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Author: [Politics] Topic: Right back to the big fat bonuses on wallstreet
cd329
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#1
Posted: 1/21/2011 8:00:20 PM

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Morgan-Stanley-CEO-gets-74M-apf-3212990988.html?x=0

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Citigroup-gives-CEO-Vikram-apf-1085395641.html?x=0

 

Thieves on wallstreet back to business as usual

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#2
Posted: 1/21/2011 8:14:54 PM
It won't stop until the whole thing collapses, which becomes more and more likely with each of these news stories. 


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#3
Posted: 1/21/2011 8:22:08 PM
Reminds me of my feeling about Facebook these days.  Let's see.  Goldman Sacs, a Golden Globe for Best Picture for Social Network, and an upcoming Academy Award for Best Picture.  Facebook has been completely absorbed by "The Machine," as I like to call it.  No wonder Facebook hasn't resulted a single political action or social change.  The movie makes it look like a revolution, but nothing could be further from the truth.




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#4
Posted: 1/21/2011 10:45:37 PM

Yup these people on Wallstreet dont care what society thinks, they are just going to keep being crooks everyday.

Hey when one of the greatest gamblers{billy walters} of all time gets hustled by the crooks on wallstreet, what chance do regular folks like us have?

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#5
Posted: 1/22/2011 12:53:22 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by cd329:

Yup these people on Wallstreet dont care what society thinks, they are just going to keep being crooks everyday.

Hey when one of the greatest gamblers{billy walters} of all time gets hustled by the crooks on wallstreet, what chance do regular folks like us have?



i wasnt aware there was a mandate for regular folks to invest in wall st and i wasnt aware wall st was the only place for investments.
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#6
Posted: 1/22/2011 12:54:52 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by cd329:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Morgan-Stanley-CEO-gets-74M-apf-3212990988.html?x=0

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Citigroup-gives-CEO-Vikram-apf-1085395641.html?x=0

 

Thieves on wallstreet back to business as usual



why are these bonuses inappropriate?
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#7
Posted: 1/22/2011 1:03:03 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by cd329:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Morgan-Stanley-CEO-gets-74M-apf-3212990988.html?x=0

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Citigroup-gives-CEO-Vikram-apf-1085395641.html?x=0

 

Thieves on wallstreet back to business as usual

 Didn't these guys earn these rewards by producing outstanding results?

 

 

 

MORGAN STANLEY

NEW YORK (AP) -- Morgan Stanley CEO John Gorman has received stock grants and options worth about $7.4 million as part of his 2010 pay package.

In a regulatory filing Friday, the company disclosed that Gorman is getting 129,809 restricted shares. Based on the bank's Friday closing price of $30.01, the stock is worth $3.9 million. He also receives stock options worth $3.5 million, according to the filing.

The value of Gorman's total pay package for the year, which would include cash and perks, wasn't disclosed.

Chairman John Mack received 66,912 restricted shares, worth a little over $2 million at current prices, the New York-based investment bank disclosed in a separate filing.

On Thursday, the bank reported that its earnings in the last three months of 2010 rose 60 percent on strong investment banking results. The stronger results marked a turnaround for the bank, which struggled to find its footing after the financial crisis.

The investment bank paid $16 billion in bonuses and other compensation to its employees in 2010, up from $14 billion a year earlier. The bank restructured how it compensates employees and can take back employees' pay if they don't meet certain standards.

Morgan Stanley also reduced the amount of cash bonuses it pays and increased the amount of deferred compensation.

CITIGROUP

NEW YORK (AP) -- Citigroup Inc. is giving its CEO a big raise.

The New York-based bank is lifting Vikram Pandit's base salary to $1.75 million from just $1 a year effective immediately, according to a filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission on Friday. The announcement comes after Citi reported its first full year of profits since Pandit took over the top job in 2007. The bank also repaid the last of its bailout money last year.

Citi was one of the hardest-hit U.S. banks during the credit crisis, and received $45 billion in taxpayer aid. Pandit in 2009 pledged to take a $1 salary until the troubled bank returned to profitability. The government sold off the last of its stake in the bank in December for a profit of $12 billion.

Richard Parsons, chair of Citigroup Inc.'s board, said in Friday's filing that the board is "very pleased" with the progress that the bank has made under Pandit's leadership. Parsons said Pandit has "worked tirelessly to put Citi back on the right track."

