Crypto thread

Can we all agree Bitcoin is *not* a currency? Place to hide cash, yes. A speculative instrument? Yes.

Now, some of the other coins, particularly Ripple (I hope) may soon have some value as currency, at least as a way for banks to move money quickly.

$11,700 

Bitcoin 

Sold NAS? I thought that was an opportunity that comes along once in a lifetime? Anyway, it will be interesting to see if Bitcoin can hold 10k. It's the tail that wags the dog so to speak. 

In regard to being a store of value, if crypto is indeed a store of value, it should remain stable or rise when the stock markets get crushed (aka, gold). For now, all of crypto remains a speculative and risk-intense investment. Have some gotten rich? Certainly yes. Will others get rich from this point forward? Certainly some will. I am not an expert in this area, and I'm already rich enough, so for now I'm on the sidelines. 

Perhaps when Bitcoin regresses back to 6k I might tip my toes. I believe a profitable range exists between 6-10k. 

I’ve been digging deep for coins. Just picked up some DIVX and PHORE. I’m deep into this crypto game. No turning back now. 

Interesting estimate of how much the biggest Bitcoin mining company, Bitmain, made last year in profits -- $4 billion. For comparison sake, that is the same that Goldman Sachs brought in.

Bitmain is making a ton of money, no doubt. They are selling mining computers by the boatload, so I wonder if that's where all of the profits are coming from???

Why not purchase the computers and mine bitcoin at home??? Wouldn't that be the most profitable way to do this? Or would it drive up your electricity bill by 10x?

The way bitcoin works is if you have a very strong mining system you “steal” all of the action. That’s why the big dogs dominate mining for bitcoin. There are plenty of other coins you can mine though and then just trade whatever you mine for something you want. 

Good day for the alts 

11.4 and risin'

It will be interesting watching munchkin Putin and Beijing devalue the currency and those who wish to remain annominous drive the value drive shares up i in the balcony seats find the struggle like a great game watching the check counter check like two Russian masters playing against Bobby fisher... clarity? Great game of chess ....

So Nature’s guess is that Bitcoin will be devalued because of Trump, Putin and Xi. 

I'm impressed you were actually able to understand, and dicepher, what Nature was talking about.

I was lost after the first sentance. Oh wait, there was only one, really long sentence.

 

Crypto drama in the past 3 hours 

Bloodbath 

In my opinion, Bitcoin will remain a tradable investment between 6-10K. I doubt it ever goes significantly higher. The fact that it does not create any value within itself (aka...a dividend) is the reason it will not appreciate. Of course, speculation will create opportunities on the long side, but to expect this asset to appreciate like a stock without creating any value within itself is contrary to the concepts of economics. 

 

im digging crypto...beats betting with the bookie i must admit.

I’m digging crypto too 

I'm in at 5k.

Get set up now so you can buy if it gets there. Fiat to BTC exchanges can take a while. 

There is a bunch of infrastructure currently being set up. Goldman backs Circle and Circle just bought Poloniex. I think Circle will get Poloniex to be the first regulated crypto exchange in the US. 

This last drop is very interesting..

Last time BTC went under 7k the prices for some of the others were not hit as hard, yet this time BTC is at 7400 and some of the minors (still with BIG market caps) are getting hit harder.

XLM and ADA at 13 cents now (still with a 3 BILLION market cap each) Ripple to 56 cents (I think the prev drop was to the 60 area when 6500 BTC) yet Litecoin is at 140 when it was below 100 last time.

It is tough because there still is no real way to calculate intrinsic value outside of potential and concept and "technology" and with the inability to do that who knows where these land in the mid and long term.

You would have made a nice profit if you jumped in when you knew it was the bottom and jumped out. 

Intrinisc value you surmise, WallStreet? Right now the primary intrinsic value is the cost of production, which is anywhere between $500-$1000 dependent upon the cost of electricity (for mining and cooling) in the area where the coins are being mined. Many minors are moving to cold climates to decrease cooling costs. 

It' also hard for me to wrap my head around the variance between the primary intrinsic value (cost of production) and the implied secondary intrinsic value (the value gained by the use of it as a currency, for example). It has always been my opinion that the value being applied to the secondary intrinsic value is too high. I can not use Bitcoin for practical purposes because it's not widely accepted and it's transaction fees are prohibitive for practical use. At today's price of $8,900, the implied secondary intrinsic value of $7,900 is absurd given my previous statement. Moving forward, the value of Bitcoin will be restrained until it is widely accepted (aka, a credit card or cash) with minimal transaction fees. It is my opinion that greed will get in the way of this happening. 

I think production cost is more than 1k, more like 3-5k because of depreciation of equipment and replacement...also mining costs per BTC are more unless you have like 8 cents per kwh. I looked into this a bit and still am a little, my issue is the unknown about the rig depreciation. I dont know how long a rig lasts before breaking down. I get the feeling a rig will last maybe a year and then need replacing or it becomes inefficient and not cost effective. Also now that BTC and ETH are heavily mined you have to gamble on those alt coins and convert..and that is a big time risk.