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Author: [Mixed Martial Arts] Topic: Rashad Evans vs. Jon Jones
keven vanlith
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#26
Posted: 3/23/2012 6:32:42 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by jwub91781:

Evans is going to get his behind demolished,just like everyone else that jones faces,while your fools,sit here and try to convince each other that evans has a chance in this fight,ill be laying my money on a proven young champion,no disrespect to those who like underdogs and all but to bet on Rashad Evans to beat John Jones is a stupid behind bet... The kid has finished his last three opp in spectacular fashion,

You might be somewhat right, about the stupid behind bet comment if this line was close to even, but at around +400, thats value for a guy who should win around 35% of  the time, according to most respected ufc handicappers as an aggregate on many posting boards out there.
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#27
Posted: 3/23/2012 8:23:36 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by ossigor:

I completely agree with the original point of this thread... and it seems like when Rashad and Jones have sparred together, neither one really dominated.

Jones is a great fighter, and he'll probably win but this line is absurd. I expect this to be an engaging fight both ways.. I love Rashad at anything over +400.


practice?....PRACTICE?.....we talkin' bout Practice?

Also that was when Evans was an established MMA fighter and Jones was what?  21-22 year old boy?  I would expect Evans to tool him at that stage....not hang with him...

I would love nothing more than Jones to get a wake up call and lose...while betting on Evans at +400 and making money off it also.  But that is pretty much a pipe dream for me.  I will sit back, root for Rashad, and not lose money.
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keven vanlith
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#28
Posted: 3/23/2012 9:13:06 PM
[Quote: Originally Posted by jonnyg4508]

practice?....PRACTICE?.....we talkin' bout Practice?

Also that was when Evans was an established MMA fighter and Jones was what?  21-22 year old boy?  I would expect Evans to tool him at that stage....not hang with him...

I would love nothing more than Jones to get a wake up call and lose...while betting on Evans at +400 and making money off it also.  But that is pretty much a pipe dream for me.  I will sit back, root for Rashad, and not lose money.
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No your right it will be tough for RE, but i think this will be Jones toughest challenge.

Its not like the 5-20K i will be hitting JDS and Sonnen with, but there is too much here not to lay a small wager, that will not hurt too much if bones wins and also cover my butt from being very sick, if i do what your doing, sitting on the sideline and watch RE pull off the upset and me just watching and not cashing.
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#29
Posted: 3/23/2012 9:42:07 PM
Thing about Rashad is yes he has looked pretty good.

But he fought a GREEN Phil Davis....that was still impressive.

But beating Tito Ortiz at this stage in any fashion...and out wrestling an injured Thiago Silva who isn't even really top 10 LHW anyway doesn't get me that excited. 

I do expect Rashad be his toughest test in the wrestling department at 205lbs.  He has a strong base, low center of gravity, and is athletic.  But I don't expect Rashad to be able to beat Jones even if he managed to slow Jones' trips and tosses down.  Rashad's striking gets overrated in my opinion.  Seems like what people remember most is Liddell fight and Forrest title win.  Yet those were basically the last times he looked good striking.  Actually he was losing to Forrest in the striking if I remember right. 

Jones' should be superior physically, and both in wrestling/grappling and standing.

I hope it is a good fight though, because that card looks pretty lackluster the rest of the way through it.
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#30
Posted: 3/24/2012 12:11:46 PM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by jonnyg4508:



practice?....PRACTICE?.....we talkin' bout Practice?

Also that was when Evans was an established MMA fighter and Jones was what?  21-22 year old boy?  I would expect Evans to tool him at that stage....not hang with him...

I would love nothing more than Jones to get a wake up call and lose...while betting on Evans at +400 and making money off it also.  But that is pretty much a pipe dream for me.  I will sit back, root for Rashad, and not lose money.

rashad was training with jones just last year in 2011 before starting the blackzillians. and its no secret that he and the majority of others had a falling out with american top team to start blackzillians. i would think that this fight is going to be their redemption for any ill-will against greg jackson

alos, rashad is now training with overeem.

there are much better bets out there right now and in the future than laying a monster -500(+) on jon jones.

 

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#31
Posted: 3/24/2012 5:02:15 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by Qncyk1:

rashad was training with jones just last year in 2011 before starting the blackzillians. and its no secret that he and the majority of others had a falling out with american top team to start blackzillians. i would think that this fight is going to be their redemption for any ill-will against greg jackson

alos, rashad is now training with overeem.

there are much better bets out there right now and in the future than laying a monster -500(+) on jon jones

You are correct it was only last year.  But do you realize how much better Jones gets each fight?  He now has more championship experience than Rashad has ever had.  He is still only 24 or 25.

Also who said they were even in sparring? Did Rashad?  If so, I wouldn't take that to heart.

