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All Forums | NBA Betting Forum

An interesting coincidence regarding two famous NBA playoff choke jobs

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MrBator
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MrBator
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 7:46 AM ET #51

Quote Originally Posted by MDnightFlight:

MrBator,
 
I'm curious as to why you play at brick and mortars on the strip when you can get lower juice on matchbook? thanks.

 

 

On the Strip (yesterday) - Magic -2.5 -110

 

At Matchbook yesterday - Magic -2.5 -112

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Quote Originally Posted by MDnightFlight:

MrBator,
 
I'm curious as to why you play at brick and mortars on the strip when you can get lower juice on matchbook? thanks.

 

 

On the Strip (yesterday) - Magic -2.5 -110

 

At Matchbook yesterday - Magic -2.5 -112

 
MrBator
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 7:58 AM ET #52

Quote Originally Posted by Ice4Blood:

can't speak for Bator... but have you ever tried to "cashout" at a sportsbook in Vegas?  how long did it take for you to get the money?  how many forms of I.D. did you have to provide?  was there a service charge?  did the IRS have a record of your wager?  did the government ever freeze your winnings?

 

None of that is a problem as long as you don't accept more than $10,000 in cash in a single transaction.  The casinos are also required to try and keep track of what you're doing all over the casino floor, and then make you sign a form when you've exceeded $10,000 in cash transactions within a 24-hour period.  This is obviously difficult for a casino to do, but they have to try (due to burdensome federal regulations). 

Anyways, in the sportsbook, if you have a ticket (or combination of tickets) whose value exceeds $10,000, all you have to do to avoid being required to sign anything is to ask for an amount of chips that will bring the cash amount you're being paid to under $10,000.  For example, if you're cashing a $6,600 winning straight bet that is now worth $12,600, simply ask for $3,000 in chips.  They will pay you with three $1,000 sportsbook chips plus $9,600 in cash.  And they won't say a word.  They actually prefer you cashout in that manner because they'd obviously like to avoid the tedious paperwork themselves.  The funny thing is, they are not allowed to suggest that simple maneuver to customers who don't know any better.  That has to be frustrating for them. 

As for the chips, you do not have to wager with them again in order to redeem them.  You can simply return to the book later and cash them in at the betting window without placing a bet.  Now, if it's the same day, and the same supervisor is on duty, and he or she notices you, they might bother you for going over that $10,000 mark in daily cash transactions.  So, it's best to either wait until the next day, or simply have a friend walk up there and cash them in.  Or, you can take note of who the supervisor is at the time you cashed that big ticket and come back later to cash in your chips when he or she is on their lunch break or whatever.

 

Don't ya love Covers?  Free knowledge!

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Quote Originally Posted by Ice4Blood:

can't speak for Bator... but have you ever tried to "cashout" at a sportsbook in Vegas?  how long did it take for you to get the money?  how many forms of I.D. did you have to provide?  was there a service charge?  did the IRS have a record of your wager?  did the government ever freeze your winnings?

 

None of that is a problem as long as you don't accept more than $10,000 in cash in a single transaction.  The casinos are also required to try and keep track of what you're doing all over the casino floor, and then make you sign a form when you've exceeded $10,000 in cash transactions within a 24-hour period.  This is obviously difficult for a casino to do, but they have to try (due to burdensome federal regulations). 

Anyways, in the sportsbook, if you have a ticket (or combination of tickets) whose value exceeds $10,000, all you have to do to avoid being required to sign anything is to ask for an amount of chips that will bring the cash amount you're being paid to under $10,000.  For example, if you're cashing a $6,600 winning straight bet that is now worth $12,600, simply ask for $3,000 in chips.  They will pay you with three $1,000 sportsbook chips plus $9,600 in cash.  And they won't say a word.  They actually prefer you cashout in that manner because they'd obviously like to avoid the tedious paperwork themselves.  The funny thing is, they are not allowed to suggest that simple maneuver to customers who don't know any better.  That has to be frustrating for them. 

As for the chips, you do not have to wager with them again in order to redeem them.  You can simply return to the book later and cash them in at the betting window without placing a bet.  Now, if it's the same day, and the same supervisor is on duty, and he or she notices you, they might bother you for going over that $10,000 mark in daily cash transactions.  So, it's best to either wait until the next day, or simply have a friend walk up there and cash them in.  Or, you can take note of who the supervisor is at the time you cashed that big ticket and come back later to cash in your chips when he or she is on their lunch break or whatever.

 

Don't ya love Covers?  Free knowledge!

