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    All Forums | General Discussion

    Can anyone in a nutshell exactly explain what Bitcoin is exactly all about?

    1234 Next Last»
    justliketoplay
    TheGoldenGoose
    Nut_Flopper
    666LES
    Qwan61
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    1234 Next Last»
     
    justliketoplay
    justliketoplay
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    Posted: Dec. 12, 2017 - 12:40 AM ET #1

    I have heard of it but never understood exactly what it is all about.....Anyone? Thank You in advance because suddenly it is huge.
    When I win Money it's my money and NOT house money
    Reply
    To remove first post, remove entire topic.
    I have heard of it but never understood exactly what it is all about.....Anyone? Thank You in advance because suddenly it is huge.
     
    TheGoldenGoose
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    Posted: Dec. 12, 2017 - 9:03 AM ET #2

    Doubled it's value in three weeks.  You set up a secured on-line "wallet".  DO NOT LOSE your log-in or password.  Or there will be no way to retrieve your money.  Then you have many choices of where to buy Bitcoin to load your wallet.  Shop wisely.  That is all.
    ~~~~~ZOSO~~~~~
    Reply
    Doubled it's value in three weeks.  You set up a secured on-line "wallet".  DO NOT LOSE your log-in or password.  Or there will be no way to retrieve your money.  Then you have many choices of where to buy Bitcoin to load your wallet.  Shop wisely.  That is all.
     
    Nut_Flopper
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    Posted: Dec. 12, 2017 - 1:21 PM ET #3

    Just use the google on the internet machine

    https://lmgtfy.com/?q=What+is+bitcoin

    https://news.bitcoin.com/bitcoin-beginners-cryptocurrency-exchange-use/
    Reply
    Just use the google on the internet machine

    https://lmgtfy.com/?q=What+is+bitcoin

    https://news.bitcoin.com/bitcoin-beginners-cryptocurrency-exchange-use/
     
    666LES
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    Posted: Dec. 13, 2017 - 3:33 PM ET #4

    Bernie Madoff on the World Wide Web.......theres you're nutshell.
    Reply
    Bernie Madoff on the World Wide Web.......theres you're nutshell.
     
    Qwan61
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    Posted: Dec. 13, 2017 - 6:16 PM ET #5

    Correct on Bernie Madoff..

    What people buying into BC ponzi scheme seem oblivious to is that
    there are now at least 700 equivalent  cryptocurrencies available and at much cheaper prices than BC.

    It's called arbitrage. You dont want to be owning the more expensive equivalent product.

    BC's rise is fueled by cryptokiddies who got a smart phone and think they are purchasing something of value.






    Reply
    Correct on Bernie Madoff..

    What people buying into BC ponzi scheme seem oblivious to is that
    there are now at least 700 equivalent  cryptocurrencies available and at much cheaper prices than BC.

    It's called arbitrage. You dont want to be owning the more expensive equivalent product.

    BC's rise is fueled by cryptokiddies who got a smart phone and think they are purchasing something of value.






     
    HockeyTeeth
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    Posted: Dec. 13, 2017 - 8:52 PM ET #6

    Most of the hipster crowd is oblivious to the energy costs associated with bitcoin mining. Some estimates suggest the energy to mine  bitcoin in three to five yrs will require power levels equal to the total amount of energy produced today. 




    Reply
    Most of the hipster crowd is oblivious to the energy costs associated with bitcoin mining. Some estimates suggest the energy to mine  bitcoin in three to five yrs will require power levels equal to the total amount of energy produced today. 




     
    vanzack
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    Posted: Dec. 13, 2017 - 9:04 PM ET #7

    Quote Originally Posted by Qwan61:

    Correct on Bernie Madoff..What people buying into BC ponzi scheme seem oblivious to is that there are now at least 700 equivalent  cryptocurrencies available and at much cheaper prices than BC.It's called arbitrage. You dont want to be owning the more expensive equivalent product. BC's rise is fueled by cryptokiddies who got a smart phone and think they are purchasing something of value.

    Alternatively, you could make the argument that alternate cryptocurrencies are not "equivalent" to BTC.

    It is kind of like saying that RC cola or your local supermarkets generic cola is equal to Coca Cola.  Yes, they are both colas, but are they really equivalent?  Should the stock price of your local supermarkets cola be as high as the stock price of Coca Cola because they are both colas?

    Bitcoin has been established as the peggable cryptocurrency.  Ever notice how all of the alt cryptos trade in BTC?  It is because in order to get in and out of anything outside of the top 20 in size, you have to trade BTC for them.

    Bitcoin is also just plain and simple Bitcoin.  Does your mom know about Litecoin or Iota?  Do you see news articles on Monero?  There is value to being the first and biggest on the block.

    Now - if you want to make the argument that BTC is overvalued - please state your case - because you do a horrendous job if that was your intent.  Cryptokiddies aren't the ones driving the price up, because Cryptokiddies aren't buying and selling volume to drive the price.  These are real investors.

    Also, consider the fact that in America - we have a stable government with stable currency.  But step outside for a moment - and ask people in Brazil, Kenya, Haiti, or Venezuela if they would rather have their own currencies or bitcoin that we call volatile but they call stable - and I think you will start to understand the real reasons why bitcoin is valued the way it is.

    It is a scarce resource, that has a vast market share to capture.  It could go to zero, and it could go to a million - but you do nothing to advance the position that bitcoin is overvalued.

    Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by Qwan61:

    Correct on Bernie Madoff..What people buying into BC ponzi scheme seem oblivious to is that there are now at least 700 equivalent  cryptocurrencies available and at much cheaper prices than BC.It's called arbitrage. You dont want to be owning the more expensive equivalent product. BC's rise is fueled by cryptokiddies who got a smart phone and think they are purchasing something of value.

    Alternatively, you could make the argument that alternate cryptocurrencies are not "equivalent" to BTC.

    It is kind of like saying that RC cola or your local supermarkets generic cola is equal to Coca Cola.  Yes, they are both colas, but are they really equivalent?  Should the stock price of your local supermarkets cola be as high as the stock price of Coca Cola because they are both colas?

    Bitcoin has been established as the peggable cryptocurrency.  Ever notice how all of the alt cryptos trade in BTC?  It is because in order to get in and out of anything outside of the top 20 in size, you have to trade BTC for them.

    Bitcoin is also just plain and simple Bitcoin.  Does your mom know about Litecoin or Iota?  Do you see news articles on Monero?  There is value to being the first and biggest on the block.

    Now - if you want to make the argument that BTC is overvalued - please state your case - because you do a horrendous job if that was your intent.  Cryptokiddies aren't the ones driving the price up, because Cryptokiddies aren't buying and selling volume to drive the price.  These are real investors.

    Also, consider the fact that in America - we have a stable government with stable currency.  But step outside for a moment - and ask people in Brazil, Kenya, Haiti, or Venezuela if they would rather have their own currencies or bitcoin that we call volatile but they call stable - and I think you will start to understand the real reasons why bitcoin is valued the way it is.

    It is a scarce resource, that has a vast market share to capture.  It could go to zero, and it could go to a million - but you do nothing to advance the position that bitcoin is overvalued.

     
    vanzack
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    Posted: Dec. 13, 2017 - 9:11 PM ET #8

    Quote Originally Posted by HockeyTeeth:

    Most of the hipster crowd is oblivious to the energy costs associated with bitcoin mining. Some estimates suggest the energy to mine  bitcoin in three to five yrs will require power levels equal to the total amount of energy produced today.

    This hipster has an explanation for you.  Please read and consider the following....

    Typically, electricity is geographically dependent and restricted.  If you live in St Louis, you cannot purchase power from Montana or the Congo.

    But the electricity needed to run mining computers does not have a geographic restriction - these computers can be anywhere - and therefore they create a totally efficient marketplace driven by energy costs.  If Kenya is offering the cheapest electricity in the world, guess  where the mining computers will be?

    Now...  When you learn how electicity grids and infrastructure is set up - you will see that countries take a "build it and they will come" approach when it comes to infrasture projects like electric grids.  

    So lets take an example:  Kenya decides that in order to attract business and further their economy they need an electric grid.  They build that electric grid in anticipation of what they will need 20 years from now - not what they need today - and that leaves a lot of overproduced electricity capacity sitting idle - which means cheap electricity!

    So what do miners do?  They go to these underutilized electric grids - AND ACTUALLY BUILD THE ECONOMIES OF DEVELOPING NATIONS.  So this hipster actually believes that if you look a little farther than the clickbait headlines - you might actually learn something that is not so obvious.

     

    peace_5

    Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by HockeyTeeth:

    Most of the hipster crowd is oblivious to the energy costs associated with bitcoin mining. Some estimates suggest the energy to mine  bitcoin in three to five yrs will require power levels equal to the total amount of energy produced today.

    This hipster has an explanation for you.  Please read and consider the following....

    Typically, electricity is geographically dependent and restricted.  If you live in St Louis, you cannot purchase power from Montana or the Congo.

    But the electricity needed to run mining computers does not have a geographic restriction - these computers can be anywhere - and therefore they create a totally efficient marketplace driven by energy costs.  If Kenya is offering the cheapest electricity in the world, guess  where the mining computers will be?

    Now...  When you learn how electicity grids and infrastructure is set up - you will see that countries take a "build it and they will come" approach when it comes to infrasture projects like electric grids.  

    So lets take an example:  Kenya decides that in order to attract business and further their economy they need an electric grid.  They build that electric grid in anticipation of what they will need 20 years from now - not what they need today - and that leaves a lot of overproduced electricity capacity sitting idle - which means cheap electricity!

    So what do miners do?  They go to these underutilized electric grids - AND ACTUALLY BUILD THE ECONOMIES OF DEVELOPING NATIONS.  So this hipster actually believes that if you look a little farther than the clickbait headlines - you might actually learn something that is not so obvious.

     

    peace_5

     
    JEFFMARKETCAP
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    Posted: Dec. 13, 2017 - 10:26 PM ET #9

    Quote Originally Posted by HockeyTeeth:

    Most of the hipster crowd is oblivious to the energy costs associated with bitcoin mining. Some estimates suggest the energy to mine  bitcoin in three to five yrs will require power levels equal to the total amount of energy produced today. 




    . Can you explain to me what bitcoin mining is?  Electricity to mine them?  
    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by HockeyTeeth:

    Most of the hipster crowd is oblivious to the energy costs associated with bitcoin mining. Some estimates suggest the energy to mine  bitcoin in three to five yrs will require power levels equal to the total amount of energy produced today. 




