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    All Forums | General Discussion

    Rapido River 1944 WW 2

    Box and one
    DB51daBEARS
    Fuse
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    Box and one
    Box and one
    Veteran
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    Joined: Jul, 1999
    Posts: 1604
    Posted: Nov. 9, 2022 - 9:52 AM ET #1

    In about an hour I am going to the Camp Mabry Army Muesuem here in Austin Texas. I play racquetball everyday from 5.30 am to about 7,00am The guys I play with are the father of An NFL qb, 4 former Air force pilots that all served in Vietnam and retired here in Austin A veterans administrator-from the VA hospital and a merchandise salesman. My father served during WW 2 in General Clarks 5th Army as an AMG officer from 1944 to 1946. Prior to that he was a teacher at Teddy Roosevelt HS teaching Italian and Spanish in the Bronx He was born in Italy and came to America at the age of 5. The only person in his Bronx neighborhood to go to college Graduated Manhattan College with honors and became a teacher . When the war broke out in 1941 he was drafted and sent to officers training school married my mother on Aug 22 1941 and the next day was on a boat to North Africa . AMG was American Military Government. Because he spoke fluent Italian with no dialect he was in command of a unit of 15-20 US soldiers that once Sicily and the Italian were invaded he was a part of AMG that as the Germans retreated from Italians cities his job was to go to those cities Establish a democracy arrest the Italian Facists and restore order thru first aid and food etc John Hersey wrote a book that won the Pulitzer Prize A Bell for Adono. Although Hersey followed an AMG officer through out his assignment my father did know the officer he followed. Its a make believe story and was made into a movie .anyway let me get back to today
    My father was near Monte Cassino when the Germans after a long battle finally retreated . About 20 miles east of Cassini there was a river called the rapido. Gen Clark under advisement not to cross decided to take pressure of the ill fated anzio invasion where the invasion force was trapped on the beach and flank the Germans It was an ill advised crossing. The Germans controlled the rapido ,had the high ground and had one side of the river heavily defended .. with Artillery and machine guns all a long the banks of the river. Clark under advisement ignored everyone and made a frontal assault to cross the river . Not sure of the head count but over 300-400 Texans crossed the ill fated river and were massacred The ones that made it were stuck on the wrong side and were killed of taken as prisoners I remember my father saying more Texas infantry died at the Rapido they at the Alamo. My father was still alive when my daughter decided to go to U Texas in Austin He said there was a memorial in Texas and he thought it was in Austin honoring the texas soldiers that died at Rapido. So someone told me at camp Mabry there is a plaque or something honoring all those soldiers killed there. So my racquetball boys picked today to visit the Muesuem ...we are going to the PX and eat lunch at the Army base..
    I am going to find the curator and ask him have you ever heard of the Rapido River blunder Will come back and report.. I hope he doesn't look at and say the " what river" When the war was over a congressional committee was formed to investigate Gen Clarks mistake and one of his assistants who I believe was a texan who advised him not to attack found Clark wrong but no one wanted to go after an American General post war. My father was not a rapido and was 20 miles south of Cassini liberating a village but knew many soldiers that were there and everyone soldier in Italy knew many died for no reason anyway gotta run hopefully someone at Mabry knows something about the tragedy at the Rapido
    sorry this is boring for some but growing up and seeing the rapido when I was 11 or 12 and having my father tell these stories .. wish he was alive to ask him many more questions later

    box and one
    Reply
    To remove first post, remove entire topic.

