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    All Forums | Boxing

    Abraham vs Taylor, Froch vs Dirrell

    walktheline
    DodgerBluFitted
    Mack05
    DatMofoThere85
    Coweringbeef
    ...
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    Views: 591
    Posts: 12
     
    walktheline
    walktheline
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    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 7:30 AM ET #1

    First off, this tourney is EXACTLY what boxing needs. It's already been said a million times, but what a treat for the true fans.
     
    Abraham is good, but not elite. His resume is trash and he has never fought at super middleweight. However, his power will give Taylor some major problems if he lands something big. There is a major flaw that is going to cost him this fight - he has no jab and backs straight up when getting pressure.
     
    He has no offense in the center of the ring. None. Zero. His gameplan is to pick off punches with that high guard, get inside, and do damage with rock solid body punches and a great left hook. Hanging around with Taylor has produced great results - ask Carl Froch. Too bad I don't see it happening. He'll lose way too many rounds getting out boxed in the center of the ring. Should Taylor gas, (which I don't think he will) he will have a shot to win the fight. He is just too small and too slow to do anything early in this fight.
     
    He'll be a day late and a dollar short, as JT puts on a clinic.
     
    Taylor, +260.
     
    Froch vs Dirrell is a fight that is much more interesting. He have your typical blazing fast american vs a granite chinned European. Dirrell's jab is going to find a home early and often. Froch needs to pick up that left hand, or he'll have trouble generating any offense. If Dirrell doesn't have the pop to keep Froch at bay, it's going to be an easy Froch victory.
     
    Actually, it will be anyways. Why? A few reasons..
     
    1.  I'm not sure Dirrell could have a worse matchup of the 5 guys in this tourney. He has only fought past 6 rounds twice, and has had no legit preperation for this level of fighter. Froch might be very flawed, but he is tough as nails both mentally and physically. Froch's experience and ability to adjust will be a huge factor.
     
    2. Can Dirrell take a punch? Umm..... maybe? One thing is sure, we'll probably find out sooner than later. If he can't, expect Froch to sell out to get inside and finish the fight.
     
    3. Dirrell is unpolished, and doesn't like pressure. Watch how much of a fit Hanshaw gave him in the first couple of rounds. Dirrell was lost - southpaw, orthodox, back again. Froch does nothing but attempt to wear you down. How will Dirrell handle it?
     
    Basically, Dirrell would have to keep Froch away by jabbing and using his massive speed advantage to get off and get away. To ask him to do it for 12 rounds on foreign soil against a solid fighter like Froch, too much to ask. Even if he did, I wouldn't trust the cards as far as I could throw them. Piss poor bet all the way around.
     
    Froch wins only, -163. This is a much better play than Taylor, even though I think both are rather solid.
    Reply
    To remove first post, remove entire topic.
    First off, this tourney is EXACTLY what boxing needs. It's already been said a million times, but what a treat for the true fans.
     
    Abraham is good, but not elite. His resume is trash and he has never fought at super middleweight. However, his power will give Taylor some major problems if he lands something big. There is a major flaw that is going to cost him this fight - he has no jab and backs straight up when getting pressure.
     
    He has no offense in the center of the ring. None. Zero. His gameplan is to pick off punches with that high guard, get inside, and do damage with rock solid body punches and a great left hook. Hanging around with Taylor has produced great results - ask Carl Froch. Too bad I don't see it happening. He'll lose way too many rounds getting out boxed in the center of the ring. Should Taylor gas, (which I don't think he will) he will have a shot to win the fight. He is just too small and too slow to do anything early in this fight.
     
    He'll be a day late and a dollar short, as JT puts on a clinic.
     
    Taylor, +260.
     
    Froch vs Dirrell is a fight that is much more interesting. He have your typical blazing fast american vs a granite chinned European. Dirrell's jab is going to find a home early and often. Froch needs to pick up that left hand, or he'll have trouble generating any offense. If Dirrell doesn't have the pop to keep Froch at bay, it's going to be an easy Froch victory.
     
    Actually, it will be anyways. Why? A few reasons..
     
    1.  I'm not sure Dirrell could have a worse matchup of the 5 guys in this tourney. He has only fought past 6 rounds twice, and has had no legit preperation for this level of fighter. Froch might be very flawed, but he is tough as nails both mentally and physically. Froch's experience and ability to adjust will be a huge factor.
     
    2. Can Dirrell take a punch? Umm..... maybe? One thing is sure, we'll probably find out sooner than later. If he can't, expect Froch to sell out to get inside and finish the fight.
     