    . Can you explain to me what bitcoin mining is?  Electricity to mine them?  
     
    vanzack
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 7:54 AM ET #10

    Quote Originally Posted by JEFFMARKETCAP:

    QUOTE Originally Posted by HockeyTeeth: Most of the hipster crowd is oblivious to the energy costs associated with bitcoin mining. Some estimates suggest the energy to mine  bitcoin in three to five yrs will require power levels equal to the total amount of energy produced today.  . Can you explain to me what bitcoin mining is?  Electricity to mine them?

    Put very simply...  Bitcoin is simply a ledger.  There are no real bitcoins.  There is only a ledger (blockchain), and this ledger says that you have the authority to transact X amount of bitcoin in the future.  If you are on the ledger, then you "own bitcoin".

    So bitcoin is simply 3 things - this ledger (blockchain), transactions, and confirmations of those transactions.

    When I want to send you bitcoin, I let the bitcoin community know by broadcasting a transaction request.  This request sits on a list (mempool) waiting to be confirmed that it is accurate and that I have the authority on the ledger to actually send this bitcoin to you.

    Miners are the people (computers) that confirm these transactions.  They get a small fee from me for sending the transaction, and they also get a little bit of new bitcoin that has never existing on the ledger before as a reward because these transactions take a lot of computing power to confirm.  Then my transaction goes on to the ledger, and the ledger grows and grows.

    And now you have "bitcoin".  But in reality, you dont have anything except an entry on the ledger that has been confirmed as accurate by the miners - and the capability to send that transaction (or part of it) in the future to someone else.

    peace_5

    Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by JEFFMARKETCAP:

    QUOTE Originally Posted by HockeyTeeth: Most of the hipster crowd is oblivious to the energy costs associated with bitcoin mining. Some estimates suggest the energy to mine  bitcoin in three to five yrs will require power levels equal to the total amount of energy produced today.  . Can you explain to me what bitcoin mining is?  Electricity to mine them?

    Put very simply...  Bitcoin is simply a ledger.  There are no real bitcoins.  There is only a ledger (blockchain), and this ledger says that you have the authority to transact X amount of bitcoin in the future.  If you are on the ledger, then you "own bitcoin".

    So bitcoin is simply 3 things - this ledger (blockchain), transactions, and confirmations of those transactions.

    When I want to send you bitcoin, I let the bitcoin community know by broadcasting a transaction request.  This request sits on a list (mempool) waiting to be confirmed that it is accurate and that I have the authority on the ledger to actually send this bitcoin to you.

    Miners are the people (computers) that confirm these transactions.  They get a small fee from me for sending the transaction, and they also get a little bit of new bitcoin that has never existing on the ledger before as a reward because these transactions take a lot of computing power to confirm.  Then my transaction goes on to the ledger, and the ledger grows and grows.

    And now you have "bitcoin".  But in reality, you dont have anything except an entry on the ledger that has been confirmed as accurate by the miners - and the capability to send that transaction (or part of it) in the future to someone else.

    peace_5

     
    Nut_Flopper
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 1:19 PM ET #11

    Quote Originally Posted by JEFFMARKETCAP:

    . Can you explain to me what bitcoin mining is?  Electricity to mine them?  


    Bitcoin is mined/created using computers to solve complex equations to solve/create a block that gets added to the Blockchain ledger i.e. bitcoins.

    Originally your basic desk top computer could mine bitcoins but as time goes on the equations become more complex and more computing power is needed. There are specific computer rigs now that are made to specifically mine bitcoin and people/governments have set up huge banks of computers in warehouses, bunkers or wherever.

    The amount of electricity to run these banks of computers is extreme with astronomical electric costs that it got to the point where you spent more on electricity than bitcoin earned. Hence why people seek out the cheapest power sources.

    Here is an example of a mining operation in China

    https://qz.com/1055126/photos-china-has-one-of-worlds-largest-bitcoin-mines/
    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by JEFFMARKETCAP:

    . Can you explain to me what bitcoin mining is?  Electricity to mine them?  


    Bitcoin is mined/created using computers to solve complex equations to solve/create a block that gets added to the Blockchain ledger i.e. bitcoins.

    Originally your basic desk top computer could mine bitcoins but as time goes on the equations become more complex and more computing power is needed. There are specific computer rigs now that are made to specifically mine bitcoin and people/governments have set up huge banks of computers in warehouses, bunkers or wherever.

    The amount of electricity to run these banks of computers is extreme with astronomical electric costs that it got to the point where you spent more on electricity than bitcoin earned. Hence why people seek out the cheapest power sources.

    Here is an example of a mining operation in China

    https://qz.com/1055126/photos-china-has-one-of-worlds-largest-bitcoin-mines/
     
    HockeyTeeth
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 1:46 PM ET #12

    Thanks for the info. Not anti bitcoin just pointing out the fact that there is a large amount of energy required to mine bitcoin. Now there is also a large amount of energy to mine gold too. Most people are ware of the costs, fuel, equipment labor and so on. When it comes to bitcoin most dont know the levels of energy required to mine it. As to where bitcoin mining occurs currently or in the future i havent researched that at all, just took a look at standard consumption levels. 


