is it possible to be Pro-person and Anti-Zionism?

Hint for the uninformed regarding hatespeech: If you view the word Zionist or Zionism in an article skip it. It's most likely a racist diatribe.

 

The people who live in Israel aren't Zionists; they're Israelis.

The people who live in Israel aren't Zionests; they're Israelis.

    And Zionism = the Jewish people's desire for a homeland. Nothing more.

No wreckage, nothing. 

It absolutely is. It just seems to me that a large percentage of time, when someone is "anti-Zionist" they are using it for cover for anti-Jewish racism. Kinda like how crazy right wingers say that they aren't white supremacists per se, they are just white nationalists. 

Truthers do us all a disservice. They find links between events that just aren't there.
Where they should demand a through investigation of the Bush administration in general they come across as bat shit crazy people with insane agendas.
Governments do commit crimes but when you distort everything you are in fact helping them. It IS easy to say "these results and conclusions are crazy" - because the ARE.

I think the Bush administration (FBI, CIA etc.) was incompetent - and this is also a crime to me.

I would most respectfully change one word. I would make the "when you distort" to "when anyone distorts"...

Why cover up a lie when a tiny bit of disinformation mixed with paranoia  and run away imagination can turn the truth into absolute idiocy...

So, what knocked over the light poles?

The US Marines,of course.

everyone knows it was Cheney's oilmen

Someone please speak up and say that the light poles were staged in advance

11 years later

 no arrests

no substantive litigation,

 none of the 1000's people involved in the cover-up have broke

 truthers alive and well

Thanks for clarifying this Kap. Honestly I'm trying to make sure people realize there IS a difference. I support person,Christians,& Muslims and their faiths, but Zionism is something more sinister I believe. BMA was so quick to defend Zionism without acknowledging the possible crimes being committed by a Zionist group.

So when I first started a thread regarding Zionism, automatically people like BMA thought the thread was against the person or a anti-Semitic rant when it is not. Every group or race has their rotten apples and it is unfair to the innocent people who are the real victims. However, wars are begun and 2 wrongs don't make a right, so there seems to be only one story being told, and it's not 100% truthful.

when you have stuff like this happening...doesn't it make you go "hmmmm?"

President Bush and Vice President Cheney agreed to testify only under several conditions:

They would be allowed to testify jointly.
They would not be required to take an oath before testifying.
The testimony would not be recorded electronically or transcribed, and that the only record would be notes taken by one of the commission staffers.
These notes would not be made public.

sounds like their innocent right? give me a break. I think Bush Jr. is too dumb and Cheney knows something and he's hiding it. Then again when Jr was in office everyone who served under Sr. served under Jr. go figure.

peace brothers

 people who are opinionated and dont understand the laws of physics

Ok, building 7, which was a steel building, collapsed into dust 

World Trade Center Disaster Study funded by Congress

conclusion: no inside job....

SUMMARY OF FINDINGS

Objective 1: Determine why and how WTC 1 and WTC 2 collapsed following the initial impacts of the aircraft.

• The two aircraft hit the towers at high speed and did considerable damage to principal structural components (core columns, floors, and perimeter columns) that were directly impacted by the aircraft or associated debris. However, the towers withstood the impacts and would have remained standing were it not for the dislodged insulation (fireproofing) and the subsequent multi-floor fires. The robustness of the perimeter frame-tube system and the large size of the buildings helped the towers withstand the impact. The structural system redistributed loads from places of aircraft impact, avoiding larger scale damage upon impact. The hat truss, a feature atop each tower which was intended to support a television antenna, prevented earlier collapse of the building core. In each tower, a different combination of impact damage and heat-weakened structural components contributed to the abrupt structural collapse.
• In WTC 1, the fires weakened the core columns and caused the floors on the south side of the building to sag. The floors pulled the heated south perimeter columns inward, reducing their capacity to support the building above. Their neighboring columns quickly became overloaded as columns on the south wall buckled. The top section of the building tilted to the south and began its descent. The time from aircraft impact to collapse initiation was largely determined by how long it took for the fires to weaken the building core and to reach the south side of the building and weaken the perimeter columns and floors.
• In WTC 2, the core was damaged severely at the southeast corner and was restrained by the east and south walls via the hat truss and the floors. The steady burning fires on the east side of the building caused the floors there to sag. The floors pulled the heated east perimeter columns inward, reducing their capacity to support the building above. Their neighboring columns quickly became overloaded as columns on the east wall buckled. The top section of the building tilted to the east and to the south and began its descent. The time from aircraft impact to collapse initiation was largely determined by the time for the fires to weaken the perimeter columns and floor assemblies on the east and the south sides of the building. WTC2 collapsed more quickly than WTC 1 because there was more aircraft damage to the building core, including one of the heavily loaded corner columns, and there were early and persistent fires on the east side of the building, where the aircraft had extensively dislodged insulation from the structural steel.
• The WTC towers likely would not have collapsed under the combined effects of aircraft impact damage and the extensive, multi-floor fires that were encountered on September11, 2001, if the thermal insulation had not been widely dislodged or had been only minimally dislodged by aircraft impact.
• In the absence of structural and insulation damage, a conventional fire substantially similar to or less intense than the fires encountered on September 11, 2001, likely would not have led to the collapse of a WTC tower.
• NIST found no corroborating evidence for alternative hypotheses suggesting that the WTC towers were brought down by controlled demolition using explosives planted prior to September 11, 2001. NIST also did not find any evidence that missiles were fired at or hit the towers. Instead, photographs and videos from several angles clearly showed that the collapse initiated at the fire and impact floors and that the collapse progressed from the initiating floors downward, until the dust clouds obscured the view.

