Messages

Forum Index : Covers Mixed Martial Arts : Messages Page 2 of 3  1 2 3  
Author: [Mixed Martial Arts] Topic: What kind of sick human beings are preventing the Edgar line from climbing?
kjrpat send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: 5Dimes |
kjrpat
Participation Meter
Veteran
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1766
Location:
#26
Posted: 2/18/2012 1:45:09 PM
My question is:

Who is judging this fight? Japanese judges?

Who judged the penn edgar fight in dubai?

Japanese judges wont side with the fighter who gets most takedown and lays on top.. Theyll side with the fighter who gets back up to his feet and goes after it.. ie: Gilbert Melendez v Ishida

Depends whos judging.. Anyone know the answer?
quote
gsprush send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: bet365 |
gsprush
Participation Meter
Veteran
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 2027
Location: Ontario
#27
Posted: 2/18/2012 2:09:58 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by kjrpat:

My question is:

Who is judging this fight? Japanese judges?

Who judged the penn edgar fight in dubai?

Japanese judges wont side with the fighter who gets most takedown and lays on top.. Theyll side with the fighter who gets back up to his feet and goes after it.. ie: Gilbert Melendez v Ishida

Depends whos judging.. Anyone know the answer?


Mark Ratner of the UFC will select the judges, just like the UFC does anytime it goes abroad.
quote
kjrpat send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: 5Dimes |
kjrpat
Participation Meter
Veteran
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1766
Location:
#28
Posted: 2/18/2012 2:17:40 PM
Select them from where though? The country where the fight is taking place?
quote
gsprush send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: bet365 |
gsprush
Participation Meter
Veteran
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 2027
Location: Ontario
#29
Posted: 2/18/2012 3:38:49 PM
No, from the US. Expect the usual suspects. D'amato, Trowbridge, Blatnick, Morse-Jarmon, Hamilton, etc.
quote
remember1118 send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook |
remember1118
Participation Meter
Prospect
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 32
Location:
#30
Posted: 2/18/2012 7:10:11 PM
I just hope there is a clearcut winner. Sick of seeing divisions tied up due to rematches over draws/controversies and injuries.
quote
ctm1985 send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: 5Dimes |
ctm1985
Participation Meter
Veteran
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1674
Location: Canada
#31
Posted: 2/19/2012 5:40:56 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by remember1118:

I just hope there is a clearcut winner. Sick of seeing divisions tied up due to rematches over draws/controversies and injuries.


I saw someone saying he was going to throw down $ on each guy to win by split/majority decision.  If I was torn on the fight that's what I'd do, not a bad idea considering how good both fighters' cardio is and how close it may be. 

But for the record I love Edgar in this fight   I see his line is back up to -130 overnight, I would be surprised if it goes higher though.
quote
kjrpat send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: 5Dimes |
kjrpat
Participation Meter
Veteran
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1766
Location:
#32
Posted: 2/19/2012 6:30:47 PM
I think Henderson could hurt Edgar

I dont think Edgar could hurt Henderson

I think that people now people Edgar has the ko power to stop Henderon after what he did to Maynard.

However, Maynard got tired, lowered his hands, became demoralized after Frankie bounced back, and was only a matter of time before his demise.

It's these opinions that I'm grappling with before I place my wager
quote
LONG-TU send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook |
LONG-TU
Participation Meter
Captain
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 5091
Location: United States
#33
Posted: 2/19/2012 11:30:39 PM
Well you guys  have good arguments for both sides   My money already on Mr. Smooth so lets get it on
quote
I-love-to-win send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook |
I-love-to-win
Participation Meter
Prospect
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 194
Location: Heard and
              McDonald Islands
#34
Posted: 2/20/2012 5:17:11 AM
The only sure thing is that the fight will go the distance.

Can't see a finish here.
quote
frank the tank send a private message View Space | Blog | Friends | Playbook |
frank the tank
Participation Meter
Captain
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 5755
Location:
#35
Posted: 2/20/2012 3:01:32 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by gsprush:

A pick'em -110/-110 each way line is insane. I can perhaps understand not wanting to bet Edgar, but I can't imagine anybody putting considerable money on Henderson at a minus or slightly + line.