    Reply
    Thanks for the info. Not anti bitcoin just pointing out the fact that there is a large amount of energy required to mine bitcoin. Now there is also a large amount of energy to mine gold too. Most people are ware of the costs, fuel, equipment labor and so on. When it comes to bitcoin most dont know the levels of energy required to mine it. As to where bitcoin mining occurs currently or in the future i havent researched that at all, just took a look at standard consumption levels. 


     
    vanzack
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 1:52 PM ET #13

    Quote Originally Posted by HockeyTeeth:

    Thanks for the info. Not anti bitcoin just pointing out the fact that there is a large amount of energy required to mine bitcoin. Now there is also a large amount of energy to mine gold too. Most people are ware of the costs, fuel, equipment labor and so on. When it comes to bitcoin most dont know the levels of energy required to mine it. As to where bitcoin mining occurs currently or in the future i havent researched that at all, just took a look at standard consumption levels.

    Understand.  It is all very interesting, and some of it is counter-intuitive.

    peace_5

    Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by HockeyTeeth:

    Thanks for the info. Not anti bitcoin just pointing out the fact that there is a large amount of energy required to mine bitcoin. Now there is also a large amount of energy to mine gold too. Most people are ware of the costs, fuel, equipment labor and so on. When it comes to bitcoin most dont know the levels of energy required to mine it. As to where bitcoin mining occurs currently or in the future i havent researched that at all, just took a look at standard consumption levels.

    Understand.  It is all very interesting, and some of it is counter-intuitive.

    peace_5

     
    Qwan61
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 3:57 PM ET #14

    Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:

    Alternatively, you could make the argument that alternate cryptocurrencies are not "equivalent" to BTC.

    It is kind of like saying that RC cola or your local supermarkets generic cola is equal to Coca Cola.  Yes, they are both colas, but are they really equivalent?  Should the stock price of your local supermarkets cola be as high as the stock price of Coca Cola because they are both colas?

    Bitcoin has been established as the peggable cryptocurrency.  Ever notice how all of the alt cryptos trade in BTC?  It is because in order to get in and out of anything outside of the top 20 in size, you have to trade BTC for them.

    Bitcoin is also just plain and simple Bitcoin.  Does your mom know about Litecoin or Iota?  Do you see news articles on Monero?  There is value to being the first and biggest on the block.

    Now - if you want to make the argument that BTC is overvalued - please state your case - because you do a horrendous job if that was your intent.  Cryptokiddies aren't the ones driving the price up, because Cryptokiddies aren't buying and selling volume to drive the price.  These are real investors.

    Also, consider the fact that in America - we have a stable government with stable currency.  But step outside for a moment - and ask people in Brazil, Kenya, Haiti, or Venezuela if they would rather have their own currencies or bitcoin that we call volatile but they call stable - and I think you will start to understand the real reasons why bitcoin is valued the way it is.

    It is a scarce resource, that has a vast market share to capture.  It could go to zero, and it could go to a million - but you do nothing to advance the position that bitcoin is overvalued.



    The cola comparison is indeed valid and supports my case for keeping prices in check and BC is pure unadulterated speculation at this point. Eventually BC will fall back to some baseline alternative currency like Coca-cola does when it is a dollar over
    Walmart generic.

    There is no reason whatsoever to own BC because it is overvalued
    due to the other cryptocurrencies and more are and will be produced. The dilution comes by competition..

    BC is converted eventually by people to their base currency when they want to cash out. Tells me you should hold your base currency because eventually BC people will need it when they cash out which I recommend.

    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:

    Alternatively, you could make the argument that alternate cryptocurrencies are not "equivalent" to BTC.

    It is kind of like saying that RC cola or your local supermarkets generic cola is equal to Coca Cola.  Yes, they are both colas, but are they really equivalent?  Should the stock price of your local supermarkets cola be as high as the stock price of Coca Cola because they are both colas?

    Bitcoin has been established as the peggable cryptocurrency.  Ever notice how all of the alt cryptos trade in BTC?  It is because in order to get in and out of anything outside of the top 20 in size, you have to trade BTC for them.

    Bitcoin is also just plain and simple Bitcoin.  Does your mom know about Litecoin or Iota?  Do you see news articles on Monero?  There is value to being the first and biggest on the block.

    Now - if you want to make the argument that BTC is overvalued - please state your case - because you do a horrendous job if that was your intent.  Cryptokiddies aren't the ones driving the price up, because Cryptokiddies aren't buying and selling volume to drive the price.  These are real investors.

    Also, consider the fact that in America - we have a stable government with stable currency.  But step outside for a moment - and ask people in Brazil, Kenya, Haiti, or Venezuela if they would rather have their own currencies or bitcoin that we call volatile but they call stable - and I think you will start to understand the real reasons why bitcoin is valued the way it is.

    It is a scarce resource, that has a vast market share to capture.  It could go to zero, and it could go to a million - but you do nothing to advance the position that bitcoin is overvalued.



    The cola comparison is indeed valid and supports my case for keeping prices in check and BC is pure unadulterated speculation at this point. Eventually BC will fall back to some baseline alternative currency like Coca-cola does when it is a dollar over
    Walmart generic.

    There is no reason whatsoever to own BC because it is overvalued
    due to the other cryptocurrencies and more are and will be produced. The dilution comes by competition..

