This may be, from my POV. one of the more offensive things Obama has done during his term:
Obama to Create African-American Education Office "WASHINGTON (AP) -- President Barack Obama is creating a new office to bolster education of African-American students.
The
White House says the office will coordinate the work of communities and
federal agencies to ensure that African-American youngsters are better
prepared for high school, college and career.
Obama
is announcing his election-year initiative Wednesday night in a speech
to the civil rights group the National Urban League as he seeks to rally
black voters. Aides say his executive order, to be signed Thursday,
will set a goal of producing "a more effective continuum" of programs
for African-American students."
Really? A race-specific federal government office that will "coordinate the work of communities and federal agencies"? What the hell does that even mean?
Ridiculous. We need another government bureaucratic agency with no clearly defined mission like we need another stick right in eye.
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To remove first post, remove entire topic.
This may be, from my POV. one of the more offensive things Obama has done during his term:
Obama to Create African-American Education Office "WASHINGTON (AP) -- President Barack Obama is creating a new office to bolster education of African-American students.
The
White House says the office will coordinate the work of communities and
federal agencies to ensure that African-American youngsters are better
prepared for high school, college and career.
Obama
is announcing his election-year initiative Wednesday night in a speech
to the civil rights group the National Urban League as he seeks to rally
black voters. Aides say his executive order, to be signed Thursday,
will set a goal of producing "a more effective continuum" of programs
for African-American students."
Really? A race-specific federal government office that will "coordinate the work of communities and federal agencies"? What the hell does that even mean?
Ridiculous. We need another government bureaucratic agency with no clearly defined mission like we need another stick right in eye.
ive done a lot of work with the asian initiative governemnt team.
it seems that two parent families that value education and have strong work ethics actually produce children that do well overall. this model is being transferred to this new government agency to see if utter dependence on the government can foster these values in urban children without the need for 2 parents, work ethic, or valuing education at all.
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ive done a lot of work with the asian initiative governemnt team.
it seems that two parent families that value education and have strong work ethics actually produce children that do well overall. this model is being transferred to this new government agency to see if utter dependence on the government can foster these values in urban children without the need for 2 parents, work ethic, or valuing education at all.
why stop at education? how about a black irs? or maybe a black dhs? yes lets have government offices for black folk and separate government offices for white folk.
i think the good old boys in the south tried to have blacks and whites separated and it was called jim crow...and wait i thought blacks didnt like that???
this is a giant mistake.
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what a pandering travesty. disgusting.
why stop at education? how about a black irs? or maybe a black dhs? yes lets have government offices for black folk and separate government offices for white folk.
i think the good old boys in the south tried to have blacks and whites separated and it was called jim crow...and wait i thought blacks didnt like that???
George W. Bush does not get enough credit for the creation of PEPFAR, which actually did very little to benefit those in the U.S.
But yet Obama should be criticized for the creation of a means to oversee a group who continues to regress in a continually failing educational system?
Strange.
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George W. Bush does not get enough credit for the creation of PEPFAR, which actually did very little to benefit those in the U.S.
But yet Obama should be criticized for the creation of a means to oversee a group who continues to regress in a continually failing educational system?
George W. Bush does not get enough credit for the creation of PEPFAR, which actually did very little to benefit those in the U.S.
But yet Obama should be criticized for the creation of a means to oversee a group who continues to regress in a continually failing educational system?
Strange.
Not sure I follow you here DJ... I don't know much about PEPFAR but it seems like a global anti-AIDS initiative, yes?
I'm criticizing Obama for two separate and distinct reasons: (1) the creation of another government agency with no clear goal or agenda (coordinate between local communities and federal resources -- WTF does that mean? that's gibberish man, we both know this). (2) The creation of a federal government agency that has a sole mission of helping only people of one ethnicity / race / skin color.
I don't see what's strange here my friend
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Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:
George W. Bush does not get enough credit for the creation of PEPFAR, which actually did very little to benefit those in the U.S.
But yet Obama should be criticized for the creation of a means to oversee a group who continues to regress in a continually failing educational system?
Strange.
Not sure I follow you here DJ... I don't know much about PEPFAR but it seems like a global anti-AIDS initiative, yes?
I'm criticizing Obama for two separate and distinct reasons: (1) the creation of another government agency with no clear goal or agenda (coordinate between local communities and federal resources -- WTF does that mean? that's gibberish man, we both know this). (2) The creation of a federal government agency that has a sole mission of helping only people of one ethnicity / race / skin color.
