look I'm a huge Diaz fan but the line is pretty crazy if you ask me. The line opened with Condit as a slight favorite now its getting pushed all the way up to -200 Diaz. Is this because the public really wants to see this GSP vs. Diaz match?
The most impressive things Diaz has going for him is his stamina and toughness. With those two things you can go a long way. That being said the obvious weakness of Diaz is that he gets hit clean too much and of course his wrestling.
Our of Diaz last last 15 or so fights who was the last person that actually tested his wrestling? I'm not saying condit is a world class wrestler or anything but you can be sure he will use some wrestling against Diaz. Condit has a very good all around game and I think the power advantage goes to Condit.
I'm not saying Diaz is going to lose but I find it hard to lay the -200 for a fight that is essentially a pick em. Can Diaz break Condit?
look I'm a huge Diaz fan but the line is pretty crazy if you ask me. The line opened with Condit as a slight favorite now its getting pushed all the way up to -200 Diaz. Is this because the public really wants to see this GSP vs. Diaz match?
The most impressive things Diaz has going for him is his stamina and toughness. With those two things you can go a long way. That being said the obvious weakness of Diaz is that he gets hit clean too much and of course his wrestling.
Our of Diaz last last 15 or so fights who was the last person that actually tested his wrestling? I'm not saying condit is a world class wrestler or anything but you can be sure he will use some wrestling against Diaz. Condit has a very good all around game and I think the power advantage goes to Condit.
I'm not saying Diaz is going to lose but I find it hard to lay the -200 for a fight that is essentially a pick em. Can Diaz break Condit?
you missed one of the most obvious impressive companents of diaz - his boxing is top tier (for MMA). and his weakness of getting hit too much doesn't seem to be a factor. the only time it has stopped him, off the top of my head, is when noons stopped him by dr stoppage - cuts
and i don't think he'll break diaz - i think we'll see two battered dudes go to a decision
you missed one of the most obvious impressive companents of diaz - his boxing is top tier (for MMA). and his weakness of getting hit too much doesn't seem to be a factor. the only time it has stopped him, off the top of my head, is when noons stopped him by dr stoppage - cuts
and i don't think he'll break diaz - i think we'll see two battered dudes go to a decision
you missed one of the most obvious impressive companents of diaz - his boxing is top tier (for MMA). and his weakness of getting hit too much doesn't seem to be a factor. the only time it has stopped him, off the top of my head, is when noons stopped him by dr stoppage - cuts
and i don't think he'll break diaz - i think we'll see two battered dudes go to a decision
Diaz strikes are good...the reason it is effective is that he keeps coming forward and breaks the guy down physically/mentally. He probably is one of the few guys that actually consistently go to the body with his punches. He does tend to "arm punch" a lot but hey its been working. I still think Condit has the most crisp punches and he's going to have to use angles/knees/kicks and everything else.
I think cuts can be a factor especially when you believe (as I do) that Condit will make it all 5 rounds. The last 5 round fight Diaz was in was vs Noons and he was still taking some shots from Noon. there is a huge difference of skill level from Noons to Condit.
you missed one of the most obvious impressive companents of diaz - his boxing is top tier (for MMA). and his weakness of getting hit too much doesn't seem to be a factor. the only time it has stopped him, off the top of my head, is when noons stopped him by dr stoppage - cuts
and i don't think he'll break diaz - i think we'll see two battered dudes go to a decision
Diaz strikes are good...the reason it is effective is that he keeps coming forward and breaks the guy down physically/mentally. He probably is one of the few guys that actually consistently go to the body with his punches. He does tend to "arm punch" a lot but hey its been working. I still think Condit has the most crisp punches and he's going to have to use angles/knees/kicks and everything else.
I think cuts can be a factor especially when you believe (as I do) that Condit will make it all 5 rounds. The last 5 round fight Diaz was in was vs Noons and he was still taking some shots from Noon. there is a huge difference of skill level from Noons to Condit.
Jon Jones opening -600 over Rashad Evans is crazy.....lol
I think this is the 1st time Diaz is actually getting the respect he deserves. His "patty-cake" style boxing doesn't look like much but it is devastating! He has dismantled a who's-who of opponents with it and seems to only be getting better.
I like Condit a lot....so I can definately understand a good value play on him...but something about Diaz....just wears fighters down.....don't think he is going to lose this one.
Jon Jones opening -600 over Rashad Evans is crazy.....lol
I think this is the 1st time Diaz is actually getting the respect he deserves. His "patty-cake" style boxing doesn't look like much but it is devastating! He has dismantled a who's-who of opponents with it and seems to only be getting better.
I like Condit a lot....so I can definately understand a good value play on him...but something about Diaz....just wears fighters down.....don't think he is going to lose this one.
look I'm a huge Diaz fan but the line is pretty crazy if you ask me. The line opened with Condit as a slight favorite now its getting pushed all the way up to -200 Diaz. Is this because the public really wants to see this GSP vs. Diaz match?
The most impressive things Diaz has going for him is his stamina and toughness. With those two things you can go a long way. That being said the obvious weakness of Diaz is that he gets hit clean too much and of course his wrestling.
Our of Diaz last last 15 or so fights who was the last person that actually tested his wrestling? I'm not saying condit is a world class wrestler or anything but you can be sure he will use some wrestling against Diaz. Condit has a very good all around game and I think the power advantage goes to Condit.
