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Author: [Politics] Topic: Illegal not Deported goes on Murder Spree
djbrow
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#26
Posted: 1/25/2012 4:12:55 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by bowlslit:

http://news.yahoo.com/north-carolina-death-row-inmate-writes-letter-life-152637993--abc-news.html

 

Always a good idea to quote the mentally unstable for 'proof' of your point.

My suggestion to spend a day in a death row ward. It isn't pretty.

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#27
Posted: 1/25/2012 4:17:40 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by djbrow:

Always a good idea to quote the mentally unstable for 'proof' of your point.

My suggestion to spend a day in a death row ward. It isn't pretty.

My counter suggestion is to spend the day, no spend two hours in a living room of the victims' family. I suggest the prison cell is much prettier.

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#28
Posted: 1/25/2012 4:19:58 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by djbrow:

Always a good idea to quote the mentally unstable for 'proof' of your point.

My suggestion to spend a day in a death row ward. It isn't pretty.

Why do some of us spend energy worrying about the mass murderers feelings?

Thats one of our biggest problems that exacerbates the problem exponentially.

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#29
Posted: 1/25/2012 4:35:27 PM

You 'created' the 'problem' that exists in this thread when you suggested that convicted criminals be afforded less rights.

You never did quite respond to how these rights should be reduced. Instead, you suggested they be afforded one appeal.Let me explain why that doesn't work.

The appeal process is both state and federal. Murder is a state charge, but one has federally protected and state protected rights. A convicted criminal must exhaust all state remedies before addressing any federal one. That is the reason that those convicted may actually have numerous appeals (state appellate court, state supreme court, federal district court, federal circuit court, Supreme Court). Unless you are going to deny one his/her constitutional rights, you simply cannot circumvent the right to challenge a conviction.

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#30
Posted: 1/25/2012 4:47:17 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by djbrow:

You 'created' the 'problem' that exists in this thread when you suggested that convicted criminals be afforded less rights.

You never did quite respond to how these rights should be reduced. Instead, you suggested they be afforded one appeal.Let me explain why that doesn't work.

The appeal process is both state and federal. Murder is a state charge, but one has federally protected and state protected rights. A convicted criminal must exhaust all state remedies before addressing any federal one. That is the reason that those convicted may actually have numerous appeals (state appellate court, state supreme court, federal district court, federal circuit court, Supreme Court). Unless you are going to deny one his/her constitutional rights, you simply cannot circumvent the right to challenge a conviction.

 Why does it take 40 years for our effed up judicial system to run though this process?

My point is the system is not reasonable and for the money we spend on housing death row inmates we could enhance the system to be much more efficient while still seeing the really really really really really guilty ones flatline.

 

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#31
Posted: 1/25/2012 4:54:26 PM

The current way our law enforcement gathers evidence these days there should be FAR less people that are in the innocent category.

A truly independant appeal body could look at each case and in two days decide if any other appeals are necessary.

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#32
Posted: 1/25/2012 5:03:58 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by djbrow:

Agreed.

We need true criminal justice reform but the problem is joe taxpayer(s) want nothing to do with the cost of actual reform, unless of course it involves no prison time for those with drug addictions. If that were to happen, we would have plenty of prison space for the real offenders.



sup bro

i've been anxious to hear how you came to this conclusion, as you once told me that you held the polar opposite view

what information enlightened you to change your mind on this?

Us freedom fighters need people like you, to help us inform the ignorant,,,,,,,
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#33
Posted: 1/25/2012 5:11:02 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by bowlslit:

 Why does it take 40 years for our effed up judicial system to run though this process?

My point is the system is not reasonable and for the money we spend on housing death row inmates we could enhance the system to be much more efficient while still seeing the really really really really really guilty ones flatline.

 

Many reasons. One being the continued cutbacks in the judicial budget. Another being the time it takes to issue decisions, obtain transcripts, file for new appeals, etc.

I would imagine the money spent on housing death row inmates is less than you think. Outside of the appeal process, the cost is likely less than for other inmates (max security generally have more walls, less libraries, less common rooms which equal less security.

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#34
Posted: 1/25/2012 5:12:36 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by bowlslit:

The current way our law enforcement gathers evidence these days there should be FAR less people that are in the innocent category.

A truly independant appeal body could look at each case and in two days decide if any other appeals are necessary.

There is. It is called an appellate court. The Supreme Court being the final arbitrator as to whether the appellate court did their job.

Do you even want to know how many cases the Supreme Court said they did not? Here is your hint...whatever you guess, the number will be much higher.

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#35
Posted: 1/25/2012 5:17:10 PM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by be easy:



sup bro

i've been anxious to hear how you came to this conclusion, as you once told me that you held the polar opposite view

what information enlightened you to change your mind on this?

Us freedom fighters need people like you, to help us inform the ignorant,,,,,,,

'sup!

I am not for legalization of drugs, per se. But I am also not for sending someone to prison for possession of a usable amount of drugs either.

I am for legalization of marijuana. I have changed my position on that. Even though most states make it a civil offense with no jail time, they backdoor it with incarceration when the person cannot pay the fine.

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#36
Posted: 1/25/2012 5:24:09 PM
yea, you told me before that you've changed your position, i'm curious as to why
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#37
Posted: 1/25/2012 5:26:35 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by djbrow:

'sup!