    3. Dirrell is unpolished, and doesn't like pressure. Watch how much of a fit Hanshaw gave him in the first couple of rounds. Dirrell was lost - southpaw, orthodox, back again. Froch does nothing but attempt to wear you down. How will Dirrell handle it?
     
    Basically, Dirrell would have to keep Froch away by jabbing and using his massive speed advantage to get off and get away. To ask him to do it for 12 rounds on foreign soil against a solid fighter like Froch, too much to ask. Even if he did, I wouldn't trust the cards as far as I could throw them. Piss poor bet all the way around.
     
    Froch wins only, -163. This is a much better play than Taylor, even though I think both are rather solid.
     
    DodgerBluFitted
    DodgerBluFitted
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    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 8:08 AM ET #2

    what site do you use to get those great odds??
     
    I use sportsinteraction, which Taylor was +250 now dropped all the way to +190 lol
     
    Guess that smart money came pouring in..
    I agree with you about Taylor putting on a clinic. He just needs to maintain that in the later rounds
    Reply
    what site do you use to get those great odds??
     
    I use sportsinteraction, which Taylor was +250 now dropped all the way to +190 lol
     
    Guess that smart money came pouring in..
    I agree with you about Taylor putting on a clinic. He just needs to maintain that in the later rounds
     
    walktheline
    walktheline
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    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 8:33 AM ET #3

    Froch wins only via 5 dimes, JT via matchbook. If you don't have either of those two, I suggest you get them ASAP.
    Reply
    Froch wins only via 5 dimes, JT via matchbook. If you don't have either of those two, I suggest you get them ASAP.
     
    Mack05
    Mack05
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    Posts: 4403
    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 10:01 AM ET #4

    Despite the fact that I have predicted correctly what? something like 12 of my last 13 fights? (Vic D was my only loss) in a row here on Covers, it seems I am going to be completely ignored AGAIN. Walktheline, I disagree with you in EVERYWAY.
     
    It seems Americans seriously underestimate the skills of AA. I have stated the reason why AA will win on other threads so I am not going to repeat that here. AA is the bet of the year. He will not lose this fight.
     
    Maybe when I am proven right AGAIN people might actually listen to me and not waste their money on a figher so far out of date and past his prime, if he were a yoghurt there would be trees groing out of him!
     
    There is NO CHANCE of an upset in the first fight. There is in the second. Why? Because Taylor does not truly believe he can win this fight. And even if he does when he steps in the ring he will be confronted by nothing he has ever seen in his life and he will begin to get that sinking feeling again. And when he climbs through the ropes, reality will hit and he will be in a different world. I cannot stress enough just how intimadating the atmosphere is in Germany.
     
    I watched fights in Germany and Thailand and I wont go to either place again as you feel so uncomfortable and you worry if you going to get your head kicked off! My second fight in Germany was Wlad against Tony the Tiger. I remember talking to my dad and 2 Germans roar at me. "Are you English"?. Then a few more heard English and came down to us staring us down. When I assured them I was not, I was let alone but if I was!...It doesnt bare thinking about.  
     
    And you guys want to bet on a mentally shot figher, fighting abroad for the first time against a hero in Germany, a warrior, a superb technical boxer. Just because he is not as flashy as JT does not mean he is not as effective!. I think your all mad! JT's last victory was against Lacey. Are you kidding me! Lacey!
     
    Ok throw away your money but don't say you were not all warned and warned regulary! Even if Taylor performs incredibily do you think he will knock AA out!? Do you think he will get a decision in Germany!? Are you kidding me...
     
    If there is to be an upset it will be in the second fight. The difference between Dirrell and Taylor is the Dirrell believes he is going to win. The guy has boxing skills and he is undefeated. Ok its a big ask to beat a guy like Froch away from home in your first major test but he has the confidence and belief of an undefeated fighter.
     
    I give up, you want to throw money away, throw it away. There will be an upset in this tourney. Just not with Jermain Taylor..
    Why people want to back a fighter that has let people down again and again only you all know. Is this a USA USA thing? It must be because there is no reason to back this idiot.
     
    Sorry I am coming across badly. I am just flabergasted people can continue to back this guy and lose hard earned money on him..
     
    The key to making money on under dogs is patience. I have parlayed AA with Clottley. I also have another double with AA and Vitali KO of big Chris. They are safe investments. Ok It will take me awhile before I see cash but at least I will see it. Look for better dogs. Trust me. Ward is a great live dog. Taylor is not
     
    Good luck all
    Reply
    Despite the fact that I have predicted correctly what? something like 12 of my last 13 fights? (Vic D was my only loss) in a row here on Covers, it seems I am going to be completely ignored AGAIN. Walktheline, I disagree with you in EVERYWAY.
     