The raise was not a surprise. In September, when the bank doled out raises to a number of top executives, Parsons had hinted that Pandit was in store for a big payout. The base salary also does not include stocks, options and other compensation that executives typically receive as part of their pay package.

Citigroup reported its fourth straight quarterly profit on Tuesday. With more customers paying their mortgages and credit card payments on time, the bank was able to reach into its reserves it no longer needed to cover loan losses.

Like others in its industry, however, the bank saw revenue from trading stocks and bonds fall sharply in the quarter. Citi shares also rose 40 percent last year, making it the best-performing stock among major U.S. banks. Shares still remain far below the $50-range they traded at pre-crisis, however.

Before agreeing to a $1 salary in 2009, Pandit had already received $125,000 in salary. His only other compensation that year was $3,750 in 401(k) benefits. In 2008, Pandit's compensation package was valued at $38.2 million. But most of that pay was made up of restricted stock and stock options.

Pandit still has plenty of work ahead of him. At the end of the 2010, Citi had set aside $40.7 billion or 6.3 percent of its total loans, for future losses. By comparison, its larger rival JP Morgan Chase & Co. set aside $32 billion, or 4.5 percent of its total loans, last year. That means Citi has more troubled loans than some of its peers.

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#8
Posted: 1/22/2011 1:16:35 PM
steveshane67

Well, it's excessive for one.  It's an increase from the previous year.  Seems excessive.  I won't even talk about all of the stockholders they bilked.

Mostly, it's excessive and gluttonous.
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#9
Posted: 1/22/2011 2:57:50 PM
Outstanding results?  You're kidding right?  Yea, that's why they needed to borrow 45 billion.

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#10
Posted: 1/22/2011 3:00:15 PM
They are being rewarded for results AFTER the money was borrowed and paid back, from what I read
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#11
Posted: 1/22/2011 3:03:16 PM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by 5_for_Fighting:

They are being rewarded for results AFTER the money was borrowed and paid back, from what I read

These corrupt fool wouldn't even be around if the equally corrupt fool in our gov't hadn't bailed their companies out with our money.  You don't see how those extravagant bonuses are bound to upset people so soon after?

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#12
Posted: 1/22/2011 3:08:52 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by SurfApe:

These corrupt fool wouldn't even be around if the equally corrupt fool in our gov't hadn't bailed their companies out with our money.  You don't see how those extravagant bonuses are bound to upset people so soon after?



Your English is abysmal.
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#13
Posted: 1/22/2011 3:26:10 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by SurfApe:

These corrupt fool wouldn't even be around if the equally corrupt fool in our gov't hadn't bailed their companies out with our money.  You don't see how those extravagant bonuses are bound to upset people so soon after?

No,I don't

I think most people with room temperature and higher IQs would see that when when companies turn profits, the economy grows....and people get hired

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#14
Posted: 1/22/2011 3:34:13 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by 5_for_Fighting:

They are being rewarded for results AFTER the money was borrowed and paid back, from what I read


Yes, but those results mirror the results before the bailout.  So, if you're judging those profits to be indicative of doing one's job well, then how do you account for "doing one's job well" before the garbage hit the fan.  That's all I'm saying.  Nothing has changed. 

When those companies turn a profit, that's how it's supposed to work, but doesn't.  If it did, then why is the wealth more divided than ever?
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#15
Posted: 1/22/2011 3:54:03 PM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by Anent:



Yes, but those results mirror the results before the bailout.  So, if you're judging those profits to be indicative of doing one's job well, then how do you account for "doing one's job well" before the garbage hit the fan.  That's all I'm saying.  Nothing has changed. 

When those companies turn a profit, that's how it's supposed to work, but doesn't.  If it did, then why is the wealth more divided than ever?

The announcement comes after Citi reported its first full year of profits since Pandit took over the top job in 2007. The bank also repaid the last of its bailout money last year.

 When was the bailout?

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#16
Posted: 1/22/2011 4:01:57 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by 5_for_Fighting:

No,I don't

I think most people with room temperature and higher IQs would see that when when companies turn profits, the economy grows....and people get hired

and their already exhorbitant salaries aren't enough motivation for them to properly run their companies?  I'm not saying there should be some type of cap or ban on executive salaries, just stating that its pretty obvious why people would find this distasteful on the heels of massive bailouts, and at a time when so many are struggling just to make ends meet.