I'm not saying Diaz is going to lose but I find it hard to lay the -200 for a fight that is essentially a pick em. Can Diaz break Condit?
I guess we'll have to wait and find out.
I am a tad surprised at the line. But it is warranted.
The best things he has going for him is cardio and toughness? What about his boxing? What about his BJJ? He is one of the best at both in the WW division.
Diaz has just as good, if not better wrestling than Condit.
Diaz has beat better strikers than Condit. Paul Daley and Penn both are better standing.
Since Condit has been in the UFC. He has a loss to Kampmann. Had a controversial split win over Ellenberger. He got his ass handed to him by a 20 year old Rory MacDonald, until he pulled it off somehow at the very end of the fight. He beat Dan Hardy (who can't?). And he flying knee'd focking Dong Hyun Kim.
What really is the most impressive thing Condit has ever done? He beats Dan Hardy by KO and flying knees an overrated and bad striker in Kim...and all of a sudden he is some real dangerous striker?
I don't see what advantage Condit even has. Don't get me wrong, Condit is a very solid fighter. I like him. But his record is overrated when you really look at it.
Diaz has the advantage in these areas:
-Cardio -Boxing -BJJ -Overall Toughness, I know he has been dropped...that is because he will stand with even the most dangerous of strikers.
We just saw his brother Nate destroy Cerrone. That match up is VERY similar to this match up. Cerrone was "supposedly the better striker because he kicks as well...and Nate the better boxer ate him for lunch.
Watch out for Nick to get cut here though. If it goes 3 or 4 rounds it is almost certain Nick will be cut up and the doctor could stop the fight.
look I'm a huge Diaz fan but the line is pretty crazy if you ask me. The line opened with Condit as a slight favorite now its getting pushed all the way up to -200 Diaz. Is this because the public really wants to see this GSP vs. Diaz match?
The most impressive things Diaz has going for him is his stamina and toughness. With those two things you can go a long way. That being said the obvious weakness of Diaz is that he gets hit clean too much and of course his wrestling.
Our of Diaz last last 15 or so fights who was the last person that actually tested his wrestling? I'm not saying condit is a world class wrestler or anything but you can be sure he will use some wrestling against Diaz. Condit has a very good all around game and I think the power advantage goes to Condit.
I'm not saying Diaz is going to lose but I find it hard to lay the -200 for a fight that is essentially a pick em. Can Diaz break Condit?
I guess we'll have to wait and find out.
I am a tad surprised at the line. But it is warranted.
The best things he has going for him is cardio and toughness? What about his boxing? What about his BJJ? He is one of the best at both in the WW division.
Diaz has just as good, if not better wrestling than Condit.
Diaz has beat better strikers than Condit. Paul Daley and Penn both are better standing.
Since Condit has been in the UFC. He has a loss to Kampmann. Had a controversial split win over Ellenberger. He got his ass handed to him by a 20 year old Rory MacDonald, until he pulled it off somehow at the very end of the fight. He beat Dan Hardy (who can't?). And he flying knee'd focking Dong Hyun Kim.
What really is the most impressive thing Condit has ever done? He beats Dan Hardy by KO and flying knees an overrated and bad striker in Kim...and all of a sudden he is some real dangerous striker?
I don't see what advantage Condit even has. Don't get me wrong, Condit is a very solid fighter. I like him. But his record is overrated when you really look at it.
Diaz has the advantage in these areas:
-Cardio -Boxing -BJJ -Overall Toughness, I know he has been dropped...that is because he will stand with even the most dangerous of strikers.
We just saw his brother Nate destroy Cerrone. That match up is VERY similar to this match up. Cerrone was "supposedly the better striker because he kicks as well...and Nate the better boxer ate him for lunch.
Watch out for Nick to get cut here though. If it goes 3 or 4 rounds it is almost certain Nick will be cut up and the doctor could stop the fight.
I am a tad surprised at the line. But it is warranted.
The best things he has going for him is cardio and toughness? What about his boxing? What about his BJJ? He is one of the best at both in the WW division.
Diaz has just as good, if not better wrestling than Condit.
Diaz has beat better strikers than Condit. Paul Daley and Penn both are better standing.
Since Condit has been in the UFC. He has a loss to Kampmann. Had a controversial split win over Ellenberger. He got his ass handed to him by a 20 year old Rory MacDonald, until he pulled it off somehow at the very end of the fight. He beat Dan Hardy (who can't?). And he flying knee'd focking Dong Hyun Kim.
What really is the most impressive thing Condit has ever done? He beats Dan Hardy by KO and flying knees an overrated and bad striker in Kim...and all of a sudden he is some real dangerous striker?
I don't see what advantage Condit even has. Don't get me wrong, Condit is a very solid fighter. I like him. But his record is overrated when you really look at it.
Diaz has the advantage in these areas:
-Cardio -Boxing -BJJ -Overall Toughness, I know he has been dropped...that is because he will stand with even the most dangerous of strikers.
We just saw his brother Nate destroy Cerrone. That match up is VERY similar to this match up. Cerrone was "supposedly the better striker because he kicks as well...and Nate the better boxer ate him for lunch.
Watch out for Nick to get cut here though. If it goes 3 or 4 rounds it is almost certain Nick will be cut up and the doctor could stop the fight.
Look when people say Diaz has great boxing its not all that true. Is his striking effective? Yes it is but that's because he doesn't tire and has ridiculous stamina and keeps coming forward.
