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Author: [Politics] Topic: George Zimmerman Case Discovery
lordspoint send a private message View Space | Friends | Playbook |
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#101
Posted: 5/21/2012 3:17:04 PM

one cannot assume that 18 inches would mean he could have disengaged.

while laying on your back you could push someone away from you a distance of 18 inches and shoot from a still vunerable position.

the distance does not equate to much unless it is shown they were many feet apart when the shot was fired

 

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#102
Posted: 5/21/2012 3:29:10 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by lordspoint:

one cannot assume that 18 inches would mean he could have disengaged.

while laying on your back you could push someone away from you a distance of 18 inches and shoot from a still vunerable position.

the distance does not equate to much unless it is shown they were many feet apart when the shot was fired

 

One cannot assume anything in this case. Every little piece of evidence must be examined in light of the statements and other evidence.

The greater the distance between Z and M at the time of the fatal shooting, however, does create some skepticism as to his version of events.

With that being said, there are also plausible scenarios where one could have a gun planted on another person and still have the ability to disengage.

I am not suggesting either, but rather pointing out that the spaciousness between the two is a major factor that will be considered and argued.

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#103
Posted: 5/21/2012 3:39:20 PM

New videos shows Trayvon participating in local fight club.....

 

http://patdollard.com/2012/05/new-video-showstrayvon-martin-participating-in-local-fight-club/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

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#104
Posted: 5/21/2012 3:46:02 PM

I was commenting on the 18" remark dj......but yes I do agree everything should be examined and disected.

 That is a huge issue in this case. If the shot was fired from 18 inches away, that is clearly (and legally) enough room for Zimmerman to have disengaged.

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#105
Posted: 5/21/2012 3:58:42 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by rooster010:

good stuff dl36



Thanks... Marijuana is a such a complicated substance and there is so much ignorance about the topic (as seen on this site) that the amount of misinformation and just plain blatantly untrue lies that people insist on propagating is crazy... 

A more logical is what began me looking at Ron Paul as the best option for president...
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bowlslit send a private message View Space | Blog | Friends | Playbook | My Sportsbook: 5Dimes |
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#106
Posted: 5/21/2012 4:00:17 PM

Still, there is no evidence to suggest that Trayvonn disengaged at all until he was shot. Would be very difficult to prove and show.

Still find it very unlikely that the gun was out before the ground and pound. Based on likelihood of Trayvon jumping someone holding a gun on him combined with the likelihood of Zimmerman being dumb enough to pull a gun on him from a distance close enough to be jumped.

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#107
Posted: 5/21/2012 5:34:52 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by djbrow:

I've already read this. There have been other conclusions that the gun was 1-18 inches away. I am not convinced that her examination would be able to definitively make the conclusion that the gun was touching because the same wound, burns, and residue would occur at a distance of give or take 18 inches.

In other words, she made be right about the gun touching, and there is room for error in this conclusion as well.



Wait, wait, wait.

You mean to tell me that the person who carried on endlessly about an autopsy report not being the same as ballistic tests is going to reference an autopsy report to suggest the shot came from further away?



GET OUT!!!!

From the Washington Post:

A lab report, based on an examination of the two sweatshirts Martin was wearing, found holes and gunshot residue consistent with a “contact shot,” meaning the gun was pressed against Martin’s chest. An autopsy report said that the gunshot wound indicated he was shot from an “intermediate range,” which experts say is between one and 18 inches away.

That is so funny dj.
I mean really. It is just too much...
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#108
Posted: 5/21/2012 5:36:46 PM
The range of the gunshot and the fact that Zimmerman's back was wet, and a witness puts Martin on top of Zimmerman, and Zimmerman's injuries, lead one to reasonably conclude that the shot was fired in self defense.

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#109
Posted: 5/21/2012 5:43:55 PM
Why are you so obsessed with this non-political topic?

It reminds me of this black woman I worked with once that talk about how she followed the OJ case very closely and paid attention to every little detail and weighed all of the evidence and it was obviously that OJ was innocent as she knew from the beginning...

