How scared are you of the nuclear Iranian boogeyman?

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Author: [Politics] Topic: How scared are you of the nuclear Iranian boogeyman?
be easy PM be easy
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Posted: 9/14/2012 2:54:10 PM
And if the issue was of importance to you, which candidate would you be voting for?

I tend to agree with the intelligence that is out there that says there is no threat of an Iranian nuclear weapons program. I know, I know, Israel is drumming up a bunch of noise to bolster American action, because as usual they'd love to force us to do their bidding, or at least do something rather then nothing so that they'd know whether or not we'd have their back (allow them to pull the trigger)

This is reason #4810 that Ron Paul was a better candidate then either of the two current dolts, because his foreign policy on this matter would have been to leave well enough alone, rather then to continue to soak the American taxpayer to do the bidding of the Israeli terrorist state
ClubDirt PM ClubDirt
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Posted: 9/14/2012 3:18:07 PM
i really can't say what the hell they are doing in iran.  however, our continous policy of us against them and making enemies of these various countries seems counterproductive and only designed to make more money for defense companies here.  i assume most of these stories are designed to create monsters, scare people into voting for one candidate or the other and ensure huge profits for defense companies. 

i'm not saying there aren't threats out there.  there are, but much of that is by our design to fulfill a certain agenda.  on a basic level where politicians are doing what's best for the country, there isn't a need for so many problems and enemies.  but in today's corrupt system, there is. 
lordspoint PM lordspoint
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Posted: 9/14/2012 3:29:42 PM

Club

there will never be peace....

be easy PM be easy
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Posted: 9/14/2012 3:34:30 PM
War is big business

click
ClubDirt PM ClubDirt
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Posted: 9/14/2012 3:49:20 PM
right, those companies need enemies to keep those billions flowing. 
be easy PM be easy
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Posted: 9/14/2012 4:08:00 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by ClubDirt:

right, those companies need enemies to keep those billions flowing. 


There is definitely correlation, although we can argue the causation, of more war leading to economic boom times. We began each of the last three decades with wars, and they were all followed by economic booms, albeit not built by such strong fundamentals,,,
rooster010 PM rooster010
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Posted: 9/14/2012 8:16:47 PM
now, now.....we dont want to seem isolationist

we must continue to give billions to those that murder americans and continue to drop bombs for oils
Rush51 PM Rush51
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Posted: 9/14/2012 9:16:31 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by be easy:

And if the issue was of importance to you, which candidate would you be voting for?

I tend to agree with the intelligence that is out there that says there is no threat of an Iranian nuclear weapons program. I know, I know, Israel is drumming up a bunch of noise to bolster American action, because as usual they'd love to force us to do their bidding, or at least do something rather then nothing so that they'd know whether or not we'd have their back (allow them to pull the trigger)

This is reason #4810 that Ron Paul was a better candidate then either of the two current dolts, because his foreign policy on this matter would have been to leave well enough alone, rather then to continue to soak the American taxpayer to do the bidding of the Israeli terrorist state


Curling up into a ball in the fetal position is not a foreign policy. 

This is the area where you libertarians lose me..


ClubDirt PM ClubDirt
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Posted: 9/14/2012 9:42:38 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Rush51:



Curling up into a ball in the fetal position is not a foreign policy. 

This is the area where you libertarians lose me..



that sounds like foxnews talk to me.  you forgot to behind something about protecting our freedoms. 

what should our policy be in these places where all we do is burn money and waste the lives of young people?
TheGoldenGoose PM TheGoldenGoose
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Posted: 9/14/2012 9:59:17 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by lordspoint:

Club

there will never be peace....




Agreed.  These people have been throwing stones at each other for the last 3,000 years.  How the hell is there ever supposed to be any peace?  Ridiculous to even have a conversation about peace.  Let them blow each other up, who cares?
Rush51 PM Rush51
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Posted: 9/14/2012 10:01:33 PM
Of course it does, Club,  because it doesn't agree with your brand of thinking... I think for myself based on what I see around me...


