Gilbreath the investigator admitted, that he does not know who started the fight, no evidence to prove who started the fight and does not have evidence to contradict Zimmerman’s statement that Martin started the fight.
He also testified he does not have evidence to contradict Zimmerman’s assertion, that he turned back around to walk to his car........and doesn't know if Zimmerman continued to follow Trayvon...
What he's saying is ..the prosecution doesn't have a case..
Gilbreath the investigator admitted, that he does not know who started the fight, no evidence to prove who started the fight and does not have evidence to contradict Zimmerman’s statement that Martin started the fight.
He also testified he does not have evidence to contradict Zimmerman’s assertion, that he turned back around to walk to his car........and doesn't know if Zimmerman continued to follow Trayvon...
What he's saying is ..the prosecution doesn't have a case..
After watching Zimmernan in his bond hearing ..he looks small.. 5'7'' and even with the bullet-proof vest around 170 lbs... I couldn't help thinking, that with his facial features, skin tone and size of his ears ..any reasonable person would have to say ..he looks more like he could be Obama's son ..than Trayvon..
Besides Zimmerman looking rather small ..his lawyer O'Mara did an excellant job of humanize his client... while limiting the scope of direct examination....
Tonight even Nancy Grace has backed off from being all Trayvon all the time..
After watching Zimmernan in his bond hearing ..he looks small.. 5'7'' and even with the bullet-proof vest around 170 lbs... I couldn't help thinking, that with his facial features, skin tone and size of his ears ..any reasonable person would have to say ..he looks more like he could be Obama's son ..than Trayvon..
Besides Zimmerman looking rather small ..his lawyer O'Mara did an excellant job of humanize his client... while limiting the scope of direct examination....
Tonight even Nancy Grace has backed off from being all Trayvon all the time..
Moral of the story... When you've won the fight, or obtained a form of submission, BACK OFF!
or it could be twisted to say -- "when you get your ass kicked take your lumps like a man and walk away and let the cops do their thing. Do not pull out a gun and kill someone because he kicked your ass."
Moral of the story... When you've won the fight, or obtained a form of submission, BACK OFF!
or it could be twisted to say -- "when you get your ass kicked take your lumps like a man and walk away and let the cops do their thing. Do not pull out a gun and kill someone because he kicked your ass."
or it could be twisted to say -- "when you get your ass kicked take your lumps like a man and walk away and let the cops do their thing. Do not pull out a gun and kill someone because he kicked your ass."
Wow. I can't believe this is the level of ignorance these days.
A fist fight is not grounds for deadly force but having your head slammed into the sidewalk crosses the line. Especially, if the offender is telling you that he is going to kill you.
or it could be twisted to say -- "when you get your ass kicked take your lumps like a man and walk away and let the cops do their thing. Do not pull out a gun and kill someone because he kicked your ass."
Wow. I can't believe this is the level of ignorance these days.
A fist fight is not grounds for deadly force but having your head slammed into the sidewalk crosses the line. Especially, if the offender is telling you that he is going to kill you.
Wow. I can't believe this is the level of ignorance these days.
A fist fight is not grounds for deadly force but having your head slammed into the sidewalk crosses the line. Especially, if the offender is telling you that he is going to kill you.
Wise up!
so giving someone a fair warning that you are going to kill them justifies the act?
Wow. I can't believe this is the level of ignorance these days.
A fist fight is not grounds for deadly force but having your head slammed into the sidewalk crosses the line. Especially, if the offender is telling you that he is going to kill you.
Wise up!
so giving someone a fair warning that you are going to kill them justifies the act?
or it could be twisted to say -- "when you get your ass kicked take your lumps like a man and walk away and let the cops do their thing. Do not pull out a gun and kill someone because he kicked your ass."
However, what if someone is on top of you,slamming your head into the ground,and saying they're going to kill you or said they were going to kill you before an altercation commences ?
If you can't escape the hold / grasp of someone,especially if they're on top of you and bashing your head into the ground - IF you are unable to "walk away" as you advise, it's reasonable that someone may feel an imminent fear for their life.
Zimmerman may have continued being the aggressor after the 911 dispatch said "we don't need you to do that" and he may have not been attacked;but,that doesn't mean he didn't feel deathly threatened,especially if he was unable to escape T's hold.
What if Trayvon did indeed attack Zimmerman ? What if that is the case ?
or it could be twisted to say -- "when you get your ass kicked take your lumps like a man and walk away and let the cops do their thing. Do not pull out a gun and kill someone because he kicked your ass."
However, what if someone is on top of you,slamming your head into the ground,and saying they're going to kill you or said they were going to kill you before an altercation commences ?
