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If Christ died on the cross for all of humanity

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Posted: #4301
Quote Originally Posted by KittyKatz286:

Without an afterlife, there is no accountability beyond this life. Correct. There is no accountability beyond this life. Some people get away with shit. Some don't. That's the way the cookie crumbles. I don't understand what is so hard to understand about that concept. Even if you don't agree with it, it is simple to grasp.

And smoothd - what you said is opinion. I don't think anything is worth dying for yet. And if I find something worth dying for then whatever. I don't think I will. At this point, I don't see the point in giving your life for anything because think about it: what good is my sacrifice if I am dead? It's useless. It doesn't help me at all. So for you to say it is contradictory is flat out false because of the definition of what a contradiction is. It MUST be the case that the two statements cannot be true at the same time as in there can be no instance where the two can coexist as true.
The science that you love to rely on has strong evidence of an afterlife. The question is what does that afterlife consists of. There are literally thousands of cases of Near Death Experiences and not all of it is due to the brain shutting down and showing us movie. There are incredible stories of people who were clinically dead and came back only to tell everyone what was going on around them.  So the scientific data points strongly to an afterlife. Accountability is where Universal Law comes into effect. Whether you believe in it or not isn't relative. It's like those people who don't recognize the US Government and declare sovereignty. Just because you declare yourselves sovereign and you don't believe in the authority of the US Government doesn't make it go away. The same thing with Universal Law. You can rationalize it away. Ask for proof and evidence. That doesn't mean a damn thing. Universal Law is God's regulator of the Universe. It's a non respecter of persons and Universal Law is absolute. You may think you're unaccountable but believe me the day of accountability comes for everyone whether you believe or not. 
 
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Posted: #4302
Quote Originally Posted by smoothd20:

The science that you love to rely on has strong evidence of an afterlife. The question is what does that afterlife consists of. There are literally thousands of cases of Near Death Experiences and not all of it is due to the brain shutting down and showing us movie. There are incredible stories of people who were clinically dead and came back only to tell everyone what was going on around them.  So the scientific data points strongly to an afterlife. Accountability is where Universal Law comes into effect. Whether you believe in it or not isn't relative. It's like those people who don't recognize the US Government and declare sovereignty. Just because you declare yourselves sovereign and you don't believe in the authority of the US Government doesn't make it go away. The same thing with Universal Law. You can rationalize it away. Ask for proof and evidence. That doesn't mean a damn thing. Universal Law is God's regulator of the Universe. It's a non respecter of persons and Universal Law is absolute. You may think you're unaccountable but believe me the day of accountability comes for everyone whether you believe or not. 


Oh boy........
 
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Posted: #4303
Can you cite the peer reviewed scientific journal that states this please?


 
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Posted: #4304
Another thing I notice about atheist. When the theist say something. We are either stupid, don't understand the concept or it's just our opinion. When the atheist say something no matter how wacky it may be it is presented with twisted facts, flimsy evidence and is presented as absolute truth and the final answer. But God's laws are dismissed because first and foremost God doesn't exist, its all a fairy tale. Yet history has shown us repeatedly how this has played out. If we were so wrong how come history shows us that God's laws rule over this world. Look at all the dictators that have tried to take over the world. Look at the Soviet Union who's official policy was atheism. History is full of accountability on a personal and national level. No friends you are all accountable for your actions in this life and beyond believe that.
 
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Posted: #4305
Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:

Can you cite the peer reviewed scientific journal that states this please?


This isn't a secret. There are literally thousands of articles written about this. Just google it and maybe you will find one of the Scientist that you follow writing a article about it. On the theory of multiverse or multi dimensions. Scientific American has written articles on this subject over the past 10 years. I even read a story in that magazine where the writer "proofed" mathematically that multi dimension existed. I'm good in math but that was above my paygrade. Again these aren't secrets and with a little effort you can find this info. Of course I know that this would mean if there are multiverses and multi dimensions your theory of no God goes out the window so this is probably something you don't want to know about. But as I have said before what we don't know will make a whole other world. There is a lot we don't know or understand and atheism offers us nothing in the way of answers since it's based on randomness of everything.
 
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Posted: #4306
Speaking of waiting. I'm still waiting for Sugarbear to show me where I posted racist statements about people of color and women. I noticed since I called him out on those lies his presence has been severely limited. If he just admits that he was lying or made a mistake that would be get enough for me. Of course Sugarbear was assuming I was White and in so doing made an ass of himself by saying things that was a lie. We all know what happens when we assume don't we. 
 
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Posted: #4307
Quote Originally Posted by smoothd20:

Speaking of waiting. I'm still waiting for Sugarbear to show me where I posted racist statements about people of color and women. I noticed since I called him out on those lies his presence has been severely limited. If he just admits that he was lying or made a mistake that would be get enough for me. Of course Sugarbear was assuming I was White and in so doing made an ass of himself by saying things that was a lie. We all know what happens when we assume don't we. 