Henderson was sloppy at times against Guida, got outboxed for 10 minutes against Varner until Varner unceremoniously ran into a guillotine when there was no reason for him to pursue a takedown, and didn't even beat Pettis, who he probably should've been able to, given Pettis didn't exactly light the world on fire against Jeremy Stephens.

Henderson has also been dropped many times and if he can't catch Edgar with a choke in a scramble, I don't see any avenue for him to win.  

Edgar -110 all day, in what will probably end up being my biggest bet of all of 2012.


Ben Henderson has looked very good since his move to the UFC. I think his domination over Jim Miller opened up a lot of eyes. I see this fight as a pk em and I'm leaning towards taking Henderson
quote
The_HOFF send a private message View Space | Blog | Friends | Playbook |
The_HOFF
Participation Meter
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1132
Location: United States
#36
Posted: 2/20/2012 11:29:57 PM
Henderson has more of an all around game than a lot of Frankie's previous opponents. I think a lot of his opponents had a terrible game plan and came in thinking they could out box Edgar. I personally thought Penn won the first fight with Frankie. But Penn clearly thought he could beat Edgar without changing anything the second fight. Henderson will not try and out box Edgar for 5 rounds. Like others have said, I think he can use his size to pin Edgar on the cage and take the fight where he wants it. 
quote
deserted send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: Pinnacle Sports |
deserted
Participation Meter
Rookie
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 684
Location: Saskatchewan
#37
Posted: 2/21/2012 3:28:59 AM
I agree with almost everything HOFF says, I do think frankie has better cardio, but henderson paces him self very well and never spends any extra engery (ever since his loss to pettis). 
quote
jonnyg4508 send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook |
jonnyg4508
Participation Meter
Rookie
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 510
Location:
#38
Posted: 2/21/2012 8:50:03 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by The_HOFF:

Henderson has more of an all around game than a lot of Frankie's previous opponents. I think a lot of his opponents had a terrible game plan and came in thinking they could out box Edgar. I personally thought Penn won the first fight with Frankie. But Penn clearly thought he could beat Edgar without changing anything the second fight. Henderson will not try and out box Edgar for 5 rounds. Like others have said, I think he can use his size to pin Edgar on the cage and take the fight where he wants it. 


I think he is well-rounded.

But I don't think he beats Edgar in any one area.

His wrestling is good, but no better than Maynard's...no better than Frankie's for that matter.

His BJJ is good.  But no better than Frankie's.

His striking is alright.  I see nothing special with it.  He throws some good kicks.  His hands are way behind Frankie's along with any sort of movement or footwork.

His cardio is good, but most likely not as good as Frankie's. 

He is bigger than Frankie.  Yet everyone is. 

He is very well-rounded.  But being well-rounded doesn't beat champs like Frankie.  Who does most everything as good or better than Bendo.
quote
Gimmmethatjuice send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook |
Gimmmethatjuice
Participation Meter
Prospect
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 127
Location:
#39
Posted: 2/21/2012 6:13:56 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by sharpstick:



*I won't "right" off BJ Penn.... but let's be honest he is 3-4-1 in his last 8 fights.  A win over BJ isn't worth what it used to be.  I mean is outstriking Nick Diaz for one round an excellent accomplishment?  If I recall it wasn't a 1 round fight, and Condit apparently just outstruck him for 4 of 5 rounds.

*To display this awesome recovery he had to get hit.  He got hit from a very rudimentary boxer on numerous occasions.    When making an argument FOR Edgar, you probably don't want to hear yourself say "well he got rocked NUMEROUS times by Maynard, but he did recover."

*Bendo offers much more than size.  But in all reality the size will likely be a big part of this fight.  He is stronger, and more athletic as well.  Skill set wise, the only real advantage in this fight is Edgar's hand speed.  Every other technical skill is extremely close.

