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    All Forums | Systems & Strategies

    Baseball line making for you math wizards

    cd329
    Underdog11
    BillWag27
    sambuca frank
    Sharkysden
    ...
    Participants:
    Search
    Views: 2331
    Posts: 17
     
    cd329
    cd329
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    Posted: Jun. 17, 2009 - 7:14 PM ET #1

    can somebody break this post i found on another site that the person uses to make lines.  Its really been many years since trying to calculate these kinds of formulas.  Please do his example step by step with the numbers, because he lost me in his example.
    Hopefully this is something good to use.
    Thanks
    cd
     
     
    Here are the formulae that I use to get from raw numbers to lines, if anybody cares.

    You need four numbers to work with: visitor runs, home runs, visitor runs allowed, home runs allowed.

    Let's take a look at tonight's Yankees/Jays game with Jaret Wright and A.J. Burnett. I've deliberately picked a game that was a no-play for me (I didn't find enough value on either side).

    Specifically for tonight's lineups:
    I have the Yankees at 5.27 runs scored, 4.64 runs allowed.
    I have the Jays at 4.81 runs scored, 4.02 runs allowed.

    First, I need "single winning percentages". For this, we first use Bill James' Pythagorean method. The formula is (A^1.83)/((A^1.83)+(B^1.83)), where A is runs scored B is runs allowed. We can do this for each team to figure out the quality they are bringing to the game. The Yankees get a .558; the Jays get a .621 AFTER adding .040 to the Jays' for being at home.

    We use another formula of James', Log5, to get from these winnig percentages to probabilities of winning the particular matchup. The Log5 formula is (C-(C*D))/(C+D-((2*C)*D)), where C is the visitors' pythagorean number from the equation above, and D is the home teams'. For the Yankees in tonight's game, I got .435. 1 - .435 = .565, which is the Jays probability of winning.

    So, assuming that the four numbers that we started out with (our handicapping) are correct, the Yankees have a .435 chance of winning the game; the Jays have a .565 chance.

    So, let's make a line.

    The formula is (1-X)/X, where X is the underdogs win probability. So in this game, the equation is (1-.435)/.435 = 1.30. So, the line is 130. Looks better as a dime line, I suppose:

    Yankees +125
    Jays -135

    How much value you need to play is up to you.
    Reply
    To remove first post, remove entire topic.
    can somebody break this post i found on another site that the person uses to make lines.  Its really been many years since trying to calculate these kinds of formulas.  Please do his example step by step with the numbers, because he lost me in his example.
    Hopefully this is something good to use.
    Thanks
    cd
     
     
    Here are the formulae that I use to get from raw numbers to lines, if anybody cares.

    You need four numbers to work with: visitor runs, home runs, visitor runs allowed, home runs allowed.

    Let's take a look at tonight's Yankees/Jays game with Jaret Wright and A.J. Burnett. I've deliberately picked a game that was a no-play for me (I didn't find enough value on either side).

    Specifically for tonight's lineups:
    I have the Yankees at 5.27 runs scored, 4.64 runs allowed.
    I have the Jays at 4.81 runs scored, 4.02 runs allowed.

    First, I need "single winning percentages". For this, we first use Bill James' Pythagorean method. The formula is (A^1.83)/((A^1.83)+(B^1.83)), where A is runs scored B is runs allowed. We can do this for each team to figure out the quality they are bringing to the game. The Yankees get a .558; the Jays get a .621 AFTER adding .040 to the Jays' for being at home.

    We use another formula of James', Log5, to get from these winnig percentages to probabilities of winning the particular matchup. The Log5 formula is (C-(C*D))/(C+D-((2*C)*D)), where C is the visitors' pythagorean number from the equation above, and D is the home teams'. For the Yankees in tonight's game, I got .435. 1 - .435 = .565, which is the Jays probability of winning.

    So, assuming that the four numbers that we started out with (our handicapping) are correct, the Yankees have a .435 chance of winning the game; the Jays have a .565 chance.

    So, let's make a line.