    It seems Americans seriously underestimate the skills of AA. I have stated the reason why AA will win on other threads so I am not going to repeat that here. AA is the bet of the year. He will not lose this fight.
     
    Maybe when I am proven right AGAIN people might actually listen to me and not waste their money on a figher so far out of date and past his prime, if he were a yoghurt there would be trees groing out of him!
     
    There is NO CHANCE of an upset in the first fight. There is in the second. Why? Because Taylor does not truly believe he can win this fight. And even if he does when he steps in the ring he will be confronted by nothing he has ever seen in his life and he will begin to get that sinking feeling again. And when he climbs through the ropes, reality will hit and he will be in a different world. I cannot stress enough just how intimadating the atmosphere is in Germany.
     
    I watched fights in Germany and Thailand and I wont go to either place again as you feel so uncomfortable and you worry if you going to get your head kicked off! My second fight in Germany was Wlad against Tony the Tiger. I remember talking to my dad and 2 Germans roar at me. "Are you English"?. Then a few more heard English and came down to us staring us down. When I assured them I was not, I was let alone but if I was!...It doesnt bare thinking about.  
     
    And you guys want to bet on a mentally shot figher, fighting abroad for the first time against a hero in Germany, a warrior, a superb technical boxer. Just because he is not as flashy as JT does not mean he is not as effective!. I think your all mad! JT's last victory was against Lacey. Are you kidding me! Lacey!
     
    Ok throw away your money but don't say you were not all warned and warned regulary! Even if Taylor performs incredibily do you think he will knock AA out!? Do you think he will get a decision in Germany!? Are you kidding me...
     
    If there is to be an upset it will be in the second fight. The difference between Dirrell and Taylor is the Dirrell believes he is going to win. The guy has boxing skills and he is undefeated. Ok its a big ask to beat a guy like Froch away from home in your first major test but he has the confidence and belief of an undefeated fighter.
     
    I give up, you want to throw money away, throw it away. There will be an upset in this tourney. Just not with Jermain Taylor..
    Why people want to back a fighter that has let people down again and again only you all know. Is this a USA USA thing? It must be because there is no reason to back this idiot.
     
    Sorry I am coming across badly. I am just flabergasted people can continue to back this guy and lose hard earned money on him..
     
    The key to making money on under dogs is patience. I have parlayed AA with Clottley. I also have another double with AA and Vitali KO of big Chris. They are safe investments. Ok It will take me awhile before I see cash but at least I will see it. Look for better dogs. Trust me. Ward is a great live dog. Taylor is not
     
    Good luck all
     
    walktheline
    walktheline
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    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 10:13 AM ET #5

    Again? Really? Abe is trash, and JT thrashed Froch round after round until he flat quit, or ran out of gas. You keep talking about that win, but if you run that 100 times, JT wins AT LEAST at an 80% clip. Mentally shot? Maybe, but he'll stand up and give AA an ass kicking, with his only chance of losing the fight being bullshit on the cards. Other than that, he'll kill the smaller, weaker, slower man with ease.
     
    JT was/is world class. AA is an over-rated clown, moving up to get a taste of what a big fight is. I don't care if these to fought in a cage, JT whips his silly ass every single time. I'm not getting into this shit, but AA has no advantage other than he is at home. None. Size, speed, power.. nope. Stamina? Maybe. This isn't a shot Miranda, (his best win) it's a level he's never been on. Now he is going to move up and bring an ABC fight plan against a star? Not a fucking chance. JT would have to blow up - could happen, but it won't. It's his fight to lose, not AA's to win.
    Reply
    Again? Really? Abe is trash, and JT thrashed Froch round after round until he flat quit, or ran out of gas. You keep talking about that win, but if you run that 100 times, JT wins AT LEAST at an 80% clip. Mentally shot? Maybe, but he'll stand up and give AA an ass kicking, with his only chance of losing the fight being bullshit on the cards. Other than that, he'll kill the smaller, weaker, slower man with ease.
     
    JT was/is world class. AA is an over-rated clown, moving up to get a taste of what a big fight is. I don't care if these to fought in a cage, JT whips his silly ass every single time. I'm not getting into this shit, but AA has no advantage other than he is at home. None. Size, speed, power.. nope. Stamina? Maybe. This isn't a shot Miranda, (his best win) it's a level he's never been on. Now he is going to move up and bring an ABC fight plan against a star? Not a fucking chance. JT would have to blow up - could happen, but it won't. It's his fight to lose, not AA's to win.
     