I don't need to come on here and give a detailed breakdown to convince you.  I could honestly really care less who you bet.  But I can tell you from experience, the line is set this way so Bendo doesn't destroy the books when he wins.  However, if you're in Vegas I invite you to come take plus money on Edgar when we put our line up.  

*The emoticons are put on by covers to enhance the experience of posting and reading.  I am well aware it doesn't change the content of my typing.

Sharp I love your MWC analysis but saying your book is gonna have Henderson the fav when the line comes up is a little silly and would be willing to make a side bet that that definitely won't be the case.  But by all means please tell me the book you work at cuz I would loooove + money on Edgar in this fight. In all actually the value in this fight is on Edgar because the line is so low ( I know I know its that low for "a reason") but its more likely a no play as you can make a great argument for both fighters and when thats the case just sit back and enjoy it and use the fight as research for future plays involving these fighters.  Also you discredit the wins over Penn but those fights vs Edgar are what sent Penn into his current tailspin. It wasn't like he had lost 3 of 4 going into those fights. Had lost once in three years going in (to St Pierre) and while the first contest was a toss up he was dominated in the second, and with the loss Edgar took away his drive and motivation as well. 

  Henderson is definitely stronger and will do his best to impose his will but Henderson is much stronger than Pettis as well and even without the kick Pettis won that fight 3 rounds to 2 as he outstruck Bendo by a large margin in the 5th round.  I think Henderson will be the champ at some stage in his career but not this Saturday.  His striking needs to improve and in a  championship fight you need to dominate the champ to take the belt and those close rounds are more than likely gonna go to the champ.  Sure Benson could come out and throw Frankie around the cage and finish him with a rear naked choke but to say that he is the "clear" bet and +105 is outright ridiculous and just a bad investment.  

Oh and there is no reason for your book to open Henderson as the favorite anyways as all the drunk idiots that walk up and wanna bet the UFC fight that night and have no idea what they are doing are gonna say "hey isn't Edgar the champ??" And after you're done explaining to them what -130 means, they will bet Edgar and they will surely do the same exact thing if they are getting Edgar at +105 or +110 as you claim it will open at.  So again opening Hendo as the fav would make zero sense, yes you're gonna get "so called sharp" money on Henderson from guys who buy too much into his recent success vs guys that Edgar has already beat and beat in a much more impressive fashion mind you or that just are still not sold on Frankie and are going to stubbornly bet against him again.  GL with your play though as I will not be wagering on it at this line unless I can get + money on Edgar which apparently if I wait long enough according to you I will.  Should be a great fight and again love your MWC plays and analysis.
quote
Gimmmethatjuice send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook |
Gimmmethatjuice
Participation Meter
Prospect
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 127
Location:
#40
Posted: 2/21/2012 6:35:03 PM
Oh and for those of you who can lock it in now, Belfort over Wanderlei in June is as easy as it gets.  The line now is -270 and will surely be -400 by fight time.  This is definitely the last time we will all have the opportunity to fade Wanderlei.  The UFC did a great thing giving him his swan song putting him as a coach on the first season of "The Ultimate Fighter Brazil" but matching him up with Vitor will definitely lead to this being his final match in the UFC.  I look for Vitor to best his previous knockout time (44 seconds into the first round) the last time they fought.  Yes it was 14 years ago but that was back when Silva could take a punch and pretty sure this Silva doesn't have that front kick in his arsenal so I really see no way "The Phenem" loses this fight!!
quote
sawman send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook |
sawman
Participation Meter
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3928
Location: Alberta
#41
Posted: 2/21/2012 8:09:48 PM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by Gimmmethatjuice:

Oh and for those of you who can lock it in now, Belfort over Wanderlei in June is as easy as it gets.  The line now is -270 and will surely be -400 by fight time.  This is definitely the last time we will all have the opportunity to fade Wanderlei.  The UFC did a great thing giving him his swan song putting him as a coach on the first season of "The Ultimate Fighter Brazil" but matching him up with Vitor will definitely lead to this being his final match in the UFC.  I look for Vitor to best his previous knockout time (44 seconds into the first round) the last time they fought.  Yes it was 14 years ago but that was back when Silva could take a punch and pretty sure this Silva doesn't have that front kick in his arsenal so I really see no way "The Phenem" loses this fight!!