I am not for legalization of drugs, per se. But I am also not for sending someone to prison for possession of a usable amount of drugs either.

I am for legalization of marijuana. I have changed my position on that. Even though most states make it a civil offense with no jail time, they backdoor it with incarceration when the person cannot pay the fine.


Sup be, Sup DJ, Sup fellas 

I share the opinion with many: that marijuana be legalized, and all other (non-violent) drug offenses be decriminalized.

Just imagine the amount of money & resources that will no longer be wasted and instead directed toward solving matters of actual public interest & public safety.

Just thought I would repeat this position, again... and until I'm blue in the face.

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#38
Posted: 1/25/2012 5:28:31 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by be easy:

yea, you told me before that you've changed your position, i'm curious as to why



We convinced him with our well rounded and logical arguments 

Team Discovery Channel/Sunny Side of Philly 
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#39
Posted: 1/25/2012 6:12:39 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by djbrow:

There is. It is called an appellate court. The Supreme Court being the final arbitrator as to whether the appellate court did their job.

Do you even want to know how many cases the Supreme Court said they did not? Here is your hint...whatever you guess, the number will be much higher.

So do you really believe this process cannot be streamlined?

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#40
Posted: 1/25/2012 6:24:24 PM
beat it

Gail the Snail,er disco69

I never realized that people just don't change their minds that often, and dj can give his personal reasons, from a litigously lawyer POV.

What was the last thing you changed your mind about?
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#41
Posted: 1/25/2012 8:32:36 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by be easy:

beat it

Gail the Snail,er disco69

I never realized that people just don't change their minds that often, and dj can give his personal reasons, from a litigously lawyer POV.

What was the last thing you changed your mind about?

You... once I started watching It's Always Sunny In Philadelphia. I now understand the manner in which you see the world and translate it to us on Covers.

So I no longer hold it against you 
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#42
Posted: 1/26/2012 8:22:30 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by DiscoD69:


You... once I started watching It's Always Sunny In Philadelphia. I now understand the manner in which you see the world and translate it to us on Covers.

So I no longer hold it against you 


hold what against me?  you have some preconceived biases against me? sounds like a personal problem there, Snail 

and DjBrow, i'm still interested, but if there is some reason why you feel you don't want to share the info, i won't hold it against you
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#43
Posted: 1/26/2012 9:15:37 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by be easy:



hold what against me?  you have some preconceived biases against me? sounds like a personal problem there, Snail 

and DjBrow, i'm still interested, but if there is some reason why you feel you don't want to share the info, i won't hold it against you

I used to hold you ignorance and abrasive personality against you.

Upon further consideration, I no longer do. 
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#44
Posted: 1/26/2012 9:56:38 AM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by be easy:



hold what against me?  you have some preconceived biases against me? sounds like a personal problem there, Snail 

and DjBrow, i'm still interested, but if there is some reason why you feel you don't want to share the info, i won't hold it against you

Not at all.

Let's remember (or research) why prohibition ended?

It was simple. It wasn't because alcohol was determined to be good or even because it was a violation of rights. Rather it was because the enforcement became more problematic than the perceived 'evil' of alcohol.

That is where I currently find marijuana prohibition. We know it offers medical benefits so there is some basis for legality. We know it also offers benefits to those who are at latter stages of life due to cancer and other horrible conditions so there are more basis for legality.

Punishing those who use simply clogs the system, as prohibition did. People are going to jail because they cannot pay the fines associated with using. It makes no sense.

I continue opposition to trafficking to children or to money laundering assciated with selling. I am in favor of laws that restrict the use of marijuana and operation of vehicles, etc. same as alcohol.

But it is time for an end to draconian laws that simply harm those that either have a use for it or cannot afford to pay the costs of the consequences, which I am not convinced outweigh the costs of regulation.

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#45
Posted: 1/26/2012 10:15:07 AM
man after mine own heart

better be careful unibrow, lest i lose my lust for koaj and have eyes only for you

To live in a society that is supposed to be held together with just laws, how can we expect people to respect the law when we are fighting a war against the sick and suffering?
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#46
Posted: 1/26/2012 10:29:46 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Hirschfelder:

when we see multiple high school massacres with a knife, and shopping mall knifing sprees as often was we see gun massacres then you will have an argument




I take it you have never seen the reports of knife attacks on large numbers of young children in school in China?
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#47
Posted: 1/26/2012 12:14:21 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by djbrow:

Not at all.

Let's remember (or research) why prohibition ended?

It was simple. It wasn't because alcohol was determined to be good or even because it was a violation of rights. Rather it was because the enforcement became more problematic than the perceived 'evil' of alcohol.

That is where I currently find marijuana prohibition. We know it offers medical benefits so there is some basis for legality. We know it also offers benefits to those who are at latter stages of life due to cancer and other horrible conditions so there are more basis for legality.

Punishing those who use simply clogs the system, as prohibition did. People are going to jail because they cannot pay the fines associated with using. It makes no sense.

I continue opposition to trafficking to children or to money laundering assciated with selling. I am in favor of laws that restrict the use of marijuana and operation of vehicles, etc. same as alcohol.

But it is time for an end to draconian laws that simply harm those that either have a use for it or cannot afford to pay the costs of the consequences, which I am not convinced outweigh the costs of regulation.


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