Objective 2: Determine why the injuries and fatalities were so high or low depending on location, including all technical aspects of fire protection, occupant behavior, evacuation, and emergency response.

• Approximately 87 percent of the estimated 17,400 occupants of the towers, and 99 percent of those located below the impact floors, evacuated successfully. In WTC 1, where the aircraft destroyed all escape routes, 1,355 people were trapped in the upper floors when the building collapsed. One hundred seven people who were below the impact floors did not survive. Since the flow of people from the building had slowed considerably 20 min before the tower collapsed, the stairwell capacity was adequate to evacuate the occupants on that morning.
• In WTC 2, before the second aircraft strike, about 3,000 people got low enough in the building to escape by a combination of self-evacuation and use of elevators. The aircraft destroyed the operation of the elevators and the use of two of the three stairways. Eighteen people from above the impact zone found a passage through the damaged third stairway (Stairwell A) and escaped. The other 619people in or above the impact zone perished. Eleven people who were below the impact floors did not survive. As in WTC 1, shortly before collapse, the flow of people from the building had slowed considerably, indicating that the stairwell capacity was adequate that morning.
• About 6 percent of the survivors described themselves as mobility impaired, with recent injury and chronic illness being the most common causes; few, however, required a wheelchair. Among the 118 decedents below the aircraft impact floors, investigators identified seven who were mobility impaired, but were unable to determine the mobility capability of the remaining 111.
• A principal factor limiting the loss of life was that the buildings were one-third to one-half occupied at the time of the attacks. NIST estimated that if the towers had been fully occupied with 20,000occupants each, it would have taken just over 3 hours to evacuate the buildings and about 14,000people might have perished because the stairwell capacity would not have been sufficient to evacuate that many people in the available time. Egress capacity required by current building codes is determined by single floor calculations that are independent of building height and does not consider the time for full building evacuation.
• Due to the presence of assembly use spaces at the top of each tower (Windows on the World restaurant complex in WTC 1 and the Top of the World observation deck in WTC 2) that were designed to accommodate over 1,000 occupants per floor, the New York City Building Code would have required a minimum of four independent means of egress (stairs), one more than the three that were available in the buildings. Given the low occupancy level on September11,2001, NIST found that the issue of egress capacity from these places of assembly, or from elsewhere in the buildings, was not a significant factor on that day. It is conceivable that such a fourth stairwell, depending on its location and the effects of aircraft impact on its functional integrity, could have remained passable, allowing evacuation by an unknown number of additional occupants from above the floors of impact. If the buildings had been filled to their capacity with 20,000 occupants, the required fourth stairway would likely have mitigated the insufficient egress capacity for conducting a full building evacuation within the available time.
• Evacuation was assisted by participation in fire drills within the previous year by two-thirds of survivors and perhaps hindered by a Local Law that prevented employers from requiring occupants to practice using the stairways. The stairways were not easily navigated in some locations due to their design, which included "transfer hallways," where evacuees had to traverse from one stairway to another location where the stairs continued. Additionally, many occupants were unprepared for the physical challenge of full building evacuation.

