Will Kevin O'Connell ever get over...

Vikings fan here. No chance we go anywhere with JJ at QB. I hated that pick from the start. Overrated at Michigan imo.

I'm gonna track both JJ and Darnold going forward in this thread.

JJ Mccarthy shouldn't have a tough day against a subpar Bears defense. The Bears allow 27.4 ppg which is 28th in the league. They allow 6.3 ypp which is 30th.

The Bears secondary has 3 key players on IR. Starting CB Jaylon Johnson, starting NB Kyler Gordon, and backup CB Terrell Smith. Backup CB Josh Blackwell got concused in the Ravens game, and missed last week vs the Bengals. He's questionable vs the Vikings. 

My take, JJ has no excuses in this spot. With guys like Jefferson, Addison, Nailer and Hockenson at his disposal, there's no reason they shouldn't move the ball. He also shouldn't face much of a pass rush at all, minus some Dennis Allen blitz's that sometimes get through. 

The Bears are 16th in the league in sack % at 7.05%. Although they have a 31% pass rush win rate from their d line which is 30th in the nfl.

So the key will be vs the blitz. 

It would help if his o line gets their shit together as well, as they were called for 9 false starts at home vs the Ravens last week. How that happens is beyond me. Maybe his cadence sucks, or communication errors getting the plays in. If KOC is a real QB whisperer as people say, this is the game to clean all that up.

Darnold on the other hand has a tough game otr vs a stout Rams D.

The Rams allow 17 ppg, #2 in the league. They allow 4.9 ypp which is #6 in the league. 

No one is hurt or questionable from the Rams secondary except Ankelo Witherspoon who hit the IR in mid September. 

The Rams sack % is 7.78% which is 10th in the league. Although the Seahawks have allowed a 4.13% sack rate which is #2 in the league. The Rams D line has a 40% pass rush win rate, #12 in the league. 

When it comes vs the blitz, Darnold has been one of the best in the business. We saw it last year as well. His passer rating vs the blitz this year is 130.8, with a 9.9 ypp, 12 td's no interceptions. 

I think it's safe to say that the Rams will want to rush with just 4, we'll see.

This game will have playoff vibes as both teams are 7-2 where the winner will take the lead in the nfc west. So the question is, will Darnold fold as he has in the past in huge games like this?

One thing is for sure, he has no touch. His problem is he's trying to be like John Elway and throw the ball thru the wall, that's not going to work. He's been wayyy off on some of this throws, and again I think its because he's trying to throw it to hard. 

Until i'm proven wrong it's my belief JJ's destined for a career as a back up and no way was a first rounder. I wish him the best and surely he could prove me wrong. 

Always easy when you look at something from hindsight.

Darnold wouldn't have any meaningful minutes if JJ didnt get hurt.

How can you just give up on your FIRST pick from LAST YEAR?

How do you know this wasn't another Casey Keenum situation?

Vikings 2024 went 14-3 with Darnold.

But all I remember is the blowout lost to the Lions for the division.

Followed by a blowout lost to the Rams in the Wildcard Round.

JJ just beat the Lions on the road as +9 dogs.

Not to diminish Darnold success with Seattle.  But Geno Smith was having great success there too.  Seahawks just a great football team to play for.

@undermysac

 Bears beat the vikings this sunday, right? If bears win and lions lose to philly bears will be in first place, are you kidding me?

You must of not read the opening post.

1. I am not looking at this in hindsight. I had a looooong thread about the Vikings last year, Sam Darnold in particular. 

2. It's not a Case Keenum situation because Sam Darnold has proven himself 2 years in a row now, with 2 different teams. Case Keenum fell of a life after that one good Vikings year.

3. I mentioned those 2 losses last year that Darnold had. We are still waiting for him to win a big/important game. This Sunday is another true test.

*fell off a cliff

          Look at Tim Tebow's college career stats.   How'd he turn out in the NFL?

Too early on JJ give him time.. who if you though Maye was this good? But you’re ignoring how poorly Jefferson is playing.. so much worse than Chase, Nacua, etc Dude step the f up and help your offense!! 