George W. Bush does not get enough credit for the creation of PEPFAR, which actually did very little to benefit those in the U.S.
But yet Obama should be criticized for the creation of a means to oversee a group who continues to regress in a continually failing educational system?
Strange.
well intended perhaps but totally misdirected.
the lack of educational achievement in the african american community has more to do with the lack of a male role model in the household, children being raised by a single mother often with multiple children, dumping of children with grand parents who are either unwilling or unable to tend for children, and children being raised in abject poverty.
focus on education must come from HOME. active engaged parents nurturing growing minds and demanding excellence and achievement. certainly governmental agencies can assist, but more often than not these programs will fail in the face of parental indifference or neglect.
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Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:
George W. Bush does not get enough credit for the creation of PEPFAR, which actually did very little to benefit those in the U.S.
But yet Obama should be criticized for the creation of a means to oversee a group who continues to regress in a continually failing educational system?
Strange.
well intended perhaps but totally misdirected.
the lack of educational achievement in the african american community has more to do with the lack of a male role model in the household, children being raised by a single mother often with multiple children, dumping of children with grand parents who are either unwilling or unable to tend for children, and children being raised in abject poverty.
focus on education must come from HOME. active engaged parents nurturing growing minds and demanding excellence and achievement. certainly governmental agencies can assist, but more often than not these programs will fail in the face of parental indifference or neglect.
Another bold move by Obama in a recent series of bold moves. Where was this type of "change" back in 2009? In an election year, this is political suicide imo, but I do applaud him for taking a stand however unpopular it may be. He's finally growing a spine, but it may all be for nothing.
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Another bold move by Obama in a recent series of bold moves. Where was this type of "change" back in 2009? In an election year, this is political suicide imo, but I do applaud him for taking a stand however unpopular it may be. He's finally growing a spine, but it may all be for nothing.
I would be far more concerned with the creation of an agency to study the viability of life on other planets and what that might mean to us (including whether we could harness technology that would be beneficial). Want to take a guess as to whether that exists?
My point is that these type of initiatives/agencies created to benefit a specific group are nothing new. But because Obama is black and a democrat, it is considered more 'liberal' waste. Yet, look at PEPFAR? Who benefited from that? Hell, it wasn't even Americans!
Of course government is wasteful. We have been done this road many times and I completely agree. But I cannot show faux anger where the beneficiaries are not only Americans, but a group that continues to show digression in a very vital area.
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I would be far more concerned with the creation of an agency to study the viability of life on other planets and what that might mean to us (including whether we could harness technology that would be beneficial). Want to take a guess as to whether that exists?
My point is that these type of initiatives/agencies created to benefit a specific group are nothing new. But because Obama is black and a democrat, it is considered more 'liberal' waste. Yet, look at PEPFAR? Who benefited from that? Hell, it wasn't even Americans!
Of course government is wasteful. We have been done this road many times and I completely agree. But I cannot show faux anger where the beneficiaries are not only Americans, but a group that continues to show digression in a very vital area.
I would be far more concerned with the creation of an agency to study the viability of life on other planets and what that might mean to us (including whether we could harness technology that would be beneficial). Want to take a guess as to whether that exists?
My point is that these type of initiatives/agencies created to benefit a specific group are nothing new. But because Obama is black and a democrat, it is considered more 'liberal' waste. Yet, look at PEPFAR? Who benefited from that? Hell, it wasn't even Americans!
Of course government is wasteful. We have been done this road many times and I completely agree. But I cannot show faux anger where the beneficiaries are not only Americans, but a group that continues to show digression in a very vital area.
I've said nothing about "liberal" waste -- I think there's plenty, PLENTY of waste on both sides, I think we agree on that one. PEPFAR likely benefited a ton of different people, even if they were not American. That being said, I am not a fan of government programs that are organized to only help one specific race. That's prohibited by the Constitution in my mind and serves to distinguish it from the other examples you bring up.
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Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:
I would be far more concerned with the creation of an agency to study the viability of life on other planets and what that might mean to us (including whether we could harness technology that would be beneficial). Want to take a guess as to whether that exists?
My point is that these type of initiatives/agencies created to benefit a specific group are nothing new. But because Obama is black and a democrat, it is considered more 'liberal' waste. Yet, look at PEPFAR? Who benefited from that? Hell, it wasn't even Americans!
Of course government is wasteful. We have been done this road many times and I completely agree. But I cannot show faux anger where the beneficiaries are not only Americans, but a group that continues to show digression in a very vital area.