When you watch him punch do you actually think..Wow he's a good boxer/puncher..No not really its more like he walks you down and takes any punch you give him. He throws nonstop punches until the opponent breaks.
I would say Daley/Penn have crisper strikes but as you can see Diaz beat the crap out of them. Penn obviously has stamina issues and is pretty small to be fighting at 170. Daley on the other hand has a bunch of losses on his record. Is this Nick Diaz really that much different from the Diaz that lost to Sherk and Sanchez?
Yes Condit lost to Kampmann but he has improved since then. Rory MacDonald is the future of the 170 pound division so him getting beat up by him isn't a big deal. What matters is that he came back and won.
All I'm saying is that this is no easy match for Diaz and this really is a pick em fight. Nick Diaz wrestling hasn't suddenly just improved.
The odds are out of whack and if Condit goes even higher I'm going to have to take him to win.
I am a tad surprised at the line. But it is warranted.
The best things he has going for him is cardio and toughness? What about his boxing? What about his BJJ? He is one of the best at both in the WW division.
Diaz has just as good, if not better wrestling than Condit.
Diaz has beat better strikers than Condit. Paul Daley and Penn both are better standing.
Since Condit has been in the UFC. He has a loss to Kampmann. Had a controversial split win over Ellenberger. He got his ass handed to him by a 20 year old Rory MacDonald, until he pulled it off somehow at the very end of the fight. He beat Dan Hardy (who can't?). And he flying knee'd focking Dong Hyun Kim.
What really is the most impressive thing Condit has ever done? He beats Dan Hardy by KO and flying knees an overrated and bad striker in Kim...and all of a sudden he is some real dangerous striker?
I don't see what advantage Condit even has. Don't get me wrong, Condit is a very solid fighter. I like him. But his record is overrated when you really look at it.
Diaz has the advantage in these areas:
-Cardio -Boxing -BJJ -Overall Toughness, I know he has been dropped...that is because he will stand with even the most dangerous of strikers.
We just saw his brother Nate destroy Cerrone. That match up is VERY similar to this match up. Cerrone was "supposedly the better striker because he kicks as well...and Nate the better boxer ate him for lunch.
Watch out for Nick to get cut here though. If it goes 3 or 4 rounds it is almost certain Nick will be cut up and the doctor could stop the fight.
Look when people say Diaz has great boxing its not all that true. Is his striking effective? Yes it is but that's because he doesn't tire and has ridiculous stamina and keeps coming forward.
When you watch him punch do you actually think..Wow he's a good boxer/puncher..No not really its more like he walks you down and takes any punch you give him. He throws nonstop punches until the opponent breaks.
I would say Daley/Penn have crisper strikes but as you can see Diaz beat the crap out of them. Penn obviously has stamina issues and is pretty small to be fighting at 170. Daley on the other hand has a bunch of losses on his record. Is this Nick Diaz really that much different from the Diaz that lost to Sherk and Sanchez?
Yes Condit lost to Kampmann but he has improved since then. Rory MacDonald is the future of the 170 pound division so him getting beat up by him isn't a big deal. What matters is that he came back and won.
All I'm saying is that this is no easy match for Diaz and this really is a pick em fight. Nick Diaz wrestling hasn't suddenly just improved.
The odds are out of whack and if Condit goes even higher I'm going to have to take him to win.
I agree with frank...a win is a win and Condit did beat the same quality guys as Diaz in my opinion. Bj is old and did well in first round but got worn out in the rest due to his stamina. If this fight took place 5 years ago I would give huge credit in that win but bj hasn't had many wins in a lOng time. His record has been awful..
I agree with frank...a win is a win and Condit did beat the same quality guys as Diaz in my opinion. Bj is old and did well in first round but got worn out in the rest due to his stamina. If this fight took place 5 years ago I would give huge credit in that win but bj hasn't had many wins in a lOng time. His record has been awful..
If you want to say Diaz deserves to be the favorite then that's fine, I cant argue that but to be a -200 range fav? No way... The fight is closer than that. The books want to balance action and they kn
If you want to say Diaz deserves to be the favorite then that's fine, I cant argue that but to be a -200 range fav? No way... The fight is closer than that. The books want to balance action and they kn
And they know Diaz is the more popular well known fighter. They know his rep is as a bad ass, public sees that and thinks the Diazes are mean SOBs. Books hsve to adjust the line accordingly. The whole Gsp hating Diaz and Diaz has been in the spotlight more plus Diaz beat the bigger names like bj penn......
Diaz according to the odds should win being a -200 and prob even big fav by sat.. I'm just saying it should be lower.
And they know Diaz is the more popular well known fighter. They know his rep is as a bad ass, public sees that and thinks the Diazes are mean SOBs. Books hsve to adjust the line accordingly. The whole Gsp hating Diaz and Diaz has been in the spotlight more plus Diaz beat the bigger names like bj penn......
Diaz according to the odds should win being a -200 and prob even big fav by sat.. I'm just saying it should be lower.
Look when people say Diaz has great boxing its not all that true. Is his striking effective? Yes it is but that's because he doesn't tire and has ridiculous stamina and keeps coming forward.
When you watch him punch do you actually think..Wow he's a good boxer/puncher..No not really its more like he walks you down and takes any punch you give him. He throws nonstop punches until the opponent breaks.
I would say Daley/Penn have crisper strikes but as you can see Diaz beat the crap out of them. Penn obviously has stamina issues and is pretty small to be fighting at 170. Daley on the other hand has a bunch of losses on his record. Is this Nick Diaz really that much different from the Diaz that lost to Sherk and Sanchez?