As much as the nfl likes to scrutinize players especially qb’s it’s a mystery how JJ went 10th overall considering it was difficult to put a highlight reel of him dropping back and passing the ball at Michigan in that funky offense. When he did drop back to pass rarely didn’t he drift or get outside of the pocket before passing. Don’t like his windup it’s time consuming and he has a little too much hero in him in this early stage hard to believe only 4 games still feels like more. Seems Vikes were strong believers of some sort of intangibles they believe he possesses like the type of guy who will not fail and no matter how hard it gets he will figure it out. The ultimate winner Tom Brady mold I like some things he does but Ive seen in this nfl these coaches can seem quite dumb in the way the games are called like against Bears why is he passing 42 times and they run only 13 times with their rb’s? They have 2 stud rb’s yet JJ is passing the ball more than 3 times than they are running the ball makes no sense.

@undermysac

 Your right

In one half of football, there was nothing about the play calling or route running that was wrong for the Vikings. 

It was all JJ Mccarthy. Pure ass. Need to turn it around kid.

He's throwing all fastballs, needs to find another pitch.

JJ Mccarthy's qbr before the last 3:15 of the game was 14.90.

But he did orchestrate what was essentially a game winning drive on their last possession of the game. Going 7 for 9 against prevent defense...

If the Bears don't return the next kickoff 57 yards, we don't know how this game ends.

Sam  Darnold was ass against the Rams, they seem to have his #. If anyone watched that game could you tell me how much they blitzed, I suspect that not much.

He posted 32.1 qbr. No TD's, 4 int's, no sacks. The Seahawks still covered the spread. 

Darnold is good but cant handle big situations. Maybe with more experience in those situations that will change but he's proven a few times now he cant win a big game.

McCarthy was, at best, a game manager for Michigan. A decent QB on a great team. But he only has a few NFL starts under him.  Come back next year and give your opinion.  He needs more time. Very very few QBs are good their rookie season.  

100% agree that Minnesota is wasting JJ and other stars on that team.  Not much they can do.  They put all their eggs into McCarthy and they need to continue to develop him....or decide they made an error and find someone else.

@undermysac

Not a Vikings fan, but….

If Darnold’s previous stops in the NFL aren’t enough, pull up the 2017 Cotton Bowl game vs Ohio State. If there was audio available, all you would here would be Darnold yelling “Mommy…help”!

@magicmike45

 JJ was a college QB. I predict he won't make it in the NFL. Johnny Manziel Jr.

Quite the conundrum for O'Connell right now. Maybe he was right about Darnold. Even though he could probably navigate a much better regular season record which would set them up better for the playoffs. But then just crumble in the high pressure games.

Meanwhile he's teaching up McCarthy, not knowing if anything will come of it. As you put it, quite well, "they put all their eggs in the McCarthy basket"

I'll be watching the replay of the Rams and Seahawks soon. I suspect that they didn't blitz him much, he's too good at getting the ball out to the hot read.

He has a weakness for sure, whether vs a full zone, or split coverage, the Rams coaches are great at exploiting people's weaknesses. 

JJ is a sunk cost. Everyone acts like he has only played 5 games. That is true. But he's been in the program for 2 years now. He should know the playbook. The problem for Minnesota right now is their QB room is weak, the upcoming draft has very poor candidates at the QB spot and if this drags on into next year early, keep parts (Jefferson, etc) are going to want out.

This is how I see this. O Connell knew Darnold would never be able to win the big games and lead them to a championship so he looked to the future. Whether it works out or not I get it and I think its a good decision. I watched the Bills for years not draft a QB and keep rolling with mediocrity. Take the plunge and take a chance. Nothing worse than being mediocre. Rather suck and go for broke

lol bo nix is awful. 

Give JJ a year. He went what… 18 months without playing a game and then was sidelined another month. Making some poor decisions with the ball but I do think he needs time to just get up to speed at this level. It ain’t the Big 10 anymore. If he sucks by the end of next season then whatever but too early to have a serious conversation at this point. 

Darnold was taking Minnesota nowhere. Mop up garbage teams and fold when it matters - he’s doing the same thing again with Seattle this year 

Jefferson is in year 6 of his career. He has 270 yards and 2 tds with JJ on the field. He is not interested in wasting 2 years to see if JJ can get up to speed. If things are looking bleak 4 or 5 games into next season, he will want out.