I've said nothing about "liberal" waste -- I think there's plenty, PLENTY of waste on both sides, I think we agree on that one. PEPFAR likely benefited a ton of different people, even if they were not American. That being said, I am not a fan of government programs that are organized to only help one specific race. That's prohibited by the Constitution in my mind and serves to distinguish it from the other examples you bring up.
the lack of educational achievement in the african american community has more to do with the lack of a male role model in the household, children being raised by a single mother often with multiple children, dumping of children with grand parents who are either unwilling or unable to tend for children, and children being raised in abject poverty.
focus on education must come from HOME. active engaged parents nurturing growing minds and demanding excellence and achievement. certainly governmental agencies can assist, but more often than not these programs will fail in the face of parental indifference or neglect.>>>
Well, how do you KNOW that this program isn't going to work on exactly what you are describing?
Let's presume what you are saying is correct. Now you have a single parent household supporting the family. Even moreso, you have a likely single parent working more than 40 hours (in more than one job) to support said family because that parent is often not working in a high paying position.
Perhaps this program will explore tutors or means of education for both the parent and child, or afterschool and late school programs.
Or maybe it does nothing and is a complete waste.
The point is the creation and actual start of the program to address a very really problem should be the least of the concerns. What it does for implementation should be.
As an aside, at least you and I can agree, unlike many of the far right wingers that permeate this board, is that answer is NOT "well, she should not have had the child in the first place."
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<<<well intended perhaps but totally misdirected.
the lack of educational achievement in the african american community has more to do with the lack of a male role model in the household, children being raised by a single mother often with multiple children, dumping of children with grand parents who are either unwilling or unable to tend for children, and children being raised in abject poverty.
focus on education must come from HOME. active engaged parents nurturing growing minds and demanding excellence and achievement. certainly governmental agencies can assist, but more often than not these programs will fail in the face of parental indifference or neglect.>>>
Well, how do you KNOW that this program isn't going to work on exactly what you are describing?
Let's presume what you are saying is correct. Now you have a single parent household supporting the family. Even moreso, you have a likely single parent working more than 40 hours (in more than one job) to support said family because that parent is often not working in a high paying position.
Perhaps this program will explore tutors or means of education for both the parent and child, or afterschool and late school programs.
Or maybe it does nothing and is a complete waste.
The point is the creation and actual start of the program to address a very really problem should be the least of the concerns. What it does for implementation should be.
As an aside, at least you and I can agree, unlike many of the far right wingers that permeate this board, is that answer is NOT "well, she should not have had the child in the first place."
<<<I've said nothing about "liberal" waste -- I think there's plenty, PLENTY of waste on both sides, I think we agree on that one. PEPFAR likely benefited a ton of different people, even if they were not American. That being said, I am not a fan of government programs that are organized to only help one specific race. That's prohibited by the Constitution in my mind and serves to distinguish it from the other examples you bring up. >>>
From the actual analysis of societal benefit, would Americans, as a whole, benefit from a program designed to reduce and treat AIDS in the world or one to study and increase the ability to educate a group that continues to lag behind its counterparts?
And I am not sure yet that we have seen that this agency will solely benefit one race at the exclusion of others, as discussed in Bakke.
You may be right, I may be crazy.
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<<<I've said nothing about "liberal" waste -- I think there's plenty, PLENTY of waste on both sides, I think we agree on that one. PEPFAR likely benefited a ton of different people, even if they were not American. That being said, I am not a fan of government programs that are organized to only help one specific race. That's prohibited by the Constitution in my mind and serves to distinguish it from the other examples you bring up. >>>
From the actual analysis of societal benefit, would Americans, as a whole, benefit from a program designed to reduce and treat AIDS in the world or one to study and increase the ability to educate a group that continues to lag behind its counterparts?
And I am not sure yet that we have seen that this agency will solely benefit one race at the exclusion of others, as discussed in Bakke.
Come on dj.... you don't think the agency meant to, in the White House's own words, "coordinate the work of communities and
federal agencies to ensure that African-American youngsters are better
prepared for high school, college and career" will only benefit one specific race? I think you are grasping here my fellow counselor
I don't think you are crazy FWIW
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Come on dj.... you don't think the agency meant to, in the White House's own words, "coordinate the work of communities and
federal agencies to ensure that African-American youngsters are better
prepared for high school, college and career" will only benefit one specific race? I think you are grasping here my fellow counselor
Do you not think this could've been better off left to organizations like the NAACP and the United Negro College Fund to meddle with?