    The formula is (1-X)/X, where X is the underdogs win probability. So in this game, the equation is (1-.435)/.435 = 1.30. So, the line is 130. Looks better as a dime line, I suppose:

    Yankees +125
    Jays -135

    How much value you need to play is up to you.
     
    cd329
    cd329
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    Posted: Jun. 18, 2009 - 11:24 PM ET #2

    come on guys help a fellow gambler out.  one of you got to know how to calculate this formula out.    I always help people out on this site with stuff i know when somebody asks for help.
    thanks cd
    Reply
    come on guys help a fellow gambler out.  one of you got to know how to calculate this formula out.    I always help people out on this site with stuff i know when somebody asks for help.
    thanks cd
     
    Underdog11
    Underdog11
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    Posted: Jun. 19, 2009 - 1:32 AM ET #3

    there arent too many real good math guys at this forum try the handicapper think tank at sbr forum, they talk hardcore math there and will surely help you.

    Reply
    there arent too many real good math guys at this forum try the handicapper think tank at sbr forum, they talk hardcore math there and will surely help you.

     
    cd329
    cd329
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    Posted: Jun. 19, 2009 - 1:48 AM ET #4

    Quote Originally Posted by Underdog11:

    there arent too many real good math guys at this forum try the handicapper think tank at sbr forum, they talk hardcore math there and will surely help you.

     

    Thanks Underdog

    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by Underdog11:

    there arent too many real good math guys at this forum try the handicapper think tank at sbr forum, they talk hardcore math there and will surely help you.

     

    Thanks Underdog

     
    BillWag27
    BillWag27
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    Posted: Jun. 19, 2009 - 11:07 AM ET #5

    CD,

    what are the questions that you are looking for?

    The formula seems straight forward to me.  I would be glad to help!

    I use a similar formula, but using RC and BR.  I feel it gives a more realistic number.

    BW
    Reply
    CD,

    what are the questions that you are looking for?

    The formula seems straight forward to me.  I would be glad to help!

    I use a similar formula, but using RC and BR.  I feel it gives a more realistic number.

    BW
     
    cd329
    cd329
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    Posted: Jun. 19, 2009 - 3:18 PM ET #6

    Quote Originally Posted by BillWag27:

    CD,

    what are the questions that you are looking for?

    The formula seems straight forward to me.  I would be glad to help!

    I use a similar formula, but using RC and BR.  I feel it gives a more realistic number.

    BW

     

    Bill,

     Thank you for the help.

    Could you go step by step doing the calculations out so i can see how he got the numbers he did. I need to see where the numbers go in the formula.  Its driving me crazy that i cant do these type of math problems anymore.   Pretend your trying to show the formula to a 5 year old, lolllllll.

    Thanks again

    cd

    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by BillWag27:

    CD,

    what are the questions that you are looking for?

    The formula seems straight forward to me.  I would be glad to help!

    I use a similar formula, but using RC and BR.  I feel it gives a more realistic number.

    BW

     

    Bill,

     Thank you for the help.

    Could you go step by step doing the calculations out so i can see how he got the numbers he did. I need to see where the numbers go in the formula.  Its driving me crazy that i cant do these type of math problems anymore.   Pretend your trying to show the formula to a 5 year old, lolllllll.

    Thanks again

    cd

     
    sambuca frank
    sambuca frank
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    Posted: Jun. 19, 2009 - 7:23 PM ET #7

    lt profits will help you or maybe gauncho
    Reply
    lt profits will help you or maybe gauncho
     
    sambuca frank
    sambuca frank
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    Posted: Jun. 19, 2009 - 8:01 PM ET #8

    how do adjust for injuries?  lets take your same game and pretend that rivera,a-rod are not playing. your numbers are useless.
    Reply
    how do adjust for injuries?  lets take your same game and pretend that rivera,a-rod are not playing. your numbers are useless.
     