I then asked her...  "If you knew it from the beginning, why even follow every little detail?"...  she responded... "Well I had to find the facts to prove for what I already knew was true"

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#110
Posted: 5/21/2012 6:51:16 PM
Bottom line is that Z shot and killed an innocent person who originally was no threat to him. His actions made this event what it was. That is why Z won't be able to claim self defense or "Stand your ground"
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#111
Posted: 5/21/2012 6:59:41 PM

[Quote: Originally Posted by 14daroad]

Wait, wait, wait.

You mean to tell me that the person who carried on endlessly about an autopsy report not being the same as ballistic tests is going to reference an autopsy report to suggest the shot came from further away?



GET OUT!!!!

From the Washington Post:

A lab report, based on an examination of the two sweatshirts Martin was wearing, found holes and gunshot residue consistent with a “contact shot,” meaning the gun was pressed against Martin’s chest. An autopsy report said that the gunshot wound indicated he was shot from an “intermediate range,” which experts say is between one and 18 inches away.

That is so funny dj.
I mean really. It is just too much...
[/Quote

Actually,  you are the one referencing the autopsy results. It is funny, though, that in post 80, you stated this wasn't a simple autopsy, yet the article you referenced referred to it as exactly that.

The error margin in autopsy results as compared to wound ballistics is greater. It doesn't mean the report you cited is wrong. The wound could have with the gun touching Martin, as stated. But it is by no means conclusive.

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#112
Posted: 5/21/2012 7:01:44 PM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by 14daroad:

The range of the gunshot and the fact that Zimmerman's back was wet, and a witness puts Martin on top of Zimmerman, and Zimmerman's injuries, lead one to reasonably conclude that the shot was fired in self defense.

Could be.

By the same token, it is also possible that Martin had ended the confrontation, realizing that Zimmerman had a weapon pointed at him, and that Zimmerman shot him anyway.

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#113
Posted: 5/21/2012 7:39:55 PM
Actually,  you are the one referencing the autopsy results. It is funny, though, that in post 80, you stated this wasn't a simple autopsy, yet the article you referenced referred to it as exactly that.

======================

The article said no such thing. I also addressed this point in post # 77 and provided a link to the discovery document in #78 which is the source of all of the information, autopsy & lab tests.

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#114
Posted: 5/21/2012 7:41:03 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by djbrow:

Could be.

By the same token, it is also possible that Martin had ended the confrontation, realizing that Zimmerman had a weapon pointed at him, and that Zimmerman shot him anyway.


Certainly possible. But unless there is a witness, I don't see how a jury could be persuaded on that. 
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#115
Posted: 5/21/2012 7:50:05 PM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by darkhorse12:

Bottom line is that Z shot and killed an innocent person who originally was no threat to him. His actions made this event what it was. That is why Z won't be able to claim self defense or "Stand your ground"

...but at some point did become a threat to him. Doesn't matter about the threat origanally.

Al Quaeda was no threat to us in 1923 but in 2001 they became a threat to us.

Do you see how retarded this point of view is?

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#116
Posted: 5/21/2012 8:04:08 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by 14daroad:

Actually,  you are the one referencing the autopsy results. It is funny, though, that in post 80, you stated this wasn't a simple autopsy, yet the article you referenced referred to it as exactly that.

======================

The article said no such thing. I also addressed this point in post # 77 and provided a link to the discovery document in #78 which is the source of all of the information, autopsy & lab tests.

From the article:

Autopsy report released

Trayvon's autopsy showed that he died of a shot to the heart and that the gun was so close, it had left gunpowder burns on his skin.

Florida Department of Law Enforcement firearms expert Amy Siewert examined Trayvon's gray sweat shirt and gray hoodie for powder burns and wrote that she found them on both garments, prompting her to conclude that the muzzle of the gun was touching them when Zimmerman pulled the trigger.

The Volusia County Medical Examiner's Office found just one other injury on Trayvon's body: a small "abrasion" on one finger of his left hand. It also found THC — the active chemical in marijuana — in Trayvon's blood and urine.