Obama pretty much just lost the hispanic vote with this proposition imo. Not to mention the many disenfranchised white vote.>>>
Given the right wing's stance on Immigration, the only way Obama looses the Hispanic vote is by bombing Mexico or Romney holding his nose and muttering Rubio.
The NAACP has done virtually nothing for education other than blame the government for the fault of the educational predicament that blacks are in.
The UNCF is solid, but doesn't really do enough to support the younger blacks who are falling behind (actually, does nothing).
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<<<dj,
Do you not think this could've been better off left to organizations like the NAACP and the United Negro College Fund to meddle with?
Obama pretty much just lost the hispanic vote with this proposition imo. Not to mention the many disenfranchised white vote.>>>
Given the right wing's stance on Immigration, the only way Obama looses the Hispanic vote is by bombing Mexico or Romney holding his nose and muttering Rubio.
The NAACP has done virtually nothing for education other than blame the government for the fault of the educational predicament that blacks are in.
The UNCF is solid, but doesn't really do enough to support the younger blacks who are falling behind (actually, does nothing).
<<<<Come on dj.... you don't think the agency meant to, in the White House's own words, "coordinate the work of communities and federal agencies to ensure that African-American youngsters are better prepared for high school, college and career" will only benefit one specific race? I think you are grasping here my fellow counselor
I don't think you are crazy FWIW>>>>
Hee hee. Billy Joel in my head.
I wouild rather wait and see. I think the idea is fine. I have no idea how it will be implemented. As my post above states, getting the NAACP away from this area will hurt no one.
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<<<<Come on dj.... you don't think the agency meant to, in the White House's own words, "coordinate the work of communities and federal agencies to ensure that African-American youngsters are better prepared for high school, college and career" will only benefit one specific race? I think you are grasping here my fellow counselor
I don't think you are crazy FWIW>>>>
Hee hee. Billy Joel in my head.
I wouild rather wait and see. I think the idea is fine. I have no idea how it will be implemented. As my post above states, getting the NAACP away from this area will hurt no one.
Well, how do you KNOW that this program isn't going to work on exactly what you are describing?
Let's presume what you are saying is correct. Now you have a single parent household supporting the family. Even moreso, you have a likely single parent working more than 40 hours (in more than one job) to support said family because that parent is often not working in a high paying position.
Perhaps this program will explore tutors or means of education for both the parent and child, or afterschool and late school programs.
Or maybe it does nothing and is a complete waste.
The point is the creation and actual start of the program to address a very really problem should be the least of the concerns. What it does for implementation should be.
As an aside, at least you and I can agree, unlike many of the far right wingers that permeate this board, is that answer is NOT "well, she should not have had the child in the first place."
ok well lets suppose this program does all those wonderful things, then why shouldn't hispanics (who graduate at a rate below that of african americans) and whites who are in low graduation rate areas also have access to the program????
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Quote Originally Posted by djbrow:
<<
Well, how do you KNOW that this program isn't going to work on exactly what you are describing?
Let's presume what you are saying is correct. Now you have a single parent household supporting the family. Even moreso, you have a likely single parent working more than 40 hours (in more than one job) to support said family because that parent is often not working in a high paying position.
Perhaps this program will explore tutors or means of education for both the parent and child, or afterschool and late school programs.
Or maybe it does nothing and is a complete waste.
The point is the creation and actual start of the program to address a very really problem should be the least of the concerns. What it does for implementation should be.
As an aside, at least you and I can agree, unlike many of the far right wingers that permeate this board, is that answer is NOT "well, she should not have had the child in the first place."
ok well lets suppose this program does all those wonderful things, then why shouldn't hispanics (who graduate at a rate below that of african americans) and whites who are in low graduation rate areas also have access to the program????
Then wouldn't the sensible thing for Obama to do is to work with the NAACP instead of taking matters into this own hand like with this racially divisive and sensitive program. Better yet, how about cracking the whip on the DOE to do more to help all struggling kids? A sub-division under the DOE like this that emphasizes black kids alone and leaving out other struggling students, namely the hispanics is just plain wrong however strong the spin is to justify it.
Obama's intention may be sound, but perception is everything. I just don't see this being well received by the vast majority of Americans. Oh is the Romney camp going to have a field day over this. You know it's coming.
And we can all agree that this is likely just further govt waste that need not be.
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dj,
Then wouldn't the sensible thing for Obama to do is to work with the NAACP instead of taking matters into this own hand like with this racially divisive and sensitive program. Better yet, how about cracking the whip on the DOE to do more to help all struggling kids? A sub-division under the DOE like this that emphasizes black kids alone and leaving out other struggling students, namely the hispanics is just plain wrong however strong the spin is to justify it.