    BC is converted eventually by people to their base currency when they want to cash out. Tells me you should hold your base currency because eventually BC people will need it when they cash out which I recommend.

     
    vanzack
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 4:03 PM ET #15

    Quote Originally Posted by Qwan61:

    QUOTE Originally Posted by vanzack: Alternatively, you could make the argument that alternate cryptocurrencies are not "equivalent" to BTC. It is kind of like saying that RC cola or your local supermarkets generic cola is equal to Coca Cola.  Yes, they are both colas, but are they really equivalent?  Should the stock price of your local supermarkets cola be as high as the stock price of Coca Cola because they are both colas? Bitcoin has been established as the peggable cryptocurrency.  Ever notice how all of the alt cryptos trade in BTC?  It is because in order to get in and out of anything outside of the top 20 in size, you have to trade BTC for them. Bitcoin is also just plain and simple Bitcoin.  Does your mom know about Litecoin or Iota?  Do you see news articles on Monero?  There is value to being the first and biggest on the block. Now - if you want to make the argument that BTC is overvalued - please state your case - because you do a horrendous job if that was your intent.  Cryptokiddies aren't the ones driving the price up, because Cryptokiddies aren't buying and selling volume to drive the price.  These are real investors. Also, consider the fact that in America - we have a stable government with stable currency.  But step outside for a moment - and ask people in Brazil, Kenya, Haiti, or Venezuela if they would rather have their own currencies or bitcoin that we call volatile but they call stable - and I think you will start to understand the real reasons why bitcoin is valued the way it is. It is a scarce resource, that has a vast market share to capture.  It could go to zero, and it could go to a million - but you do nothing to advance the position that bitcoin is overvalued. The cola comparison is indeed valid and supports my case for keeping prices in check and BC is pure unadulterated speculation at this point. Eventually BC will fall back to some baseline alternative currency like Coca-cola does when it is a dollar over Walmart generic.There is no reason whatsoever to own BC because it is overvalueddue to the other cryptocurrencies and more are and will be produced. The dilution comes by competition..BC is converted eventually by people to their base currency when they want to cash out. Tells me you should hold your base currency because eventually BC people will need it when they cash out which I recommend.

    I understand, and accept your position.  It is all speculation afterall.  Some like the Giants -3, and some like the Cowboys +3.  Telling the future is a tough gig.

    But I try not to use absolutes when I take a position on this because as you say, it is all speculation at this point.

    I find the whole thing facsinating - and TBH - I have been somewhat consumed with it for the past several years which is one reason I have pulled back from sports gambling a little bit.

    GL.

    peace_5

    Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by Qwan61:

    QUOTE Originally Posted by vanzack: Alternatively, you could make the argument that alternate cryptocurrencies are not "equivalent" to BTC. It is kind of like saying that RC cola or your local supermarkets generic cola is equal to Coca Cola.  Yes, they are both colas, but are they really equivalent?  Should the stock price of your local supermarkets cola be as high as the stock price of Coca Cola because they are both colas? Bitcoin has been established as the peggable cryptocurrency.  Ever notice how all of the alt cryptos trade in BTC?  It is because in order to get in and out of anything outside of the top 20 in size, you have to trade BTC for them. Bitcoin is also just plain and simple Bitcoin.  Does your mom know about Litecoin or Iota?  Do you see news articles on Monero?  There is value to being the first and biggest on the block. Now - if you want to make the argument that BTC is overvalued - please state your case - because you do a horrendous job if that was your intent.  Cryptokiddies aren't the ones driving the price up, because Cryptokiddies aren't buying and selling volume to drive the price.  These are real investors. Also, consider the fact that in America - we have a stable government with stable currency.  But step outside for a moment - and ask people in Brazil, Kenya, Haiti, or Venezuela if they would rather have their own currencies or bitcoin that we call volatile but they call stable - and I think you will start to understand the real reasons why bitcoin is valued the way it is. It is a scarce resource, that has a vast market share to capture.  It could go to zero, and it could go to a million - but you do nothing to advance the position that bitcoin is overvalued. The cola comparison is indeed valid and supports my case for keeping prices in check and BC is pure unadulterated speculation at this point. Eventually BC will fall back to some baseline alternative currency like Coca-cola does when it is a dollar over Walmart generic.There is no reason whatsoever to own BC because it is overvalueddue to the other cryptocurrencies and more are and will be produced. The dilution comes by competition..BC is converted eventually by people to their base currency when they want to cash out. Tells me you should hold your base currency because eventually BC people will need it when they cash out which I recommend.

    I understand, and accept your position.  It is all speculation afterall.  Some like the Giants -3, and some like the Cowboys +3.  Telling the future is a tough gig.

    But I try not to use absolutes when I take a position on this because as you say, it is all speculation at this point.

    I find the whole thing facsinating - and TBH - I have been somewhat consumed with it for the past several years which is one reason I have pulled back from sports gambling a little bit.

    GL.

    peace_5

     
    Qwan61
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 4:44 PM ET #16

    Nothing new under the sun. In the midst of the tulip bubble, tulips were being used as a currency too..

    https://www.quora.com/How-were-tulips-used-as-a-currency-by-the-Dutch
    Reply
    Nothing new under the sun. In the midst of the tulip bubble, tulips were being used as a currency too..

    https://www.quora.com/How-were-tulips-used-as-a-currency-by-the-Dutch
     
    666LES
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 5:18 PM ET #17

    In the fever of the tulip bubble in the Netherlands,you could buy a house with a few bulbs.
    Stable or Volatile  are relative terms and a Venezuelian farmer might trade his $$ for Bitcoin only due to the fact that a currency backed by an apparent failing petro-dollar pales in comparison to a shiny bauble supported by a whirlwind of thin,blue air.
    something is always better then nothing.
    Reply
    In the fever of the tulip bubble in the Netherlands,you could buy a house with a few bulbs.
    Stable or Volatile  are relative terms and a Venezuelian farmer might trade his $$ for Bitcoin only due to the fact that a currency backed by an apparent failing petro-dollar pales in comparison to a shiny bauble supported by a whirlwind of thin,blue air.
    something is always better then nothing.
     