And they gave definitive word on his size: 5-feet-11, 158 pounds. Zimmerman's family has said Zimmerman was 5-feet-8 and about 190 pounds.

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#117
Posted: 5/21/2012 8:05:52 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by 14daroad:


Certainly possible. But unless there is a witness, I don't see how a jury could be persuaded on that. 

In a 50/50 scenario, maybe they could be.

In a proof beyond a reasonable doubt scenario, not a chance.

If this is the prosecutions theory, they better have some evidence to support this.

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#118
Posted: 5/21/2012 8:26:01 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by bowlslit:

...but at some point did become a threat to him. Doesn't matter about the threat origanally.

Al Quaeda was no threat to us in 1923 but in 2001 they became a threat to us.

Do you see how retarded this point of view is?

I stated 4 facts and you call it retarded. How about you rebut my post with facts.

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#119
Posted: 5/21/2012 9:25:59 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by djbrow:

From the article:

Autopsy report released

Trayvon's autopsy showed that he died of a shot to the heart and that the gun was so close, it had left gunpowder burns on his skin.

Florida Department of Law Enforcement firearms expert Amy Siewert examined Trayvon's gray sweat shirt and gray hoodie for powder burns and wrote that she found them on both garments, prompting her to conclude that the muzzle of the gun was touching them when Zimmerman pulled the trigger.

The Volusia County Medical Examiner's Office found just one other injury on Trayvon's body: a small "abrasion" on one finger of his left hand. It also found THC — the active chemical in marijuana — in Trayvon's blood and urine.

And they gave definitive word on his size: 5-feet-11, 158 pounds. Zimmerman's family has said Zimmerman was 5-feet-8 and about 190 pounds.



Where's all those people who lied about him being some 6'3 hulk?  5'11 and 158?  He couldn't hurt a fukkin fly.  Z had 30+ pounds on the kid.
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#120
Posted: 5/21/2012 9:33:24 PM
One thing for sure if the z-man gets off the hook, we won't have to worry about him fugging with any young teenagers again. The z-man took more shots to the face than a Colombian Prostitute!
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#121
Posted: 5/21/2012 10:05:16 PM
QUOTE Originally Posted by No_Contest:

One thing for sure if the z-man gets off the hook, we won't have to worry about him fugging with any young teenagers again. The z-man took more shots to the face than a Colombian Prostitute!
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#122
Posted: 5/22/2012 7:41:21 AM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by depeche2:



Where's all those people who lied about him being some 6'3 hulk?  5'11 and 158?  He couldn't hurt a fukkin fly.  Z had 30+ pounds on the kid.

weight difference has no bearing on fight.............if you can actually fight

 

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#123
Posted: 5/22/2012 8:56:57 AM
QUOTE

Originally Posted by depeche2:



Where's all those people who lied about him being some 6'3 hulk?  5'11 and 158?  He couldn't hurt a fukkin fly.  Z had 30+ pounds on the kid.

So you're saying a guy 30 lbs heavier than a teen-aged football player chased him down, right?

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#124
Posted: 5/22/2012 9:00:21 AM

By the way, this is odd/interesting from the Orlando Sentinal:

1917:20 - Shot fired; screams from Zimmerman cease

And the article says that came from the Standord PD

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#125
Posted: 5/22/2012 9:04:01 AM
QUOTE Originally Posted by djbrow:

In a 50/50 scenario, maybe they could be.

In a proof beyond a reasonable doubt scenario, not a chance.

If this is the prosecutions theory, they better have some evidence to support this.

I think the prosecution is only going to go so far as to say that Zimmerman "profiled" him (not a crime) and provoked a confrontation (not 2nd degree murder) and therefore those actions show depravity.

Or something.

This case is putting the criminal justice system in a bad light.

Oh, and to believe Martin's friend "Dee-Dee" one has to believe she was horrified about what she heard on the phone but decided not to call the police or reach out to the Martin family. Makes a ton of sense.

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