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The end of online gambling is near

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Posted: #126
Quote Originally Posted by ShaukDaddy:

Blame this Aussie


WOW!

And the biggest irony of all? It's been rumored that the only reason the FBI got their hands on him is because Full Tilt or Poker Stars (the companies he used to work for and stole from) tipped off the FBI that he was going to be traveling to the United States last yea


Poker industry turned the gun on themselves....

Well gentlemen, this is the guy you should point to when online sports gambling and poker ceases to exist as we know it
 
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Posted: #127

this might actually be a blessing in disguise

i can only believe that based on the potential taxable revenue that there will be at least legalized U.S. internet poker in the near future

as to sports betting, i have no clue because there will be vast opposition from the respective leagues, namely, the NFL 

 
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Posted: #128
I don't know shit but if you think about the state of our economy right now and the fact that the FBI goes after a billion dollar business knowing dam well how they operate can suggest to me that the US wants the control.  I think sportsbooks will be fine just dont keep 50,000 grand in an account. 
 
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Posted: #129
Quote Originally Posted by LeafsNeedD:



Really?  You think they're dumb enough to keep that much money in the U.S.? 



No, but I think the US DOJ can sieze the money no matter where in the world it is.
 
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Posted: #130
I really just want to know when are we going to get some clarity on this.  Eaither just tell us if we will ever be able to play again online.
 
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Posted: #131
Quote Originally Posted by michaelpaul1:

and yes online sportsbooks are next...

Sportsbooks were first.

This is just the latest shot at the industry.

The problem is the three poker sites targeted yesterday acted illegally by catering to US customers.

They made themselves an easy target.

 
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Posted: #132
Quote Originally Posted by CSFurious:

this might actually be a blessing in disguise

i can only believe that based on the potential taxable revenue that there will be at least legalized U.S. internet poker in the near future

as to sports betting, i have no clue because there will be vast opposition from the respective leagues, namely, the NFL 



The second tax comes into the equation, it takes away the slight chance of winning the player has.  I play poker pretty regularly and if I was taxed at even 10% of my winnings I'd now be a losing player. 
 
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Posted: #133
Quote Originally Posted by LeafsNeedD:



The second tax comes into the equation, it takes away the slight chance of winning the player has.  I play poker pretty regularly and if I was taxed at even 10% of my winnings I'd now be a losing player. 

Exactly.

And a legalized tax on the industry would be >10%. The profit margins here are very slim for the novice/intermediate pokers players.
 
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Posted: #134
I'm glad I left the USA 35 years ago. Europe wins again in the war against the morality police.
 
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Posted: #135
Couldn't they just tax it the same way pokerstars would? 50 dollar tournament costs you 55. It's always been 10% pretty much I thought.
 
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Posted: #136

Guys - I get the feeling that people are worried about legality with their individual betting.

Dont be.  This is not about bettors.  Do whatever you want - keep playing - stop betting - take your money out - or leave your money in.  You are not in danger of being arrested or pursued by the DOJ.

You might be at risk for losing your money though, and the point of this thread was to issue a warning to keep your eyes and ears open - because there has probably never been a more volatile time in offshore gambling than there is right now.

Support your local animal shelter. I am on twitter.
 
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Posted: #137
I haven't read this whole thread but will later on but I think you guys have this all wrong. Sure the FBI shut these sites down but why wouldn't they? After all online poker is thriving in of all places: Washington DC

https://www.lotterypost.com/news/230298


In the eyes of the US government why should they have any competition?
 
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Posted: #138

Quote Originally Posted by chilitokid:

I haven't read this whole thread but will later on but I think you guys have this all wrong. Sure the FBI shut these sites down but why wouldn't they? After all online poker is thriving in of all places: Washington DC

https://www.lotterypost.com/news/230298


In the eyes of the US government why should they have any competition?

Utterly false.

 

What Washington DC has proposed could be considered illegal.

The problem with the current UIGEA of 2006 is that it is ambiguous. Leaving room for interpretation.

The Federal Government has shown recently (one need only look to Obamacare) they do not care for state or district rights.

Legalized poker is far from a done deal.

 
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Posted: #139
Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:

Guys - I get the feeling that people are worried about legality with their individual betting.

Dont be.  This is not about bettors.  Do whatever you want - keep playing - stop betting - take your money out - or leave your money in.  You are not in danger of being arrested or pursued by the DOJ.

You might be at risk for losing your money though, and the point of this thread was to issue a warning to keep your eyes and ears open - because there has probably never been a more volatile time in offshore gambling than there is right now.

exactly...we are living in very troubling times...a revolution is likely soon....
 
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Posted: #140
Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:

Guys - I get the feeling that people are worried about legality with their individual betting.

Dont be.  This is not about bettors.  Do whatever you want - keep playing - stop betting - take your money out - or leave your money in.  You are not in danger of being arrested or pursued by the DOJ.

You might be at risk for losing your money though, and the point of this thread was to issue a warning to keep your eyes and ears open - because there has probably never been a more volatile time in offshore gambling than there is right now.


I think people here are exponentially more worried about the fate of their money then they are about any future DOJ prosecution because of their online gambling. 

This was, always has been, is, and always will be the nightmare scenario, that is, log onto your pokersite or gambling site and an error message (or in this case an intentional error message created by the DOJ) appears and you have no idea who to speak to or deal with with regards to your account balance.