 
MrBator
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 8:01 AM ET #53

Quote Originally Posted by Ice4Blood:

can't speak for Bator... but have you ever tried to "cashout" at a sportsbook in Vegas?  how long did it take for you to get the money?  how many forms of I.D. did you have to provide?  was there a service charge?  did the IRS have a record of your wager?  did the government ever freeze your winnings?

 

 

A service charge?  Have you actually been to Las Vegas?  There is no service charge for cashing winning tickets, but don't give them any ideas!  They're desperate these days!

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Quote Originally Posted by Ice4Blood:

can't speak for Bator... but have you ever tried to "cashout" at a sportsbook in Vegas?  how long did it take for you to get the money?  how many forms of I.D. did you have to provide?  was there a service charge?  did the IRS have a record of your wager?  did the government ever freeze your winnings?

 

 

A service charge?  Have you actually been to Las Vegas?  There is no service charge for cashing winning tickets, but don't give them any ideas!  They're desperate these days!

 
MrBator
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 8:04 AM ET #54

Quote Originally Posted by Ice4Blood:

can't speak for Bator... but have you ever tried to "cashout" at a sportsbook in Vegas?  how long did it take for you to get the money?  how many forms of I.D. did you have to provide?  was there a service charge?  did the IRS have a record of your wager?  did the government ever freeze your winnings?

 

 

With a little knowledge such as what I provided above, the IRS never has to know that you bet on sports at all, never mind knowing how much you won.  It is a crime in my book to let the government rip you off by somehow forcing you to pay taxes on sports betting "winnings."  That should never happen.

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Quote Originally Posted by Ice4Blood:

can't speak for Bator... but have you ever tried to "cashout" at a sportsbook in Vegas?  how long did it take for you to get the money?  how many forms of I.D. did you have to provide?  was there a service charge?  did the IRS have a record of your wager?  did the government ever freeze your winnings?

 

 

With a little knowledge such as what I provided above, the IRS never has to know that you bet on sports at all, never mind knowing how much you won.  It is a crime in my book to let the government rip you off by somehow forcing you to pay taxes on sports betting "winnings."  That should never happen.

 
bob696969
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 10:09 AM ET #55

Quote Originally Posted by Borat38:

Quote Originally Posted by bob696969:

 

Probably a good idea to start with Rashard Lewis.  His contract is going to kill your cap space for years, especially when Howard signs his extention.  Orlando did really well considering they were playing 4 on 5 the whole game....

A guy making max money HAS TO BRING IT EVERY GAME... A max money guy is a franchise cornerstone..... lewis can't rebound in traffic, can't create his own shot off the dribble, does not play tough defense and can't take it to the hole..... he is a taller version of steve kerr.....

WHAT A HORRIBLE CONTRACT.  SHAME ON YOU OTIS SMITH!  They overpaid him for no reason.... there was not anyone else even bidding for him.....

[/Quote
bob696969, I agree with the orange highlighted part. Rashard is way overpaid; you could get two decent power forwards in the mold of KG from the Clippers or Warriors, or three if you take young blood from the draft.

You must've been kidding, though, when you said that Rashard can't rebound, can't take it to the hole, defend, or create his own shot. Lewis's career stat-- 19ppg, 6.2 rpg, 45.6% FG shooting, not to mention 41% three-pt FG. Those are All-Stars numbers, and precisely what made Lewis such a nightmare to guard for the Cavs' smaller defensive lineup. Aside from LeBron, who didn't have him as a defensive assignment, who among this year's playoff Celts or Cavs had the total package of size, speed and length in one package to guard him? None. That was why Orlando won handily over the much-touted Cavs.)

Those of you bashing Turkoglu and Rashard Lewis, think for a moment: Would Orlando even be in the Finals if you take out these two players from the Magic lineup? I thought so. Turk might be Choke-oglu when it matters, but scroll way back to the series with Philly and tell me how many clutch shots he has made thus far this year.

Lewis and Turk are both very skilled players. 

Lewis put up good numbers, but not max-money numbers.  Is it Lewis' fault he got max money? NO.  But he is not putting up max money numbers, and he has the responsibility to bear the burden of his contract when he signed it.... 

I did not say lewis can't rebound.... I said "rebound in traffic".... meaning he is capble of getting rebounds when his team does a good job of boxing out and the ball comes in his direction.... Lewis does not have the intensity or toughness to get tough, gritty rebounds.... Lewis' rebounding numbers are primarily because of the space and boxing out from howard....