    DatMofoThere85
    DatMofoThere85
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    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 10:51 AM ET #6

    AA used to have trouble making 160. That's why he would always give away the first 3 rounds. Now that he doesn't have to worry about weight he will probabably start faster. AA fighting in front of his fans will not be beat. I can see JT being ahead after 6 rounds but that's it. JT trained in Houston (my hometown) for this fight. My homegirl saw him numerous times at the stripclub she works at. So much for having stronger legs and stamina for JT.
    Reply
    AA used to have trouble making 160. That's why he would always give away the first 3 rounds. Now that he doesn't have to worry about weight he will probabably start faster. AA fighting in front of his fans will not be beat. I can see JT being ahead after 6 rounds but that's it. JT trained in Houston (my hometown) for this fight. My homegirl saw him numerous times at the stripclub she works at. So much for having stronger legs and stamina for JT.
     
    walktheline
    walktheline
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    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 10:54 AM ET #7

    Every stripper in Vegas sees Floyd there 24/7, and he seems to do ok more often than not.
    Reply
    Every stripper in Vegas sees Floyd there 24/7, and he seems to do ok more often than not.
     
    Mack05
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    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 11:27 AM ET #8

    Walktheline you know absolutely nothing about boxing if you believe Taylor wins this fight. Have you ever boxed? I have (not as a pro mind you). I won a national bronze medal as an amatuer so I could box at a decent level.
     
    I gave up boxing when in my last fight, when I never trained as hard in my life as I did for that last fight. I fought a guy that domainated me over 4 rounds 17 months previous. I didn't train hard for the first fight so I put it down to that.
     
    I felt great going in but this time I as away from home. As soon as the bell rang I got caught with a great hook to the body. Here we go again. And I lost.I was mentally shot and my arms felt so heavy the whole time. Closer fight in the end, but I still lost. I knew then I would never make it as a boxer. Hang up the gloves Mack and I did.
     
    What's your point I hear you say. Now I am not comparing myself to Taylor. My point is that the mental aspect of boxing is just as important as the physical part. Taylor is a mentally shot fighter. No if but or questuion about that. He does not have the desire or mental toughness to win a fight in Germany. I know a mentally shot fighter when I see one. He may feel good going in but that will end as soon as he hits the ring. I guarentee you.
     
    If you watch the build up to the Taylor v Froch fight both Dibella and Taylor repeat again and again that this is his last chance and that he has to take it. And yes he fought a great fight but he still managed to lose in his home crowd with a huge lead on the cards. That was supposedly his last chance. If you lost what you believed was your last chance tell me how you can win again when your given another chance? How many more chances does this idiot want? 1,2,3,4,5? I question putting a guy like Taylor in this tournament. I wishh we had Lucian Bute instead.
     
    Again, you want to back this idiot who messed up "his last chance" against a undefeated fighter, who is probably Germany's top three superstar (if not number 1) and adored there. The super 6 to Germany is as big as the superbowl in the States. Its all they have been talking about over there. Do you think Taylor can knock out a guy that tough?Seriously?. Do you honestly believe even if Taylor fights an incredible fight that he will get a decision against a guy like AA in Germany?Seriously? In GERMANY! why don't you smell the sh!t your shoveling.
     
    As Pacman proved against Hatton and Oscar, size aint everything. Now AA is no pacman but if you basing your argument on size then thats the stupidest thing I have ever heard! Believe it or not walktheline smaller fighters have beaten bigger fighers before. On the night they will weigh the exact same so your agrument is on what? A height difference? If thats the case how has Valuev ever lost a fight!?
     
    Btw Miranda became shot AFTER his lose to Abraham. Pavlik wanted nothing to do with this guy what does that tell you?
     
    People like you want to back Taylor for all the wrong reasons. Dogs will win in this touranment but you are smoking something if you think Taylor wins this fight with these kind of odds stacked against him. If he rolled back the years, won every round in style he would not decision AA in Germany.
     
    Ignore history lessons if you must but its by learning from past fights and past mistakes that we learn to make the correct judgement going forward. At least those of us that are intelligent do..
    Reply
    Walktheline you know absolutely nothing about boxing if you believe Taylor wins this fight. Have you ever boxed? I have (not as a pro mind you). I won a national bronze medal as an amatuer so I could box at a decent level.
     
    I gave up boxing when in my last fight, when I never trained as hard in my life as I did for that last fight. I fought a guy that domainated me over 4 rounds 17 months previous. I didn't train hard for the first fight so I put it down to that.
     