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#17
Posted: 1/22/2011 4:15:06 PM
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45 billion in 2008.  Yea, they paid it back at the end of 2010, with the government making 12 billion.  Those are the numbers I've seen.  Let's see, the gov made 12 billion, Citi made enough to reward their CEO handsomely.  How's the economy doing?  That was the whole point - when the banks came back they'd bring the economy back with them.  It's not happening, it never does. 

I don't think a bonus like that has anything to do with job merit.  Sorry, but those are my values. 
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#18
Posted: 1/22/2011 4:16:03 PM
I can understand why the "withouts" are jealous, but, I for one rejoice when companies do well.

That means my money, and my investments will generally do well.

As well as the economy and the jobs market and housing market.

If these guys are the brightest minds, and they aren't rewarded, other companies are out there that WILL reward them for jobs well done.

I think of it as performance bonuses
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#19
Posted: 1/22/2011 4:21:02 PM
Remember, if you owned stock before theses bailouts, you lost most of your assets.  Now, barely 2 years later they reward their CEO like that?  It seems like the ethical thing to do would be to pay back the shareholders some part of what they lost.  But I know they're not required to. The whole thing is completely insane, which is one reason why it's falling apart.  They just put another nail in their own eventual coffin.
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#20
Posted: 1/22/2011 4:21:50 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by SurfApe:

These corrupt fool wouldn't even be around if the equally corrupt fool in our gov't hadn't bailed their companies out with our money.  You don't see how those extravagant bonuses are bound to upset people so soon after?

Just like the UAW and Auto manufacturers...
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#21
Posted: 1/22/2011 4:24:38 PM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by 5_for_Fighting:

I can understand why the "withouts" are jealous, but, I for one rejoice when companies do well.

That means my money, and my investments will generally do well.

As well as the economy and the jobs market and housing market.

If these guys are the brightest minds, and they aren't rewarded, other companies are out there that WILL reward them for jobs well done.

I think of it as performance bonuses

Fair enough, you just seemed tone deaf towards any criticism of this practice.  I too rejoice when companies (at least those i'm long on) do well, i just find the bonuses somewhat excessive and certainly sympathize with the "withouts" who have seen few new jobs from this recovery.

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#22
Posted: 1/22/2011 4:27:11 PM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by potter36:

Just like the UAW and Auto manufacturers...

Not sure what the UAW has to do with this topic per se, but i was opposed to those bailouts as well.

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#23
Posted: 1/22/2011 4:59:58 PM
a few questions

1) do those companies owe the govt any money (ie have they paid back the bailout)

2) what business is of yours what a private company does with its money?

and if those simple questions arent enough

3) if morgan stanley and citi cant pay market wages for execs, how do you expect them to recruit good talent and be a profitable company?
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#24
Posted: 1/22/2011 5:11:10 PM
Well lets just state the obvious..

These firms are around due to the taxpayer, does the average taxpayer get paid this kind of compensation? There is reason to be bothered, we fronted their existence and less than two years later they are rolling out the mega bonuses again.

One other tiny point..these "profits" are due to one thing and only one thing..these firms are borrowing money from the UST and the FED at pretty much zero interest, buying federal bonds/notes/bills, leveraged and earning their "profits" by getting fees for participating in these auctions and getting leveraged interest from the government, and they are profiting off leveraged gambling in commodities and futures trading.

If you look closely at the earnings releases, the "profits" are from "fixed income" trading..they arent lending, they are still bleeding from the leverage they still carry, litigation is ongoing and coming down the road.

These firms exist due to the government, they are making profits because of the FED and the government, they are giving monster bonuses due to these two facts, so there is good reason for someone to be bothered by these bonuses being given.
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#25
Posted: 1/22/2011 5:49:25 PM
http://www.icenews.is/index.php/2011/01/20/more-icelandic-bankers-arrested/

until this happens in the US, nothing changes

if and when that does happen, it will be nothing short of a revolution

the people of iceland were asked / told to pay back 5b in bankster debt. they told the government and banksters to shove it up their fools. conversely, our government and banksters told us to give them 787 billion (that we know of) and we did it...

the icelandic example is the only hope for all of us. arrest the banksters, collapse the fiat currency system and start from scratch as free people
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