Lamar odom is smothering Lewis.  Lewis can create his shot against cement shoed defenders like brian scalabrine or ben wallace or wally scissorback.... Against odom, if he does not have an open set shot, lewis is not shooting....

Lewis has looked like a floppy chicken the few times he has taken it to the hole in traffic against the lakers......... watch the games!

Lewis had very fine numbers in the regular season, when he was facing crappy defenses....but A max money guy is paid to win championships.... and championships are won with gritty rebounds against tough, lock-down defensive match-ups.....And very clearly, lewis is not capable of that......

SHAME ON YOU OTIS SMITH!!!

I stand by what i said....

 

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Quote Originally Posted by Borat38:

Quote Originally Posted by bob696969:

 

Probably a good idea to start with Rashard Lewis.  His contract is going to kill your cap space for years, especially when Howard signs his extention.  Orlando did really well considering they were playing 4 on 5 the whole game....

A guy making max money HAS TO BRING IT EVERY GAME... A max money guy is a franchise cornerstone..... lewis can't rebound in traffic, can't create his own shot off the dribble, does not play tough defense and can't take it to the hole..... he is a taller version of steve kerr.....

WHAT A HORRIBLE CONTRACT.  SHAME ON YOU OTIS SMITH!  They overpaid him for no reason.... there was not anyone else even bidding for him.....

[/Quote
bob696969, I agree with the orange highlighted part. Rashard is way overpaid; you could get two decent power forwards in the mold of KG from the Clippers or Warriors, or three if you take young blood from the draft.

You must've been kidding, though, when you said that Rashard can't rebound, can't take it to the hole, defend, or create his own shot. Lewis's career stat-- 19ppg, 6.2 rpg, 45.6% FG shooting, not to mention 41% three-pt FG. Those are All-Stars numbers, and precisely what made Lewis such a nightmare to guard for the Cavs' smaller defensive lineup. Aside from LeBron, who didn't have him as a defensive assignment, who among this year's playoff Celts or Cavs had the total package of size, speed and length in one package to guard him? None. That was why Orlando won handily over the much-touted Cavs.)

Those of you bashing Turkoglu and Rashard Lewis, think for a moment: Would Orlando even be in the Finals if you take out these two players from the Magic lineup? I thought so. Turk might be Choke-oglu when it matters, but scroll way back to the series with Philly and tell me how many clutch shots he has made thus far this year.

Lewis and Turk are both very skilled players. 

Lewis put up good numbers, but not max-money numbers.  Is it Lewis' fault he got max money? NO.  But he is not putting up max money numbers, and he has the responsibility to bear the burden of his contract when he signed it.... 

I did not say lewis can't rebound.... I said "rebound in traffic".... meaning he is capble of getting rebounds when his team does a good job of boxing out and the ball comes in his direction.... Lewis does not have the intensity or toughness to get tough, gritty rebounds.... Lewis' rebounding numbers are primarily because of the space and boxing out from howard....

Lamar odom is smothering Lewis.  Lewis can create his shot against cement shoed defenders like brian scalabrine or ben wallace or wally scissorback.... Against odom, if he does not have an open set shot, lewis is not shooting....

Lewis has looked like a floppy chicken the few times he has taken it to the hole in traffic against the lakers......... watch the games!

Lewis had very fine numbers in the regular season, when he was facing crappy defenses....but A max money guy is paid to win championships.... and championships are won with gritty rebounds against tough, lock-down defensive match-ups.....And very clearly, lewis is not capable of that......

SHAME ON YOU OTIS SMITH!!!

I stand by what i said....

 

 
bob696969
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 10:15 AM ET #56

BORAT38 --> you are making the same mistake most GM's make.... looking at raw numbers without considering how those numbers are earned and who they are earned against....
 
Shareef Abur-Rahim was an all-star with 20 pts 10 boards, but the dude was soft and got his numbers against shitty defense and/or when he team was getting blown out.....
 
Good thing he retired, or Otis Smith might have given him Max-Money as welll......lol....
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BORAT38 --> you are making the same mistake most GM's make.... looking at raw numbers without considering how those numbers are earned and who they are earned against....
 
Shareef Abur-Rahim was an all-star with 20 pts 10 boards, but the dude was soft and got his numbers against shitty defense and/or when he team was getting blown out.....
 
Good thing he retired, or Otis Smith might have given him Max-Money as welll......lol....
 
