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Author: [General Discussion] Topic: If Christ died on the cross for all of humanity
smoothd20
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#5226
Posted: 3/11/2012 2:15:06 AM
I may be a kook in your eyes but I don't spend countless hours debating with someone about something I don't believe in. I find that to be quite bizarre and strange to say the least. I also don't get angry with people who say they KNOW something. If they say they KNOW  they must KNOW according to their belief. Jesus healed according to the faith that you have inside of you. He said many times that the  Father within doeth the works. So I'm puzzled as to why me knowing something whether it's God, UFO's experiences that my friends had or me, or anything for that matter would bother someone so much as to be labeled a kook. Interesting how the mind works. Yet you guys sit around and read about theories most which have been proven wrong and take it for gospel. Quite amazing when you think about it. News flash for the atheist! There is more to this world than meets the eye and our understanding of this Universe is the equivalent of being in Pre-school at this point. We basically know very little. So to dismiss something simply because you don't KNOW anything about it is really crazy. 
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#5227
Posted: 3/11/2012 4:54:02 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by SirJohnDrake:

You are still showing that you are wet between the ears. ..lol

Where have I said what I posted previously about the first cause argument was my work?

If you go back to pg. 208 post #5178 this is what I clearly said to inform anyone who read what I posted:

(The most famous of all arguments for the existence of God are the "five ways" of Saint Thomas Aquinas.

One of the five ways, the fifth, is the argument from design and the other four are versions of the first-cause argument.)

So I clearly posted that the first cause argument was the work of Saint Thomas Aquinas. So in essence I wasn't stealing anything and making it look that it originated from me. C'mon wake up dude! Are you having trouble comprehending what you are reading?...lol

I have been posting a lot of passages from the bible also...do I ever say it is coming from me?...well of course not, it is coming from the Lord, because the bible is the Word of God.

So am I plagiarizing the Lord too? Well of course not.

I'm just stating what He has said which is written in the bible like for example whoever believes and accepts Jesus Christ as their Lord Savior and repents their sins will be allowed to enter God's Kingdom of Heaven and spend eternity in paradise.




I didn't say you claimed the "argument" to be yours, but you copied and pasted from a website.  (And I'm the one who has trouble comprehending.)  It's funny to me that you think you're so clever.  The problem with stupid people is that they can't think on a higher level, and they don't realize there is a higher level of thinking, so to have a conversation with these people, one must drop down to their level.  It is quite tiresome, really.    Basically what I'm trying to say is that stupid people don't know they're stupid.  It's ok to be unintelligent, as I have become very tolerant of all people, just don't attempt to involve yourself in intelligent conversation.
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#5228
Posted: 3/11/2012 8:37:56 AM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by CRRECORDS:

Einstein believed in Spinoza's God which rejects your Jesus God.

Einstein didnt believe in a personal God because he could not get past all the evils that are present in our world.

He made an assumption as most atheists do, that if God existed , he would create a world that is physically good and morally good.

We as Christians do not believe that the purpose of the universe is to be physically perfect or to make perfect moral choices BUT as a place where spiritual creatures can CHOOSE to love God or reject God.

It would not be possible to have this CHOICE if the only choices we have can ONLY be good ones..

Evil is a consequence of free will, Mr Einstein, as brilliant as he was in science, could not comprehend this ...

 

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#5229
Posted: 3/11/2012 8:58:25 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by HutchEmAll:

I love a good debate and I respect many of the people who have posted in this thread (and that includes those that share similar opinions and those that have different opinions.....I have learned a lot and that is what counts IMO).  

That said, the question of whether God exists won't be confirmed or denied until you die.  There are arguments on both sides, but neither can know for sure.  I stick a nick in my leg and I bleed.  That can't be disputed.  I see it.  I experience it.  Something supernatural.  No one on this earth has experienced it.  They can't know for sure something like that exists.  

SJD says something can't come from nothing.  I get that.  But I still don't know how God defies that.  Supernatural or not, He had to come from something.  To deny that is just saying you are guessing.  You don't know for sure.  

I think alot confusion arises is when non believers equate the reasonings / laws and physics of this universe / world that we live in to a world which we as  believers believe in (supernatural).

