Fast Forward to November 7th

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Author: [Politics] Topic: Fast Forward to November 7th
be easy PM be easy
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Posted: 9/21/2012 11:09:58 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by mattbrot:



Be Easy -- Of course there are MANY MANY things as bad or worse than soda. And yes you are correct that there is a huge irony when schools replace sodas in vending machines with powerade etc... And yes there are many many things that the government can and should fix if they want to take this "healthier society stance".

But does all of that mean that this small measure is not a step in the right direction?




i see no benefit in replacing one evil with another

Conservative, n: A statesman who is enamored of existing evils, as distinguished from the Liberal who wishes to replace them with others.

like i said, i believe that good information trumps bullshit policy clouded with bad information. So long as the government perpetuates all the bad science and the bad information that goes along with it, a tax on soda serves no benefit to society, imo
mattbrot PM mattbrot
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Posted: 9/21/2012 11:14:28 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by be easy:



i see no benefit in replacing one evil with another

Conservative, n: A statesman who is enamored of existing evils, as distinguished from the Liberal who wishes to replace them with others.

like i said, i believe that good information trumps bullshit policy clouded with bad information. So long as the government perpetuates all the bad science and the bad information that goes along with it, a tax on soda serves no benefit to society, imo


Only speaking to the soda issue here  -- They are not replacing one bad with another. They are not saying you have to buy 16 ounces of soda AND 16 ounces of gatorade. They are simply saying you can only buy at most 16 ounces of soda at a time. 
Crusher13 PM Crusher13
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Posted: 9/21/2012 11:17:34 AM
WTF?  Club

Rush will always have his audience and make his cray And he LOVES his country too  Your statement is absolutely foolish

Fox News is generally fair and balanced but leans to the right Pretty smart business decision considering their competition's ratings Free market economies reward risk takers whom provide what consumers want

Yes they both benefit from BOH's relection but some realize the greater cost is the TOTAL meltdown of the SOCIETY AND REPUBLIC

That is the main reason why I hate responding to you tools who don't realize the repercussions of your decisions Especially to someone who has 2 daughters who will be paying off all this debt to eternity, that is, if the good ole USA will still be around should BOH  get relected.
ClubDirt PM ClubDirt
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Posted: 9/21/2012 11:21:30 AM
take a look at a box of fruit loops, which probably has a disgusting amount of sugar and god knows what else in it.  the ftc, i think, regulates advertising.  at the top of the box, it should have a skull and crossbones but it says it's a good source of fiber and whole grains. 

no, it's not a good source of fiber.  broccoli is a good source of fiber.  and i won't get into the whole grains issue. 

the government could give a darn about people's health.  there is a lot of subsidized corn farmers who need a place for their corn.  why not turn into into syrup, put it in everything and get the government to tell people there's a health benefit. 
be easy PM be easy
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Posted: 9/21/2012 11:34:02 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by ClubDirt:

take a look at a box of fruit loops, which probably has a disgusting amount of sugar and god knows what else in it.  the ftc, i think, regulates advertising.  at the top of the box, it should have a skull and crossbones but it says it's a good source of fiber and whole grains. 

no, it's not a good source of fiber.  broccoli is a good source of fiber.  and i won't get into the whole grains issue. 

the government could give a darn about people's health.  there is a lot of subsidized corn farmers who need a place for their corn.  why not turn into into syrup, put it in everything and get the government to tell people there's a health benefit. 


the government benefits from this as well, as it is 'an opiate to the masses' to keep them addicted on the cheap/dirty fuel (carbohydrates/sugars) which also negatively affects the mind, as well as the body, making people dumber and less likely to question thy master
rooster010 PM rooster010
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Posted: 9/21/2012 6:36:36 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by mattbrot:



It is ironic I admit. As ironic as republicans wanting less government and then not allowing abortions. 

I can do it also - the irony goes both ways.


except i am not cheering for, nor supporting any republican

what are you doing?

trying to fight ignorance with ignorance?


rooster010 PM rooster010
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Posted: 9/21/2012 6:39:16 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by mattbrot:



Now back to this issue. You are correct in that it is not a ban. It is no different than a tax. You can still get the same volume of soda you just have to pay more for it.