165yds
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 1:50 PM ET #57

there is a certain capper here not gonna mention names who LOVES the magic, didnt love this game to begin with,  i was gonna put small amount since i have no feel for this game but now its a definite no play. you should know who im talking about. be very careful Bator and great luck.
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there is a certain capper here not gonna mention names who LOVES the magic, didnt love this game to begin with,  i was gonna put small amount since i have no feel for this game but now its a definite no play. you should know who im talking about. be very careful Bator and great luck.
 
Woall
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 2:02 PM ET #58

Lakers lines are skewed, indeed.  all the money i have lost on betting on this team to beat spreads could have been added to my Lakers-to-win-finals investments.  sickening. 
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Lakers lines are skewed, indeed.  all the money i have lost on betting on this team to beat spreads could have been added to my Lakers-to-win-finals investments.  sickening. 
 
LetsDoThisRight
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 2:53 PM ET #59

Quote Originally Posted by MrBator:

 

 

A service charge?  Have you actually been to Las Vegas?  There is no service charge for cashing winning tickets, but don't give them any ideas!  They're desperate these days!

 

I'm not one to back Ice4Blood, BUT I think all of those questions he posed were about cashing out through an online sportsbook. 

 

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Quote Originally Posted by MrBator:

 

 

A service charge?  Have you actually been to Las Vegas?  There is no service charge for cashing winning tickets, but don't give them any ideas!  They're desperate these days!

 

I'm not one to back Ice4Blood, BUT I think all of those questions he posed were about cashing out through an online sportsbook. 

 

 
shot-callers
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 3:10 PM ET #60

Bator you feeling the over tonight.  I see the lakers not playing the same type of D as last game.  I looking defensive let up and this game being in the 100's.  Lakers with a 3-1 lead in the series will naturally not play with as much intensisty. 
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Bator you feeling the over tonight.  I see the lakers not playing the same type of D as last game.  I looking defensive let up and this game being in the 100's.  Lakers with a 3-1 lead in the series will naturally not play with as much intensisty. 
 
Ice4Blood
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 3:13 PM ET #61

Quote Originally Posted by MrBator:

A service charge?  Have you actually been to Las Vegas?  There is no service charge for cashing winning tickets, but don't give them any ideas!  They're desperate these days!

and you say I don't have a sense of humor? 

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Quote Originally Posted by MrBator:

A service charge?  Have you actually been to Las Vegas?  There is no service charge for cashing winning tickets, but don't give them any ideas!  They're desperate these days!

and you say I don't have a sense of humor? 

 
Ice4Blood
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 3:17 PM ET #62

Quote Originally Posted by LetsDoThisRight:

 

I'm not one to back Ice4Blood, BUT I think all of those questions he posed were about cashing out through an online sportsbook. 

thank you!  i can't believe that had to be clarified...

 

all of the things i mentioned are things you DO have to worry about when playing online, and things you DON'T have to worry about when playing at a Vegas sportsbook...

i.e.... an argument in favor of making your bets on the strip instead of making them at Matchbook (or wherever)...

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Quote Originally Posted by LetsDoThisRight:

 

I'm not one to back Ice4Blood, BUT I think all of those questions he posed were about cashing out through an online sportsbook. 

thank you!  i can't believe that had to be clarified...

 

all of the things i mentioned are things you DO have to worry about when playing online, and things you DON'T have to worry about when playing at a Vegas sportsbook...

i.e.... an argument in favor of making your bets on the strip instead of making them at Matchbook (or wherever)...

 
MrBator
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 3:22 PM ET #63

Quote Originally Posted by Ice4Blood:

thank you!  i can't believe that had to be clarified...

 

all of the things i mentioned are things you DO have to worry about when playing online, and things you DON'T have to worry about when playing at a Vegas sportsbook...

i.e.... an argument in favor of making your bets on the strip instead of making them at Matchbook (or wherever)...

 

Oh, I gotcha now.  I was slowwwww on the uptake.  Very slow.

 

"My Bad"    

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Quote Originally Posted by Ice4Blood:

thank you!  i can't believe that had to be clarified...

 

all of the things i mentioned are things you DO have to worry about when playing online, and things you DON'T have to worry about when playing at a Vegas sportsbook...

i.e.... an argument in favor of making your bets on the strip instead of making them at Matchbook (or wherever)...

 

Oh, I gotcha now.  I was slowwwww on the uptake.  Very slow.

 

"My Bad"    

 
larryhughes
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 3:22 PM ET #64

Bator. Any lean on the total (198)?


