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Anyone wan tto argue that buying a car is better than leasing a car?

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Posted: #51
Quote Originally Posted by t6rider:

I would rather be locked in a closet for a week with Jason Collins then ever step foot in a car dealership again. I can't stand those criminals. They should all be locked up the way they try to steal from every person. They're in the business of stealing people's money. 


My last experience was in 2005. We had decent credit and we had very good income at the time. My wife like the new Pathfinder at the time. I walked in, was a person as I usually am, showing them Im not gonna be pushed around. It was a Pathfinder LE. Fully loaded. DVD, leather, everything. 


I sat down and listened to their bullshit for an hour. The sticker was 37,900. We went early in the month, which was a mistake. Before they threw me out because of cussing and assholeness, I told them get the Lease Payment down to $400 a month and I'll come sign right now. No money down No bullshit. 


Three weeks later I get a call and they asked if I was still interested. I said I'll come sign today if you guy get it at $400. I couldn't believe they caved. I signed that day. I forgot the interest rate. I probably still got screwed. Felt like a sweet deal. Probably wasn't. I'm retarded. 

 
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Posted: #52
Leasing (i.e. Renting) your vehicle is not very smart. 

The wisest thing to do is buy a vehicle that is several years old.  Most of the depreciation takes place in the first few years of any vehicle.
 
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Posted: #53
Quote Originally Posted by mattbrot:


Bill -- in regards to the bolded part above -- this is true. But it should be the case. Just as Club should make his decision based on his personal situation of how he views cars. 

Everybody's personal situation shapes the decision.
- How much do you have to spend
- do you view a ride as a luxury piece or just as a way to get from point A to B?
- How long do you plan on owning it? Do you itch to get in new wheels every few years or are you straight with the same thing for a while?
- What is your annual mileage?
etc...

The pros and cons of leasing/buying changes depending on the answer to these types of questions.

 
Yea, I agree. I intended that more towards the people who believe that leasing should be thrown out completely thinking it's never a viable option. 
 
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Posted: #54
If you buy a used car, even a decent one, instead of leasing, youre basically still making payments, just in a different form. You're paying for repairs which are payments in itself that are sometimes cheap and other times, really expensive. The benefit of buying used and paying for repairs is, sometimes you can put it off for a month or two when you are broke as long as it doesnt cause other parts to fail, because you let the repair go for too long. 

I think cars are one of the worst investments next to a goldigging wife. 
 
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Posted: #55
Quote Originally Posted by Rush51:

Leasing (i.e. Renting) your vehicle is not very smart. 

The wisest thing to do is buy a vehicle that is several years old.  Most of the depreciation takes place in the first few years of any vehicle.

100% true.

However, some people do not have this option.  They may be in sales or consulting or a doctor, etc and need to drive a nice car.

Would you want your surgeon, or lawyer, or financial advisor driving a 9 year old Accord?  

Then leasing makes a lot of sense.  You never have a car more than 3 years old.


 
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Posted: #56
Quote Originally Posted by timbaland99:

If you buy a used car, even a decent one, instead of leasing, youre basically still making payments, just in a different form. You're paying for repairs which are payments in itself that are sometimes cheap and other times, really expensive. The benefit of buying used and paying for repairs is, sometimes you can put it off for a month or two when you are broke as long as it doesnt cause other parts to fail, because you let the repair go for too long. 

I think cars are one of the worst investments next to a goldigging wife. 

Is there really such a thing? Or a guy who got fooled from da puzzy?

 
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Posted: #57

Club.. I have been a fleet manager for a several years.. So I have much experience  I'm an old man now so let me tell you. Do not lease..Buy one.

Begin with a late model. 2012 or 2013. But buy if between June until October, because dealers want to start getting ready for the 2014 in September.

Preferably if you can buy from a private owner . Look for an old geezer like me selling a low mile. Do not buy a foreign name brand. values are changing on them. US cars are equal if not better and the public is beginning to realize this. Forget Toyota, prices are too high and values are not what they used to be. Get rid of that Camry it has a girly impression, sorry but it's true, just ask any gal. Do not trade it in, sell it outright for top dollar, lots of female buyers out there.