with ya 100%, bro

quote
sharpstick send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: M Resort |
sharpstick
Participation Meter
Captain
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 8111
Location: Nevada
#42
Posted: 2/22/2012 9:00:53 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Gimmmethatjuice:


Sharp I love your MWC analysis but saying your book is gonna have Henderson the fav when the line comes up is a little silly and would be willing to make a side bet that that definitely won't be the case.  But by all means please tell me the book you work at cuz I would loooove + money on Edgar in this fight. In all actually the value in this fight is on Edgar because the line is so low ( I know I know its that low for "a reason") but its more likely a no play as you can make a great argument for both fighters and when thats the case just sit back and enjoy it and use the fight as research for future plays involving these fighters.  Also you discredit the wins over Penn but those fights vs Edgar are what sent Penn into his current tailspin. It wasn't like he had lost 3 of 4 going into those fights. Had lost once in three years going in (to St Pierre) and while the first contest was a toss up he was dominated in the second, and with the loss Edgar took away his drive and motivation as well. 

  Henderson is definitely stronger and will do his best to impose his will but Henderson is much stronger than Pettis as well and even without the kick Pettis won that fight 3 rounds to 2 as he outstruck Bendo by a large margin in the 5th round.  I think Henderson will be the champ at some stage in his career but not this Saturday.  His striking needs to improve and in a  championship fight you need to dominate the champ to take the belt and those close rounds are more than likely gonna go to the champ.  Sure Benson could come out and throw Frankie around the cage and finish him with a rear naked choke but to say that he is the "clear" bet and +105 is outright ridiculous and just a bad investment.  

Oh and there is no reason for your book to open Henderson as the favorite anyways as all the drunk idiots that walk up and wanna bet the UFC fight that night and have no idea what they are doing are gonna say "hey isn't Edgar the champ??" And after you're done explaining to them what -130 means, they will bet Edgar and they will surely do the same exact thing if they are getting Edgar at +105 or +110 as you claim it will open at.  So again opening Hendo as the fav would make zero sense, yes you're gonna get "so called sharp" money on Henderson from guys who buy too much into his recent success vs guys that Edgar has already beat and beat in a much more impressive fashion mind you or that just are still not sold on Frankie and are going to stubbornly bet against him again.  GL with your play though as I will not be wagering on it at this line unless I can get + money on Edgar which apparently if I wait long enough according to you I will.  Should be a great fight and again love your MWC plays and analysis.

Not concerned about the small parlay bettors who will bet Edgar regardless.

Concerned about the scalpers and big money players.  At worst case scenario I will get a large amount of scalpers playing the +105 on Edgar, while they play Henderson at +120 or whatever elsewhere.  Sometimes you have to take a stand in Vegas to make some money.... and this is my stand.

I mean you can make whatever side bet you want?  What is the max you'll take.... I mean I am in charge of what it opens at.  
quote
Qncyk1 send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook |
Qncyk1
Participation Meter
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1058
Location: Mexico
#43
Posted: 2/22/2012 9:56:24 AM
QUOTE

hi sharpstick,

i know styles make fights but i dont see how you arrived at frankie +105.

in the third maynard fight, edgar was a -150. before grey was ko'd, i think he would have been an even money play at worst against bendo.

i'll bet you a friendly unit that edgar does not go off at +105 at five dimes.

fwiw, i am not going to make a play on this fight as there better bets in both boxing and mma saturday.

my business accepts credit cards as im sure that yours does as well.

 

Originally Posted by sharpstick:


Not concerned about the small parlay bettors who will bet Edgar regardless.

Concerned about the scalpers and big money players.  At worst case scenario I will get a large amount of scalpers playing the +105 on Edgar, while they play Henderson at +120 or whatever elsewhere.  Sometimes you have to take a stand in Vegas to make some money.... and this is my stand.

