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    All Forums | Investments

    Downside of A Variable Annuity?

    DiverRon
    mikey22222
    wallstreetcappers
    claycourtlesson
    PALLADIUM
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    Views: 367
    Posts: 10
     
    DiverRon
    DiverRon
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    Joined: Jun, 2008
    Posts: 3837
    Posted: Aug. 7, 2008 - 9:59 AM ET #1

    Hi all:
     
    My dad is being hounded by an insurance salesman
    to put some money into a fixed annuity.
    The thing is the fixed annuity wraps your money
    up for several years or more for a yield of 4% or so and tax deferrred; if you need your money there is a surrender charge to
    get it.
    It is guaranteed money however.
    On the other side of things my dads brokerage house
    Charles Schwab has a Variable Annuity with a 6% yield
    and no surrender (you can get all your money right away).
    With the variable I am not sure how it works with recovering
    your principle if things go down a bit.
     
    IN SHORT I UNDERSTAND FIXED ANNUITIES BUT WHAT
    ARE THE ADVANTAGES AND DISADVANTAGES OF VARIABLE ANNUITIES?
    Reply
    To remove first post, remove entire topic.
    Hi all:
     
    My dad is being hounded by an insurance salesman
    to put some money into a fixed annuity.
    The thing is the fixed annuity wraps your money
    up for several years or more for a yield of 4% or so and tax deferrred; if you need your money there is a surrender charge to
    get it.
    It is guaranteed money however.
    On the other side of things my dads brokerage house
    Charles Schwab has a Variable Annuity with a 6% yield
    and no surrender (you can get all your money right away).
    With the variable I am not sure how it works with recovering
    your principle if things go down a bit.
     
    IN SHORT I UNDERSTAND FIXED ANNUITIES BUT WHAT
    ARE THE ADVANTAGES AND DISADVANTAGES OF VARIABLE ANNUITIES?
     
    mikey22222
    mikey22222
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    Posts: 535
    Posted: Aug. 7, 2008 - 10:49 AM ET #2

    Variable annuities come in many shaps and sizes. Gennerally the fees associated with these things...unually hidden ..are huge.  The major selling point is that you can be invested long term in equities and have professional management and not pay taxes until you start to withdraw at retirement at alower tax bracket. If your dad is older I would not expose him to the equity market when the economy is in the tank and going lower. Its not the time to be invested in equities. Plus the annuity is a highly commisioned product to the broker or agent. It will say that 100% of you money is invested but there are penalties for early withdrawal. In a word its good for the broker but bad for the customer.
    Reply
    Variable annuities come in many shaps and sizes. Gennerally the fees associated with these things...unually hidden ..are huge.  The major selling point is that you can be invested long term in equities and have professional management and not pay taxes until you start to withdraw at retirement at alower tax bracket. If your dad is older I would not expose him to the equity market when the economy is in the tank and going lower. Its not the time to be invested in equities. Plus the annuity is a highly commisioned product to the broker or agent. It will say that 100% of you money is invested but there are penalties for early withdrawal. In a word its good for the broker but bad for the customer.
     
    wallstreetcappers
    wallstreetcappers
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    Posts: 58464
    Posted: Aug. 7, 2008 - 11:04 AM ET #3

    mikey makes good points..they are also very illiquid, meaning if you try and sell the product you get smacked around pretty good.

    In my view I would rather see what term insurance you could find and if  your father liked the product mix of the annuity investment wise, try to find a fund that has a similar makeup.

    There is a secret in the investment market that ANNUITIES are a BIG payday for a broker..big time payout, so I wonder why that is??


    Reply
    mikey makes good points..they are also very illiquid, meaning if you try and sell the product you get smacked around pretty good.

    In my view I would rather see what term insurance you could find and if  your father liked the product mix of the annuity investment wise, try to find a fund that has a similar makeup.

    There is a secret in the investment market that ANNUITIES are a BIG payday for a broker..big time payout, so I wonder why that is??


     
    claycourtlesson
    claycourtlesson
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    Joined: Jan, 2006
    Posts: 14917
    Posted: Aug. 7, 2008 - 11:49 AM ET #4

    Insurance salespeople calling you on the phone trying to move their garbage?
     
    Sounds like my phone.
     
    Turn off ringer, and turn off answering machine.
     
    Variable annuities, for the most part, are putrid.
    Reply
    Insurance salespeople calling you on the phone trying to move their garbage?
     
    Sounds like my phone.
     
    Turn off ringer, and turn off answering machine.
     
    Variable annuities, for the most part, are putrid.
     