Buy with your needs for the future in mind. Change the oil every 4 k miles, at the dealership only, it's just as cheap and they are more familiar with your type of car. Put new tires, brakes and battery when needed. That's about all they need nowadays and drive it to 200,000 miles. 

 

Buy American

 

 
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Posted: #58
I will. Buy a used car. There you go.
 
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Posted: #59
One more thing... Change the fuel and air filters at 12 K miles and it will save you money in the long run.. Check engine light is very sensitive too.  You need to change the oil more frequently because vehicles are so sensitive to temperature, when the oil gets a little thicker it's noticeable. My transmissions even changes slightly different just before my 4k oil change. 
 
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Posted: #60

Club -

This just boils down to a cost of ownership analysis.

Look at total costs over a lease vs a buy over the period you intend to keep the car.

One thing to look at is lease turn in fees - often there is some BS 500 dollar charge or similar to just turn in the car.  Alternatively, you save on SALES taxes on a lease because you only pay taxes monthly on the amount you pay - rather than the whole amount of the car upfront.  Also - a lease allows you to definitively lock up a residual value on the car rather than taking a chance on what it could be - something that you may or may not like.

I look at leasing as simply another way to finance a car.  If it makes sense from a total cost of ownership standpoint - then do it.  Anyone who makes blanket statements about interest rates - or own vs rent - really doesn't have anything to offer you.  It is a case by case basis - and often a week by week basis for the same car at the same dealership depending on rates and promos.

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Legend
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Posted: #61

You should be able to do something like this:

3 year cost of ownership for my car:

Lease = 12,150
Buy = 11,185

Or something like that.  You should be able to calculate those numbers and then simply decide based on cost of ownership.

 

Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
 
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Posted: #62
Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:

You should be able to do something like this:

3 year cost of ownership for my car:

Lease = 12,150
Buy = 11,185

Or something like that.  You should be able to calculate those numbers and then simply decide based on cost of ownership.

 



yeah, if i did it, i'd get the entire deal on paper and take it home and work it out. 

i guess that's one reason (of several) why they really don't want you to leave the store without signing up. 

i probably will lease a car at some point because i'd like to drive a nice new car for once and don't want to pay full price for a depreciating asset or own a depreciating asset for too long. 
 
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Posted: #63
I've always thought of it as after 3 years what do i have to show for my investment.
Take a Nissan Altima for example

Lease $2500 down + $289 month X 36 months =$10,404 + $2500= $12,904
Buy  $454 monthly for 60 months = $27,240 + $2500 = $ 29,740

Assuming you Leased another car around the same amount
 $289 X 24 months = $6,936 + $2500 down = $9.436

You would've spent $22,340 in 5 years leasing with nothing to show for it versus only $7400 more and you own the car with no monthly payments freeing up $289 month. 
 
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Posted: #64
Quote Originally Posted by BigChris51:

I've always thought of it as after 3 years what do i have to show for my investment.
Take a Nissan Altima for example

Lease $2500 down + $289 month X 36 months =$10,404 + $2500= $12,904
Buy  $454 monthly for 60 months = $27,240 + $2500 = $ 29,740

Assuming you Leased another car around the same amount
 $289 X 24 months = $6,936 + $2500 down = $9.436

You would've spent $22,340 in 5 years leasing with nothing to show for it versus only $7400 more and you own the car with no monthly payments freeing up $289 month. 

Ah, but what you are missing is the 3 year cost to cost comparison.

Take your example....

A.  Lease = $12,904
B.  Buy = 454*36= $16,344  ....  Now add back any difference in what the car is worth and what you owe to make your total 3 year cost of ownership.

I am not advocating leasing.  But you have to do an apples to apples cost comparison.  Your comparison is driving a car in years 1 2 and 3, and then another car in 1 and 2 - vs driving a car in years 1 2 3 4 5.   Not the same.

Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
 
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Posted: #65
Quote Originally Posted by mattbrot:

This is a tough one that can go either way. Depends also on how you view cars. Personally I do not need a new fancy ride every 3 - 5 years so I like the idea of having a car paid off in a few years and then not carrying any monthly payment. We have a 06 Altima (75K miles) and an 09 Civic (30 K miles) both paid off for about 2 years now. We take care of the cars etc... and so will likely drive them for a while.

I do not view them as an investment in the sense that we will make money off of them but I view them as an investment in the sense that for the past two years we have had no payments and if all goes well we will not have any payments for another 5 - 7 years. If you lease you can always trade in every now and then but you will always have a min $350 monthly payment.   

BINGO!

Think of leasing as renting from AVIS.  You'll figure it out eventually.
 
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Posted: #66
Quote Originally Posted by Rush51:

Leasing (i.e. Renting) your vehicle is not very smart. 

The wisest thing to do is buy a vehicle that is several years old.  Most of the depreciation takes place in the first few years of any vehicle.

Spot on. 
 
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Posted: #67
Van 

I understand your point and you do make a good one. 

What if we did that lease arrangement for 3 lease agreements over a 9 year period?  
 
it depends on the person themselves, their financial situation - life situation - how much they owe the bookie. , 

Some people can just drive 1 car for 10 years and end up saving a lot over time.  

I think leasing is great if you can't afford to buy a Mercedes or BMW and want higher status. 

Bottom line is the car companies have every angle covered.
 
 
 
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Posted: #68
Quote Originally Posted by mattbrot:

This is a tough one that can go either way. Depends also on how you view cars. Personally I do not need a new fancy ride every 3 - 5 years so I like the idea of having a car paid off in a few years and then not carrying any monthly payment. We have a 06 Altima (75K miles) and an 09 Civic (30 K miles) both paid off for about 2 years now. We take care of the cars etc... and so will likely drive them for a while.

I do not view them as an investment in the sense that we will make money off of them but I view them as an investment in the sense that for the past two years we have had no payments and if all goes well we will not have any payments for another 5 - 7 years. If you lease you can always trade in every now and then but you will always have a min $350 monthly payment.   

Good for you 

Take the extra $$$$, Act as if you still have 2 car payments and put it towards your mortgage, kids collage fund, IRA, or whatever will help you cut down your retirement age by a few years. 
 
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Posted: #69
Quote Originally Posted by BigChris51:

Van 

I understand your point and you do make a good one. 

What if we did that lease arrangement for 3 lease agreements over a 9 year period?  
 
it depends on the person themselves, their financial situation - life situation - how much they owe the bookie. , 

Some people can just drive 1 car for 10 years and end up saving a lot over time.  

I think leasing is great if you can't afford to buy a Mercedes or BMW and want higher status. 

Bottom line is the car companies have every angle covered.
 
 

Im not making a judgement on whether it is wise to drive a new car every 3 years.  Lots would say it is unwise.

But the way I understood the original post was that he was asking for a 3 year decision - or at least that's the way I interpreted it.

I don't think anyone would argue that driving a new car for 9 years is financially the best move rather than leasing 3 times, but.....

How about we phrase it this way....  If you knew you were going to die 3 years from today - would it be wiser to lease of buy for the next 3 years?  That can be calculated at time of purchase - and sometimes it would be lease and sometimes it would be buy.  Its not black and white like most posters in this thread are suggesting.

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Posted: #70
Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:

Ah, but what you are missing is the 3 year cost to cost comparison.

Take your example....

A.  Lease = $12,904
B.  Buy = 454*36= $16,344  ....  Now add back any difference in what the car is worth and what you owe to make your total 3 year cost of ownership.