If you can't escape the hold / grasp of someone,especially if they're on top of you and bashing your head into the ground - IF you are unable to "walk away" as you advise, it's reasonable that someone may feel an imminent fear for their life.
Zimmerman may have continued being the aggressor after the 911 dispatch said "we don't need you to do that" and he may have not been attacked;but,that doesn't mean he didn't feel deathly threatened,especially if he was unable to escape T's hold.
What if Trayvon did indeed attack Zimmerman ? What if that is the case ?
However, what if someone is on top of you,slamming your head into the ground,and saying they're going to kill you or said they were going to kill you before an altercation commences ?
If you can't escape the hold / grasp of someone,especially if they're on top of you and bashing your head into the ground - IF you are unable to "walk away" as you advise, it's reasonable that someone may feel an imminent fear for their life.
Zimmerman may have continued being the aggressor after the 911 dispatch said "we don't need you to do that" and he may have not been attacked;but,that doesn't mean he didn't feel deathly threatened,especially if he was unable to escape T's hold.
What if Trayvon did indeed attack Zimmerman ? What if that is the case ?
I think this is pretty accurate as for defenses/actions.
The conundrum is if Zimmerman approached Martin and Martin felt fearful and thus, reacted the way he did. As I said before, under Florida law, they BOTH would have been acting legally by their actions.
As an aside, there could be very few feelings of danger than fearing losing consciousness in an attack, and thus being at the mercy of someone you don't know who has attacked you. If, and I expressly say IF that was the case, it probably was justified, only in that sense.
However, what if someone is on top of you,slamming your head into the ground,and saying they're going to kill you or said they were going to kill you before an altercation commences ?
If you can't escape the hold / grasp of someone,especially if they're on top of you and bashing your head into the ground - IF you are unable to "walk away" as you advise, it's reasonable that someone may feel an imminent fear for their life.
Zimmerman may have continued being the aggressor after the 911 dispatch said "we don't need you to do that" and he may have not been attacked;but,that doesn't mean he didn't feel deathly threatened,especially if he was unable to escape T's hold.
What if Trayvon did indeed attack Zimmerman ? What if that is the case ?
I think this is pretty accurate as for defenses/actions.
The conundrum is if Zimmerman approached Martin and Martin felt fearful and thus, reacted the way he did. As I said before, under Florida law, they BOTH would have been acting legally by their actions.
As an aside, there could be very few feelings of danger than fearing losing consciousness in an attack, and thus being at the mercy of someone you don't know who has attacked you. If, and I expressly say IF that was the case, it probably was justified, only in that sense.
However, what if someone is on top of you,slamming your head into the ground,and saying they're going to kill you or said they were going to kill you before an altercation commences ?
If you can't escape the hold / grasp of someone,especially if they're on top of you and bashing your head into the ground - IF you are unable to "walk away" as you advise, it's reasonable that someone may feel an imminent fear for their life.
Zimmerman may have continued being the aggressor after the 911 dispatch said "we don't need you to do that" and he may have not been attacked;but,that doesn't mean he didn't feel deathly threatened,especially if he was unable to escape T's hold.
What if Trayvon did indeed attack Zimmerman ? What if that is the case ?
I completely agree with this. Either way this is a stupid conversation to have because essentially we are all arguing for our own internal bias of how the scene went down.
two things I think at play here:
1) TM was up to no good and as such was playing with fire. I am not trying to take the blame off him.
2) Once the cops were notified Martinez should not of pursued the issue any further. By doing so he (much like TM) put himself into a sticky situation. And regardless of how the night actually went down and if he is found guilty or not in the long run his life will never be the same again. Not just because he has to live with killing someone...
However, what if someone is on top of you,slamming your head into the ground,and saying they're going to kill you or said they were going to kill you before an altercation commences ?
If you can't escape the hold / grasp of someone,especially if they're on top of you and bashing your head into the ground - IF you are unable to "walk away" as you advise, it's reasonable that someone may feel an imminent fear for their life.
Zimmerman may have continued being the aggressor after the 911 dispatch said "we don't need you to do that" and he may have not been attacked;but,that doesn't mean he didn't feel deathly threatened,especially if he was unable to escape T's hold.
What if Trayvon did indeed attack Zimmerman ? What if that is the case ?
I completely agree with this. Either way this is a stupid conversation to have because essentially we are all arguing for our own internal bias of how the scene went down.
two things I think at play here:
1) TM was up to no good and as such was playing with fire. I am not trying to take the blame off him.
2) Once the cops were notified Martinez should not of pursued the issue any further. By doing so he (much like TM) put himself into a sticky situation. And regardless of how the night actually went down and if he is found guilty or not in the long run his life will never be the same again. Not just because he has to live with killing someone...
I think this is pretty accurate as for defenses/actions.