    I felt great going in but this time I as away from home. As soon as the bell rang I got caught with a great hook to the body. Here we go again. And I lost.I was mentally shot and my arms felt so heavy the whole time. Closer fight in the end, but I still lost. I knew then I would never make it as a boxer. Hang up the gloves Mack and I did.
     
    What's your point I hear you say. Now I am not comparing myself to Taylor. My point is that the mental aspect of boxing is just as important as the physical part. Taylor is a mentally shot fighter. No if but or questuion about that. He does not have the desire or mental toughness to win a fight in Germany. I know a mentally shot fighter when I see one. He may feel good going in but that will end as soon as he hits the ring. I guarentee you.
     
    If you watch the build up to the Taylor v Froch fight both Dibella and Taylor repeat again and again that this is his last chance and that he has to take it. And yes he fought a great fight but he still managed to lose in his home crowd with a huge lead on the cards. That was supposedly his last chance. If you lost what you believed was your last chance tell me how you can win again when your given another chance? How many more chances does this idiot want? 1,2,3,4,5? I question putting a guy like Taylor in this tournament. I wishh we had Lucian Bute instead.
     
    Again, you want to back this idiot who messed up "his last chance" against a undefeated fighter, who is probably Germany's top three superstar (if not number 1) and adored there. The super 6 to Germany is as big as the superbowl in the States. Its all they have been talking about over there. Do you think Taylor can knock out a guy that tough?Seriously?. Do you honestly believe even if Taylor fights an incredible fight that he will get a decision against a guy like AA in Germany?Seriously? In GERMANY! why don't you smell the sh!t your shoveling.
     
    As Pacman proved against Hatton and Oscar, size aint everything. Now AA is no pacman but if you basing your argument on size then thats the stupidest thing I have ever heard! Believe it or not walktheline smaller fighters have beaten bigger fighers before. On the night they will weigh the exact same so your agrument is on what? A height difference? If thats the case how has Valuev ever lost a fight!?
     
    Btw Miranda became shot AFTER his lose to Abraham. Pavlik wanted nothing to do with this guy what does that tell you?
     
    People like you want to back Taylor for all the wrong reasons. Dogs will win in this touranment but you are smoking something if you think Taylor wins this fight with these kind of odds stacked against him. If he rolled back the years, won every round in style he would not decision AA in Germany.
     
    Ignore history lessons if you must but its by learning from past fights and past mistakes that we learn to make the correct judgement going forward. At least those of us that are intelligent do..
     
    Coweringbeef
    Coweringbeef
    Prospect
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Dec, 2007
    Posts: 223
    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 12:27 PM ET #9

    I laid the short odds on Abraham in Germany.
    "Taylor does not truly believe he can win this fight."
     
    Yeah something is up with his head and has been for awhile.
    He has that haunted look in his eye.

    I've spoken with people who have trained with him and they say he is insecure and really wants to be seen as a good boxer.
    They say he eats too much red meat leading to fight.
     
    But mostly, I think he'll get badgered into a dec loss.
     
    It IS Germany, after all and AA is a big star over there.
    And there is NO way JT KO's AA.
    Unlike Froch, AA has a very high guard and a very good defence.
    Reply
    I laid the short odds on Abraham in Germany.
    "Taylor does not truly believe he can win this fight."
     
    Yeah something is up with his head and has been for awhile.
    He has that haunted look in his eye.

    I've spoken with people who have trained with him and they say he is insecure and really wants to be seen as a good boxer.
    They say he eats too much red meat leading to fight.
     
    But mostly, I think he'll get badgered into a dec loss.
     
    It IS Germany, after all and AA is a big star over there.
    And there is NO way JT KO's AA.
    Unlike Froch, AA has a very high guard and a very good defence.
     
    Mack05
    Mack05
    Veteran
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Nov, 2005
    Posts: 4403
    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 12:49 PM ET #10

    Cowering at least some sense prevails. I was beginning to think people were starting to lose their minds on this site! Right I am off to Nottingham. I will send some live updates.
    Reply
    Cowering at least some sense prevails. I was beginning to think people were starting to lose their minds on this site! Right I am off to Nottingham. I will send some live updates.
     
    getlowplayaz
    getlowplayaz
    Veteran
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Sep, 2006
    Posts: 2418
    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 6:00 PM ET #11

    i was going to bet on dirrell but froch is a beast
    Reply
    i was going to bet on dirrell but froch is a beast
     
     
    getlowplayaz
    getlowplayaz
    Veteran
    Participation Meter
    Joined: Sep, 2006
    Posts: 2418
    Posted: Oct. 17, 2009 - 6:01 PM ET #12

    jt is going to gas at the end as i watch it live
    Reply
    jt is going to gas at the end as i watch it live
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