Yes Condit lost to Kampmann but he has improved since then. Rory MacDonald is the future of the 170 pound division so him getting beat up by him isn't a big deal. What matters is that he came back and won.
All I'm saying is that this is no easy match for Diaz and this really is a pick em fight. Nick Diaz wrestling hasn't suddenly just improved.
The odds are out of whack and if Condit goes even higher I'm going to have to take him to win.
BOL on your plays
agreed. this fight should be closer to even money.
Look when people say Diaz has great boxing its not all that true. Is his striking effective? Yes it is but that's because he doesn't tire and has ridiculous stamina and keeps coming forward.
When you watch him punch do you actually think..Wow he's a good boxer/puncher..No not really its more like he walks you down and takes any punch you give him. He throws nonstop punches until the opponent breaks.
I would say Daley/Penn have crisper strikes but as you can see Diaz beat the crap out of them. Penn obviously has stamina issues and is pretty small to be fighting at 170. Daley on the other hand has a bunch of losses on his record. Is this Nick Diaz really that much different from the Diaz that lost to Sherk and Sanchez?
Yes Condit lost to Kampmann but he has improved since then. Rory MacDonald is the future of the 170 pound division so him getting beat up by him isn't a big deal. What matters is that he came back and won.
All I'm saying is that this is no easy match for Diaz and this really is a pick em fight. Nick Diaz wrestling hasn't suddenly just improved.
The odds are out of whack and if Condit goes even higher I'm going to have to take him to win.
BOL on your plays
agreed. this fight should be closer to even money.
Look when people say Diaz has great boxing its not all that true. Is his striking effective? Yes it is but that's because he doesn't tire and has ridiculous stamina and keeps coming forward.
When you watch him punch do you actually think..Wow he's a good boxer/puncher..No not really its more like he walks you down and takes any punch you give him. He throws nonstop punches until the opponent breaks.
I would say Daley/Penn have crisper strikes but as you can see Diaz beat the crap out of them. Penn obviously has stamina issues and is pretty small to be fighting at 170. Daley on the other hand has a bunch of losses on his record. Is this Nick Diaz really that much different from the Diaz that lost to Sherk and Sanchez?
Yes Condit lost to Kampmann but he has improved since then. Rory MacDonald is the future of the 170 pound division so him getting beat up by him isn't a big deal. What matters is that he came back and won.
All I'm saying is that this is no easy match for Diaz and this really is a pick em fight. Nick Diaz wrestling hasn't suddenly just improved.
The odds are out of whack and if Condit goes even higher I'm going to have to take him to win.
BOL on your plays
I don't agree at all with you down playing Diaz's boxing. Who else is asked by Miguel Cotto to spare with them to get ready for Margarito? Who else spares occasionally with a guy like Andre Ward?
Look at what his brother Nate just did to Cerrone...with boxing?
How you down play his boxing, I really don't understand. Freddie Roach once said BJ Penn had the best boxing in MMA. And Diaz left him a bloody mess. Worse beating BJ has ever took. And it wasn't some 5 round fight. It was a 3 rounder...and he left him a mess.
We can agree to disagree. I just don't get how people can STILL act like he doesn't have excellent boxing. He outstrikes great MMA strikers all the time.
Look when people say Diaz has great boxing its not all that true. Is his striking effective? Yes it is but that's because he doesn't tire and has ridiculous stamina and keeps coming forward.
When you watch him punch do you actually think..Wow he's a good boxer/puncher..No not really its more like he walks you down and takes any punch you give him. He throws nonstop punches until the opponent breaks.
I would say Daley/Penn have crisper strikes but as you can see Diaz beat the crap out of them. Penn obviously has stamina issues and is pretty small to be fighting at 170. Daley on the other hand has a bunch of losses on his record. Is this Nick Diaz really that much different from the Diaz that lost to Sherk and Sanchez?
Yes Condit lost to Kampmann but he has improved since then. Rory MacDonald is the future of the 170 pound division so him getting beat up by him isn't a big deal. What matters is that he came back and won.
All I'm saying is that this is no easy match for Diaz and this really is a pick em fight. Nick Diaz wrestling hasn't suddenly just improved.
The odds are out of whack and if Condit goes even higher I'm going to have to take him to win.
BOL on your plays
I don't agree at all with you down playing Diaz's boxing. Who else is asked by Miguel Cotto to spare with them to get ready for Margarito? Who else spares occasionally with a guy like Andre Ward?
Look at what his brother Nate just did to Cerrone...with boxing?
How you down play his boxing, I really don't understand. Freddie Roach once said BJ Penn had the best boxing in MMA. And Diaz left him a bloody mess. Worse beating BJ has ever took. And it wasn't some 5 round fight. It was a 3 rounder...and he left him a mess.
We can agree to disagree. I just don't get how people can STILL act like he doesn't have excellent boxing. He outstrikes great MMA strikers all the time.
If you want to say Diaz deserves to be the favorite then that's fine, I cant argue that but to be a -200 range fav? No way... The fight is closer than that. The books want to balance action and they kn
Please come back to this thread and acknowledge the outcome after Diaz beats down Condit. And finishes him by the 3rd or 4th.
Diaz still won't get the credit he deserves. I guess he never really will. People will find a way to discredit Condit then.
People may not understand Diaz's brand of boxing. But it is great. His combo's are second to none. The volume of punches is 2nd to none. The technique is 2nd to none when it comes to MMA fighters.