I don't know the answer to your question, but  ignoring the rest of the world is not the answer..    Find a balance. 
ClubDirt PM ClubDirt
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Posted: 9/14/2012 10:18:36 PM
rush, if it is foxnews talk or sounds like foxnews talk, then it likely does not agree with my thinking.  we can all agree on that. 

no one said anything about ignoring the world.  of course, that's a far cry from government building or democracy building which really is another way of saying, let's interfere in other countries and get involved in conflicts because our defense companies and energy companies need to make billions of dollars and they own our politicians.  i'm guessing that's not foxnews talk. 

easier to call everyone a box who isn't prepared to sacrifice the lives of others to continue fighting in some country inhabited by brown people who believe in a different god.
Nut_Flopper PM Nut_Flopper
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Posted: 9/14/2012 11:00:30 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Rush51:



Curling up into a ball in the fetal position is not a foreign policy. 

This is the area where you libertarians lose me..




The mindset that Ron Paul is an isolationist or wants to "curl up into a ball" is a fallacy.

What business do we have manipulating governments, setting up military shops in various countries etc. other than just that, business. Reverse the situation what if Russia or China tried doing to us what we do throughout the world?

Paul is for a strong defense not an offense. Its simplistic but we mind our own business and God help you if you darn with us.
dl36 PM dl36
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Posted: 9/14/2012 11:28:31 PM
Im scared of the north korean boogieman also

Since these countries obviously have weapons of mass destruction it is our duty to invade these countries engage in reckless and senseless spending resources, energy, lives and money... at least a trillion dollars... minimum... 

at least that is what 21st century history tells us is the right the thing to do...

and then when people question the spendaholics their only answer is that we have to stave the course and cant cut and run... not until we bankrupt the nation first of course and launder as much public/government money to private/corporate...



Ktrain PM Ktrain
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Posted: 9/15/2012 12:10:55 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by be easy:

And if the issue was of importance to you, which candidate would you be voting for?


I tend to agree with the intelligence that is out there that says there is no threat of an Iranian nuclear weapons program. I know, I know, Israel is drumming up a bunch of noise to bolster American action, because as usual they'd love to force us to do their bidding, or at least do something rather then nothing so that they'd know whether or not we'd have their back (allow them to pull the trigger)

This is reason #4810 that Ron Paul was a better candidate then either of the two current dolts, because his foreign policy on this matter would have been to leave well enough alone, rather then to continue to soak the American taxpayer to do the bidding of the Israeli terrorist state

 
Ktrain PM Ktrain
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Posted: 9/15/2012 12:11:40 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Nut_Flopper:



The mindset that Ron Paul is an isolationist or wants to "curl up into a ball" is a fallacy.

What business do we have manipulating governments, setting up military shops in various countries etc. other than just that, business. Reverse the situation what if Russia or China tried doing to us what we do throughout the world?

Paul is for a strong defense not an offense. Its simplistic but we mind our own business and God help you if you darn with us.

 
Ktrain PM Ktrain
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Posted: 9/15/2012 12:18:11 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Rush51:



Curling up into a ball in the fetal position is not a foreign policy. 

This is the area where you libertarians lose me..



Why is worrying about our self defense and letting the rest of the world take care of itself considered "curling into a ball in the fetal position?"

Why do we always have to stick our noses into others business? Why do we always have to be the worlds police?

Did you ever think that maybe, just maybe, our imperialistic nature has brought this violence upon us? Dictating who runs other countries governments is going to piss some people off sooner or later. 

We weren't thrilled when Russia put missiles in Cuba. Now imagine an Islamic country doing it in Canada, Mexico, Jamaica, Cayman Islands, etc. 

http://www.qwmagazine.com/2011/12/13/image-us-military-bases-around-iran/

I don't think we would be thrilled with that either and we would certainly be on edge. 
wallstreetcappers PM wallstreetcappers
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Posted: 9/15/2012 12:28:52 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Rush51:



Curling up into a ball in the fetal position is not a foreign policy. 

This is the area where you libertarians lose me..



Yup..

He lost me there and about 50 other places too.

Isolationism is great until it isnt..then you are either so far behind the game that you lose it all, OR you come in so late that you lose 10000 times more money and lives had you been more globally responsible in the first place.

I dont like the WWI approach or the GWB approach, but I positively do not like looking the other way, especially with regards to the destruction of human rights..