Well, he stopped posting because he couldn't take the aggravation from all the stupidity.

On a side note, didn't you say women were put on earth to serve man?  I don't feel like going looking for that post.
 
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Posted: #4308
Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:



Well, he stopped posting because he couldn't take the aggravation from all the stupidity.

On a side note, didn't you say women were put on earth to serve man?  I don't feel like going looking for that post.
That wasn't me.
 
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Posted: #4309
Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:



Well, he stopped posting because he couldn't take the aggravation from all the stupidity.

On a side note, didn't you say women were put on earth to serve man?  I don't feel like going looking for that post.

I do believe that was Matt in his attempt to convince us that the earth is 6,000 years old lol
 
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Posted: #4310
Quote Originally Posted by KittyKatz286:


I do believe that was Matt in his attempt to convince us that the earth is 6,000 years old lol


Oh, of course.
 
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Posted: #4311
Quote Originally Posted by KittyKatz286:


I do believe that was Matt in his attempt to convince us that the earth is 6,000 years old lol

That is so ridiculous. I can't believe that there are people who still believe that mess.
 
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Posted: #4312
I was waiting to drop the bomb on Sugarbear thats why I just let him go on with that bullshit about me making racist statements. If I called you an anti-Semitic pig and it turns out you were Jewish I would swiftly apologize. But Sugarbear wasn't interested in the truth he was only a troll making dumbass statements and not being man enough to realize how stupid he was being. 
 
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Posted: #4313
I'm happy to see you guys finally changed you avatars. 
 
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Posted: #4314
Quote Originally Posted by smoothd20:


That is so ridiculous. I can't believe that there are people who still believe that mess.

Doesn't that make you think though?  If the bible is the word of god, how could it be wrong about anything??  I have a big issue with that.

And I'm glad you like my new avatar 
 
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Posted: #4315
Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:


Doesn't that make you think though?  If the bible is the word of god, how could it be wrong about anything??  I have a big issue with that.

And I'm glad you like my new avatar 

I believe smoothd has said in the past that the bible does not specifically say the earth is 6,000 years old. However, smoothd is more concerned about god than Christianity. He's all about a higher power and not so much about organized religion and mindless subordination.
 
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Posted: #4316
Quote Originally Posted by KittyKatz286:


You want ONE reason, ok.

You shouldn't rob a bank even if you could get away with it because it is bad for society if people robbed from each other, including banks (since technically you're stealing other people's money.) But stealing in general is wrong relative to society.

But in your world view, there is no obligation for me to care about anyone or anything except myself.

If i can get away with it, then why not. No one catches me here, no afterlife accountability, who cares about the people that i rob, life is utterly meaningless, the earth will die a cosmic death, you have not convinced me at all why i shouldnt rob a bank if i can get away with it. Dont talk about the ompact of other people, who cares, life is utterly meaningless.

Furthemore, if on any given day, i rob a bank, rape a 12 year old girl, kill a gay man i am absolutely no different to volunteers who help disabled people, help the elderly, help chariities etc.

If you tell me that i am wrong, then it is no different to you telling me chocolate is better than vanilla. Just one persons opinion over another, your not right, your not wrong.....Just a matter of opinion. Who are you to tell me what is right or wrong, you are no one in an athestic world. You are just random luck of molecules put together by luck who has no worth.

 
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Posted: #4317

Quote Originally Posted by KittyKatz286:

I believe life has no ultimate meaning. I believe there is no god. I would not rob a bank, rape anyone, or murder anyone. While this is no proof that I am right, it is proof that I could be right; proof that you cannot rule out people being moral without god.

If i put on an atheists glasses for a moment, i read this comment as

"Vanilla ice cream is better than chocolate ice cream, i would not eat chocolate ice cream".

Thats all what it means in an atheistic view.....

In this world, there is no such thing as vanilla being better than chocolate, as each person has an opinion on what tastes better, IT IS RELATIVE, thats what happens when morals become relative.

 
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Posted: #4318

Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:

Still waiting on this one, Rostos:  If morals are absolute, then killing is never okay.  Correct?

Morals are transended by God. What God says is the moral law.

God said do not murder, then you do not murder.

 
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Posted: #4319

Quote Originally Posted by Mikniks:



He knows where I'm going with this, so it is getting ignored.  Understandable.

Wrong, i was watching the cricket for the past 3 hrs

 
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Posted: #4320

Quote Originally Posted by smoothd20:

Another thing I notice about atheist. When the theist say something. We are either stupid, don't understand the concept or it's just our opinion. When the atheist say something no matter how wacky it may be it is presented with twisted facts, flimsy evidence and is presented as absolute truth and the final answer. But God's laws are dismissed because first and foremost God doesn't exist, its all a fairy tale. Yet history has shown us repeatedly how this has played out. If we were so wrong how come history shows us that God's laws rule over this world. Look at all the dictators that have tried to take over the world. Look at the Soviet Union who's official policy was atheism. History is full of accountability on a personal and national level. No friends you are all accountable for your actions in this life and beyond believe that.