Once again no different that a tax on smokes, booze etc... Do you have an issue with tax on smoke or that they even regulate who can smoke? If you really think about it the soda thing is not much different. 

It is no different than trying to reduce that amount of saturated fats that restaurants can use, trying to regulate the food that schools serve the children for lunch, no different than trying to regulate the options available in vending machines at schools etc... There are many examples.

I will not go through all the numbers but I can provide them if you want but briefly -
- Approximately 1/3 of children in the US are overweight and/or obese (triple that of 3 decades ago).
- And it is estimated that over 50% of people in the US will be obese by 2030 (this number is a little higher depending on where you read).
- By 2030 it is estimated that the total healthcare costs associated attributable to obesity could be from 860 - 960 billion. Approximately 17% of US health expenses.

This does not even take into account the other diseases that obesity is a well known precursor for.

So if it is a small measure to try to have a healthier society than what is the issue?


it does nothing but pad the coffers and rob liberty

treatment of a disease by way of symptoms is futile

you are on a very slippery slope



rooster010 PM rooster010
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Posted: 9/21/2012 6:40:30 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by mattbrot:



And Rooster this is a significant stretch to say the least.  No one is saying to ban these things and it is not even possible. The soda "tax" is simply to making a small stride to aid in fighting against obesity.

There is a huge difference between the two.




it will not aid the fight

that is the hypocrisy
lordspoint PM lordspoint
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Posted: 9/21/2012 7:24:07 PM
It won't stop at soda my friends.
Posted using a mobile device.
rick3117 PM rick3117
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Posted: 9/21/2012 9:16:04 PM
Taxing things to limit their use is not the way a free society should solve their problems. The Cass Sunstein "nudge" doctrine in just scientific and economic tyranny.  Just as it would be if they passed a $5 dollar a bullet tax on ammo.  A clever way to subvert and undermine liberty is still just as bad as a frontal assault on liberty.

The cigarette tax does nothing but disproportionately rob the poor  of their disposable income so that they can not buy their children nutritious food.

There,  an example of how the left's love of taxation is making obese children. 

rick3117 PM rick3117
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Posted: 9/21/2012 9:18:49 PM
It truly is unbelievable that there are A-holes sitting at home thinking of ways to economically punish people during the worst financial situation since the great depression, knowing full well that almost all of the taxes that are proposed are a direct assault on the working poor. 




mattbrot PM mattbrot
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Posted: 9/21/2012 9:48:35 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by rooster010:



it does nothing but pad the coffers and rob liberty

treatment of a disease by way of symptoms is futile

you are on a very slippery slope




I think that we are not following eachother. This effort is not a way of treating a disease by way of symptoms. It is a way of treating a disease by trying to reduce reduce the chance that symptoms manifest. Is this what you meant? I really am not sure. 

Are you are saying that you do not treat a disease by trying to prevent a symptom? If so than that is flat out wrong. 

Now if you want to have the conversation that it goes well beyond drinking soda and is related to cultural and upbringings (an also unfortunately genetics) than I agree but either way you still minimize the symptoms. That may be educating the parents about the impact of a sedentary lifestyle, the importance of a good diet, the impact of TV and video game time etc.. but either way it is still trying to prevent the symptoms.

Is regulating soda a bad thing? Maybe as nobody wants to be told what to do. But my point is that the underlying intent is not all that bad.

Like I said earlier -- of course there are many other contributors however, just cause you can not control all of them does not mean you can not try to to take small steps.

 
jay10 PM jay10
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Posted: 9/21/2012 9:51:20 PM
It's a bullshit law.....
mattbrot PM mattbrot
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Posted: 9/21/2012 9:51:26 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by rooster010:



it will not aid the fight

that is the hypocrisy

I disagree. It might help, it might not but it deffinetely is not going to hurt. So What is the harm? Is that a reason to not try at all? 

That type of logic can be applied to just about anything.


mattbrot PM mattbrot
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Posted: 9/21/2012 9:54:54 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by rick3117:

Taxing things to limit their use is not the way a free society should solve their problems. The Cass Sunstein "nudge" doctrine in just scientific and economic tyranny.  Just as it would be if they passed a $5 dollar a bullet tax on ammo.  A clever way to subvert and undermine liberty is still just as bad as a frontal assault on liberty.

The cigarette tax does nothing but disproportionately rob the poor  of their disposable income so that they can not buy their children nutritious food.