    BigGame90
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 6:23 PM ET #18

    Van-  Remeber you posted about this awhile ago so am curious to what you think will happen with the value once all the "coins" run out.

    When bitcoin was created it was the arichitecture was to support a set amount of "coins". What's going to happen when so called coins are not able to be "mined".  Does the system go dark and everyone loses while the original investors cash out?

     

    Cash is not as volitale as bitcoin so how does it continue to skyrocket in value when there's an X amount of "coins"?

     

    BTW had a chance to invest at $6.  shoulda, woulda, coulda.

    Reply

    Van-  Remeber you posted about this awhile ago so am curious to what you think will happen with the value once all the "coins" run out.

    When bitcoin was created it was the arichitecture was to support a set amount of "coins". What's going to happen when so called coins are not able to be "mined".  Does the system go dark and everyone loses while the original investors cash out?

     

    Cash is not as volitale as bitcoin so how does it continue to skyrocket in value when there's an X amount of "coins"?

     

    BTW had a chance to invest at $6.  shoulda, woulda, coulda.

     
    vanzack
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 7:46 PM ET #19

    Quote Originally Posted by BigGame90:

    Van-  Remeber you posted about this awhile ago so am curious to what you think will happen with the value once all the "coins" run out. When bitcoin was created it was the arichitecture was to support a set amount of "coins". What's going to happen when so called coins are not able to be "mined".  Does the system go dark and everyone loses while the original investors cash out?   Cash is not as volitale as bitcoin so how does it continue to skyrocket in value when there's an X amount of "coins"?   BTW had a chance to invest at $6.  shoulda, woulda, coulda.

    Well, I think "running out" of minable BTC will be a non-event.

    Right now, about 80% of all possible BTC is in circulation.  The remaining 20% continues to be mined until about the year 2140.  So I would fully expect that in the next 23 years, something drastic will be changed, added or whatever to make this a non-event.  Think about the internet 23 years ago in the year 1995, and think of it now.

    Miners get 2 rewards when they successfully "mine" a block (figure out the math equation so that a group of transactions get confirmed).  They get the fees from the transaction, and they get new BTC.  When the new BTC runs out, I think it is safe to assume that fees will probably go up to cover it.

    So overall - this is a little like crystal ball stuff - and something that on a list of 100 things I am concerned about with bitcoin would come in 101.

    peace_5

     

    https://www.bitcoinblockhalf.com/

    Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by BigGame90:

    Van-  Remeber you posted about this awhile ago so am curious to what you think will happen with the value once all the "coins" run out. When bitcoin was created it was the arichitecture was to support a set amount of "coins". What's going to happen when so called coins are not able to be "mined".  Does the system go dark and everyone loses while the original investors cash out?   Cash is not as volitale as bitcoin so how does it continue to skyrocket in value when there's an X amount of "coins"?   BTW had a chance to invest at $6.  shoulda, woulda, coulda.

    Well, I think "running out" of minable BTC will be a non-event.

    Right now, about 80% of all possible BTC is in circulation.  The remaining 20% continues to be mined until about the year 2140.  So I would fully expect that in the next 23 years, something drastic will be changed, added or whatever to make this a non-event.  Think about the internet 23 years ago in the year 1995, and think of it now.

    Miners get 2 rewards when they successfully "mine" a block (figure out the math equation so that a group of transactions get confirmed).  They get the fees from the transaction, and they get new BTC.  When the new BTC runs out, I think it is safe to assume that fees will probably go up to cover it.

    So overall - this is a little like crystal ball stuff - and something that on a list of 100 things I am concerned about with bitcoin would come in 101.

    peace_5

     

    https://www.bitcoinblockhalf.com/

     
    JEFFMARKETCAP
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 8:02 PM ET #20

    Thanks for the explanations Vanzack and Nut Flopper

    I am thinking of getting into XRP ripple.  I just signed up to a bitstamp account.  I have been watching XRP since it was 20 cents.  I just never got around to opening an account and now it's on a tear.  The thing that concerns me about it is there are a ton of XRP coins which bring the dilution factor in.  So I doubt it could possibly be as high priced as Bitcoin.  But I think it will still be a good investment.  Overall I think this crypto run will be over at some point in 2018.  Wallstreet now has futures on Bitcoin.  The banks do not want Bitcoin to succeed I believe.  I believe they will inflate the price and crash it.  However I believe that XRP will survive.  The banks are using it and it will survive from what I have read.  Who knows I might be wrong but just a hunch.  
    Reply
    Thanks for the explanations Vanzack and Nut Flopper

    I am thinking of getting into XRP ripple.  I just signed up to a bitstamp account.  I have been watching XRP since it was 20 cents.  I just never got around to opening an account and now it's on a tear.  The thing that concerns me about it is there are a ton of XRP coins which bring the dilution factor in.  So I doubt it could possibly be as high priced as Bitcoin.  But I think it will still be a good investment.  Overall I think this crypto run will be over at some point in 2018.  Wallstreet now has futures on Bitcoin.  The banks do not want Bitcoin to succeed I believe.  I believe they will inflate the price and crash it.  However I believe that XRP will survive.  The banks are using it and it will survive from what I have read.  Who knows I might be wrong but just a hunch.  
     