The conundrum is if Zimmerman approached Martin and Martin felt fearful and thus, reacted the way he did. As I said before, under Florida law, they BOTH would have been acting legally by their actions.
As an aside, there could be very few feelings of danger than fearing losing consciousness in an attack, and thus being at the mercy of someone you don't know who has attacked you. If, and I expressly say IF that was the case, it probably was justified, only in that sense.
I totally concur. I'm also wondering what the distance was from Trayvon's body to Z's vehicle. I think a timeline based on Z's 911 call,when he said OK to the dispatcher saying "we don't need you to do that" may indicate how far Z had been able to walk away from his vehicle. The greater the distance Trayvon's body was may support that Z continued to pursue T - in contrast to the shooting having occurred in close proximity to Z's vehicle which his defense could argue supports Z's claim that T approached Z while he was retreating.
I think this is pretty accurate as for defenses/actions.
The conundrum is if Zimmerman approached Martin and Martin felt fearful and thus, reacted the way he did. As I said before, under Florida law, they BOTH would have been acting legally by their actions.
As an aside, there could be very few feelings of danger than fearing losing consciousness in an attack, and thus being at the mercy of someone you don't know who has attacked you. If, and I expressly say IF that was the case, it probably was justified, only in that sense.
I totally concur. I'm also wondering what the distance was from Trayvon's body to Z's vehicle. I think a timeline based on Z's 911 call,when he said OK to the dispatcher saying "we don't need you to do that" may indicate how far Z had been able to walk away from his vehicle. The greater the distance Trayvon's body was may support that Z continued to pursue T - in contrast to the shooting having occurred in close proximity to Z's vehicle which his defense could argue supports Z's claim that T approached Z while he was retreating.
I completely agree with this. Either way this is a stupid conversation to have because essentially we are all arguing for ourowninternalbias of how the scene went down.
two things I think at play here:
1) TM was up to no good and as such was playing with fire. I am not trying to take the blame off him.
2) Once the cops were notified Martinez should not of pursued the issue any further. By doing so he (much like TM) put himself into a sticky situation. And regardless of how the night actually went down and if he is found guilty or not in the long run his life will never be the same again. Not just because he has to live with killing someone...
Well, I hope that's not the case in here.I certainly hope that jurors can remain prejudice free. And yes I too agree that this is a sad,sad situation.
I completely agree with this. Either way this is a stupid conversation to have because essentially we are all arguing for ourowninternalbias of how the scene went down.
two things I think at play here:
1) TM was up to no good and as such was playing with fire. I am not trying to take the blame off him.
2) Once the cops were notified Martinez should not of pursued the issue any further. By doing so he (much like TM) put himself into a sticky situation. And regardless of how the night actually went down and if he is found guilty or not in the long run his life will never be the same again. Not just because he has to live with killing someone...
Well, I hope that's not the case in here.I certainly hope that jurors can remain prejudice free. And yes I too agree that this is a sad,sad situation.
In the 911 recordings Zimmerman is asked by the dispatcher regarding Trayvon Martin, "How old would you say he is?" Zimmerman responds, "Late teens." His statement in court is that he thought Martin was a little bit younger than he was. This statement is a lie.
In the 911 recordings Zimmerman is asked by the dispatcher regarding Trayvon Martin, "How old would you say he is?" Zimmerman responds, "Late teens." His statement in court is that he thought Martin was a little bit younger than he was. This statement is a lie.
In the 911 recordings Zimmerman is asked by the dispatcher regarding Trayvon Martin, "How old would you say he is?" Zimmerman responds, "Late teens." His statement in court is that he thought Martin was a little bit younger than he was. This statement is a lie.
Just like this new statement where Zimmerman said he {martin} was banging his head against the pavement telling him he is going to die.
That isn't what he told the police right after it happened, according to the police report.
He did, however, always maintain that Martin attacked him, was on top of him, and punching him. The addition of the statement is intriguing.
In the 911 recordings Zimmerman is asked by the dispatcher regarding Trayvon Martin, "How old would you say he is?" Zimmerman responds, "Late teens." His statement in court is that he thought Martin was a little bit younger than he was. This statement is a lie.
Just like this new statement where Zimmerman said he {martin} was banging his head against the pavement telling him he is going to die.
That isn't what he told the police right after it happened, according to the police report.
He did, however, always maintain that Martin attacked him, was on top of him, and punching him. The addition of the statement is intriguing.
Just like this new statement where Zimmerman said he {martin} was banging his head against the pavement telling him he is going to die.
That isn't what he told the police right after it happened, according to the police report.
He did, however, always maintain that Martin attacked him, was on top of him, and punching him. The addition of the statement is intriguing.