Well said.

 
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Posted: #4321
Quote Originally Posted by smoothd20:

"But saying the solider is stupid does not mean he is stupid in general. He is stupid for a specific reason. That reason is that he is giving up his own life for others. I personally do not believe in this type of conduct. I would not value someone else's life over mine. So I am not focusing on the selfless act that he performed regarding the compassion he showed for others. I am referring to his decision to give up his own life".
_______________________________________________________

I think I'm a reasonably intelligent college educated man. This statement here does show contradiction. How is giving up your life for others a stupid decision?  Our  great young American men and women in the service give up their lives everyday for us. How is that stupid?  The great Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. said that "if a man can't find something worth dying for then his life isn't fit to live."  It's never stupid to give up your life for others. Like I have eluded to earlier there are things that I have done and risked my life for people I would never know. I don't consider myself stupid. I have been involved in numerous operations where I have been shot at more times than I care to remember. I have actually been shot twice while performing these operations. I can't get into specifics but believe me when I tell you I didn't consider myself stupid and my team didn't consider me stupid. On the contrary I have been seen as a hero. But I don't consider myself a hero at all. I'm just a man doing what he feels is right.  I would die for my country, my family, my friends  and strangers I don't know. You guys consider it stupid because for you life ends here. But for the real scientists who know that energy can't be destroyed they know that life doesn't end here. So while you see it all as stupid and meaningless. I see meaningful, and productive life on this planet. 
When you are the under the power of the ego and all it's lies this is just another manifestation of the lies the ego has built for you.  You're trapped in a world of your own making. You seem to be reasonably intelligent but you have lost your soul in the process and have become hostage to your own intellect. You have allowed atheism to steal everything from you and now you feel hopeless and meaningless. It's like being in love with a beautiful woman but you're still lonely. Atheism gives you exactly what you say it does...Nothing absolutely nothing and it's all meaningless. I choose to lead a meaningful life and if I should die tonight so be it. I move on to the next episode confident that my spirit the real me is prepared for the next world.  


Smooth, despite your repeated and completely unwarranted personal attacks, I will take your anectdote at face value (though if you have no problem lying about others, why would lying about your own exploits be troubling in the least.)  I actually agree with most of what you say about self sacrifice hee, but for different reasons.  Self sacrifice which benefits the society as a whole is actually a beneficial trait from an evolutionary standpoint, and is seen throughout the animal kingdom.  I disagree with my esteemed fellow atheist kitty that this behavior is stupid.  While not beneficial to the individual actor who will not live to reap the benefits, such an action could protect said individuals genes in the form of defending his family, or protect the larger society as a whole.  Just thought you'd like to know that there is actually a real reason some brains are wired for such action. 

As for the blue portion of your text, this is a complete misunderstanding of science.  Energy is not destroyed when a human dies, it is simply transferred during the decomposition process.  Pretty elementary stuff there.

As for any inherent meaning, kitty, miks, et al are correct- there appears to be no inherent meaning to life in general, but this does not preclude us from having relative meaning to ourselves, loved ones, and society as a whole while we are here.  If you can call surviving meaning, then that is our meaning.  Certain actions benefit survival of the species and/or individual, so they have relative meaning.  I know it is somewhat nuanced, but this really should not be a difficult concept to grasp.

 
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Posted: #4322
Quote Originally Posted by smoothd20:

The science that you love to rely on has strong evidence of an afterlife. The question is what does that afterlife consists of. There are literally thousands of cases of Near Death Experiences and not all of it is due to the brain shutting down and showing us movie. There are incredible stories of people who were clinically dead and came back only to tell everyone what was going on around them.  So the scientific data points strongly to an afterlife. Accountability is where Universal Law comes into effect. Whether you believe in it or not isn't relative. It's like those people who don't recognize the US Government and declare sovereignty. Just because you declare yourselves sovereign and you don't believe in the authority of the US Government doesn't make it go away. The same thing with Universal Law. You can rationalize it away. Ask for proof and evidence. That doesn't mean a damn thing. Universal Law is God's regulator of the Universe. It's a non respecter of persons and Universal Law is absolute. You may think you're unaccountable but believe me the day of accountability comes for everyone whether you believe or not. 

If this is true, then it should not be difficult for you to find just ONE article in a respected, peer reviewed journal that takes this position.  Anectdotal evidence is not science!  As for the blue part, the only universal laws are those of physics.

 
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Posted: #4323
Quote Originally Posted by Rostos:

Morals are transended by God. What God says is the moral law.

God said do not murder, then you do not murder.

this will explain ros's position on God's murdering:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkHarZHrWJE
 

 

 
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Posted: #4324
Quote Originally Posted by CRRECORDS:

this will explain ros's position on God's murdering:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkHarZHrWJE
 

 


this fits rostos thinking to a T 

thou shall not murder, unless god says so 
 
 
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Posted: #4325
So Rostos, if someone is trying to kill you, and you shoot them, and they die, you have sinned???
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