Matt Cain under .500 record

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Author: [MLB Betting] Topic: Matt Cain under .500 record
dcmc34f PM dcmc34f
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Posted: 4/2/2012 7:44:42 PM
Have the owners lost their mind? How in the world can these IDIOT owners give a pitcher with an under .500 record all this money. 69-73 with an 3.35 era, in the NL too. It's not his fault, he's not stupid, like these owners are, he's going to take the money. I know, I know, tell me how GREAT he is. If he is so good, then why is his record under .500? They just won the World Series, can't blame the ole " pitched for a bad team" theory. They win the WS and he is just 13-11, WOW. Overrated pitcher if you ask me. You want a Stud pitcher, Josh Johnson. 48-23. 48 wins in 113 starts, Cain, 69 wins in 203 starts
stevo1 PM stevo1
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Posted: 4/2/2012 7:59:05 PM
bermea12 PM bermea12
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Posted: 4/2/2012 8:00:16 PM
Come on give him a break, have u seen his run support, last year was under 2, is hard to win games like that
dcmc34f PM dcmc34f
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Posted: 4/2/2012 8:02:45 PM
Clayton Kershaw is 47-28. 47 wins in 113 starts, same as Johnson. Cain is OVERRATED.
dcmc34f PM dcmc34f
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Posted: 4/2/2012 8:04:30 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by bermea12:

Come on give him a break, have u seen his run support, last year was under 2, is hard to win games like that
What about Marlins and Dodgers? Johnson and Kershaw have ZERO run support and they win. Explain that to me?
drum67 PM drum67
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Posted: 4/2/2012 8:44:00 PM
Giants don't score runs.
Laroja PM Laroja
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Posted: 4/2/2012 8:49:35 PM
Bizarre contract.
dcmc34f PM dcmc34f
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Posted: 4/2/2012 9:09:19 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by drum67:

Giants don't score runs.
Last year, 2011, Giants avg 3.5 runs, LA 3.9, marlins 3.7. In 2010, Giants avg, 4.3 runs Dodgers 4.1 Marlins 4.4. In the last 2 years, the Giants have scored more runs than both LA and Marlins. What else do you got?
Sparky10191 PM Sparky10191
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Posted: 4/2/2012 9:11:03 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by dcmc34f:

Have the owners lost their mind? How in the world can these IDIOT owners give a pitcher with an under .500 record all this money. 69-73 with an
3.35 era, in the NL too. It's not his fault, he's not stupid, like these owners are, he's going to take the money. I know, I know, tell me how GREAT he is. If he is so good, then why is his record under .500? They just won the World Series, can't blame the ole " pitched for a bad team" theory. They win the WS and he is just 13-11, WOW. Overrated pitcher if you ask me. You want a Stud pitcher, Josh Johnson. 48-23. 48 wins in 113 starts, Cain, 69 wins in 203 starts

Sorry bud...but you lose your argument when you posted his ERA. That ERA is EXACTLY why he deserves to be a top paid pitcher. 
dcmc34f PM dcmc34f
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Posted: 4/2/2012 9:20:13 PM
Kershaw is at 2.88 and Johnson is 2.99. What do they deserve, 40 million a year?
Sparky10191 PM Sparky10191
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Posted: 4/2/2012 9:22:24 PM
When the Giants score 3 or more runs in Cain's starts and he gets a decision...

2005: 1-0
2006: 12-7
2007: 6-3
2008: 6-6
2009: 13-4
2010: 13-2
2011: 10-1

In his career...he is 61-23. So not taking the lineup into consideration is far from fair. 
The Hawk PM The Hawk
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Posted: 4/2/2012 9:23:39 PM

They were the lowest scoring World Series winner ever...........

Take any two player from the teams you mentioned, and they will be better than any two players from last years Giants team.........

Spartacus10 PM Spartacus10
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Posted: 4/2/2012 9:26:39 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Sparky10191:


Sorry bud...but you lose your argument when you posted his ERA. That ERA is EXACTLY why he deserves to be a top paid pitcher. 




Every single person in this thread (except Sparky) just represented how little knowledge of baseball they have. Wins certainly aren't how you should judge a pitchers performance. What about when Hernandez won the CY Young with a 13-12 record, but his ERA was just 2.27. What we can take from this is that wins are basically irrelevant, ERA is a much better statistic to judge a pitcher.

Is a pitcher with a 16-10 record with a 3.95 ERA better than a pitcher with a  8-10 record with a 2.47 ERA? The simple answer is no.
Sparky10191 PM Sparky10191
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Posted: 4/2/2012 9:27:18 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by dcmc34f:

Kershaw is at 2.88 and Johnson is 2.99. What do they deserve, 40 million a year?