People slobbed on Cerrone's balls for a while. Cerrone was a -280 favorite at one point. And Nate Diaz beat the undefeated kickboxer down. With what? His boxing? They both have excellent boxing...and Nick's is better.
We can all revisit this thread after the fight. I will eat crow if need be. There is no "value" in a losing fighter. And Diaz wins this fight other than getting his scar tissue cut badly and it is stopped.
If you want to say Diaz deserves to be the favorite then that's fine, I cant argue that but to be a -200 range fav? No way... The fight is closer than that. The books want to balance action and they kn
Please come back to this thread and acknowledge the outcome after Diaz beats down Condit. And finishes him by the 3rd or 4th.
Diaz still won't get the credit he deserves. I guess he never really will. People will find a way to discredit Condit then.
People may not understand Diaz's brand of boxing. But it is great. His combo's are second to none. The volume of punches is 2nd to none. The technique is 2nd to none when it comes to MMA fighters.
People slobbed on Cerrone's balls for a while. Cerrone was a -280 favorite at one point. And Nate Diaz beat the undefeated kickboxer down. With what? His boxing? They both have excellent boxing...and Nick's is better.
We can all revisit this thread after the fight. I will eat crow if need be. There is no "value" in a losing fighter. And Diaz wins this fight other than getting his scar tissue cut badly and it is stopped.
the line was closer when it came out. But guys like me stepped on it early, predicting it would go higher, and it has gotten past 2 to 1 fav
Johny, i'm on diaz too, and think he wins, but one thing i'll add to your comment that 200 yr old Rory beat down condit. the remarkable thing about that fight is it showed the resiliancy of condit. he was in HORRIBLE shape, and fought his way back to the late sub... I'm pretty sure we will see the same resiliancy from both fighters. should be a bloody war - can't wait!
the line was closer when it came out. But guys like me stepped on it early, predicting it would go higher, and it has gotten past 2 to 1 fav
Johny, i'm on diaz too, and think he wins, but one thing i'll add to your comment that 200 yr old Rory beat down condit. the remarkable thing about that fight is it showed the resiliancy of condit. he was in HORRIBLE shape, and fought his way back to the late sub... I'm pretty sure we will see the same resiliancy from both fighters. should be a bloody war - can't wait!
I realize Condit has decent cardio and is a tough guy himself. I just think where he usually has that advantage vs. most anyone else...he won't have it vs. Diaz. Diaz is tougher and can go longer than Condit.
I'm just a whole lot more impressed by Diaz beating down Penn. People can say he is old and washed up. Then why did people bet Penn as the favorite? Why was he not washed up before that fight...and after he all of a sudden is? Penn was the favorite in that fight and people still bet him as the favorite. I'm more impressed with a beatdown of Penn and Paul Daley than a KO of Kim and Dan Hardy. I think Condit's striking is being very overrated over looking good vs. sub par guys. Or just a guy like Kim who is not a striker.
Diaz trains with the likes of Andre Ward...often. As seen on the Primetime show he brought in the current 170lb Muay Thai champ to work with him all camp. He trains with waaay better strikers than Condit.
I also just don't get why people want to discredit his boxing. What more does he have to do than mess Penn up standing and beat Paul Daley in a striking contest? He does get hit more than he should, but when was the last time that mattered? Noons beating him by cuts? Diaz hasn't been stopped since he was like 19 years old. When Condit is hitting him with stuff and Diaz is walking through it, Condit will wilt. Everyone does.
I think everyone is more in love with magical 1 punch KO's and flying knees. More than say excellent technical boxing. Volume punches. And pressure. I'm not one of those guys. Diaz to me is brilliant for MMA.
I'm not in love with the -200 line. Especially when it was had at much better odds. But I think it is pretty spot on right now. If it is a little high, it is in no way a ridiculous line. The +105 Diaz opened at was way more ridiculous than the -200 he is now.
I guess we will see if Diaz can impress yet again. Either way it should be a very entertaining match.
I realize Condit has decent cardio and is a tough guy himself. I just think where he usually has that advantage vs. most anyone else...he won't have it vs. Diaz. Diaz is tougher and can go longer than Condit.
I'm just a whole lot more impressed by Diaz beating down Penn. People can say he is old and washed up. Then why did people bet Penn as the favorite? Why was he not washed up before that fight...and after he all of a sudden is? Penn was the favorite in that fight and people still bet him as the favorite. I'm more impressed with a beatdown of Penn and Paul Daley than a KO of Kim and Dan Hardy. I think Condit's striking is being very overrated over looking good vs. sub par guys. Or just a guy like Kim who is not a striker.
Diaz trains with the likes of Andre Ward...often. As seen on the Primetime show he brought in the current 170lb Muay Thai champ to work with him all camp. He trains with waaay better strikers than Condit.
I also just don't get why people want to discredit his boxing. What more does he have to do than mess Penn up standing and beat Paul Daley in a striking contest? He does get hit more than he should, but when was the last time that mattered? Noons beating him by cuts? Diaz hasn't been stopped since he was like 19 years old. When Condit is hitting him with stuff and Diaz is walking through it, Condit will wilt. Everyone does.
I think everyone is more in love with magical 1 punch KO's and flying knees. More than say excellent technical boxing. Volume punches. And pressure. I'm not one of those guys. Diaz to me is brilliant for MMA.