Iran is a thug, NKorea the same..Iraq not at all..

So why did we go into Iraq again?
cashin PM cashin
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Posted: 9/15/2012 1:26:54 AM

For a few reasons, I think Romney would be much easier to suck into an Iran/Israel type military conflict. And I don't think we should have ever been militarlily messing with that part of the world on our own from the beginning. We should have started developing alternative energy sources long ago.

You hate to see human rights being violated as severely as we have from dictators in that part of the world, but I've never thought it was our duty/obligation as a country to protect them except thru providing help with alliances. Evil exists no matter what form it comes in & from - always has, always will.

rooster010 PM rooster010
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Posted: 9/15/2012 10:51:27 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Ktrain:


Why is worrying about our self defense and letting the rest of the world take care of itself considered "curling into a ball in the fetal position?"

Why do we always have to stick our noses into others business? Why do we always have to be the worlds police?

Did you ever think that maybe, just maybe, our imperialistic nature has brought this violence upon us? Dictating who runs other countries governments is going to piss some people off sooner or later. 

We weren't thrilled when Russia put missiles in Cuba. Now imagine an Islamic country doing it in Canada, Mexico, Jamaica, Cayman Islands, etc. 

http://www.qwmagazine.com/2011/12/13/image-us-military-bases-around-iran/

I don't think we would be thrilled with that either and we would certainly be on edge. 


because thats what the sheep hear on their t.v.
be easy PM be easy
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Posted: 9/15/2012 10:59:36 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by wallstreetcappers:


Yup..

He lost me there and about 50 other places too.

Isolationism is great until it isnt..then you are either so far behind the game that you lose it all, OR you come in so late that you lose 10000 times more money and lives had you been more globally responsible in the first place.

I dont like the WWI approach or the GWB approach, but I positively do not like looking the other way, especially with regards to the destruction of human rights..

Iran is a thug, NKorea the same..Iraq not at all..

So why did we go into Iraq again?


oh the irony, coming from a guy that supports imprisoning US citizens for ingesting plant matter
wallstreetcappers PM wallstreetcappers
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Posted: 9/15/2012 11:20:52 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by be easy:



oh the irony, coming from a guy that supports imprisoning US citizens for ingesting plant matter

I love your blase explanation. I'm having a similar discussion with a friend of mine who you would probably really get along with..lots of rationalization, lots of diversion and tangent-izing..

be easy PM be easy
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Posted: 9/15/2012 11:53:04 AM
SO you don't like looking the other way, especially with regards to human rights

does that only apply to foreigners?

Or do you not see imprisoning Americans for consuming plant matter a violation of human rights?
Stiln PM Stiln
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Posted: 9/15/2012 12:52:29 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Nut_Flopper:



The mindset that Ron Paul is an isolationist or wants to "curl up into a ball" is a fallacy.

What business do we have manipulating governments, setting up military shops in various countries etc. other than just that, business. Reverse the situation what if Russia or China tried doing to us what we do throughout the world?

Paul is for a strong defense not an offense. Its simplistic but we mind our own business and God help you if you darn with us.


We don't have any business manipulating governments... no ones saying... But do we have a responsibility to protect other sovereign nations populaces if they their governments cannot protect their own citizens. It's a doctrine but we're not trying to do to China what we are doing in the middle east so that's a poor analogy with no substantive value..

Nonetheless whats the point of spending all this money on defense if we have no watch over what other nations are doing in the international community. Are you saying we need to pull our embassies out of these nations in the middle east.

Furthermore with your viewpoint I hope you would also strongly support removing virtually any kind of aid to Israel and Egypt.  But some people start to go ape garbage when the discussion shifts to removing aid from Israel so what are we going to do about that??
wallstreetcappers PM wallstreetcappers
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Posted: 9/15/2012 3:04:28 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by be easy:

SO you don't like looking the other way, especially with regards to human rights

does that only apply to foreigners?

Or do you not see imprisoning Americans for consuming plant matter a violation of human rights?

Well as you know I've never been into the connect the dots game..because as we have gone over a zillion times, you can rationalize or connect ANY viewpoint or approach, it really is a waste of time trying to rationalize one thing off the back of another.

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