    BigGame90
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 8:04 PM ET #21

    Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:

    QUOTE Originally Posted by BigGame90: Van-  Remeber you posted about this awhile ago so am curious to what you think will happen with the value once all the "coins" run out. When bitcoin was created it was the arichitecture was to support a set amount of "coins". What's going to happen when so called coins are not able to be "mined".  Does the system go dark and everyone loses while the original investors cash out?   Cash is not as volitale as bitcoin so how does it continue to skyrocket in value when there's an X amount of "coins"?   BTW had a chance to invest at $6.  shoulda, woulda, coulda. Well, I think "running out" of minable BTC will be a non-event. Right now, about 80% of all possible BTC is in circulation.  The remaining 20% continues to be mined until about the year 2140.  So I would fully expect that in the next 23 years, something drastic will be changed, added or whatever to make this a non-event.  Think about the internet 23 years ago in the year 1995, and think of it now. Miners get 2 rewards when they successfully "mine" a block (figure out the math equation so that a group of transactions get confirmed).  They get the fees from the transaction, and they get new BTC.  When the new BTC runs out, I think it is safe to assume that fees will probably go up to cover it. So overall - this is a little like crystal ball stuff - and something that on a list of 100 things I am concerned about with bitcoin would come in 101.   https://www.bitcoinblockhalf.com/

     

     

    I am not 100% certain but when I did my research over a handful of years ago, I thought coins were set to run out before 2040. i think it was around 2025 actually. I believe bitcoin hasn't been around for over 15 years so if 80% of coins are released today, I find it hard to believe the next 20% will take over 100 years to mine.

    I also thought miners only recived coins and not a fee when successfuly completing or mining an equation. But then again, it's been a handful of years since I've done research on this so I could be wrong.

    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:

    QUOTE Originally Posted by BigGame90: Van-  Remeber you posted about this awhile ago so am curious to what you think will happen with the value once all the "coins" run out. When bitcoin was created it was the arichitecture was to support a set amount of "coins". What's going to happen when so called coins are not able to be "mined".  Does the system go dark and everyone loses while the original investors cash out?   Cash is not as volitale as bitcoin so how does it continue to skyrocket in value when there's an X amount of "coins"?   BTW had a chance to invest at $6.  shoulda, woulda, coulda. Well, I think "running out" of minable BTC will be a non-event. Right now, about 80% of all possible BTC is in circulation.  The remaining 20% continues to be mined until about the year 2140.  So I would fully expect that in the next 23 years, something drastic will be changed, added or whatever to make this a non-event.  Think about the internet 23 years ago in the year 1995, and think of it now. Miners get 2 rewards when they successfully "mine" a block (figure out the math equation so that a group of transactions get confirmed).  They get the fees from the transaction, and they get new BTC.  When the new BTC runs out, I think it is safe to assume that fees will probably go up to cover it. So overall - this is a little like crystal ball stuff - and something that on a list of 100 things I am concerned about with bitcoin would come in 101.   https://www.bitcoinblockhalf.com/

     

     

    I am not 100% certain but when I did my research over a handful of years ago, I thought coins were set to run out before 2040. i think it was around 2025 actually. I believe bitcoin hasn't been around for over 15 years so if 80% of coins are released today, I find it hard to believe the next 20% will take over 100 years to mine.

    I also thought miners only recived coins and not a fee when successfuly completing or mining an equation. But then again, it's been a handful of years since I've done research on this so I could be wrong.

     
    TRAIN69
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    Posted: Dec. 14, 2017 - 10:58 PM ET #22

    So Van.....outside of the top few cryptocurrencies already at a few hundred each, are there any really worth looking at? I assume there will be a lot of startups, but only a handful will be relevant long term. Are there any other ways to invest in this as a parallel (storage etc)? I can obviously google stuff, but I know you already have more info than I can dig up in a couple days of surfing the net.....an_wink

    Reply

    So Van.....outside of the top few cryptocurrencies already at a few hundred each, are there any really worth looking at? I assume there will be a lot of startups, but only a handful will be relevant long term. Are there any other ways to invest in this as a parallel (storage etc)? I can obviously google stuff, but I know you already have more info than I can dig up in a couple days of surfing the net.....an_wink

     
    vanzack
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    Posted: Dec. 15, 2017 - 1:21 PM ET #23

    Quote Originally Posted by BigGame90:

    QUOTE Originally Posted by vanzack: QUOTE Originally Posted by BigGame90: Van-  Remeber you posted about this awhile ago so am curious to what you think will happen with the value once all the "coins" run out. When bitcoin was created it was the arichitecture was to support a set amount of "coins". What's going to happen when so called coins are not able to be "mined".  Does the system go dark and everyone loses while the original investors cash out?   Cash is not as volitale as bitcoin so how does it continue to skyrocket in value when there's an X amount of "coins"?   BTW had a chance to invest at $6.  shoulda, woulda, coulda. Well, I think "running out" of minable BTC will be a non-event. Right now, about 80% of all possible BTC is in circulation.  The remaining 20% continues to be mined until about the year 2140.  So I would fully expect that in the next 23 years, something drastic will be changed, added or whatever to make this a non-event.  Think about the internet 23 years ago in the year 1995, and think of it now. Miners get 2 rewards when they successfully "mine" a block (figure out the math equation so that a group of transactions get confirmed).  They get the fees from the transaction, and they get new BTC.  When the new BTC runs out, I think it is safe to assume that fees will probably go up to cover it. So overall - this is a little like crystal ball stuff - and something that on a list of 100 things I am concerned about with bitcoin would come in 101.   https://www.bitcoinblockhalf.com/     I am not 100% certain but when I did my research over a handful of years ago, I thought coins were set to run out before 2040. i think it was around 2025 actually. I believe bitcoin hasn't been around for over 15 years so if 80% of coins are released today, I find it hard to believe the next 20% will take over 100 years to mine. I also thought miners only recived coins and not a fee when successfuly completing or mining an equation. But then again, it's been a handful of years since I've done research on this so I could be wrong.