I'm not in love with the -200 line. Especially when it was had at much better odds. But I think it is pretty spot on right now. If it is a little high, it is in no way a ridiculous line. The +105 Diaz opened at was way more ridiculous than the -200 he is now.
I guess we will see if Diaz can impress yet again. Either way it should be a very entertaining match.
I don't agree at all with you down playing Diaz's boxing. Who else is asked by Miguel Cotto to spare with them to get ready for Margarito? Who else spares occasionally with a guy like Andre Ward?
Look at what his brother Nate just did to Cerrone...with boxing?
How you down play his boxing, I really don't understand. Freddie Roach once said BJ Penn had the best boxing in MMA. And Diaz left him a bloody mess. Worse beating BJ has ever took. And it wasn't some 5 round fight. It was a 3 rounder...and he left him a mess.
We can agree to disagree. I just don't get how people can STILL act like he doesn't have excellent boxing. He outstrikes great MMA strikers all the time.
having the best boxing in mma and having the stamina/mindset(bj) to go along with it are entirely two different entities.
bj arguably won the first round against diaz. but like front-runner zab judah, he could not keep up the pace or mindset, the same with his fight against fitch. and the reason why cotto spared with diaz was to replicate margo in that diaz is roughly the same height, weight and throws the same winging, wide punches along with body shots and uppercuts. he is very identical to margarito.
and i do agree with you. if the fight goes past the third diaz is a proven commodity down the stretch whereas condit is not.
I don't agree at all with you down playing Diaz's boxing. Who else is asked by Miguel Cotto to spare with them to get ready for Margarito? Who else spares occasionally with a guy like Andre Ward?
Look at what his brother Nate just did to Cerrone...with boxing?
How you down play his boxing, I really don't understand. Freddie Roach once said BJ Penn had the best boxing in MMA. And Diaz left him a bloody mess. Worse beating BJ has ever took. And it wasn't some 5 round fight. It was a 3 rounder...and he left him a mess.
We can agree to disagree. I just don't get how people can STILL act like he doesn't have excellent boxing. He outstrikes great MMA strikers all the time.
having the best boxing in mma and having the stamina/mindset(bj) to go along with it are entirely two different entities.
bj arguably won the first round against diaz. but like front-runner zab judah, he could not keep up the pace or mindset, the same with his fight against fitch. and the reason why cotto spared with diaz was to replicate margo in that diaz is roughly the same height, weight and throws the same winging, wide punches along with body shots and uppercuts. he is very identical to margarito.
and i do agree with you. if the fight goes past the third diaz is a proven commodity down the stretch whereas condit is not.
having the best boxing in mma and having the stamina/mindset(bj) to go along with it are entirely two different entities.
bj arguably won the first round against diaz. but like front-runner zab judah, he could not keep up the pace or mindset, the same with his fight against fitch. and the reason why cotto spared with diaz was to replicate margo in that diaz is roughly the same height, weight and throws the same winging, wide punches along with body shots and uppercuts. he is very identical to margarito.
and i do agree with you. if the fight goes past the third diaz is a proven commodity down the stretch whereas condit is not.
It is true. He broke Penn. But either way he left Penn a mess. Worst beating ever. Basically made him want to retire.
I just don't see what Condit has in striking? He has some wild power. He throws some heavy shots I guess. But is his boxing technical? Is his kickboxing/MT even technical?
BJ Penn had the best style to mess Diaz up standing. He throws his punches straight down the pipe. Through Diaz's looping guard. Condit is not that fighter.
Yea, that is why he brought in Diaz. But don't you think he could find a Pro Boxer with that style? Boxer's know an endless amount of boxing sparring partners. Doesn't it say something when he asks Diaz...an MMA fighter, to help him spar for one of his biggest fights of his life? Most boxers don't even respect MMA fighters skills. I'm sure if he was just looking for a style to give him a look, that he could have found a similar Pro Boxer.
People look at the way the Diaz brothers throw their punches. And they just refuse to believe that they are real good. They refuse to acknowledge that their volume of punches DO hurt. Ask Cerrone. Ask Penn. I love when guys say they don't have much power. So KOing Paul Daley in round 1 is not power? KOing a guy like Robbie Lawler...a big 185er with 1 punch, is not power? Then what is power? They just don't throw wild haymakers much. They realize volume, accurate punching is way more effective.
They end up out lasting and out striking anyone they stand with. Both of them. They lose to wrestlers. Condit is less of a wrestler than Diaz is.
Diaz isn't getting flying knee'd. Condit is getting out struck. Or at the very least out-lasted. And if it goes to the ground somehow, Diaz is superior. If Condit messes around he will get sub'd. He has been sub'd more than once in his life. He is what? A purple belt? Diaz is a Gracie blackbelt.
having the best boxing in mma and having the stamina/mindset(bj) to go along with it are entirely two different entities.
bj arguably won the first round against diaz. but like front-runner zab judah, he could not keep up the pace or mindset, the same with his fight against fitch. and the reason why cotto spared with diaz was to replicate margo in that diaz is roughly the same height, weight and throws the same winging, wide punches along with body shots and uppercuts. he is very identical to margarito.
and i do agree with you. if the fight goes past the third diaz is a proven commodity down the stretch whereas condit is not.
It is true. He broke Penn. But either way he left Penn a mess. Worst beating ever. Basically made him want to retire.
I just don't see what Condit has in striking? He has some wild power. He throws some heavy shots I guess. But is his boxing technical? Is his kickboxing/MT even technical?