    Sharkysden
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    Posted: Jun. 19, 2009 - 8:45 PM ET #9

    It looks like an excel plug in formula.  if you create a table in excel and enter the formulas into the cells it will calculate it for you. 
    Reply
    It looks like an excel plug in formula.  if you create a table in excel and enter the formulas into the cells it will calculate it for you. 
     
    sambuca frank
    sambuca frank
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    Posted: Jun. 19, 2009 - 8:50 PM ET #10

    how much is a-rod worth on the moneyline according to excel?
    my guess is 6-9 cents
    Reply
    how much is a-rod worth on the moneyline according to excel?
    my guess is 6-9 cents
     
    andy88c
    andy88c
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    Posted: Jun. 20, 2009 - 1:29 AM ET #11

    I tried calculating Runs created (different formulas are given for this, incl. James') using BP's projected stats and it honestly got way too complicated. To be frank, the thing with linemaking with algorithms is that it doesn't take into effect multiple variables that have considerable impacts on games. In order to account for the gamut including splits, career stats vs. certain players, a late travel time for a game the next day, momentum, players getting days off, etc., it would get way too complicated...
    Reply
    I tried calculating Runs created (different formulas are given for this, incl. James') using BP's projected stats and it honestly got way too complicated. To be frank, the thing with linemaking with algorithms is that it doesn't take into effect multiple variables that have considerable impacts on games. In order to account for the gamut including splits, career stats vs. certain players, a late travel time for a game the next day, momentum, players getting days off, etc., it would get way too complicated...
     
    andy88c
    andy88c
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    Posted: Jun. 20, 2009 - 1:29 AM ET #12

    Good luck though, man, and I hope you are able to create something that works for you.
    Reply
    Good luck though, man, and I hope you are able to create something that works for you.
     
    cd329
    cd329
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    Posted: Jun. 20, 2009 - 3:20 PM ET #13

    guys i dont care if the formula works or not.  I just want to see this example calculated out, so it will help me out calculating other types of math problems.  I really just cant remember how to do this type of math anymore.
     
    Sharky, i wish i could use excel to calculate this.
    Reply
    guys i dont care if the formula works or not.  I just want to see this example calculated out, so it will help me out calculating other types of math problems.  I really just cant remember how to do this type of math anymore.
     
    Sharky, i wish i could use excel to calculate this.
     
    angelobruno
    angelobruno
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    Posted: Jun. 20, 2009 - 4:28 PM ET #14

    the one guy  who could help you you were a total moron to so i dont blame him for not responding but sn knows his stuff esp all that formulas and so forth
     
    next time think before you come barging in somebodies thread ranting with that bullshit like you did  
    Reply
    the one guy  who could help you you were a total moron to so i dont blame him for not responding but sn knows his stuff esp all that formulas and so forth
     
    next time think before you come barging in somebodies thread ranting with that bullshit like you did  
     
    sambuca frank
    sambuca frank
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    Posted: Jun. 22, 2009 - 6:03 PM ET #15

    take 5.27/4.64=1.14
    take4.81/4.02=1.20
    add 1.14 and1.20=2.34
    take the higher #(1.20/2.34=51.2%)= tor-105 neutral field
    add your home field advantage accordingly!!
     
     
    Reply
    take 5.27/4.64=1.14
    take4.81/4.02=1.20
    add 1.14 and1.20=2.34
    take the higher #(1.20/2.34=51.2%)= tor-105 neutral field
    add your home field advantage accordingly!!
     
     
     
    cd329
    cd329
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    Posted: Jun. 22, 2009 - 10:59 PM ET #16

    Quote Originally Posted by sambuca frank:

    take 5.27/4.64=1.14
    take4.81/4.02=1.20
    add 1.14 and1.20=2.34
    take the higher #(1.20/2.34=51.2%)= tor-105 neutral field
    add your home field advantage accordingly!!
     
     

     

    Sambuca Frank, is this your own formula up above or is it the one i posted?

    thanks

    Reply
    Quote Originally Posted by sambuca frank:

    take 5.27/4.64=1.14
    take4.81/4.02=1.20
    add 1.14 and1.20=2.34
    take the higher #(1.20/2.34=51.2%)= tor-105 neutral field
    add your home field advantage accordingly!!
     
     

     

    Sambuca Frank, is this your own formula up above or is it the one i posted?

    thanks

     
     
    cd329
    cd329
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    Posted: Jun. 22, 2009 - 11:08 PM ET #17

    Frank,
     In your example, how did you turn 51.2 percent into a line of -105?
    Reply
    Frank,
     In your example, how did you turn 51.2 percent into a line of -105?
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