    In about an hour I am going to the Camp Mabry Army Muesuem here in Austin Texas. I play racquetball everyday from 5.30 am to about 7,00am The guys I play with are the father of An NFL qb, 4 former Air force pilots that all served in Vietnam and retired here in Austin A veterans administrator-from the VA hospital and a merchandise salesman. My father served during WW 2 in General Clarks 5th Army as an AMG officer from 1944 to 1946. Prior to that he was a teacher at Teddy Roosevelt HS teaching Italian and Spanish in the Bronx He was born in Italy and came to America at the age of 5. The only person in his Bronx neighborhood to go to college Graduated Manhattan College with honors and became a teacher . When the war broke out in 1941 he was drafted and sent to officers training school married my mother on Aug 22 1941 and the next day was on a boat to North Africa . AMG was American Military Government. Because he spoke fluent Italian with no dialect he was in command of a unit of 15-20 US soldiers that once Sicily and the Italian were invaded he was a part of AMG that as the Germans retreated from Italians cities his job was to go to those cities Establish a democracy arrest the Italian Facists and restore order thru first aid and food etc John Hersey wrote a book that won the Pulitzer Prize A Bell for Adono. Although Hersey followed an AMG officer through out his assignment my father did know the officer he followed. Its a make believe story and was made into a movie .anyway let me get back to today
    My father was near Monte Cassino when the Germans after a long battle finally retreated . About 20 miles east of Cassini there was a river called the rapido. Gen Clark under advisement not to cross decided to take pressure of the ill fated anzio invasion where the invasion force was trapped on the beach and flank the Germans It was an ill advised crossing. The Germans controlled the rapido ,had the high ground and had one side of the river heavily defended .. with Artillery and machine guns all a long the banks of the river. Clark under advisement ignored everyone and made a frontal assault to cross the river . Not sure of the head count but over 300-400 Texans crossed the ill fated river and were massacred The ones that made it were stuck on the wrong side and were killed of taken as prisoners I remember my father saying more Texas infantry died at the Rapido they at the Alamo. My father was still alive when my daughter decided to go to U Texas in Austin He said there was a memorial in Texas and he thought it was in Austin honoring the texas soldiers that died at Rapido. So someone told me at camp Mabry there is a plaque or something honoring all those soldiers killed there. So my racquetball boys picked today to visit the Muesuem ...we are going to the PX and eat lunch at the Army base..
    I am going to find the curator and ask him have you ever heard of the Rapido River blunder Will come back and report.. I hope he doesn't look at and say the " what river" When the war was over a congressional committee was formed to investigate Gen Clarks mistake and one of his assistants who I believe was a texan who advised him not to attack found Clark wrong but no one wanted to go after an American General post war. My father was not a rapido and was 20 miles south of Cassini liberating a village but knew many soldiers that were there and everyone soldier in Italy knew many died for no reason anyway gotta run hopefully someone at Mabry knows something about the tragedy at the Rapido
    sorry this is boring for some but growing up and seeing the rapido when I was 11 or 12 and having my father tell these stories .. wish he was alive to ask him many more questions later

     
    DB51daBEARS
    DB51daBEARS
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    Joined: Sep, 2016
    Posts: 4135
    Posted: Nov. 9, 2022 - 10:27 AM ET #2

    @Box and one

    Hey buddy...that's an amazing story about your dad, and what he did as an AMG (and that's just in Sicily).  I'm sure he was on the continent also (I think you've mentioned that before).  I guess you've seen this link (below) I just now googled.  I had never heard of this battle action, though we all know of Monte Cassino and the Sicily invasion, and North Africa as well.  

    Some of the stories you've related to us about your dad's life and times here at Covers are very vivid!!!

    Glad you still like to give a shout out to the Bronx, and to Manhattan College.  I can only speak for myself, but your recollections are never boring!!!

    https://www.texasmilitaryforcesmuseum.org/36division/archives/rapido/rapido2.htm

    Cheers...all the best always  thumbs_up

    Reply

    @Box and one

    Hey buddy...that's an amazing story about your dad, and what he did as an AMG (and that's just in Sicily).  I'm sure he was on the continent also (I think you've mentioned that before).  I guess you've seen this link (below) I just now googled.  I had never heard of this battle action, though we all know of Monte Cassino and the Sicily invasion, and North Africa as well.  

    Some of the stories you've related to us about your dad's life and times here at Covers are very vivid!!!

    Glad you still like to give a shout out to the Bronx, and to Manhattan College.  I can only speak for myself, but your recollections are never boring!!!

    https://www.texasmilitaryforcesmuseum.org/36division/archives/rapido/rapido2.htm

    Cheers...all the best always  thumbs_up

     
    Box and one
    Box and one
    Veteran
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Jul, 1999
    Posts: 1604
    Posted: Nov. 9, 2022 - 5:09 PM ET #3