I think the atheists here are at a big disadvantage. We are currently in this universe, therefore we can study and observe the laws of the naturalistic world. I think logically we can conclude that everything that begins to exist has a cause.....This law is a conservation law within physics. We KNOW this to be true because we can observe.

However, when one tries to apply this rule to a world we believers believe in (supernatural), there is no basis to do so. Remember, the supernatural world is not the same as the natural world we live in. We havent observed the supernatural world, so we dont know its laws.

Therefore, comparisons shouldnt be made.

 

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#5230
Posted: 3/11/2012 9:07:50 AM

This thread has to stop......Things are getting repeated and repeated and repeated.

SJD and Smoothd, you guys have been great, God bless, but i think you are exhausting alot of energy here.

Keep in my these passages.

Corinthians 1:18

"For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God"

When People laugh at this quote, it further strengthens its truth...

 

 

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#5231
Posted: 3/11/2012 9:12:04 AM

SJD and Smooth....I further tell you why this is a waste of time.

Consider this quote

Romans 1:20" For since the creation of the world his invisible attributes – his eternal power and divine nature – have been clearly seen, because they are understood through what has been made. So people are without excuse"

With this quote in mind, for the past 5000 quotes, we have been looking at a wall that is painted in blue , we are saying that the colour of the wall is blue, we know it is blue, yet the atheists are saying it is not blue.

Thats what it comes down...We can all argue till we are blue in the face, it wont matter, this is what it comes down to.

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#5232
Posted: 3/11/2012 10:25:44 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Rostos:

Therefore, comparisons shouldn't be made.

 


You are right, no comparison can be made with fantasy, and logic. It leads to folks like you thinking you have something of value to add to critical thinking, and debate.

"I know, because I know" is not critical thinking, nor debate. It is the petulant whining of a child. And now we have you all claiming proof of alien visitation... fawktards...
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#5233
Posted: 3/11/2012 10:34:20 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by smoothd20:

I may be a kook So to dismiss something simply because you don't KNOW anything about it is really crazy. 
We dismiss non-testable assertions, such as your claim to know god exists. This claim will be routinely dismissed as anything but nonsensical drivel in any intelligent debate. I imagine that is why you argue on a gambling site (isn't gambling a sin, and therefore you will burn in hell). If you took your crazy talk to the streets you'd be seen as another fool with a "god hates people" sign. Belief is the absence of knowing, like believing fly's come from rotten meat. Or virgin births, or living in a whale.
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smoothd20
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#5234
Posted: 3/11/2012 10:59:04 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by jagerfury:


You are right, no comparison can be made with fantasy, and logic. It leads to folks like you thinking you have something of value to add to critical thinking, and debate.

"I know, because I know" is not critical thinking, nor debate. It is the petulant whining of a child. And now we have you all claiming proof of alien visitation... fawktards...
In true to your form you get it twisted. The fact is Rostos, and SJD are on record as saying they don't believe in life on other planets. I am on record in saying that it does. I never said I had proof. What I said was based on my experience with a UFO I KNOW for a fact that there is life on other planets. I haven't been to their planets so I can't bring you a sample. But what I experienced in 1995 wasn't from this world and nothing you or the government can say can change that. That's just a fact. Three of my friends experienced the same thing that night. So no matter what you think about it the facts of the situation don't change. Regarding my friend the same situation exists for him. As I have stated you can laugh ask for proof or dismiss the whole thing as some sort of fantasy on everybody's part. All that shows is that you have a mind of a imbecile because you can't think beyond this world. I guess in your brain unless the aliens landed on the White House lawn they don't exist but to people who witness or experience these things what are they suppose to believe? Some government lie about weather balloons or the special effects of the sun. Some other mumbo jumbo that makes no sense at all. Are you really that stupid or are you just pretending. We don't have all the answers to why things happen but they happen and to sit back and ridicule the people who experienced them is stupid at best and naive at worse. Stop believing the BS that the authorities tell you and think for just a moment. Not everything we see in the sky is some secret government project. I can guarantee you this every single person on this thread including myself would have been scared shitless if you would have been in the car with my friend on that drive in Utah. He didn't have your run of the mill "oh look mommy what's that up in the sky" No his was a lot more intense than that. So all you guys talking the crap you're talking would have been singing a different tune just like he is from that experience 2 weeks ago. Be careful who you laugh at people because you never know what life has in store for you. 
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#5235
Posted: 3/11/2012 11:09:41 AM
Our case is simple people. We have answered all of your questions to the best of our ability. We have had exhaustive write-ups concerning scripture and historical evidence presented on this thread. We have had brilliant minds come to this thread and try to satisfy the blood thirsty atheist to no avail. Every attempt has been met with contempt. On the atheist side we have had nobody answer any question seriously. Your contradictions and lies are supported with more contradictions and lies. Simple  challenges put forth by myself Rostos and others have been simply ignored or feeble attempts have been made in order to dismiss. The one thing I have learned about atheist is you guys really don't take yourselves seriously. At the end of the day even you know that you're full of crap. So the game goes on while you atheist holler for "proof and evidence" like a bunch of wild wolves in the night hollering at the moon. I submit this to you that any sensible person who would read the pages of this thread can easily see how the atheist have deluded themselves on the issues. Keep living the dream atheist keep living the dream. 
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smoothd20
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#5236
Posted: 3/11/2012 11:16:27 AM
BTW before the jokes start. Let me say this Fat women need love to!
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#5237
Posted: 3/11/2012 11:33:08 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Rostos:

Einstein didnt believe in a personal God because he could not get past all the evils that are present in our world.

He made an assumption as most atheists do, that if God existed , he would create a world that is physically good and morally good.

We as Christians do not believe that the purpose of the universe is to be physically perfect or to make perfect moral choices BUT as a place where spiritual creatures can CHOOSE to love God or reject God.

It would not be possible to have this CHOICE if the only choices we have can ONLY be good ones..

Evil is a consequence of free will, Mr Einstein, as brilliant as he was in science, could not comprehend this ...

 

you as a christian can not comprhend your bible....this is from your leader:

Isaiah 45:7

King James Version (KJV)

 7I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

we as agnostics, atheists and deists......can only say one thing.....your leader is sick perverted and misogynistic and as Einstein knew anyone who bows to this God really has some delusional problems.

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#5238
Posted: 3/11/2012 4:49:51 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by CRRECORDS:

you as a christian can not comprhend your bible....this is from your leader:

Isaiah 45:7

King James Version (KJV)

 7I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

we as agnostics, atheists and deists......can only say one thing.....your leader is sick perverted and misogynistic and as Einstein knew anyone who bows to this God really has some delusional problems.

If atheists are going to start quoting scripture please do so accurately. The above scripture should read. "I form the light and create darkness. I make peace and create calamity" 
The Lord is saying he is in control which he is. Calamity is referring to natural disasters. But make no mistake God allows Satan/ego to rule this world and it's only the misguided fools such as yourself who doesn't recognize this. But I expect nothing else from a man that believes in nothing. 
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#5239
Posted: 3/11/2012 4:52:32 PM
A man once said that "if a man doesn't believe in nothing he will fall for anything" I think we can safely say that the overwhelming majority of atheists fit this category as they will fall for anything that doesn't pertain to God. 
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#5240
Posted: 3/11/2012 5:43:49 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by smoothd20:

A man once said that "if a man doesn't believe in nothing he will fall for anything" I think we can safely say that the overwhelming majority of atheists fit this category as they will fall for anything that doesn't pertain to God. 

so if someone believes in something, they will fall for anything?

try again...
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#5241
Posted: 3/11/2012 6:16:57 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by CRRECORDS:

you as a christian can not comprhend your bible....this is from your leader:

Isaiah 45:7

King James Version (KJV)

 7I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

we as agnostics, atheists and deists......can only say one thing.....your leader is sick perverted and misogynistic and as Einstein knew anyone who bows to this God really has some delusional problems.

God does not cause evil, he permits evil. That is a big difference.

Many atheists seem to have alot of trouble understanding the implications of free will. Many of these arguments from atheists are emotional arguments.

If the only choices we can make are good ones, then how are we free creatures? We wouldnt be, he may as well attach strings to us and control every move we make like puppets. You wouldnt be able to have sex before or outside marriage, you wouldnt be able to look at a woman in lust, you wouldnt be able to swear, if a man wanted revenge he wouldnt be able to do so, if a man wanted to cheat on his wife, he wouldnt be able to do so.......Is this what you want..

Many atheists dont consider the alternaives, many are tied up in emotional arguments without considering the alternative...

We live in a world where humans have free will, unfortunately when we look around us, we see the full implications of free will.