Rashad is no where near the striker of Machida, Shogun, or Page....and Jones cruised by them all.  Well Machida did do well in that first round...But he didn't KTFO of Bones like he did to Rashad.

I won't be laying -500 on anyone straight.  But I will gladly throw him in a parlay or 2.  All I am saying is I won't waste my money betting Rashad.  Jon Jones is on a whole different level. 

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#32
Posted: 3/24/2012 5:09:44 PM

People...many of the same people have said this same sort of thing in the Shogun fight, Machida, and Page fights....and each time Jones didn't win...he completely destroyed his opponent who was supposed to have "value". 

I don't see where Evans can match him?  Tito Ortiz took Evans down.  Evans, although vastly overrated...his hands aren't that great.  His power is pretty overrated.  He hardly has any standing finishes in his career.  Or finishes that came from dropping someone.  Sean Salmon? A crusty Liddell that everyone was dropping?  He took a crusty old Tito out with a knee to the stomach.  And he always seem to get clipped each fight standing....although not finishes...he was clipped by Rapmage, clipped by Thiago, caught pretty decent by Tito Ortiz.  And we all know what Machida did to him.

When you add in the fact that Jones gets better each time out.  Has reach on him like a MFer, is much bigger.

I just see no where Rashad is better.  Not 1 single area.  If I see not 1 single advantage for a guy...there is no way I can bet him.

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#33
Posted: 3/27/2012 6:13:59 PM

Value is used too much around here. Obviously laying -500 with Jones isnt great, but I dont think +430 is "value" either. These lines are begging for you to take a stab at the dog as they know full well Jones is gonna be the last leg of some parlays. IMO, Evans would have to be +650 for me to consider putting money on him.

 

bol

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#34
Posted: 4/3/2012 6:36:43 PM
suga...
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#35
Posted: 4/6/2012 2:26:33 AM
There is no such thing as VALUE when you lose $.  Everyone has ever wagered against Jon Jones has...LOST $ (with the exception of the Hammil DQ).  There are some things you just dont do in the gambling fight game:

-Bet against Floyd Mayweather
-Bet against GSP
-Bet on Bernard Hopkins to KO someone
-Bet against Jon Jones

Look elsewhere for your value.  Jones is too damn big and too damn well rounded.  He has infinite paths to victory in his fights and wont lose until he moves up to heavyweight.
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#36
Posted: 4/6/2012 7:20:13 AM
I have to agree with rzagza here.    I did make the mistake of betting against GSP, Anderson Silva and Jon Jones--once each.  Never again.

Mayweather is also a relevant example.  He is the prototypical fighter who's such a prick that people love to bet against him.  I'll root against him in every fight, but there aren't odds that would convince me I'm getting value betting against him.

The line on Jones is pretty high for MMA, I admit.  I like the bet against the fight going the distance better.  Most likely, Jones will dismantle Evans like he has everyone else.  Maybe Rashad sneaks in one perfect strike or, more likely, catches Jon leaving his long arm exposed for an arm bar.  The only way I see this fight going 5 rounds is if they dance around and never engage, and I believe that they genuinely hate each other too much to let that happen.

Anyway, LONG-TU, thanks for the thread.  Bets are always more interesting when you know who's on the other side.

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#37
Posted: 4/7/2012 11:24:43 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by McDoc:

I have to agree with rzagza here.    I did make the mistake of betting against GSP, Anderson Silva and Jon Jones--once each.  Never again.

Mayweather is also a relevant example.  He is the prototypical fighter who's such a prick that people love to bet against him.  I'll root against him in every fight, but there aren't odds that would convince me I'm getting value betting against him.

The line on Jones is pretty high for MMA, I admit.  I like the bet against the fight going the distance better.  Most likely, Jones will dismantle Evans like he has everyone else.  Maybe Rashad sneaks in one perfect strike or, more likely, catches Jon leaving his long arm exposed for an arm bar.  The only way I see this fight going 5 rounds is if they dance around and never engage, and I believe that they genuinely hate each other too much to let that happen.

Anyway, LONG-TU, thanks for the thread.  Bets are always more interesting when you know who's on the other side.

  Thanks bro  . Anyway you know rzagza bets  all large favs right ?
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#38
Posted: 4/8/2012 9:51:25 PM
JON JONES FOR THE KO OR TAP OUT i love how everyone talks crap about bones jones but he keeps knocken them out and chockin them out just like lyoto got put to sleep like a little baby the play is obviousley bones jones or no play att all
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#39
Posted: 4/8/2012 9:52:15 PM
oh yeah and as far as rashad going punch for punch which is the kind of fighter he is Jones has like a full foot on him
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#40
Posted: 4/8/2012 9:56:07 PM
hold on one more but i think a smal bet of $50 or $100 on rashad would make the fight very fun to watch
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#41
Posted: 4/12/2012 8:19:43 AM
I met Bones Jones in the airport about 7 months ago and we sat and talked before his flight for about 20 minutes. I asked him about a lot. He told me without doubt he would "smash" Cain if he moved up to heavyweight. Months later watching Cain lose to Dos Santos revealed Bones probably would have.