I mean you can make whatever side bet you want?  What is the max you'll take.... I mean I am in charge of what it opens at.  
quote
sharpstick send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: M Resort |
sharpstick
Participation Meter
Captain
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 8111
Location: Nevada
#44
Posted: 2/22/2012 11:31:12 AM
I don't think it will go off at +105 on 5 dimes either.  

If you'd like to change the wager to he will be +105 at a book in Vegas, I'll take any amount you could possibly imagine as your action.


quote
Qncyk1 send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook |
Qncyk1
Participation Meter
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1058
Location: Mexico
#45
Posted: 2/22/2012 11:48:11 AM

im not in vegas and if i remember correctly there is a law prohibiting casinos on publishing lines.

i am stuck with www.caliente.com.mx and another casino here in mexico. no props, no parlays, no nothing. that and i have to pay an additional 2-4 percent juice.

sucks.

if you change your mind on the 5dimes bet let me know.

good luck with bendo and it should be a great fight.

quote
sharpstick send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: M Resort |
sharpstick
Participation Meter
Captain
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 8111
Location: Nevada
#46
Posted: 2/22/2012 12:03:22 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Qncyk1:

im not in vegas and if i remember correctly there is a law prohibiting casinos on publishing lines.

i am stuck with www.caliente.com.mx and another casino here in mexico. no props, no parlays, no nothing. that and i have to pay an additional 2-4 percent juice.

sucks.

if you change your mind on the 5dimes bet let me know.

good luck with bendo and it should be a great fight.


It will be a fun fight.  
quote
stats1 send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: 5Dimes |
stats1
Participation Meter
Captain
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 6627
Location: Georgia
#47
Posted: 2/23/2012 12:28:31 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by gsprush:

A pick'em -110/-110 each way line is insane. I can perhaps understand not wanting to bet Edgar, but I can't imagine anybody putting considerable money on Henderson at a minus or slightly + line.

Henderson was sloppy at times against Guida, got outboxed for 10 minutes against Varner until Varner unceremoniously ran into a guillotine when there was no reason for him to pursue a takedown, and didn't even beat Pettis, who he probably should've been able to, given Pettis didn't exactly light the world on fire against Jeremy Stephens.

Henderson has also been dropped many times and if he can't catch Edgar with a choke in a scramble, I don't see any avenue for him to win.  

Edgar -110 all day, in what will probably end up being my biggest bet of all of 2012.
with your write up i am thinking they might cancel the fight and save henderson his beating!!!
quote
tmurda666
RSI Wagerline RSI Rating
send a private message View Space | Blog | Friends | Playbook |
tmurda666
Participation Meter
Rookie
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 977
Location: New York
#48
Posted: 2/23/2012 2:28:12 PM
takanori gomi, joe lauzon, yushin okami, jake shields, chech kongo, rampage, bendo...
quote
MoneyShot send a private message View Space | Blog | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: Pinnacle Sports |
MoneyShot
Participation Meter
MVP
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 17324
Location: Canada
#49
Posted: 2/24/2012 3:48:54 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by sharpstick:


Not concerned about the small parlay bettors who will bet Edgar regardless.

Concerned about the scalpers and big money players.  At worst case scenario I will get a large amount of scalpers playing the +105 on Edgar, while they play Henderson at +120 or whatever elsewhere.  Sometimes you have to take a stand in Vegas to make some money.... and this is my stand.

I mean you can make whatever side bet you want?  What is the max you'll take.... I mean I am in charge of what it opens at.  

hey sharp, what book are you working at ?  Just curious...

quote
ctm1985 send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: 5Dimes |
ctm1985
Participation Meter
Veteran
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1674
Location: Canada
#50
Posted: 2/25/2012 12:05:43 AM
Holy garbage, Frankie up between -145 and -155 on all the books.  Has this been rising all day?? 

And Sharpstick, did you open Frankie as the dog?
quote
Forum Index : Covers Mixed Martial Arts : Messages Page 2 of 3  1 2 3  
You have entered the forum as a GUEST. 
You must login/register to post or reply.