BJ Penn had the best style to mess Diaz up standing. He throws his punches straight down the pipe. Through Diaz's looping guard. Condit is not that fighter.
Yea, that is why he brought in Diaz. But don't you think he could find a Pro Boxer with that style? Boxer's know an endless amount of boxing sparring partners. Doesn't it say something when he asks Diaz...an MMA fighter, to help him spar for one of his biggest fights of his life? Most boxers don't even respect MMA fighters skills. I'm sure if he was just looking for a style to give him a look, that he could have found a similar Pro Boxer.
People look at the way the Diaz brothers throw their punches. And they just refuse to believe that they are real good. They refuse to acknowledge that their volume of punches DO hurt. Ask Cerrone. Ask Penn. I love when guys say they don't have much power. So KOing Paul Daley in round 1 is not power? KOing a guy like Robbie Lawler...a big 185er with 1 punch, is not power? Then what is power? They just don't throw wild haymakers much. They realize volume, accurate punching is way more effective.
They end up out lasting and out striking anyone they stand with. Both of them. They lose to wrestlers. Condit is less of a wrestler than Diaz is.
Diaz isn't getting flying knee'd. Condit is getting out struck. Or at the very least out-lasted. And if it goes to the ground somehow, Diaz is superior. If Condit messes around he will get sub'd. He has been sub'd more than once in his life. He is what? A purple belt? Diaz is a Gracie blackbelt.
Nick Diaz has lost 7 fights and has scar tissue all over his brows, lets not act like he's some invulnerable fighter or remotely unbeatable. Many of his wins have been over middle of the pack type guys. He has a win over the second best Cyborg Santos as one of his better wins.
Nick Diaz has lost 7 fights and has scar tissue all over his brows, lets not act like he's some invulnerable fighter or remotely unbeatable. Many of his wins have been over middle of the pack type guys. He has a win over the second best Cyborg Santos as one of his better wins.
Please come back to this thread and acknowledge the outcome after Diaz beats down Condit. And finishes him by the 3rd or 4th.
Diaz still won't get the credit he deserves. I guess he never really will. People will find a way to discredit Condit then.
People may not understand Diaz's brand of boxing. But it is great. His combo's are second to none. The volume of punches is 2nd to none. The technique is 2nd to none when it comes to MMA fighters.
People slobbed on Cerrone's balls for a while. Cerrone was a -280 favorite at one point. And Nate Diaz beat the undefeated kickboxer down. With what? His boxing? They both have excellent boxing...and Nick's is better.
We can all revisit this thread after the fight. I will eat crow if need be. There is no "value" in a losing fighter. And Diaz wins this fight other than getting his scar tissue cut badly and it is stopped.
wow dude, you need to chill out... you seem to take things personal.. Diaz is the one who is -200 here, i just think he should be lower, you are taking things out of proportion. No value in a losing fighter? obviously so you are telling me if you got condit at +300 you wouldnt take that? how high would condit have to be for you to take him? And if you are so confident in diaz why did you say earlier you werent going to bet it?
Please come back to this thread and acknowledge the outcome after Diaz beats down Condit. And finishes him by the 3rd or 4th.
Diaz still won't get the credit he deserves. I guess he never really will. People will find a way to discredit Condit then.
People may not understand Diaz's brand of boxing. But it is great. His combo's are second to none. The volume of punches is 2nd to none. The technique is 2nd to none when it comes to MMA fighters.
People slobbed on Cerrone's balls for a while. Cerrone was a -280 favorite at one point. And Nate Diaz beat the undefeated kickboxer down. With what? His boxing? They both have excellent boxing...and Nick's is better.
We can all revisit this thread after the fight. I will eat crow if need be. There is no "value" in a losing fighter. And Diaz wins this fight other than getting his scar tissue cut badly and it is stopped.
wow dude, you need to chill out... you seem to take things personal.. Diaz is the one who is -200 here, i just think he should be lower, you are taking things out of proportion. No value in a losing fighter? obviously so you are telling me if you got condit at +300 you wouldnt take that? how high would condit have to be for you to take him? And if you are so confident in diaz why did you say earlier you werent going to bet it?
I don't agree at all with you down playing Diaz's boxing. Who else is asked by Miguel Cotto to spare with them to get ready for Margarito? Who else spares occasionally with a guy like Andre Ward?
Look at what his brother Nate just did to Cerrone...with boxing?
How you down play his boxing, I really don't understand. Freddie Roach once said BJ Penn had the best boxing in MMA. And Diaz left him a bloody mess. Worse beating BJ has ever took. And it wasn't some 5 round fight. It was a 3 rounder...and he left him a mess.
We can agree to disagree. I just don't get how people can STILL act like he doesn't have excellent boxing. He outstrikes great MMA strikers all the time.
I didn't say his striking wasn't effective. Heck if you can walk people down with that constant pressure...you'll win most of the fights. He doesn't have great speed on his punches or great power but its effective..keeps moving forward. The guy moving backwards will tire out due to the ridiculous pace.
Condit will/should have the gameplan of taking Diaz down and/or use angles when fighting him. I just don't agree that he's a great boxer. And yes BJ Penn does have the best boxing in MMA but his loss was due to the constant pressure and his weak stamina. Round 1 he was picking Diaz apart until he got tired due to the pressure.
I don't agree at all with you down playing Diaz's boxing. Who else is asked by Miguel Cotto to spare with them to get ready for Margarito? Who else spares occasionally with a guy like Andre Ward?