     

    It is not a linear release of BTC.  It uses a halving formula.  Google "bitcoin halving" for a better explanation.

    Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by BigGame90:

    QUOTE Originally Posted by vanzack: QUOTE Originally Posted by BigGame90: Van-  Remeber you posted about this awhile ago so am curious to what you think will happen with the value once all the "coins" run out. When bitcoin was created it was the arichitecture was to support a set amount of "coins". What's going to happen when so called coins are not able to be "mined".  Does the system go dark and everyone loses while the original investors cash out?   Cash is not as volitale as bitcoin so how does it continue to skyrocket in value when there's an X amount of "coins"?   BTW had a chance to invest at $6.  shoulda, woulda, coulda. Well, I think "running out" of minable BTC will be a non-event. Right now, about 80% of all possible BTC is in circulation.  The remaining 20% continues to be mined until about the year 2140.  So I would fully expect that in the next 23 years, something drastic will be changed, added or whatever to make this a non-event.  Think about the internet 23 years ago in the year 1995, and think of it now. Miners get 2 rewards when they successfully "mine" a block (figure out the math equation so that a group of transactions get confirmed).  They get the fees from the transaction, and they get new BTC.  When the new BTC runs out, I think it is safe to assume that fees will probably go up to cover it. So overall - this is a little like crystal ball stuff - and something that on a list of 100 things I am concerned about with bitcoin would come in 101.   https://www.bitcoinblockhalf.com/     I am not 100% certain but when I did my research over a handful of years ago, I thought coins were set to run out before 2040. i think it was around 2025 actually. I believe bitcoin hasn't been around for over 15 years so if 80% of coins are released today, I find it hard to believe the next 20% will take over 100 years to mine. I also thought miners only recived coins and not a fee when successfuly completing or mining an equation. But then again, it's been a handful of years since I've done research on this so I could be wrong.

     

    It is not a linear release of BTC.  It uses a halving formula.  Google "bitcoin halving" for a better explanation.

     
    vanzack
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    Posted: Dec. 15, 2017 - 1:25 PM ET #24

    Quote Originally Posted by TRAIN69:

    So Van.....outside of the top few cryptocurrencies already at a few hundred each, are there any really worth looking at? I assume there will be a lot of startups, but only a handful will be relevant long term. Are there any other ways to invest in this as a parallel (storage etc)? I can obviously google stuff, but I know you already have more info than I can dig up in a couple days of surfing the net.....

    I honestly do not know much about the characteristics of alt coins outside of the top 5 or so.

    I can tell you that if you were to make a flow chart with classes of currency - fiat currency would be A (dollars, euro etc), BTC would be B, and all other alt crypto would be C.

    You cant get from A to C (in most cases outside of the top 10) without going through B.

    This gives BTC a huge advantage, because it is the peggable crypto currency.

    So even though you can make an argument that monero or iota have better features than BTC, bitcoin is still the elephant in the room (at least for now).

    So because I have no idea what causes the #153rd cryptocurrency to go up one day and down the next - besides pump and dump speculation - I have no input.  Others I am sure do.

    peace_5

    Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
    Reply

    Quote Originally Posted by TRAIN69:

    So Van.....outside of the top few cryptocurrencies already at a few hundred each, are there any really worth looking at? I assume there will be a lot of startups, but only a handful will be relevant long term. Are there any other ways to invest in this as a parallel (storage etc)? I can obviously google stuff, but I know you already have more info than I can dig up in a couple days of surfing the net.....

    I honestly do not know much about the characteristics of alt coins outside of the top 5 or so.

    I can tell you that if you were to make a flow chart with classes of currency - fiat currency would be A (dollars, euro etc), BTC would be B, and all other alt crypto would be C.

    You cant get from A to C (in most cases outside of the top 10) without going through B.

    This gives BTC a huge advantage, because it is the peggable crypto currency.

    So even though you can make an argument that monero or iota have better features than BTC, bitcoin is still the elephant in the room (at least for now).

    So because I have no idea what causes the #153rd cryptocurrency to go up one day and down the next - besides pump and dump speculation - I have no input.  Others I am sure do.

    peace_5

     
     
    TRAIN69
    TRAIN69
    Legend
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Oct, 2002
    Posts: 55668
    Posted: Dec. 15, 2017 - 3:19 PM ET #25

    Gotcha. Are there any companies/stocks that are gonna prosper from cryptocurrency? Not the coins themselves.....storage companies, software etc? Im not tech savvy, but theres gotta be some peripheral things that cash in on the new wave of doing businss with cryto

     

    Thanks for the response brotherpeace_5

    Reply

    Gotcha. Are there any companies/stocks that are gonna prosper from cryptocurrency? Not the coins themselves.....storage companies, software etc? Im not tech savvy, but theres gotta be some peripheral things that cash in on the new wave of doing businss with cryto

     

    Thanks for the response brotherpeace_5

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