Yes, most of his story is a lie imo... he's said everything possible from the beginning to make it look like he was totally innocent & was just attacked out of the blue when returning to his car after going to check an address to give to police. I'm sure he'll also lose as much weight as possible before trial.
Of course, being a guy who snaps with rage when pushed past a certain point, he'll be the ideal kind of defendant for a defense atty in a case like this. They generally are easy going, friendly & need/want to be liked (low self-esteem) & Z will be able to naturally appear in court or on the stand (if he takes it) exactly as his attys would want. Authentically sorry, humble, non-aggressive...
Just like this new statement where Zimmerman said he {martin} was banging his head against the pavement telling him he is going to die.
That isn't what he told the police right after it happened, according to the police report.
He did, however, always maintain that Martin attacked him, was on top of him, and punching him. The addition of the statement is intriguing.
Yes, most of his story is a lie imo... he's said everything possible from the beginning to make it look like he was totally innocent & was just attacked out of the blue when returning to his car after going to check an address to give to police. I'm sure he'll also lose as much weight as possible before trial.
Of course, being a guy who snaps with rage when pushed past a certain point, he'll be the ideal kind of defendant for a defense atty in a case like this. They generally are easy going, friendly & need/want to be liked (low self-esteem) & Z will be able to naturally appear in court or on the stand (if he takes it) exactly as his attys would want. Authentically sorry, humble, non-aggressive...
Gilbreath the investigator admitted, that he does not know who started the fight, no evidence to prove who started the fight and does not have evidence to contradict Zimmerman’s statement that Martin started the fight.
He also testified he does not have evidence to contradict Zimmerman’s assertion, that he turned back around to walk to his car........and doesn't know if Zimmerman continued to follow Trayvon...
What he's saying is ..the prosecution doesn't have a case..
When asked if they had evidence that Z lied in his original statement to police, Gilbreath also said, "Yes".
Gilbreath the investigator admitted, that he does not know who started the fight, no evidence to prove who started the fight and does not have evidence to contradict Zimmerman’s statement that Martin started the fight.
He also testified he does not have evidence to contradict Zimmerman’s assertion, that he turned back around to walk to his car........and doesn't know if Zimmerman continued to follow Trayvon...
What he's saying is ..the prosecution doesn't have a case..
When asked if they had evidence that Z lied in his original statement to police, Gilbreath also said, "Yes".
In the 911 recordings Zimmerman is asked by the dispatcher regarding Trayvon Martin, "How old would you say he is?" Zimmerman responds, "Late teens." His statement in court is that he thought Martin was a little bit younger than he was. This statement is a lie.
When Zimmerman said " late teens" he was observing him from a distance .......when Trayvon and Zimmerman confronted each other the 6'3" teen could have looked older to him ..
In the 911 recordings Zimmerman is asked by the dispatcher regarding Trayvon Martin, "How old would you say he is?" Zimmerman responds, "Late teens." His statement in court is that he thought Martin was a little bit younger than he was. This statement is a lie.
When Zimmerman said " late teens" he was observing him from a distance .......when Trayvon and Zimmerman confronted each other the 6'3" teen could have looked older to him ..
Zimmerman's story sounds like a stoner tale. It's just like when my mom caught me stoned 16 years ago and I just made up all kinds of bullshit to get her to back off. You go in full on panic mode and will say anything to get out of trouble.
His ass was on the line and he didn't want his cherry popped in prison and I don't blame him because I would make up shit to get out of jail too. Ive been stopped by the cops and I bullshit my way out and I always say to myself, I can't believe they bought it.
Zimmerman's story sounds like a stoner tale. It's just like when my mom caught me stoned 16 years ago and I just made up all kinds of bullshit to get her to back off. You go in full on panic mode and will say anything to get out of trouble.
His ass was on the line and he didn't want his cherry popped in prison and I don't blame him because I would make up shit to get out of jail too. Ive been stopped by the cops and I bullshit my way out and I always say to myself, I can't believe they bought it.
When Zimmerman said " late teens" he was observing him from a distance .......when Trayvon and Zimmerman confronted each other the 6'3" teen could have looked older to him ..
You are really reaching for justification here....rather implausible.
Zimmerman is the provoker in this entire situation. That is indisputable. Had he remained in his vehicle and obeyed the instructions he was given not to do anything....Trayvon would be alive.
Life is more precious than anything else, lest we forget.
When Zimmerman said " late teens" he was observing him from a distance .......when Trayvon and Zimmerman confronted each other the 6'3" teen could have looked older to him ..
You are really reaching for justification here....rather implausible.
Zimmerman is the provoker in this entire situation. That is indisputable. Had he remained in his vehicle and obeyed the instructions he was given not to do anything....Trayvon would be alive.
Life is more precious than anything else, lest we forget.
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