In the world we live in...they deserve to be 2 of the top paid pitchers in the league. We're not arguing who is better...because JJ and Kershaw ARE better. But the way people are paid now...Cain is deserving.
Spartacus10 PM Spartacus10
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Posted: 4/2/2012 9:28:11 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by dcmc34f:

Kershaw is at 2.88 and Johnson is 2.99. What do they deserve, 40 million a year?


After 100 more starts each (which would put them closer to Cain) I can guarantee you see a regression.
dcmc34f PM dcmc34f
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Posted: 4/2/2012 9:59:44 PM
Sparky, is a pitcher who pitches in the National league that has a career era of 3.35 considered a great pitcher?
dcmc34f PM dcmc34f
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Posted: 4/2/2012 10:01:14 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Spartacus10:





Every single person in this thread (except Sparky) just represented how little knowledge of baseball they have. Wins certainly aren't how you should judge a pitchers performance. What about when Hernandez won the CY Young with a 13-12 record, but his ERA was just 2.27. What we can take from this is that wins are basically irrelevant, ERA is a much better statistic to judge a pitcher.

Is a pitcher with a 16-10 record with a 3.95 ERA better than a pitcher with a  8-10 record with a 2.47 ERA? The simple answer is no.
Cain does not have a 2.47 era and is NO WHERE NEAR IT.
Sparky10191 PM Sparky10191
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Posted: 4/2/2012 10:12:07 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by dcmc34f:

Sparky, is a pitcher who pitches in the National league that has a career era of 3.35 considered a great pitcher?


2.89
3.14
2.88

Last 3 years. Consistency. 
Sparky10191 PM Sparky10191
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Posted: 4/2/2012 10:12:35 PM
And does it matter that he's doing his damage in the National League if he's going to continue to play in the National League?
Spartacus10 PM Spartacus10
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Posted: 4/2/2012 10:37:04 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by dcmc34f:

Sparky, is a pitcher who pitches in the National league that has a career era of 3.35 considered a great pitcher?


Kershaw and Johnson both pitch in the NL as well, and their ERA's aren't much better, plus they still have about 4 full seasons worth of starts to get where Cain is. I can almost guarantee that both of their numbers will regress as well as hitters get a better feel for them. Your argument is horrible, especially considering that Kershaw has started more games in pitcher friendly parks than Cain (both pitch quite a few games.) Personally, I feel Kershaw will regress and by the end will be a career 3.80 ERA kind of pitcher.
boberts427 PM boberts427
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Posted: 4/2/2012 10:41:38 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Sparky10191:


2.89
3.14
2.88

Last 3 years. Consistency. 

 

also Johnson lives on the DL

Cains getting 17 wins this year, relaxed and paid, also dont forget he had to watch Zito make 18.5 a year lol

dcmc34f PM dcmc34f
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Posted: 4/2/2012 10:41:50 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Sparky10191:


2.89
3.14
2.88

Last 3 years. Consistency. 
Sparky, the question was, a pitcher, not Cain, take the name out of it. A pitcher with a career 3.35 in the NL a great pitcher? Now answer it.
Sparky10191 PM Sparky10191
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Posted: 4/2/2012 10:47:24 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by dcmc34f:

Sparky, the question was, a pitcher, not Cain, take the name out of it. A pitcher with a career 3.35 in the NL a great pitcher? Now answer it.


I think that's the story here. You take the name Cain and you don't think elite. But he's as consistent as it comes. 

He has a 2.97 ERA over 662 innings over the past 3 years with no signs of slowing down. And he's only 27 years old.
dcmc34f PM dcmc34f
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Posted: 4/2/2012 10:47:48 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by boberts427:

 

also Johnson lives on the DL

Cains getting 17 wins this year, relaxed and paid, also dont forget he had to watch Zito make 18.5 a year lol

Cain will have his normal year, 10 to 13 wins, era between 3.00 and 3.45. All I'm saying is, the owners don't spend their money wisely, and Cain is not worth it. Not with those numbers. Kershaw will win 18-20, era UNDER 3, WAY UNDER. I'll take that.
Sparky10191 PM Sparky10191
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Posted: 4/2/2012 10:50:10 PM
3.00 - 3.45 is not a normal ERA? His normal ERA is between 2.88 and 3.14.

Not everyone comes into the league and is one of the best pitchers year in and year out. He's been hitting his strides for a few seasons now and is a top starter. Top 15 in my book.
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