I am not advocating leasing.  But you have to do an apples to apples cost comparison.  Your comparison is driving a car in years 1 2 and 3, and then another car in 1 and 2 - vs driving a car in years 1 2 3 4 5.   Not the same.



that's what i was hoping someone would mention with one of my earlier posts.  i see the argument that at the end of a lease, you've made payments and have nothing to show for it so you've lost what was paid in 3 years.  but they fail to make the comparison that three years after you purchase a vehicle you've incurred a similar loss due to depreciation.  in some sense, there may not be a big difference.

and there is a value to having a new car for 3 years under warranty that you don't have to buy and can give back.

for instance let's say there is a car that costs $35,000 that will be worth $23,000 after three years.  let's say the cost of leasing it for 3 years is $14,000.  if you place a value on having the opportunity to drive the new car for 3 years at or near $2,000 spread out over 3 years, then leasing might be worth it.
 
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Posted: #71
Car dealers ------><------ Consumers 
 
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Posted: #72
I've never personally leased a car myself, but have worked for many years liquidating used cars for banks and lease companies.  I would say the biggest factor when leasing a vehicle is the residual value.  When you lease a car, they project what the value of the vehicle will be in 3 years.  Unfortunately, sometimes the market conditions are very unpredictable, as things went down a few years ago.  They are essentially predicting what the value of the car is going to be in advance, but as the say goes; "garbage happens".  When the market took a big downturn a few years ago and gas prices were spiking, car dealers did not take that into account when original setting residual values.  So basically if you leased a $40k car in 2007 with a residual value of $25k after 3 years, it ended up only being worth $18k and you were on the hook for more than anticipated.  Even Kelly Blue Book had issues setting any sort of market value for used vehicles because for things were changing on a week to week basis, and most dealers will use KBB as a market guide.  Obviously the market doesn't crash like it did often, but it's definitely wise to consider the future used car market and how your cars value will fare over the life of the lease.

Personally, I will never buy a brand new car.  If I ever wanted to buy one, I would consider something 1-2 yrs old with very low mileage.  It will most likely still be under the manufacturer warranty (extended warranties are very cheap nowadays too) and as mentioned earlier, most people who purchase higher end vehicles tend to take better overall car of them.  There's not much damage you can do to a vehicle driving it for 10-30k miles unless you're really trying to.  GL whatever you decide.
 
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Posted: #73
Quote Originally Posted by don juan:

Club.. I have been a fleet manager for a several years.. So I have much experience  I'm an old man now so let me tell you. Do not lease..Buy one.

Begin with a late model. 2012 or 2013. But buy if between June until October, because dealers want to start getting ready for the 2014 in September.

Preferably if you can buy from a private owner . Look for an old geezer like me selling a low mile. Do not buy a foreign name brand. values are changing on them. US cars are NOT equal and definately not better and the public knows this. Forget Toyota, prices are too high and values are not what they used to be. Get rid of that Camry it has a girly impression, sorry but it's true, just ask any gal. Do not trade it in, sell it outright for top dollar, lots of female buyers out there.

Buy with your needs for the future in mind. Change the oil every 4 k miles, at the dealership only, that way our service department can put a spark plug upp your A$$ with no lube. it's SEEMS just as cheap and they are more familiar with your type of car so they can set it up to breakdown. Put new tires, brakes and battery when needed. That's about all they need nowadays and drive it to 200,000 miles. 

 

Buy EUROPEAN

 



don -- you are contributing twice in the same day with a good post im shocked. i did correct a couple things you had wrong but for the most part you know whats up 
 
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Posted: #74

Kelly, you have much confidence, so as your avatar says you are........

My dealership has changed my oil the last 6 times for 24.95 plus tax. Including filter, topping off all the fluids and tire pressure check. They didn't try to sell me anything except to ask if I would consider trading.

I have known many people, including myself who were screwed at one of those quick-lube places. They high pressure you for everything.

A good friend bought a brand new car and the first oil change was at a quick lube. The kid put in the wrong filter and my friend had no oil when the check engine light came on after driving a few miles. He had to take them to court to pay for the damage.

I know of many horror stories like that. But to each his own.

Thank God there are real patriots who buy American. not fair weather patriots.

 
 
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Posted: #75
VALUE: Buying a used car for around $5K that was lady driven, lightly used, has low mileage, well maintained, and highly reviewed online/guides is the way to go. You can usually get a few solid years and even resell it for half of what you paid, and repeat the process again.
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