Yesterday, that nightmare came true for online poker players. 

 
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Posted: #141
do we need to worry about funds in Bookmaker since they also have poker??
 
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Posted: #142
I dont trust shit right now with what these fuckbag religious zealots are doing with this country and our rights...
 
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Posted: #143
OK, I'll admit it. I'm stumped so I hope some of the sharps on this site can answer this for me. How does the US government have jurisdiction over these three sites when they are located in sovereign territory? I fully realize the US pushes it's own citizens around but how can they shut down these companies when they are licensed in areas where the US has no jurisdiction?
 
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Posted: #144
Quote Originally Posted by vanzack:

Yes, todays news from the poker world is bad.  No, it is worse than bad.

How bad?  Bad enough to potentially bring down the 3 top poker sites - Pokerstars and Full Tilt together swamp the online sports betting world in terms of volume.  So one can only assume that this is very bad for the extremely limited sports betting that is left out there for Americans.

The cliff notes are that Pokerstars, Ulitmate Bet, and Full Tilt were using undercover ways to fund and pay accounts in America.  They bought off bank presidents, bought banks outright, and used CC and WU methods that the DOJ deems illegal according to the UIGEA of 2006.  Indictments were handed out today, and no official word has come from the sites - but there is much speculation from very reliable sources that they will most likely shut down completely.  At best, they will remain open for non-Americans, but Americans poker playing days online are all but done.

I wonder what Negranu, Hellmuth, Ivey - and those other posers will do now - will they just make a cash grab and disappear or will they fight with the money they made on the backs of the players to get something done.  I wonder what this will do to the poker movement - it could go one way or the other - but what are the odds on a bunch of degenerates getting organized and getting something done?  Maybe the PPA will do something - I hope so.

Sounds similar to sports betting?  How do you think the few sportsbooks left out there will feel when they contemplate this knowing they do the same exact things to keep Americans?

The end is near my dear friends.  Sure there will always be places that will take wagers with extreme risks and non-transparancy to the bettor, but the days of trust are gone.  Any book can close at any time, your money could be gone at any book at any time. 

This is a big deal.  Some might say that online gambling for Americans couldnt get worse, but today it got enormously worse.  I have my own opinions about why this is happening - and those have to do with paving the way for inevitable legalization and taxation and knocking these guys out for financial gain - but that is just opinion and doesnt really matter.  The reality is that I wouldnt have a penny offshore now at any book that accepts Americans.  If you have money at Pinnacle or Betfair - you are probably fine - but unless you are willing to lose your money at any time, just sit out for a while.  Pokerstars and Fulltilt are in a different stratisphere compared to bookmaker and greek - if they can go (at least for Americans) then certainly anything can happen to those remaining.

Keep your eyes and ears open - things are happening quickly - stay on top of the news and stay on top of your balances.

Today, we went from being very cold to entering the ice age of online gambling.  The good news is, the ice always seems to melt eventually.

 

I no i played the poker seen years ago and just play for fun now with all games but i was ripped by full tilt more then once playing 2wice i was in the lead in a tourney and all of asudden a player would join go in every hand everybody else would fold over and over and it wouldnt stop till i was broke and then ,the guy would leave and table would dissapear thats was the last time i played anything on there it was a 5 dollar game i thing Lokks good on the crooks

Mr Evil.
 
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Posted: #145

Quote Originally Posted by lovesoccer:

OK, I'll admit it. I'm stumped so I hope some of the sharps on this site can answer this for me. How does the US government have jurisdiction over these three sites when they are located in sovereign territory? I fully realize the US pushes it's own citizens around but how can they shut down these companies when they are licensed in areas where the US has no jurisdiction?

A: They don't

A: They just did

Swell, aint it

 
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Posted: #146
Quote Originally Posted by Renton2010:

Utterly false.

 

What Washington DC has proposed could be considered illegal.

The problem with the current UIGEA of 2006 is that it is ambiguous. Leaving room for interpretation.

The Federal Government has shown recently (one need only look to Obamacare) they do not care for state or district rights.

Legalized poker is far from a done deal.

It remains to be seen but I'll put my money on the fact that the US government wants every penny generated from taxes on a person's winnings and these are the steps they are taking to ensure that happens.
If you think about it this way: the US gov't shuts down every avenue a player has to gamble for months (possibly a year or more) outside a casino but then opens up internet gambling (test site DC) later on. The US only wants the taxes generated from it because they now have seen the $ amounts flying through the banking system (because the banks were reporting suspicious activity).
TAXES and REVENUE is all this is about....and the US gov't wants it all to stay within the US.
 
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Posted: #147
The people who run those sites, are in america.
 
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Posted: #148
Quote Originally Posted by ShaukDaddy:

The people who run those sites, are in america.
Correct just ask Patrice Tierney, wife of Massachusetts Congressman John Tierney. Rather strange isn't it?
 
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Posted: #149
I think some of you are looking at things wrong IF things became legal down the road.  Think of all the losing players these sites have.  The gov't wants to tax the books on all these winnings flowing to them.  As for you, the average player who scrapes a profit, go find some tickets off the floor at your local racetrack to offset those winnings. 
 
 
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the end is near
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