Look at what his brother Nate just did to Cerrone...with boxing?
How you down play his boxing, I really don't understand. Freddie Roach once said BJ Penn had the best boxing in MMA. And Diaz left him a bloody mess. Worse beating BJ has ever took. And it wasn't some 5 round fight. It was a 3 rounder...and he left him a mess.
We can agree to disagree. I just don't get how people can STILL act like he doesn't have excellent boxing. He outstrikes great MMA strikers all the time.
I didn't say his striking wasn't effective. Heck if you can walk people down with that constant pressure...you'll win most of the fights. He doesn't have great speed on his punches or great power but its effective..keeps moving forward. The guy moving backwards will tire out due to the ridiculous pace.
Condit will/should have the gameplan of taking Diaz down and/or use angles when fighting him. I just don't agree that he's a great boxer. And yes BJ Penn does have the best boxing in MMA but his loss was due to the constant pressure and his weak stamina. Round 1 he was picking Diaz apart until he got tired due to the pressure.
Please come back to this thread and acknowledge the outcome after Diaz beats down Condit. And finishes him by the 3rd or 4th.
Diaz still won't get the credit he deserves. I guess he never really will. People will find a way to discredit Condit then.
People may not understand Diaz's brand of boxing. But it is great. His combo's are second to none. The volume of punches is 2nd to none. The technique is 2nd to none when it comes to MMA fighters.
People slobbed on Cerrone's balls for a while. Cerrone was a -280 favorite at one point. And Nate Diaz beat the undefeated kickboxer down. With what? His boxing? They both have excellent boxing...and Nick's is better.
We can all revisit this thread after the fight. I will eat crow if need be. There is no "value" in a losing fighter. And Diaz wins this fight other than getting his scar tissue cut badly and it is stopped.
if im on the site i will definitely say diaz won but dont forget like i said Diaz is a -200 favorite so he is supposed to win 66% of the time in this situation according to the odds... I hope you dont brag like a know it all if Diaz wins because like i said he is a decent size fav.
First and for most, im not a diaz hater, im actually a fan of diaz and i have given him credit many times. So dont act like all of us in here dont think diaz is good just because we are leaning towards betting condit.
Please come back to this thread and acknowledge the outcome after Diaz beats down Condit. And finishes him by the 3rd or 4th.
Diaz still won't get the credit he deserves. I guess he never really will. People will find a way to discredit Condit then.
People may not understand Diaz's brand of boxing. But it is great. His combo's are second to none. The volume of punches is 2nd to none. The technique is 2nd to none when it comes to MMA fighters.
People slobbed on Cerrone's balls for a while. Cerrone was a -280 favorite at one point. And Nate Diaz beat the undefeated kickboxer down. With what? His boxing? They both have excellent boxing...and Nick's is better.
We can all revisit this thread after the fight. I will eat crow if need be. There is no "value" in a losing fighter. And Diaz wins this fight other than getting his scar tissue cut badly and it is stopped.
if im on the site i will definitely say diaz won but dont forget like i said Diaz is a -200 favorite so he is supposed to win 66% of the time in this situation according to the odds... I hope you dont brag like a know it all if Diaz wins because like i said he is a decent size fav.
First and for most, im not a diaz hater, im actually a fan of diaz and i have given him credit many times. So dont act like all of us in here dont think diaz is good just because we are leaning towards betting condit.
Please come back to this thread and acknowledge the outcome after Diaz beats down Condit. And finishes him by the 3rd or 4th.
Diaz still won't get the credit he deserves. I guess he never really will. People will find a way to discredit Condit then.
People may not understand Diaz's brand of boxing. But it is great. His combo's are second to none. The volume of punches is 2nd to none. The technique is 2nd to none when it comes to MMA fighters.
People slobbed on Cerrone's balls for a while. Cerrone was a -280 favorite at one point. And Nate Diaz beat the undefeated kickboxer down. With what? His boxing? They both have excellent boxing...and Nick's is better.
We can all revisit this thread after the fight. I will eat crow if need be. There is no "value" in a losing fighter. And Diaz wins this fight other than getting his scar tissue cut badly and it is stopped.
I think you are getting confused about what great boxing is. Diaz greatest attribute is his stamina and that allows him to be effective with his strikes. You show clips of Diaz to real boxers and they will laugh.
I am a huge Diaz fan but I'm realistic about it. He's no master class boxer.
Please come back to this thread and acknowledge the outcome after Diaz beats down Condit. And finishes him by the 3rd or 4th.
Diaz still won't get the credit he deserves. I guess he never really will. People will find a way to discredit Condit then.
People may not understand Diaz's brand of boxing. But it is great. His combo's are second to none. The volume of punches is 2nd to none. The technique is 2nd to none when it comes to MMA fighters.
People slobbed on Cerrone's balls for a while. Cerrone was a -280 favorite at one point. And Nate Diaz beat the undefeated kickboxer down. With what? His boxing? They both have excellent boxing...and Nick's is better.
We can all revisit this thread after the fight. I will eat crow if need be. There is no "value" in a losing fighter. And Diaz wins this fight other than getting his scar tissue cut badly and it is stopped.
I think you are getting confused about what great boxing is. Diaz greatest attribute is his stamina and that allows him to be effective with his strikes. You show clips of Diaz to real boxers and they will laugh.
I am a huge Diaz fan but I'm realistic about it. He's no master class boxer.
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