Obama's intention may be sound, but perception is everything. I just don't see this being well received by the vast majority of Americans. Oh is the Romney camp going to have a field day over this. You know it's coming.
And we can all agree that this is likely just further govt waste that need not be.
Well, Notwithstanding the cogent points made from those above, I do agree with our present linesmen dj. in regards to assisting those who have abject statistics with education / graduation ! I'm not apprised of the statistics of other minorities as it pertains to this subject. However, do we NOT want progress to be made among African Americans in regards of education ?? Certainly this has a veneer of preferential treatment,but,we shouldn't cease doing the best we can with a certain group simply because their attitudes or indeed overall scholastic performance continues to lag behind other racial groups / ethnicities. If certain animals are facing extinction,we employ models which we believe will preserve their species. Again, I understand the fine points all of you have made.But,I just can't FEEL RIGHT not advocating a proposed program which aims to help a certain group that I believe will help the balance of Americans in the long term.
Good night,gentlemen.
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Well, Notwithstanding the cogent points made from those above, I do agree with our present linesmen dj. in regards to assisting those who have abject statistics with education / graduation ! I'm not apprised of the statistics of other minorities as it pertains to this subject. However, do we NOT want progress to be made among African Americans in regards of education ?? Certainly this has a veneer of preferential treatment,but,we shouldn't cease doing the best we can with a certain group simply because their attitudes or indeed overall scholastic performance continues to lag behind other racial groups / ethnicities. If certain animals are facing extinction,we employ models which we believe will preserve their species. Again, I understand the fine points all of you have made.But,I just can't FEEL RIGHT not advocating a proposed program which aims to help a certain group that I believe will help the balance of Americans in the long term.
Well, Notwithstanding the cogent points made from those above, I do agree with our present linesmen dj. in regards to assisting those who have abject statistics with education / graduation ! I'm not apprised of the statistics of other minorities as it pertains to this subject. However, do we NOT want progress to be made among African Americans in regards of education ?? Certainly this has a veneer of preferential treatment,but,we shouldn't cease doing the best we can with a certain group simply because their attitudes or indeed overall scholastic performance continues to lag behind other racial groups / ethnicities. If certain animals are facing extinction,we employ models which we believe will preserve their species. Again, I understand the fine points all of you have made.But,I just can't FEEL RIGHT not advocating a proposed program which aims to help a certain group that I believe will help the balance of Americans in the long term.
Good night,gentlemen.
ahh, feelings. it feels good to help people in trouble. we all know this sensation and the desire to do good.
our encouragement of out of wedlock families has been a big part of the undoing of black culture.
daddies matter!
yet it feels good to have welfare etc because hunger and poverty is awful
yet the answer lies in teaching someone to fish not providing them fish someone else caught forever
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Quote Originally Posted by OakleyDoak:
Well, Notwithstanding the cogent points made from those above, I do agree with our present linesmen dj. in regards to assisting those who have abject statistics with education / graduation ! I'm not apprised of the statistics of other minorities as it pertains to this subject. However, do we NOT want progress to be made among African Americans in regards of education ?? Certainly this has a veneer of preferential treatment,but,we shouldn't cease doing the best we can with a certain group simply because their attitudes or indeed overall scholastic performance continues to lag behind other racial groups / ethnicities. If certain animals are facing extinction,we employ models which we believe will preserve their species. Again, I understand the fine points all of you have made.But,I just can't FEEL RIGHT not advocating a proposed program which aims to help a certain group that I believe will help the balance of Americans in the long term.
Good night,gentlemen.
ahh, feelings. it feels good to help people in trouble. we all know this sensation and the desire to do good.
our encouragement of out of wedlock families has been a big part of the undoing of black culture.
daddies matter!
yet it feels good to have welfare etc because hunger and poverty is awful
yet the answer lies in teaching someone to fish not providing them fish someone else caught forever
Ultimately, dj and kap are on point here as implementation is eventually what will make or break this when factoring in Bakke. Expect a long drawn out fight in the court system should this even get that far.
Therefore, one can plausibly conclude that this is likely just another election ploy.
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Ultimately, dj and kap are on point here as implementation is eventually what will make or break this when factoring in Bakke. Expect a long drawn out fight in the court system should this even get that far.
Therefore, one can plausibly conclude that this is likely just another election ploy.
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