There,  an example of how the left's love of taxation is making obese children. 


This is a good point. And spoken like a true democrat . It is the same reason why the 9-9-9 theory of taxation was a regressive tax and why tax based on consumption (what you spend) is also a regressive tax. 

And yes the cigarette tax does effect the poor more than others but what is the alternative?  
rooster010 PM rooster010
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Posted: 9/21/2012 10:01:17 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by mattbrot:


I think that we are not following eachother. This effort is not a way of treating a disease by way of symptoms. It is a way of treating a disease by trying to reduce reduce the chance that symptoms manifest. Is this what you meant? I really am not sure. 

Are you are saying that you do not treat a disease by trying to prevent a symptom? If so than that is flat out wrong. 

Now if you want to have the conversation that it goes well beyond drinking soda and is related to cultural and upbringings (an also unfortunately genetics) than I agree but either way you still minimize the symptoms. That may be educating the parents about the impact of a sedentary lifestyle, the importance of a good diet, the impact of TV and video game time etc.. but either way it is still trying to prevent the symptoms.

Is regulating soda a bad thing? Maybe as nobody wants to be told what to do. But my point is that the underlying intent is not all that bad.

Like I said earlier -- of course there are many other contributors however, just cause you can not control all of them does not mean you can not try to to take small steps.

 


child obesity is the disease

drinking soda is a symptom

your laws and regulations, no matter how well intended, will not make a dent

prohibition does not work

has history not taught you anything?

you must agree with the on-line gambling bans, i mean, they're in place to protect people, right?






jay10 PM jay10
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Posted: 9/21/2012 10:03:34 PM

I don't agree with rooster much,,,,

 

 

But when I do......it's magical.....

rooster010 PM rooster010
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Posted: 9/21/2012 10:04:39 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by jay10:

It's a bullshit law.....


a voice of reason

the only laws being made these days are to take money out of one pocket and put it in another

no matter the politician
rooster010 PM rooster010
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Posted: 9/21/2012 10:05:58 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by jay10:

I don't agree with rooster much,,,,

 

 

But when I do......it's magical.....



you are generous to a fault

much love
rooster010 PM rooster010
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Posted: 9/21/2012 10:21:04 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by mattbrot:


I think that we are not following eachother. This effort is not a way of treating a disease by way of symptoms. It is a way of treating a disease by trying to reduce reduce the chance that symptoms manifest. Is this what you meant? I really am not sure. 

Are you are saying that you do not treat a disease by trying to prevent a symptom? If so than that is flat out wrong. 

Now if you want to have the conversation that it goes well beyond drinking soda and is related to cultural and upbringings (an also unfortunately genetics) than I agree but either way you still minimize the symptoms. That may be educating the parents about the impact of a sedentary lifestyle, the importance of a good diet, the impact of TV and video game time etc.. but either way it is still trying to prevent the symptoms.

Is regulating soda a bad thing? Maybe as nobody wants to be told what to do. But my point is that the underlying intent is not all that bad.

Like I said earlier -- of course there are many other contributors however, just cause you can not control all of them does not mean you can not try to to take small steps.

 


agree some, and its obvious im no doctor

i just dont agree with punishing the responsible in an effort to control anybody





jay10 PM jay10
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Posted: 9/21/2012 10:25:54 PM

My mom used to drink a 12 pack of Tab per week...She died of cancer at 55.

rooster010 PM rooster010
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Posted: 9/21/2012 10:31:13 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by jay10:

My mom used to drink a 12 pack of Tab per week...She died of cancer at 55.



my dad died of a failed kidney, dialysis twice a week for years

i need no law to avoid the soda's
jay10 PM jay10
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Posted: 9/21/2012 10:38:29 PM
Of course, she smoked a pack of Kool Filter Kings, as well........
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Posted: 9/21/2012 10:39:45 PM
pack a day, it should read..
Killer_B PM Killer_B
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Posted: 9/22/2012 12:21:44 AM
Exhibit A that the governments of the country DO NOT CARE ABOUT THE CITIZENRY is allowing the sale of cigarettes.

500,000 dead per year - every year that this goes on. But they tax it and it's a good money maker, so go on public keep killing yourself but but we really C-A-R-E about you.
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