But when I asked him about Rashad. He said he "didn't know" and he said it would "be tough". I asked him if it was true about what Rashad said about them to training together. He said they definitely both "got the best of each other training".

One thing I did notice about Bones is mentally he is young but very determined. I can tell he doesn't like losing and doesn't want to lose and that's just scary. Bones did seem really hesitant when I was asked him about Rashad. I'm a Sugar Rashad fan and a Bones Jones fan btw. No Bias.
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#42
Posted: 4/12/2012 11:06:20 AM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by 007DetroitKing:

I met Bones Jones in the airport about 7 months ago and we sat and talked before his flight for about 20 minutes. I asked him about a lot. He told me without doubt he would "smash" Cain if he moved up to heavyweight. Months later watching Cain lose to Dos Santos revealed Bones probably would have.

But when I asked him about Rashad. He said he "didn't know" and he said it would "be tough". I asked him if it was true about what Rashad said about them to training together. He said they definitely both "got the best of each other training".

One thing I did notice about Bones is mentally he is young but very determined. I can tell he doesn't like losing and doesn't want to lose and that's just scary. Bones did seem really hesitant when I was asked him about Rashad. I'm a Sugar Rashad fan and a Bones Jones fan btw. No Bias.

good stuff DetroitKing

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#43
Posted: 4/12/2012 1:12:44 PM
Not hating this is just how it goes and I have become used to it.

People claim a guy has a chance vs. GSP, Bones, or Silva.  They claim value.

Other people say, I wouldn't bet against GSP, Silva, or Bones.  They are just too good for their division.  Just sit this one out.

GSP, Silva, Bones win for like the combined 35th time in a row.  The others say I told you so.  The people who bet against them say well it was just a stab in ths dark.  I wasn't going to lay -500 on an MMA fight.

Next fight the whole process happens again. 

Jones isn't going to lose and +400 on Rashad isn't enough for me to see if something flukey happens.
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#44
Posted: 4/12/2012 4:35:27 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by jonnyg4508:

I can't knock you that much for taking that line on a top level fighter.

But people have lost pretty much 100% of the time trying to take a GSP/Anderson opponent and thinking they have value.  Jon Jones is pretty much at or close to that level in my opinion.  And is still getting better each time out.    Those big lines are warranted in my eyes.

Agreed.  Theres certain fighter that you just dont bet against.  Then again, Fedor used to be on that list so who knows.  I will be staying away and enjoying this one.
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#45
Posted: 4/12/2012 8:46:20 PM
Yea, Fedor was on that list.  Then after Pride he fought cans.  Pretty easy to stay on that list when you are fighting bums.

Fedor would have won the man paying juice money on like 20 straight fights.  I'm sure a final loss wouldn't of been a big deal.  All fighters lose at some point.  But not 25 year old Jon Jones who are monsters at their division.

Fedor was old and small for the division.  I wouldn't put him in the same league as GSP/Anderson or Jones now.  Fedor was great in Pride and then fought cans.  Then returned against legit, huge, HWs....and lost.  Fedor lovers may have not seen it coming.  But Fedor haters did. 

Even so, the million times you pay juice and win made those guys a bunch more money than the 1 or 2 losses they took.
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#46
Posted: 4/12/2012 8:49:56 PM
I just see no advantages for Evans.  Perhaps experience.  But not by that much.  Jones has fought a lot lately and already has 3 championship fights under his belt.  More than Evans' 2.  So experience to me isn't a factor. 

Can't bet on a guy who has ZERO advantages.  He has a quicker traditional shot I guess.  Doesn't really matter when that isn't Jones' game.  He isn't a traditional wrestler. 
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#47
Posted: 4/21/2012 7:17:56 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by LONG-TU:

Locking in Evans + 430    2 units 

We can discuss all day who is a better fighter but this line is ridiculously retarded 

The only chance Evans has to win this fight is if Jon Jones bet on Evans plus the 430.

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#48
Posted: 4/21/2012 9:31:33 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by walbanger:

The only chance Evans has to win this fight is if Jon Jones bet on Evans plus the 430.

)     Put your whole bankroll on Jones if u so sure.
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#49
Posted: 4/21/2012 11:53:09 PM

Pending4/21/12 11:59pm  Props Fighting  1041 Jones wins by TKO/KO +115* vs Any other resul
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#50
Posted: 4/21/2012 11:53:39 PM
sorry bud against you
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