Will he give 20 every night? The fact that the bucks relied on this guy late was a joke at best. I'm a bulls guy and I saw his worth there; he's overshot the moon so far and I don't see it continuing. As for Middleton, he's good. Does he continue to play well? Not so sure. The raps can play defense especially at home and I expect this series from the raptors perspective to be more of a half court game of execution. Interested to see how the bucks handle this on the road without home court advantage. Going back to half court ball, Raps have the advantage there by far becuase we all know the bucks want to control the pace. Casey shouldn't and won't allow the bucks to run.


     Lastly, the pick and roll for the raptors and getting favorable matchups for Lowry and DeRozan will be huge going forward. Not so sure bucks can stop it and if giannis gets pulled out of the lane, ibaka and Val will rule down low. 6 points is a lot in a series like this but this business where the books have to make that line becuase of the home/away situations....that is absurd. The books make lines based off of perception of the public too. Can't deny that. Can the bucks cover is 6? Sure for reasons I listed above, I can see the raptors playing their most complete game tonite as a team. We will see. Again, I could be wrong here and if so, good stuff Scal. As we have seen, anything goes in these playoffs.

    Not sure what else to say with this. Raptors came to play. Scal, let's get that new winning streak started though. Good luck going forward amigo. 
     
    Achilles1629
    Achilles1629
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 10:08 PM ET #87

    How many times did giannis score going left? And when he went left, how many times did he spin back to the right? Going forward, teams WILL stop that. He needs to really get a jumper like KAT or Anthony Davis. He's still a great player though. 
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    How many times did giannis score going left? And when he went left, how many times did he spin back to the right? Going forward, teams WILL stop that. He needs to really get a jumper like KAT or Anthony Davis. He's still a great player though. 
     
    BlueRaps
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 10:09 PM ET #88

    Scal just doesnt like Raps
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    Scal just doesnt like Raps
     
    Dallas1987
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 10:19 PM ET #89

    You'll get another chance at bucks +6 in Milwaukee no sweat
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    You'll get another chance at bucks +6 in Milwaukee no sweat
     
    scalabrine
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 10:33 PM ET #90

    Quote Originally Posted by Achilles1629:


    Not sure what else to say with this. Raptors came to play. Scal, let's get that new winning streak started though. Good luck going forward amigo. 

    It's a young team Achilles. Yes Giannis is mostly everything and he gave them everything. 30 on 12-19 shooting. So we got every we wanted from him.

    I can only commend the Raps for starting Powell these past two games. and he's turned into the 1/2 MVP. 

    There is no way the Bucks can win the series now with guys like that going for 25.

    Just got my doors blown off. Need to make better picks than this. Although I like getting blown out in a way because .5 pt losses F with your head.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Achilles1629:


    Not sure what else to say with this. Raptors came to play. Scal, let's get that new winning streak started though. Good luck going forward amigo. 

    It's a young team Achilles. Yes Giannis is mostly everything and he gave them everything. 30 on 12-19 shooting. So we got every we wanted from him.

    I can only commend the Raps for starting Powell these past two games. and he's turned into the 1/2 MVP. 

    There is no way the Bucks can win the series now with guys like that going for 25.

    Just got my doors blown off. Need to make better picks than this. Although I like getting blown out in a way because .5 pt losses F with your head.
     
    drifter44
    drifter44
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 11:10 PM ET #91

    You cost one hundred bucks man...your next pick better be a winner so I could double it up...or I am going to have to come after you...
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    You cost one hundred bucks man...your next pick better be a winner so I could double it up...or I am going to have to come after you...
     
    firesox
    firesox
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    Posted: Apr. 24, 2017 - 11:22 PM ET #92

    Lol classic scal.

    Stay arrogant so i know which ones to fade harder
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    Lol classic scal.

    Stay arrogant so i know which ones to fade harder
     
    PhillyBrown
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    Posted: Apr. 25, 2017 - 12:05 AM ET #93

    Well all I can say is you're definitely not the only one who couldn't believe the line was that high and got sucked in on +6. Was trying to convince Bucks backers all day, don't take the bait, listen to what the line is telling you.

    I think they take game 6 too, Bucks little run is over now they're limitations have been exposed.
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    Well all I can say is you're definitely not the only one who couldn't believe the line was that high and got sucked in on +6. Was trying to convince Bucks backers all day, don't take the bait, listen to what the line is telling you.

    I think they take game 6 too, Bucks little run is over now they're limitations have been exposed.
     
    scalabrine
    scalabrine
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    Posted: Apr. 25, 2017 - 12:14 AM ET #94

    Quote Originally Posted by PhillyBrown:

    Well all I can say is you're definitely not the only one who couldn't believe the line was that high and got sucked in on +6. Was trying to convince Bucks backers all day, don't take the bait, listen to what the line is telling you.

    I think they take game 6 too, Bucks little run is over now they're limitations have been exposed.

    It's insane in 2017, with all we know about capping to think a PLUS 6 DOG is a 'public favorite'.

    A plus 6 dog....the public is fading a -6 favorite. Alright.

    Insane. But to each his own.

    This is the risk you take betting on inexperience and youth. When you lose you fall hard. That's fine. I did. I just learn from it what I can and move onto the next game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PhillyBrown:

    Well all I can say is you're definitely not the only one who couldn't believe the line was that high and got sucked in on +6. Was trying to convince Bucks backers all day, don't take the bait, listen to what the line is telling you.

    I think they take game 6 too, Bucks little run is over now they're limitations have been exposed.

    It's insane in 2017, with all we know about capping to think a PLUS 6 DOG is a 'public favorite'.

    A plus 6 dog....the public is fading a -6 favorite. Alright.

    Insane. But to each his own.

    This is the risk you take betting on inexperience and youth. When you lose you fall hard. That's fine. I did. I just learn from it what I can and move onto the next game.

     
     
    bum
    bum
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    Posted: Apr. 25, 2017 - 1:09 AM ET #95

    let's celebrate the wins!

    5-0 run is impressive

    we learned from this game and it's time to move on to the next

    let's go Jazz!

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    let's celebrate the wins!

    5-0 run is impressive

    we learned from this game and it's time to move on to the next

    let's go Jazz!

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