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#5242
Posted: 3/11/2012 6:41:24 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Rostos:

God does not cause evil, he permits evil. That is a big difference.

Many atheists seem to have alot of trouble understanding the implications of free will. Many of these arguments from atheists are emotional arguments.

If the only choices we can make are good ones, then how are we free creatures? We wouldnt be, he may as well attach strings to us and control every move we make like puppets. You wouldnt be able to have sex before or outside marriage, you wouldnt be able to look at a woman in lust, you wouldnt be able to swear, if a man wanted revenge he wouldnt be able to do so, if a man wanted to cheat on his wife, he wouldnt be able to do so.......Is this what you want..

Many atheists dont consider the alternaives, many are tied up in emotional arguments without considering the alternative...

We live in a world where humans have free will, unfortunately when we look around us, we see the full implications of free will.

your god created the monster...but he did not cause the monster..........good twist.....you should get into politics
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#5243
Posted: 3/11/2012 6:47:14 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by smoothd20:

If atheists are going to start quoting scripture please do so accurately. The above scripture should read. "I form the light and create darkness. I make peace and create calamity" 
The Lord is saying he is in control which he is. Calamity is referring to natural disasters. But make no mistake God allows Satan/ego to rule this world and it's only the misguided fools such as yourself who doesn't recognize this. But I expect nothing else from a man that believes in nothing. 
accurately???? the kjv 1611 says "God created evil" Isaiah 45:7... what modern day version are you quoting??????  a sugar coated version????????????
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#5244
Posted: 3/11/2012 7:28:21 PM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by CRRECORDS:

your god created the monster...but he did not cause the monster..........good twist.....you should get into politics

So you dont want evil in the world, but you still want free will.

Basically you want a squared circle?

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#5245
Posted: 3/11/2012 7:59:46 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by CRRECORDS:

accurately???? the kjv 1611 says "God created evil" Isaiah 45:7... what modern day version are you quoting??????  a sugar coated version????????????

I have the KJV thank you very much. But I must say I'm glad you're finally reading the Good Book. This is progress. Continue to read everyday even if you don't believe. 
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#5246
Posted: 3/11/2012 8:03:19 PM
If anybody especially the atheist want to enter a NCAA tournament pool, PM me and I will send you the contact info. My friends in Minnesota have been doing this for years and it's alot of fun. Are atheist allowed to have fun? I guess we will see. Oh yeah we play for money hopefully you atheist can afford a few bucks. 
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#5247
Posted: 3/11/2012 8:22:06 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by smoothd20:

If anybody especially the atheist want to enter a NCAA tournament pool, PM me and I will send you the contact info. My friends in Minnesota have been doing this for years and it's alot of fun. Are atheist allowed to have fun? I guess we will see. Oh yeah we play for money hopefully you atheist can afford a few bucks. 

will the pot be make believe too?
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#5248
Posted: 3/11/2012 8:27:33 PM
Did you know if you mated a Bulldog with a Shitsu you would get a Bullshit....Do to the offensive nature of the the name the genus name is Sirsmootheiusrostos
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#5249
Posted: 3/12/2012 12:23:23 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Rostos:

God does not cause evil, he permits evil. That is a big difference.

Many atheists seem to have alot of trouble understanding the implications of free will. Many of these arguments from atheists are emotional arguments.

If the only choices we can make are good ones, then how are we free creatures? We wouldnt be, he may as well attach strings to us and control every move we make like puppets. You wouldnt be able to have sex before or outside marriage, you wouldnt be able to look at a woman in lust, you wouldnt be able to swear, if a man wanted revenge he wouldnt be able to do so, if a man wanted to cheat on his wife, he wouldnt be able to do so.......Is this what you want..

Many atheists dont consider the alternaives, many are tied up in emotional arguments without considering the alternative...

We live in a world where humans have free will, unfortunately when we look around us, we see the full implications of free will.

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#5250
Posted: 3/12/2012 12:33:22 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by smoothd20:


I have the KJV thank you very much. But I must say I'm glad you're finally reading the Good Book. This is progress. Continue to read everyday even if you don't believe. 

He might be reading it but is he really interpreting correctly what he is reading? A lot of people have trouble in really understanding what the bible is really trying to convery over to them and they end up forming all these misconceptions.

 

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