    DB thanks and that archive you posted tells the whole story of  Rapido 

    The place was empty but there were 3 guys sitting at the desk and I asked them is there any plaque or mention of the Rapido River battle. They all laughed and said in the 3rd room not only is it dedicated to the tragedy but a wall display behind the glass. Its a display of the German position looking down in the valley of the river and the banks . So as your standing on the display you can see what the Germans are watching down before they use artillery, mortars and machine guns . So you are standing on top of a hill or mountain looking down on the river and valley. You are a German soldier .. unreal the museum was awesome with about 3 or 4 Sherman tanks, jeeps, trucks a few airplanes. The WW 1 section was really nice because they made it a bunker. They had a few periscopes to look up since a sniper would of blown your head off. They had a section on the Alamo but didn't get to see it. We were there for about 3 hours and nobody else came in. Imagine the past 2 weeks in Austin F-1 was here with about 500,000 out of townees and last week was South by southwest and about 1.2 million were here .I asked at the desk when Austin has its big venues do you get a lot of people visiting They said no one comes here to camp Mabry. In the bookstore I bought an arm patch that was lost but it was what my father wore as part of the 5th Army .. great time

    box and one
    Reply

    DB thanks and that archive you posted tells the whole story of  Rapido 

    The place was empty but there were 3 guys sitting at the desk and I asked them is there any plaque or mention of the Rapido River battle. They all laughed and said in the 3rd room not only is it dedicated to the tragedy but a wall display behind the glass. Its a display of the German position looking down in the valley of the river and the banks . So as your standing on the display you can see what the Germans are watching down before they use artillery, mortars and machine guns . So you are standing on top of a hill or mountain looking down on the river and valley. You are a German soldier .. unreal the museum was awesome with about 3 or 4 Sherman tanks, jeeps, trucks a few airplanes. The WW 1 section was really nice because they made it a bunker. They had a few periscopes to look up since a sniper would of blown your head off. They had a section on the Alamo but didn't get to see it. We were there for about 3 hours and nobody else came in. Imagine the past 2 weeks in Austin F-1 was here with about 500,000 out of townees and last week was South by southwest and about 1.2 million were here .I asked at the desk when Austin has its big venues do you get a lot of people visiting They said no one comes here to camp Mabry. In the bookstore I bought an arm patch that was lost but it was what my father wore as part of the 5th Army .. great time

     
    DB51daBEARS
    DB51daBEARS
    Veteran
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Sep, 2016
    Posts: 4135
    Posted: Nov. 9, 2022 - 5:52 PM ET #4

    Hey Box,

    The TMF Museum and those displays sound incredible...standing on the hill top looking down as a German soldier would have been.  Just waiting to rip our guys to pieces!!!  Always the way - thankfully not every general officer, but too many of 'em.  Something so clearly designed for failure and huge loss of life!!!!  I saw some remarks online about Gen. Clark was not the most well liked commanding officer...arrogant and uncaring, too.

    I have to read the link now...looking forward to it.  I included the link in my prior post because I wanted to include it in my response.  Now I can take my time and read all about it.  American History was ALWAYS my favorite subject in school.  I hope/believe/know I'll get down to Austin some time...that will be amazing to experience!  Great that you shared with everybody what your dad was doing to fight the good fight.

    Cheers buddy...always great to read whatever you post...including MEAN GREEN FOOTBALL  thefootball  an_cheers 

    Reply

    Hey Box,

    The TMF Museum and those displays sound incredible...standing on the hill top looking down as a German soldier would have been.  Just waiting to rip our guys to pieces!!!  Always the way - thankfully not every general officer, but too many of 'em.  Something so clearly designed for failure and huge loss of life!!!!  I saw some remarks online about Gen. Clark was not the most well liked commanding officer...arrogant and uncaring, too.

    I have to read the link now...looking forward to it.  I included the link in my prior post because I wanted to include it in my response.  Now I can take my time and read all about it.  American History was ALWAYS my favorite subject in school.  I hope/believe/know I'll get down to Austin some time...that will be amazing to experience!  Great that you shared with everybody what your dad was doing to fight the good fight.

    Cheers buddy...always great to read whatever you post...including MEAN GREEN FOOTBALL  thefootball  an_cheers 

     
     
    Fuse
    Fuse
    Legend
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    Joined: Mar, 2016
    Posts: 84838
    Posted: Nov. 11, 2022 - 5:24 PM ET #5

    Wow.peace_5peaceclover

    Learn, be content and stay disciplined.
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    Wow.peace_5peaceclover

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