• The functional integrity and survivability of the stairwells was affected by the separation of the stairwells and the structural integrity of stairwell enclosures. In the impact region of WTC 1, the stairwell separation was the smallest over the building height—clustered well within the building core—and all stairwells were destroyed by the aircraft impact. By contrast, the separation of stairwells in the impact region of WTC 2 was the largest over the building height—located along different boundaries of the building core—and one of three stairwells remained marginally passable after the aircraft impact. The shaft enclosures were fire rated but were not required to have structural integrity under typical accidental loads: there were numerous reports of stairwells obstructed by fallen debris from damaged enclosures.
• The active fire safety systems (sprinklers, smoke purge, fire alarms, and emergency occupant communications) were designed to meet or exceed current practice. However, with the exception of the evacuation announcements, they played no role in the safety of life on September 11 because the water supplies to the sprinklers were damaged by the aircraft impact. The smoke purge systems operated under the direction of the fire department after fires were not turned on, but they also would have been ineffective due to aircraft damage. The violence of the aircraft impact served as its own alarm. In WTC 2, contradictory public address announcements contributed to occupant confusion and some delay in occupants beginning to evacuate.
• For the approximately 1,000 emergency responders on the scene, this was the largest disaster they had even seen. Despite attempts by the responding agencies to work together and perform their own tasks, the extent of the incident was well beyond their capabilities. Communications were erratic due to the high number of calls and the inadequate performance of some of the gear. Even so, there was no way to digest, test for accuracy, and disseminate the vast amount of information being received. Their jobs were complicated by the loss of command centers in WTC 7 and then in the towers after WTC 2 collapsed. With nearly all elevator service disrupted and progress up the stairs taking about 2 min per floor, it would have taken hours for the responders to reach their destinations, assist survivors, and escape had the towers not collapsed.

Objective 3: Determine what procedures and practices were used in the design, construction, operation, and maintenance of WTC 1 and WTC 2.

• Because of The Port Authority's establishment under a clause of the United States Constitution, its buildings were not subject to any state or local building regulations. The buildings were unlike any others previously built, both in their height and in their innovative structural features. Nevertheless, the actual design and approval process produced two buildings that generally were consistent with nearly all of the provisions of the New York City Building Code and other building codes of that time that were reviewed by NIST. The loads for which the buildings were designed exceeded the New York City code requirements. The quality of the structural steels was consistent with the building specifications. The departures from the building codes and standards identified by NIST did not have a significant effect on the outcome of September 11.
• For the floor systems, the fire rating and insulation thickness used on the floor trusses, which together with the concrete slab served as the main source of support for the floors, were of concern from the time of initial construction. NIST found no technical basis or test data on which the thermal protection of the steel was based. On September 11, 2001, the minimum specified thickness of the insulation was adequate to delay heating of the trusses; the amount of insulation dislodged by the aircraft impact, however, was sufficient to cause the structural steel to be heated to critical levels.
• Based on four standard fire resistance tests that were conducted under a range of insulation and test conditions, NIST found the fire rating of the floor system to vary between 3/4hour and 2hours; in all cases, the floors continued to support the full design load without collapse for over 2 hours.
• The wind loads used for the WTC towers, which governed the structural design of the external columns and provided the baseline capacity of the structures to withstand abnormal events such as major fires or impact damage, significantly exceeded the requirements of the New York City Building Code and other building codes of the day that were reviewed by NIST. Two sets of wind load estimates for the towers obtained by independent commercial consultants in 2002, however, differed by as much as 40 percent. These estimates were based on wind tunnel tests conducted as part of insurance litigation unrelated to the Investigation.

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Another one who can only cut and paste. Welcome back woop

only a sheep accepts nists investigation

 Nists "investigation"

yes, I honestly believe that if something did not add up, they would come out and say it....so, you are saying that this conspiracy encompassed the ENTIRE GOVERNMENT of the USA?

that's hilarious....what a knee slapper..thanks for the good laugh, doggie..now, go back to digging snot balls out of your nose so that you won't starve, and go get a job......

9-11 was a US government conspiracy

Also, please refute point by point what this prestigious organization has found in regard to the collapse...ill wait.........

There is no government conspiracy, you morons.......

" I think that there was a 9-11 conspiracy by the US gov."

Dog. Have you ever told Elvis I said hello? Did you find the sound stage they faked the moon landing on yet?

Are you going to post more youtube vids that you have fell for that were produced by Islamic groups? I mean hell they for sure have nothing to hide.

As for gullible? You have it covered. Just look at your posting history and how many different things you claim are conspiracies.

Youtube - Dogunders gospel website. Not one video on that site can be fake. Another question Dog, when Hollywood makes movies and the actor is killed in the movie, I am confused as to how I see him in another movie. I mean all the stuff we watch is SO real! There is NO WAY anyone with these beliefs can twist a fable to make it sound good.

Help me Dog! And when you post more vids by Harry and you get called out, try to make sure you see who is producing the videos so you don't look so stupid

 

Well, then who should investigate?

Please....get a job and leave the conspiracy unraveling to the smart people....you're nothing but a sheep being led to slaughter...you and the rest of your "truther" buffoons...lmao...

One last thought, genius, if is so evident that these buildings were the victims of a controlled demolition, then why did the insurance companies pay out billions, rather than bring this subject up?


I had my car broken into recently, and my insurance company wouldn't replace my $300 digital camera without me sending them receipts and police reports, but apparently multi-billion dollar insurance fraud can be carried out without anyone asking questions.

Unbelievable.