    PALLADIUM
    PALLADIUM
    Banned
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    Joined: Apr, 2008
    Posts: 952
    Posted: Aug. 7, 2008 - 9:43 PM ET #5

    Make sure the agent isn't selling him an equity indexed they are a scam however VA's are getting better every day. Take a look at ING life pay plus if he wants a VA.  It guarantees the income base will step up by 7% or the better of the highest quarterly account value each year.  The base can be used for lifetime income withdrawn at 6-7% depending on age without ever having to annuitize.  All the while locking in higher market gains, it's tax deferred until you take withdrawals.  He puts in a 100k and market drops 50% in ten years; the death benefit is 200k and his income base is 200k, in a worst case scenario in this market what is wrong with that. If someone is older and wants equity exposure why wouldn't they use a VA?  They lock in gains and guarantee you income while a stocks, uit, mf's are completely dependent upon the markets returns.  You either want income now, income later, or to leave a legacy ,and VA with the death benefits provide all those options; with many cheaper than a C share mutual fund.
    Reply
    Make sure the agent isn't selling him an equity indexed they are a scam however VA's are getting better every day. Take a look at ING life pay plus if he wants a VA.  It guarantees the income base will step up by 7% or the better of the highest quarterly account value each year.  The base can be used for lifetime income withdrawn at 6-7% depending on age without ever having to annuitize.  All the while locking in higher market gains, it's tax deferred until you take withdrawals.  He puts in a 100k and market drops 50% in ten years; the death benefit is 200k and his income base is 200k, in a worst case scenario in this market what is wrong with that. If someone is older and wants equity exposure why wouldn't they use a VA?  They lock in gains and guarantee you income while a stocks, uit, mf's are completely dependent upon the markets returns.  You either want income now, income later, or to leave a legacy ,and VA with the death benefits provide all those options; with many cheaper than a C share mutual fund.
     
    Jamill24
    Jamill24
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    Posts: 1330
    Posted: Aug. 7, 2008 - 11:27 PM ET #6

    I work in the bank channel for fixed annuities and everything that has been said regarding fixed annuities is true, however most companies like the one I work for have a guarantee return of premium no matter when you surrender the contract.  And most companies offer 10-15% per year liquidity for withdrawals.  Not all the liquidity that most would like  but it does offer some liquidity.  The last thing I will say is, the company I work has a product that BofA offers at 5% for $100k + and Chase offers a product at 4.75% for $100k+.    Not saying that a fixed is the way to go, just thought I would give you more input on it.
    Reply
    I work in the bank channel for fixed annuities and everything that has been said regarding fixed annuities is true, however most companies like the one I work for have a guarantee return of premium no matter when you surrender the contract.  And most companies offer 10-15% per year liquidity for withdrawals.  Not all the liquidity that most would like  but it does offer some liquidity.  The last thing I will say is, the company I work has a product that BofA offers at 5% for $100k + and Chase offers a product at 4.75% for $100k+.    Not saying that a fixed is the way to go, just thought I would give you more input on it.
     
    wallstreetcappers
    wallstreetcappers
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    Posted: Aug. 7, 2008 - 11:55 PM ET #7

    If it were ME and I were giving advice, if you wanted a var or fixed annuity, WAIT for rates to go up.

    The higher the rates go in general, usually the higher the annuity since it has to compete with other instruments in the marketplace.

    But that said, no way could I recco someone buying one period.
    Reply
    If it were ME and I were giving advice, if you wanted a var or fixed annuity, WAIT for rates to go up.

    The higher the rates go in general, usually the higher the annuity since it has to compete with other instruments in the marketplace.

    But that said, no way could I recco someone buying one period.
     
    depeche2
    depeche2
    Legend
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    Joined: Feb, 2002
    Posts: 67006
    Posted: Aug. 8, 2008 - 3:42 PM ET #8

    My dad is being hounded by an insurance salesman

    That says it all now, doesn't it?
    Reply
    My dad is being hounded by an insurance salesman

    That says it all now, doesn't it?
     
    accventures
    accventures
    Legend
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    Joined: Jan, 2005
    Posts: 33235
    Posted: Aug. 8, 2008 - 6:05 PM ET #9

    very high in fees typically
    Reply
    very high in fees typically
     
     
    DiverRon
    DiverRon
    Veteran
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Jun, 2008
    Posts: 3837
    Posted: Aug. 8, 2008 - 7:03 PM ET #10

    Great advice all!
    thanks.
    he going with a discounted VA IN HIS CHARLES SCHWABB
    account. 6.8% APR and can change sectors, etc,. but there is
    more possible upside gain (not sure of the specifics).
    He is going 65% in bonds in his VA i think.
    No surrender.
    Anyway, the full service salesman is pissed who sells the Fixed
    Annuities; I'm sure he missed out on a BIG PAYDAY!
    Reply
    Great advice all!
    thanks.
    he going with a discounted VA IN HIS CHARLES SCHWABB
    account. 6.8% APR and can change sectors, etc,. but there is
    more possible upside gain (not sure of the specifics).
    He is going 65% in bonds in his VA i think.
    No surrender.
    Anyway, the full service salesman is pissed who sells the Fixed
    Annuities; I'm sure he missed out on a BIG PAYDAY!
    All Forums | Investments

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