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Bator. Any lean on the total (198)?


 
rockstar8920
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 3:59 PM ET #65

MRBATOR I WANT TO COME TO LAS VEGAS AND MEET YOU. WOULD THAT BE A POSSIBILITY ?
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MRBATOR I WANT TO COME TO LAS VEGAS AND MEET YOU. WOULD THAT BE A POSSIBILITY ?
 
MrBator
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 4:02 PM ET #66

Quote Originally Posted by rockstar8920:

MRBATOR I WANT TO COME TO LAS VEGAS AND MEET YOU. WOULD THAT BE A POSSIBILITY ?

 

You can come here, but the line's pretty long.

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Quote Originally Posted by rockstar8920:

MRBATOR I WANT TO COME TO LAS VEGAS AND MEET YOU. WOULD THAT BE A POSSIBILITY ?

 

You can come here, but the line's pretty long.

 
rockstar8920
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 4:05 PM ET #67

THE LINE IS LONG AT THE SPORTSBOOK WHERE YOU CASH OUT ? DO YOUR CHARGE A CONSULTING FEE ? 
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THE LINE IS LONG AT THE SPORTSBOOK WHERE YOU CASH OUT ? DO YOUR CHARGE A CONSULTING FEE ? 
 
maysabator
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 4:19 PM ET #68

hey batorman what do you think of magic -1 Q1 -130 as a play?
if magic are going to win dont you think they come out blazing right off the gate?
thanks
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hey batorman what do you think of magic -1 Q1 -130 as a play?
if magic are going to win dont you think they come out blazing right off the gate?
thanks
 
Addict101
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 4:27 PM ET #69

this might be the last game of the season if Turkoglu has to shoot free throws
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this might be the last game of the season if Turkoglu has to shoot free throws
 
MrBator
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 4:54 PM ET #70

Quote Originally Posted by maysabator:

hey batorman what do you think of magic -1 Q1 -130 as a play?
if magic are going to win dont you think they come out blazing right off the gate?
thanks

 

Pretty much, but I can't endorse letting your book clip you for that -130 juice.  Minus 120 would be okay, but I would not lay 130.

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Quote Originally Posted by maysabator:

hey batorman what do you think of magic -1 Q1 -130 as a play?
if magic are going to win dont you think they come out blazing right off the gate?
thanks

 

Pretty much, but I can't endorse letting your book clip you for that -130 juice.  Minus 120 would be okay, but I would not lay 130.

 
GWarner27
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 5:52 PM ET #71

great article, even better thread
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great article, even better thread
 
MrBator
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 6:44 PM ET #72

The Magic are 18-0 at home this season off a loss.  They went 12-0 SU & 8-4 ATS during the regular season and 6-0 SU & 6-0 ATS in the playoffs.  Over the last two seasons the Magic have played 36 home games following a loss and won 32 out of the 36. 
 
 
It's incredible that they've posted numbers like these and still so many squares are ready to write them off for good after what happened in the last game.  Tonight will be a big win for the Orlando Magic, followed by another one on Tuesday night.
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The Magic are 18-0 at home this season off a loss.  They went 12-0 SU & 8-4 ATS during the regular season and 6-0 SU & 6-0 ATS in the playoffs.  Over the last two seasons the Magic have played 36 home games following a loss and won 32 out of the 36. 
 
 
It's incredible that they've posted numbers like these and still so many squares are ready to write them off for good after what happened in the last game.  Tonight will be a big win for the Orlando Magic, followed by another one on Tuesday night.
 
teddyp
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 6:57 PM ET #73

MrBator, would you still book the Magic at -3.5 -110.  I still feel sick from game 3 when I let the books beat me at -4.5.  I am just scared that this might happen again.  

Any 1H or total action this game?
Thanks in advance.
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MrBator, would you still book the Magic at -3.5 -110.  I still feel sick from game 3 when I let the books beat me at -4.5.  I am just scared that this might happen again.  

Any 1H or total action this game?
Thanks in advance.
 
MrBator
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 7:21 PM ET #74

I just added two adjusted lines bets:
 
 
Orlando -8.5 +230 from Bookmaker for one unit (their limit)
 
 
Orlando -9.5 +260 from ABC for half a unit (their limit)
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I just added two adjusted lines bets:
 
 
Orlando -8.5 +230 from Bookmaker for one unit (their limit)
 
 
Orlando -9.5 +260 from ABC for half a unit (their limit)
 
 
MrBator
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Posted: Jun. 14, 2009 - 7:45 PM ET #75

Just added:
 
 
Orlando -5.5 +130 from ABC for half a unit
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Just added:
 
 
Orlando -5.5 +130 from ABC for half a unit
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